Macross Frontier 2nd Movie: Sayonara no Tsubasa

[CrowKenobi]

Originally Posted by LoveMeKags

I never stated such, I said it was what I gathered from the translated interview. Don't put words in my mouth, please.

Fine. Then your "theory" is just that: a theory. One of many. Please don't get all emotional when your "theory" is questioned because that's how theories get proven true or false.

[LoveMeKags]

Originally Posted by CrowKenobi

Fine. Then your "theory" is just that: a theory. One of many. Please don't get all emotional when your "theory" is questioned because that's how theories get proven true or false.

That wasn't it at all.

It was the simple fact that one of the members here stated "Ranka lost and now you wanna say Frontier isn't canon at all" to me. They put words into my mouth and rolled with it. I merely defended the fact that the way Kawamori talked in the interview gave me the impression (or theory) that there are two universes to Macross and Frontier was on the non-canon side along with Zero. That was it.

But where people keep coming up with the fact I want to prove Frontier isn't canon to justify AruRan is a pathetic thing to say. All we want is to prove canon, right? So all I was doing is stating my theory.

Explain to me what's wrong with that, CrowKenobi? Why is it that people feel the need to argue with a simple theory or opinion so much that they even insult or put words into people's mouths?

[BetoJR]

There is no spoon. I mean, canon. Erm... What was I saying again? I forget.

[Yot-chan]

Originally Posted by LoveMeKags

The fact of the matter is that no one has watched all the Macross' in a row like I have: one right after the other, to see the repetitiveness.

Are you ABSOLUTELY SURE about that...?

[Tak]

Originally Posted by Natsuki Hyuga

Now, now Takky... Certainly you are not to hit on touch Lady Karice.

Oh, but I am (trying) I see no reason to refrain myself from any opportunity to know her at a more personal level. That is, should dear Karice ever grant me the permission and the utmost pleasure of such privilege.

Originally Posted by Natsuki Hyuga

(Consideration will be put out only if you finally move your lazy finger and brain and procrastinate on translating any interviews long overdue, my sweet bottom son! That or flirt with err, wait, assist Yocchin in his Macross translation project, or give us a great universal bunny, or better, Kindan no Elixir perfomance live!)

Oh alright... what else do I still owe you? I remember translating some of the interviews about the triangle a long time ago, and some others... even being blackmailed into translating an entire episode over IRC!! (or was that Cheesie's doing?) Naturally, I became weary of further commitments, seeing how I have been unfairly taken advantage of :sniff:

And even an entire chapter of the manga!... ... err... or was that for Mai-Hime and one of Valkyria... memory is fuzzy...

Originally Posted by Karice

@Takky, carrying out the last suggestion would be quite well received, I would think

Are you referring to the performance? That would depend if it is an exclusively private one just for you?

Originally Posted by Yot-chan

Are you ABSOLUTELY SURE about that...?

I think we both know the answer to that.

- Tak

[BetoJR]

Originally Posted by Tak

We both know the answer to that.

Of course she is. Why, weren't we all, at that age? I remember...

Ah...

No, I don't.

What about those surfboards, eh, guys? Eh? Anyone? Bueller?

[CrowKenobi]

Originally Posted by LoveMeKags

That wasn't it at all.

It was the simple fact that one of the members here stated "Ranka lost and now you wanna say Frontier isn't canon at all" to me. They put words into my mouth and rolled with it. I merely defended the fact that the way Kawamori talked in the interview gave me the impression (or theory) that there are two universes to Macross and Frontier was on the non-canon side along with Zero. That was it.

I've gone back a page or two in this thread and can't find any mention of anyone writing that.

But where people keep coming up with the fact I want to prove Frontier isn't canon to justify AruRan is a pathetic thing to say. All we want is to prove canon, right? So all I was doing is stating my theory.

I'll give you that, but be sure that your theory isn't based on misinterpretations of official sources...

Explain to me what's wrong with that, CrowKenobi? Why is it that people feel the need to argue with a simple theory or opinion so much that they even insult or put words into people's mouths?

Perhaps it's because of how "out of left field" the theory looks compared to what they're familiar with "canon-wise." (and you do yourself disservice to your theory by throwing insults back at them)

[BetoJR]

Originally Posted by CrowKenobi

and you do yourself disservice to your theory by throwing insults back at them

I've been meaning to ask for some time... But what's the general consensus here about cursing?
I mean, I know the general guidelines of "don't be an asshole" and such, but I've been noticing an increasing amount of curse words being bandied about by several members in several threads. Is that acceptable?

[Falcor]

I realize this has nothing to do with the movie, but it does relate to this thread.

To contribute to your consensus, Beto, I see cursing (cussing/swearing) as a rich seasoning, like cloves; a little dash here and there for emphasis is tolerable, otherwise it should be avoided.

[BetoJR]

Yeah, I'm not prude enough to complain over the occasional fu-- or sh-- (I do speak and curse like a sailor IRL), but sometimes things do get out of hand, and it starts to annoy more than endear, specially over long walls of text.

[Tak]

All I know is, I've just been told to go f*** myself, and somehow I am supposed to tolerate it.

- Tak

[Falcor]

If you're referring to this post, it appears only those who read it in its original state know what you're referring to. It also indicates that somebody does indeed care and has taken steps to prevent any more unpleasantries.

[Alchemist007]

I've only ever seen the Frontier series and this movie, but it sounds like there's argument over what would be the canon storyline. I'm guessing this is something they like to answer in sequels? Like how Sheryl is the descendant from an earlier series' character?

