AnimeSuki Forums

warita · 2012-01-31, 04:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malkuth

^ What you are alluding to I believe is a recurring plot hole of the manga

You mean how they just assume the correct thing, even though there is little to no evidence for it?

anyways..... as for the eleventh diary owner, Yuno correctly guesses it is him. There is not so much to choose from anymore. Lets look at the list:

1. Yukki
2. Yuno

3. ~~Homeroom teacher~~

4. ~~the detective~~

5. ~~the kiddo~~

6. ~~sacred eye~~

7. Ai and Maru

8. ~~dog breeder~~

9. Uryuu Minene
10. the mother person
11. ?
12. ~~crazy power ranger guy~~

So assuming that Minene is helping, Ai and Maru were present and are more adorable than dangerous.... the mother person doesnt involve herself much until this point and the way she does things is through her aprentices (and Yukkis dad doesnt seem to be an apprentice), it is safe to asume it is the doings of 11th diary owner.

-Sho- · 2012-01-31, 04:27

I wish Yukki will change his clothes , i know it's summer but come on , it's like if he was going in a camp trip...
As usual , Yuno's acting so good

Malkuth · 2012-01-31, 05:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by warita

You mean how they just assume the correct thing, even though there is little to no evidence for it?

I shouldn't elaborate more out of fear of hinting/spoiling... PM if you want to discuss the biggest revealation of the whole story... though I wouldn't recommend it to anyone

Quote:

Originally Posted by warita

anyways..... as for the eleventh diary owner, Yuno correctly guesses it is him. There is not so much to choose from anymore. Lets look at the list:

1. Yukki
2. Yuno

3. ~~Homeroom teacher~~

4. ~~the detective~~

5. ~~the kiddo~~

6. ~~sacred eye~~

7. Ai and Maru

8. ~~dog breeder~~

9. Uryuu Minene
10. the mother person
11. ?
12. ~~crazy power ranger guy~~

So assuming that Minene is helping, Ai and Maru were present and are more adorable than dangerous.... the mother person doesnt involve herself much until this point and the way she does things is through her aprentices (and Yukkis dad doesnt seem to be an apprentice), it is safe to asume it is the doings of 11th diary owner.

The process of elimination works better

You really gotten into Yuno's thought process, I fear for your love interest ending up like Yukiteru a couple of episodes back

Stiletto · 2012-01-31, 07:17

Both Yukiteru and his dad are wussies. If Minene sat on me, I'd be invigorated to do a thousand push ups.

An okay episode, though the build-up will probably be released next episode. That was pretty pathetic though, Yukiteru seems pretty good at being punched and picked up by Mar.

Quote:

Originally Posted by warita

12. ~~Awesome ally of justice that made Minene into an eyepatchy~~

You make Yomotsu sound so bad, so I fixed that for you.

Sackett · 2012-01-31, 08:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by warita

Oh.... and how about the ending? Did anybody get it? Why would the 7ths want Yukkis dad? Either I failed to understand something here, or it will be revealed in the next episode.
.

They think his Dad is working for the 11th.

So if that's so then 7th now has a lead on all the diary owners. 11th has been hanging out of sight in the background. I bet he's a real sneak, using Yuki's father against him is pretty low. He probably attacks through proxies and patsies.

Interesting that 7th didn't move when 9th was involved, but as soon as 11th showed his hand... maybe they've been having their own conflict with 11th for the past period of time while Yuki was dealing with all the other diary owners? Possibly 11th has been attacking them through proxies and they haven't been able to identify him.

That's probably the real reason 7th kept Yukki and Yuno's diaries working. They want to use 1st and 2nd as bait. Bait that they can eliminate anytime they feel like it.

As for Yuno leaping to conclusions, well that sort of fits with Yuno's character.

There's a term for people like her: Properly Paranoid

"Yuki's father wants Yuki's diary?"

"He must be working for a diary holder, but who?"

"The one we haven't seen yet. Yes. Obviously they are trying to attack us from the shadows."

"Oh well. Best get on with killing him. I have to protect Yuki"

Has Yuno made at least one leap to a conclusion that turned out to be wrong? I think she has a couple times.

