Question to Encoders: File Sizes getting out of hand?

[jpwong]

Dedicated online backup relies on

1. Having a decent connection so it doesn't take all day just to watch 1 video
2. Having enough bandwidth to use this method (more ISP are jumping onto caps going as low as 40-60GB/month now)
3. Having a reliable online storage center

It's not a bad option, it just won't work for a lot of people and DVDs end up being the most practical choice in a cost/time/convenience setting.

[lubczyk]

Originally Posted by fireshark

Dedlcated online backup? And what if you don't have the bandwidth to do it? At least here un the US, some of us are still stuck with crappy connections, and re"archiving" BD rips at 40kb/s is not my idea of a good day.

You pay a little more for more bandwidth? Why would you spend less money on cheapo bandwidth but more money on DVDr's?

All that time and money you're wasting on unreliable DVDr's. Just upgrade your internet plan to be able to use a good storage service.

Just how much time, money and space you wasted burning all those DVDr's?

[zrdb]

I say the bigger the files the better-I'll download subs of whatever series I'm watching and rip the subs and find better quality raws and make my own episodes.

[Desbreko]

Single layer, Verbatim brand DVD+R's are about 20 cents each and it takes me about fifteen minutes to burn and verify a disc with my 16x burner. And for most of that time I can also be doing other stuff. Combine that with the 320 disc binder sitting on my shelf and it works out to very little time, money, and space required to back stuff up on DVDs.

So, 20 cents per disc or about another $50 per month on top of what my current DSL costs now for a high speed cable net connection. If you think the latter is cheaper, you need to go back to school.

[[darkfire]]

Originally Posted by lubczyk

You pay a little more for more bandwidth? Why would you spend less money on cheapo bandwidth but more money on DVDr's?

All that time and money you're wasting on unreliable DVDr's. Just upgrade your internet plan to be able to use a good storage service.

Just how much time, money and space you wasted burning all those DVDr's?

Depends where you live. Not everyone can get Fios, Comcast sucks at uploads and At&T Stops a 1mbs up and thats on their Max8 and Max18 service plan.

[shirohamada]

Originally Posted by jpwong

Dedicated online backup relies on

1. Having a decent connection so it doesn't take all day just to watch 1 video
2. Having enough bandwidth to use this method (more ISP are jumping onto caps going as low as 40-60GB/month now)
3. Having a reliable online storage center

It's not a bad option, it just won't work for a lot of people and DVDs end up being the most practical choice in a cost/time/convenience setting.

> dedicated online backup for animu
oh u

Originally Posted by zrdb

I say the bigger the files the better-I'll download subs of whatever series I'm watching and rip the subs and find better quality raws and make my own episodes.

>implying pre-encoded, upscaled raws on share any better than a fansubban group with dedicated capture box in osaka

Originally Posted by Desbreko

Unless you set up your drives in a RAID array, it seems more likely for hard drives to crash and burn within ten years than it is for high quality, carefully stored DVDs to become corrupt. If you use crappy, generic brand discs and scratch the hell out of them like most people do, then sure, they're not going to last long. But I have plenty of CD-Rs and DVD+Rs that have outlived multiple hard drives.

get hdd dock dude.

hitachi 1TB $65.
inb4WDblack

Originally Posted by K!R4

you know that depends on the people archivin these media (burned or retail disc) whether theyre goin to work or not after 5-10 years. if you take care of your stuff, i bet theyd work and last 20 years or forever. if youre like a retard who keeps his stuff lying around with crap and dont give a shit where its place after theyre used, i bet a newly burned or bought DVD/CD will stop working after one day.

fyi: i have old dvds and cds that were burned and bought way back late 90s and are still fckn workin, so i dont see any problems for people who are still using dvdr to archive files or buying retail dvd/cd or bluray. anyway, i stopped using verbatim shits long ago not because theyre not good dvdr but because theyre fckn expensive as hell. i switch to taiyo yuden dvdr which are pretty much the same as verbatim's quality and much cheaper.

the world is ending in 2012

Originally Posted by fireshark

>>Hari Michiru
If your computer can handle HD content, it can encode iPod at a pretty quick clip. Especially if you resize to 320x240 (iPod resolution) encoding gets pretty fast. For 720p content, encoding to CRF21 with LanczosResize to 240p, reencodes usually putter along at ~60fps. (Intel T6400)

try spline36resize.


sure is trollan

[lubczyk]

Originally Posted by [darkfire]

Depends where you live. Not everyone can get Fios, Comcast sucks at uploads and At&T Stops a 1mbs up and thats on their Max8 and Max18 service plan.

So you can pay to download fansubs but not upload? It your connection is that bad, why not just watch streaming anime or not download anime fansubs at all?