[Tak]

Originally Posted by Alchemist007

I've only ever seen the Frontier series and this movie, but it sounds like there's argument over what would be the canon storyline. I'm guessing this is something they like to answer in sequels? Like how Sheryl is the descendant from an earlier series' character?

There isn't much of an argument than what someone is trying to convey, for canon to Macross is not difficult to comprehend, at all.

There is an outline in Kawamori's head, and that is the basis of Macross history, if you will.

From that event, Kawamori then creates a variety of shows based on it. So major events like Space War I, Protodevlin conflict, and the more recent Vajra war, are considered canon. How it is interpreted and presented to the audience is an entirely different story.

For example: Hitler died in WWII after committing suicide. In Inglorious Basterds, a movie based on the same historical event, Hitler died after being riddled with machine-gun fire. Same event, different interpretations.

Backtrack a bit, Karice had posted extensively about the subject, and the interviews are where majority consensus lay.

- Tak (Oh, and Christoph Waltz... he was awesome. One of few Austrians I actually admire)

[magnuskn]

Originally Posted by BetoJR

I've been meaning to ask for some time... But what's the general consensus here about cursing?
I mean, I know the general guidelines of "don't be an asshole" and such, but I've been noticing an increasing amount of curse words being bandied about by several members in several threads. Is that acceptable?

We had that discussion a few months ago... as long as you don't use them against other people and too liberally, saying "fuck" isn't prohibited.

[moncikoma]

I think i am the only person here..who has not watched the final movie...LOl

Dunno why...i just not mentaly ready to wwatch it yet...

Maybe because i dont want this awesome series to end....hhahaha

[teelatsuki]

Originally Posted by LoveMeKags

Not in a row, obviously. I watched every single thing back-to-back in a marathon.

Spoiler for bla bla:

Not after 25 years they don't. They call that a pattern or trolling, if you will.

Then why, why is he always telling us to look at past series of Macross when trying to interpret the significance of a scene. For Movie 2, he said "watch Zero."

If he has to say that, then it means the story isn't original, it's been done before or bits of it. To do something original, he wouldn't have had a triangular ending like Macross 7 for the series or an ending in Movie 2 that was similar to Zero (or looked like fucking Aquarion!). If you want to do something original, let go of the past stories you've made and give new material. Frontier failed at this and Kawamori seems to already note it by stating this a repetitiveness to the series as a whole.

But we also have to lean on the fact that when you've worked with one set of characters for so long, it's hard to stray away from their image in your head. I'm sure Kawamori has the same trouble because he worked with Hikaru, Misa, and Minmei for years. That's the downside of being a writer or creating a story/script in general.

...

Where are the facepalms icons when you need them? I wrote there ALL IN ONE GO, "back-to-back in a marathon" as you want to put it. How did you miss that?

And thanks to this post I now know that you don't seem to grasp the meaning of either canon or tribute.

Originally Posted by karice67

@teelatsuki

Just forget it.
[...]
Thanks for the defense though, peoples

Will do, just wanted to let that one out of my system.

Some people should just leave behind their victim complex.

Originally Posted by moncikoma

I think i am the only person here..who has not watched the final movie...LOl

Dunno why...i just not mentaly ready to wwatch it yet...

Maybe because i dont want this awesome series to end....hhahaha

I know that feeling, but when I heard that it was out, I just needed to see Sheryl again and then was mindblowed with all the awesomeness of the whole cast and all the action.

But yeah, not done with it yet though, I have to still watch zero and the two movies and then rewatch the series and the movies and then if I feel like it probably re watch the whole franchise again.

Hope that you get ready to watch soon I'm sure you wont regret it and hopefully you won't feel like it ended.

[LoveMeKags]

Originally Posted by teelatsuki

Where are the facepalms icons when you need them? I wrote there ALL IN ONE GO, "back-to-back in a marathon" as you want to put it. How did you miss that?

You did not give off that vibe. Instead of inserting "have seen back-to-back" you only said "have seen every." So do not blame me for not understanding you meant back-to-back.

And thanks to this post I now know that you don't seem to grasp the meaning of either canon or tribute.

25 years is a long time to give a tribute. Maybe if you hadn't created a piece for the movie/series in-between that long time. But since Macross has had multiple series since the original, a tribute doesn't count. It's called trolling (as multiple people have stated multiple times but you refuse to see). After 25 years, and multiple series beforehand, it is not a tribute, but trolling.

[Tak]

Originally Posted by LoveMeKags

You did not give off that vibe. Instead of inserting "have seen back-to-back" you only said "have seen every." So do not blame me for not understanding you meant back-to-back.

I understood him perfectly, and I am sure others do, as well. At this point, I believe you are just picking on small technicalities (if they should even be considered as such) due to your insistence on refusing to correct an obvious fallacy. Except, as usual, it ended up unconvincing to everyone else.

Originally Posted by LoveMeKags

25 years is a long time to give a tribute.

25 years may be a long time, but its no reason not to pay tribute. Give us a good reason why it would be? There are many older things out there getting it.

- Tak

[Darthtabby]

Originally Posted by LoveMeKags

25 years is a long time to give a tribute. Maybe if you hadn't created a piece for the movie/series in-between that long time. But since Macross has had multiple series since the original, a tribute doesn't count. It's called trolling (as multiple people have stated multiple times but you refuse to see). After 25 years, and multiple series beforehand, it is not a tribute, but trolling.

Are you telling me a 25th Anniversary sequel that deliberately draws upon all major previous versions of the franchise doesn't qualify as a tribute? Macross Frontier is far more of a tribute than Zero, Plus or Seven was (all of which have their own unique aspects that distinguish them from the rest of the franchise even if they have certain things in common) and I think that's okay for a series that was made for the franchise's 25th anniversary.