I think it's more that Yuno is just fine with killing people because of conclusions based on partial information. That's the odd thing about her. Not that a large number of her paranoid assumptions are correct.

miketyson · 2012-01-31, 09:28

Yuno's not really jumping to conclusions here, based on the information available to her. The surviving diary owners: 1, 2, 7, 8, 9, and 11. For whom is Yuki's dad working?

It isn't 1, it isn't 2, and probably isn't 9. This leaves 7, 8, or 11.

7 doesn't make much sense, so it's either 8 or 11.

8's modus operandi is to gather info via an army of foot soldiers. 8 could decide that "manipulate dad via debt" is the right move, but it doesn't fit what we've seen from 8.

So, odds are it's probably 11 making a move (with a small chance it's a strategy change from 8).

Hence, slightly complicated reasoning but not that difficult or unreasonable. It's another place where the author skimped out on exposition. That's a pattern in the manga: if it isn't doesn't move the story forward and isn't comic relief it tends to be omitted entirely; was probably *terrified* of getting cancelled.

This arc is imho a place where the plotting could've been better if the author was more confident with the material. EG: have Yukiteru's dad say he forgot his phone and ask to borrow one from Yukiteru, then Yuno, then Minene, only to get turned down ("missing", "don't have it", "no"). Yuno tells Yukiteru he's an enemy, Yukiteru's like "he's just a busy guy and needed to make a call", then it plays out like it did.

Anyways, imho chalk Yuno's conclusion up to logic (+ lack of exposition) and not some magic future-knowledge or whatever.

monsta666 · 2012-01-31, 17:07

Can't really add to the comments regarding the remaining diary owners but the main thing I will say about this series is Yuno's manic obsession/love for Yukki. It is certainly unnerving and to me, it was more frightening than anything else. But I don't know, over time I begin to see a certain charm, could I even say respect? I mean for all her craziness to so blindly protect the one you love with complete and utter disregard for your own wellbeing is quite something. And she does seem to show some guilt with that kidnapping stunt she pulled off by allowing Yukki to tie her up so there is some guilt, some humanity in her. Although one cannot deny she is troubled person. I just wonder if they will go into any depth about what was the cause of her psychotic behaviour...

warita · 2012-02-01, 11:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by monsta666

Although one cannot deny she is troubled person. I just wonder if they will go into any depth about what was the cause of her psychotic behaviour...

Monsta, I am pretty sure they will, I would be disappointed if they didnt.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malkuth

You really gotten into Yuno's thought process, I fear for your love interest ending up like Yukiteru a couple of episodes back

Malkuth you charmer!!! :P

ookamigirl · 2012-02-01, 13:58

Yukkii's dad sure is a player.
The hospital part with Uryuu was pretty funny.
Uryuu as a personal trainer was kinda mild. Guess she liked his dad.
Yuno's stalking sure comes in handy when the times get tough.

Malkuth · 2012-02-01, 14:18

By the way, now we all see which side of the family made Yukiteru such a useless person ::heh

Quote:

Originally Posted by warita

Malkuth you charmer!!! :P

Always trying my best to see the worse any given situation

Quote:

Originally Posted by ookamigirl

Yukkii's dad sure is a player.

... bound to fail

Quote:

Originally Posted by ookamigirl

The hospital part with Uryuu was pretty funny.
Uryuu as a personal trainer was kinda mild. Guess she liked his dad.

I like puppies too, they try so hard to impress you, it's cute

Quote:

Originally Posted by ookamigirl

Yuno's stalking sure comes in handy when the times get tough.

Not really, since technically she is stalking only Yukiteru, not his dad

warita · 2012-02-05, 13:30

So I watched episode 17 raw as I just couldnt wait...

Spoiler for episode 17:

Flawfinder · 2012-02-05, 17:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by warita

So I watched episode 17 raw as I just couldnt wait...

Spoiler for episode 17:

I think they wanted him because his debt was supposed to be cleared by one of the diary holders (I think it was 11th), so therefore, if they got him, they'd have a clue on who the mystery diary holder was.

serenade_beta · 2012-02-05, 23:51

Spoiler for ep17:

Malkuth · 2012-02-06, 03:58

^ rape was indeed redundant, being about by her family and falling in love with that joke is enough to make her sympathetic.