Shoot, I download a lot of my anime through proxy. A lot of times through dial-up and satellite internet since i'm on the move much of the time.

[TheFluff]

Originally Posted by lubczyk

So you can pay to download fansubs but not upload? It your connection is that bad, why not just watch streaming anime or not download anime fansubs at all?

I realize that this might be news to you since you appear to be living in some kind of alternate reality, but the vast majority of consumer broadband connections in the real world are extremely asymmetrical with a huge bias towards downloading; downloading 20 or 30 times faster than you upload is not uncommon.

[lubczyk]

Originally Posted by TheFluff

I realize that this might be news to you since you appear to be living in some kind of alternate reality, but the vast majority of consumer broadband connections in the real world are extremely asymmetrical with a huge bias towards downloading; downloading 20 or 30 times faster than you upload is not uncommon.

So watch streaming anime or get some kind of business plan. That's what I use now since I'm always on the move.

[Arm]

Originally Posted by lubczyk

So watch streaming anime or get some kind of business plan. That's what I use now since I'm always on the move.

What does streaming have anything to do with this discussion. This whole argument is based off where to backup or archive anime. Considering most people don't have the speed to backup the anime in a timely manner (due to asymmetrical connections), nor the bandwidth (hello 60gb/month bandwidth), online backup is not viable. I don't see how streaming anime is relevant.

[Quarkboy]

Originally Posted by Arm

What does streaming have anything to do with this discussion. This whole argument is based off where to backup or archive anime. Considering most people don't have the speed to backup the anime in a timely manner (due to asymmetrical connections), nor the bandwidth (hello 60gb/month bandwidth), online backup is not viable. I don't see how streaming anime is relevant.

Well, to play devil's advocate... Backing up doesn't have to be that fast. Unless you're downloading gigs of anime every day, you can have a backup upload set to go overnight or something, and even if you only get 60 KB/s up or something cruel like that, you could still backup an episode an hour... If it does it passively when you're not using the connection otherwise, it's still viable.

[Arm]

Originally Posted by Quarkboy

Well, to play devil's advocate... Backing up doesn't have to be that fast. Unless you're downloading gigs of anime every day, you can have a backup upload set to go overnight or something, and even if you only get 60 KB/s up or something cruel like that, you could still backup an episode an hour... If it does it passively when you're not using the connection otherwise, it's still viable.

Point taken, but the bandwidth is still a problem. In Canada, most ISPs top residential service is 100gb/month, and I know it's similar, if not worse in other places. I'm also wondering if online storage is even cost effective for the size they give you. I haven't looked into it much, but isn't is usually a fairly steep monthly fee for only a few GBs (upgradable obviously though)?

Either way, the main reason I posted was referring to the mention of streaming anime and how that was relevant.

[crash-kun]

Originally Posted by lubczyk

get some kind of business plan. That's what I use now since I'm always on the move.

AWE SHIT!! Thats a great freakin' idea, I don't know why I didn't think to do that!

[Garylisk]

So I will just chime in that I'm lazy and just mux raw with subs nowadays. I should probably feel guilty, but I don't.

I don't see why people are so worried about downloading 200-300MB instead of 170 or 175. Seriously? I'll have to read this whole thread when I get home tonight, seems interesting and flamey.

Also, blank DVDs are dirty cheap, check Newegg, look for "Ritek RiData DVD+R" 100 spindle for $18 with free shipping. That's 18 cents a disc. Small price to pay. Just keep your anime catalogued and number the discs. MS Access, Personal Video Database, etc... works great.

Filesize being an issue is so 2002.

[jpwong]

Originally Posted by Garylisk

I don't see why people are so worried about downloading 200-300MB instead of 170 or 175. Seriously? I'll have to read this whole thread when I get home tonight, seems interesting and flamey.

I thought the original complaint was that filesizes were starting to exceed 400MB and 500MB per episode (truth be told I haven't actually seen much anime that does that though). It's not really a big deal, but it does add up to your bandwidth cap (assuming your ISP has implemented them) when you add in other activities that are becoming more prevalent in the modern age.

[lubczyk]

Originally Posted by jpwong

I thought the original complaint was that filesizes were starting to exceed 400MB and 500MB per episode (truth be told I haven't actually seen much anime that does that though). It's not really a big deal, but it does add up to your bandwidth cap (assuming your ISP has implemented them) when you add in other activities that are becoming more prevalent in the modern age.

You know, residential plans are not for bittorrent. My relatives in Poland pay for every extra GB over 10 and they don't use up their bandwidth.

100 GB/month should be fine for 99% of users.

File sizes are not bad at all. Most of the fansubs I watch are under 300 MB even at 720p.

