2011-10-05, 10:03 | Link #1301 | ||||
Lost at Sea
Join Date: Mar 2010
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I said that Fumito was a "good guy" since, in your hypothesis, his goal is to enable Saya to broker the best possible outcome in the conflict between the humans and furukimonos. He wears the retrospective halo of the "good" ending he is working toward. That is not to say he is in fact good. Or even that the end he envisages is good either. I very much appreciated your characterization of Fumito, especially your tale of moral compromises and corruption by association with monsters. Such a story would have been in its way just as horrifying as Saya's, had the writers chosen to tell it. I would have liked to have seen that! Quote:
Magic and screenwriters' license make anything possible. I would like to know more about just how Fumito controlled the furukimono using Saya's blood. We get two references: the first to the talismans the actors wear to protect themselves, and the second to the mirror that Fumito breaks to summon the Bunny Monster. Both of these devices seem clearly magical. In that case I wonder if Fumito is not a magician or a sorcerer? This would certainly fit with the show's hallmark blending of the human and the magical worlds, as evidenced by Saya herself, by Tadayoshi, and almost certainly the dog. Quote:
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The story seems to suggest that these values are open to humans and furukimono alike: they are not human but universal. So the division in kind between human and furukimono does not really exist. There are different axes at play: power, tastes, physical shape, etc. But these unite humans and furukimonos along a spectrum, and do not separate them. That is a really excellent description of where Saya's experience leaves her, by the way. |
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2011-10-05, 13:12 | Link #1303 | |||||
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Austria
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a) Fumito wasn't a sociopath when he took the job. (Estimate: Possible to Likely) b) Fumito is human. (Estimate: very, very likely - although Fumito being a Furukimono has certain intriguing points, too; mimic enough to fool his superiors? controlled himself, and using Saya to break free?) Quote:
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2011-10-06, 22:03 | Link #1306 |
Junior Member
Join Date: Oct 2011
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Not sure if it has been speculated here yet, but does anyone besides me think that Itsuki may still be alive and might even show up in the upcoming Blood-C movie?
The thing is, everyone from the main cast has died at least once before the whole experiment was revealed to Saya, except for Fumito, Tsutsutori, and Itsuki. (Since Fumito was behind all the attacks from the furukimono, I'll exclude him.) Then when episode 12 happens, Tokizane is the first to die permanently when it is revealed that Fumito had given him a fake talisman after his first death when he defected to Tsutsutori's group. The same case with the twins, Nono and Nene. Then Tsutsutori dies for the first time, but let's assumed that it is a permanent death since Fumito surmised that she would defect from the very beginning, thus she had a fake talisman to begin with. As for Yuuka, she died once and is still sided with Fumito, but it wasn't revealed whether her current (2nd) talisman is real or fake since she is the only person from the main cast to survive the finale aside from Fumito. Not as important right now, but it might be crucial in the upcoming movie. Finally, there's Itsuki, who has yet to die before episode 12. He hasn't defected to Tsutsutori's group, but his first death was from trying to protect Saya from bullets. However, assuming that he is still holding on to the same talisman he had from the beginning as part of the main cast, there isn't any proof on whether his current talisman was real or fake, and thus, whether he still has a chance of being alive. ...Unless I missed a part where they said the talisman only works on attacks from furukimono, then everything I speculated is entirely wrong. Did they ever mention if this part is a known fact? (There's way too many pages for me to skim through. ) |
2011-10-07, 01:46 | Link #1307 | |
Translator, Producer
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Tokyo, Japan
Age: 44
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Chances are very good the talismans had some of Saya's blood in it and were a variant on whatever he was using to control them. I.e. they aren't magic that'll protect you from bullets. The other deaths were all staged fakes.
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2011-10-07, 06:20 | Link #1308 | |
Junior Member
Join Date: Oct 2011
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2011-10-11, 09:43 | Link #1309 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2007
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in this TV series, the bad guy (Fumito) wins... in movie version, Saya sure get her revenge very badly...
however, hope Saya would need some companion or allies to be with, because there sure more furukimono(s) to deal with in upcoming movie... (Tokyo Massacre) |
2011-10-30, 14:17 | Link #1312 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Austria
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That's a very interesting analysis.
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One problem we have is the story of Blood-C is not yet finished, and depending on how the film plays out, things might yet change. But one thing right now: "...we can never get outside those ideals..." This "never", I think, is not warranted. Morals - to me - are a sort of addiction to a brain-state constellation (metaphorically, not literally). And you can kick an addiction; but it's not easy. A choice and its implementation aren't the same thing: you can choose to change, but you need to re-affirm that choice every step along the way, and the road is long enough for your goals to change with yourself. You're an organism who will never fully understand itself, because the very act of understanding changes you. Saya's situation is extreme: everything has been drawn out from under her, so what else does she have to fall back on but habit?`Note that this a matter not of "What am I going to do now?" but a matter of "What am I going to want to do now?" The Saya of that moment literally has little else to sustain her but habit. Ultimately, Saya won't be able to ignore her past feelings. After all, a body collects traces of what it's been going through, and - whether or not you think you have a soul - you know you have a body. So I'd say that we're not at a comparable point in the story, between the two series. You'll have to await the outcome of the film for finishing this off. |
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2011-10-30, 18:40 | Link #1313 |
Lost at Sea
Join Date: Mar 2010
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Dawnstorm, thanks.
A clarification: we can't get outside of some frame of reference, some value structure. Even if we change ourselves in the way you describe, we can only do so from some point of view. I agree that Blood-C calls into question "the centrality of humanist values," as you put it. If Saya's domestic feelings and commitments are simply constructs of Fumito's making, then her moral perspective is simply the mask of a superior power. This is Nietzsche's critique of morality; Blood-C echoes it. But the behaviorism you specify really pertains only to Fumito's perspective. Saya by contrast has really experienced friends and father: the fact that they were in fact neither is immaterial to the reality of her subjective experience. If she holds on to her experiences out of habit, if she knows intellectually they are lies, they are nonetheless still subjectively real to her. If Blood-C is at a midpoint, to what does it compare in Blood+? Spoiler:
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2011-10-31, 13:59 | Link #1314 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Austria
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I pretty much agree with you in your last post.
I wondered about that, too, but it's too hard to compare, partly because of the very different approach to characterisation and plot, and partly because I don't remember Blood+ too well. |
2011-11-08, 20:54 | Link #1316 |
AS Mods Sandbag
Join Date: Jan 2008
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This show was so meaningless for me.
After her school mates "died" I thought that something would happen ... I don't know what but not this nonsense of an end. Really, for me this show is one of the worst I have ever seen. Oh but don't worry my "worst"-list is not short This is just my humble opinion. |
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action, blood, clamp, miko, production i.g. |
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