Other than that, more solid parenting, horrible CG tower exploding, Yukiteru changed his mind again, gore and sex got censored, and Yuno's victim list got one more addition... the usual, what was unusual is that someone got killed but not by her

Also it was a nice choice not to put an extra after the episode's end.

warita · 2012-02-06, 04:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malkuth

^ rape was indeed redundant,.....gore and sex got censored

I am very happy it got censored, because seriously.... after the sacred eye arc I was very disturbed. I know this kind of thing happens in the world, but as a woman I always feel very upset to see it in anime. And I do agree with serenada beta, when he/she said, that there was no need for a second rape in this anime.

Seriously.... if I want to see more rape, I am off to watch hentais, you get a load of that in there. So I am happy to see it sensored, even though I think it would have been even better they didnt include it in there in the first place.

Malkuth · 2012-02-06, 05:03

^ censoring trivializes the crimes (be it rape, murder, torture, war, or whatever else)... there is no point to have a disturbing scene written, and then censor it, don't write it to begin with if you are afraid of scaring the audience or to be accessible to the masses.

And it's quite funny the cult arc was my favourite, especially since it merged mosaic the mosaic part and after watching it uncensored it was really a harrowing experience, I wish the rest of the manga and the anime could keep the writing quality at that level (minus the dart destroying that scroll) for the duration of the story.

As for animated hentai, usually it's worse but for very different reasons not subject to this thread

Sides · 2012-02-06, 06:32

Loved episode 17. Inclusion of the rape scene was managed in a good way. Mirai Nikki is a really dark story to being with shying back on scene like this would have weaken the whole concept. I am glad that they pull it through and showed that rape is serious matter, unlike those hentai stuff, where the victim suddenly starts enjoying being raped, WTF. A lot of shows tend to start half way through tackling a serious matter only to make a swift U-Turn at the last minute, so I welcome that the makers of this series have the guts to stay firm.
Other than that, the way that portrayed how a group of people will take advantage of certain situation, thumbs up. This shit happens in real life, but most of the time people gang up to bully others, or to make themselves superior.

Fnights · 2012-02-06, 07:35

This is one of the few anime where i'm collecting the BDs. BDs are on another level of quality and very well made, and expecially without all these horrible black bands and blurs that ruin the immersion.

Btw, this was a great episode. Was the mother of Yukki really killed by her father or from the one that manipulated him? Eh eh...

9/10.

Chase · 2012-02-06, 09:14

That bastard killed yuki's mom. The one thing i was hoping they wouldn't do in this anime every since Yuno hit her side the head and they did anyway. Im going to cry myself to sleep now.

miketyson · 2012-02-06, 10:00

This was another solid episode, hopefully the quality stays this high as we go. I'm not sure if it's just that they're moving through the story material faster or have a better budget for these most-recent episodes, but ever since the OP/ED changed there's been a noticeable jump in quality (visually and in terms of direction). Some spoilered commentary:

Spoiler for Anime-Original:

At this point I'd be surprised if we ever see either the 10th's or the 7th's omakes, which're two of my favorites. For those who want to know what's in them:

Spoiler for Missing Omakes:

We're moving at a good clip and should be able to finish the entire story quite comfortably with the remaining episodes.

2012-02-01, 13:58	Link #1269
ookamigirl Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2011	Yukkii's dad sure is a player. The hospital part with Uryuu was pretty funny. Uryuu as a personal trainer was kinda mild. Guess she liked his dad. Yuno's stalking sure comes in handy when the times get tough. __________________ My Blog --> ookami

2012-02-05, 13:30	Link #1271
warita Dai-Youkai Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Vienna	So I watched episode 17 raw as I just couldnt wait... Spoiler for episode 17: The flashback about Ai and Maru was pretty sad..... not much else to say. All in all this episode indulged in shoking us and I must say it succeeded too. Yukkis dad was exactly the colosal asshole I expected him to be. Not only he abandons his son to save his own life, but even stabs the mother of his child to death. This is just a guess, but I think that Yukki will man up from now. I mean, if this doesnt shake him awake, then I dont know what. Yukki, please do me a favour and cut your dad to tiny pieces for me. On a side not, I failed to understand why the 7ths wanted Yukkis dad in the first place.