Like I've said. I don't understand why people are picky about "FREE" fansubs. If you want smaller file sizes, there's always some group making some 704 x 400 encode in Xvid.

I can't understand why anyone would want the quality of "free" content to go down.

[Access]

Originally Posted by lubczyk

To all you CD/DVD collectors: Are you aware of such a thing as disc rot? Most of those CDRs and DVDRs you encode will not work within 5 to 10 years due to slight errors in recording and disc rot over time.

CD-R and DVD-R are disposable media that are not meant for archival storage.

...

Of course, I don't backup my anime. They're fansubs. I don't know music CDs, DVDs or tapes anymore. They're disposable. with anime and basically every other media being basically on demand, I see no need to archive fansubs.

That's strange b'cos I regularly use CD-Rs burned 8-12 years ago and I am yet to find one I can't read. Maybe I'm just real lucky. Seriously I think it is overstated, with LDs there were many allegations of disc rot and some of them actually true b'cos manufacturing conditions weren't always the best. I'm not saying they will never rot but 'will not work within 5 to 10 years' is just not true in practice.

I do recognize today true data security on the cheap you want a RAID network or something like that. $200. for 1.5TB (mirrored) and you are paying maybe 2x what you would for an equivelent number of DVD-Rs. With the other RAID schemes you can approach the cost of DVD-Rs not to mention the convenience of not having to burn discs or write-only nature of doing so.

The on-demand thing is true _today_. We don't know what the future will bring. Someday, that too will go out of style. The same way we've gone from tapes, to CDs, to online delivery / local storage for music. Given enough time, stuff always changes.

[Garylisk]

Originally Posted by jpwong

I thought the original complaint was that filesizes were starting to exceed 400MB and 500MB per episode (truth be told I haven't actually seen much anime that does that though). It's not really a big deal, but it does add up to your bandwidth cap (assuming your ISP has implemented them) when you add in other activities that are becoming more prevalent in the modern age.

OK yeah, you know, I had heard something about that whole bandwidth cap thing. Man, I can't imagine it. I sure hope they don't ever do that in my area, but I hear more and more providers are doing it.

I shudder at the thought of someday soon having to pay for a business connection.

Seriously, though. I have a Fiber connection from AT&T (UVerse) - My download speed is ridiculous. Now, you tell me - If they don't want me downloading arse tons of files, why would they give me this much speed? I can't think of a webpage out there where you'd need this much bandwidth. Not even a game. When I can download things at over 350k/sec, believe me, I think it can only be intended for one purpose - Downloading large files, or lots of files! Either way, I rock this bandwidth hard daily, and love it.

[TheFluff]

if you have a fast internet connection you shouldn't bother with backing anything up anyway
music and manga is small enough to just keep on your harddrive, and anime should be deleted immediately after watching because it's trivial to just redownload it later, even years and years after it aired

90% of all anime isn't even worth temporary diskspace in the first place anyway, so it should take you a few years to fill a 500gb drive with stuff that is actually worth keeping; by the point it's full you're going to be overdue for an upgrade anyway

[jpwong]

Originally Posted by lubczyk

You know, residential plans are not for bittorrent. My relatives in Poland pay for every extra GB over 10 and they don't use up their bandwidth.

Business plans aren't for bittorent either though. I don't know if it's different where you are, but a business plan is paying through the nose because they guarantee the connection, not transfer volume. Where I live a business plan can cost anywhere up to 4x the residential price, but you get a slower connection with lower bandwidth limits. But they do guarantee that your net connection will never be down for a period longer than 24 hours. Whereas a residential connection can potentially be waiting up to 7 days to be fixed because internet isn't a mission critical resource.

100GB/month is fine for most users, in fact, unless you're collecting every anime series that's out in a given season, it would be overkill. But the world is moving to a higher useage state. Digital gaming distribution is rapidly fanning out, HD video streaming, digital video rentals, multimedia intensive web sites. With no real competition in any given region for broadband (usually only seems to be 1 cable and 1 DSL provider per area), there's not really much incentive to compete, and each ISP's caps can differ wildly. You can have providers that have ridiculous 10GB/month limits in their terms, or you could end up with Comcast's generous 250GB/month limits (or so I've read) or somewhere in between.

Not saying that available internet packages are bad, but there's nothing that would be really geared towards the idea of an online storage model. A lot of ISPs will start to rail on you if you do "too much" uploading which could be as low as simply uploading the equivalent of 1/3 of your cap in any given month because upload is a lot more "precious" to the ISP than download is which is why you get these connections that are 7.5Mbps down 512kbps up or 15M/1M.

I think TheFluff has it right. With the whole anime situation we have right now, you're better off only backing up whatever you really really like, everything else is for the most part, easily replaceable, or got licensed at some point if you suffer a catastrophic drive failure.