2012-02-05, 23:51	Link #1273
serenade_beta そのおっぱいで13才 Join Date: Dec 2006	Spoiler for ep17: Hah?! There was so no need to rape Ai in the anime. It makes me feel sorry for her for a completely different reason. Not only that, but since they already did the whole rape setting with Tsubaki, by doing it again, it screams: "Hey, how do we make this character have a sad and sympathetic past?" "I don't know! Mm.......... Hmm....." "Oh, hmm, female, so how about rape?!" like it's a doujinshi. Well, in a way, it is, but that isn't the point. At least think up a setting that isn't so similar to a previous character. The rest was fine, though I wonder why the elevator had two 2nd floor buttons. A bizarre occurrence on the level of Akise's magical jacket. __________________ -Blog --> http://tdnshumi.blogspot.com/ (Mainly about video games) -R.I.P. Hiroshi Yamauchi, Gaming wouldn't have been the same without you (9/19/13)

2012-02-06, 09:14	Link #1279
Chase Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007	That bastard killed yuki's mom. The one thing i was hoping they wouldn't do in this anime every since Yuno hit her side the head and they did anyway. Im going to cry myself to sleep now. __________________ Currently Playing: Devil May Cry 4:SE The Witch and the Hundred Knight Battlefield 4

2012-02-06, 10:00	Link #1280
miketyson Senior Member Join Date: May 2011	This was another solid episode, hopefully the quality stays this high as we go. I'm not sure if it's just that they're moving through the story material faster or have a better budget for these most-recent episodes, but ever since the OP/ED changed there's been a noticeable jump in quality (visually and in terms of direction). Some spoilered commentary: Spoiler for Anime-Original: The rape was an interesting addition. Watching how this episode played out, I kinda think it might've been part of the characters' original backstory that the author decided not to include in the manga. I saw this because it doesn't just give a reason for why Ai + Marco's diaries work the way they do, it also happened in a way that parallels their eventual defeat: both times Marco and Ai got separated due to some trickery, and both times they paid the consequences. The anime's added content has generally worked to smooth things over but hasn't added anything higher-level (like parallelism, etc.), hence my guess that this is the 7th's "canon" backstory, and not something Asread added on their own. In any case, I think the general idea is solid, but something other than a rape would've been a better "bad thing" to have had happen (kidnapping?). At this point I'd be surprised if we ever see either the 10th's or the 7th's omakes, which're two of my favorites. For those who want to know what's in them: Spoiler for Missing Omakes: In the 10th's, Murmur sneaks into the kennel and pretends to be a dog. The 10th is suspicious, and starts practicing a comedy routine. The routine is the same as this in english: "Who was the greatest baseball player? Roof! How does sandpaper feel? Ruff!", except all the questions have answers that work with "wan" (b/c that's what Japanese dogs say). Murmur doesn't get the routine and keeps giving the "correct" answers. In the 7th's, Muru-Muru shows up in Marco's bed right as Ai comes home, making Ai jealous ("you've finally gotten tired of me and found someone else?") and leaving Marco a bit baffled. We're moving at a good clip and should be able to finish the entire story quite comfortably with the remaining episodes.

2012-01-31, 04:27	Link #1262
-Sho- ~Omedetô~ Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Somewhere between heaven and hell !	I wish Yukki will change his clothes , i know it's summer but come on , it's like if he was going in a camp trip... As usual , Yuno's acting so good

2012-01-31, 09:28	Link #1266
miketyson Senior Member Join Date: May 2011	Yuno's not really jumping to conclusions here, based on the information available to her. The surviving diary owners: 1, 2, 7, 8, 9, and 11. For whom is Yuki's dad working? It isn't 1, it isn't 2, and probably isn't 9. This leaves 7, 8, or 11. 7 doesn't make much sense, so it's either 8 or 11. 8's modus operandi is to gather info via an army of foot soldiers. 8 could decide that "manipulate dad via debt" is the right move, but it doesn't fit what we've seen from 8. So, odds are it's probably 11 making a move (with a small chance it's a strategy change from 8). Hence, slightly complicated reasoning but not that difficult or unreasonable. It's another place where the author skimped out on exposition. That's a pattern in the manga: if it isn't doesn't move the story forward and isn't comic relief it tends to be omitted entirely; was probably terrified of getting cancelled. This arc is imho a place where the plotting could've been better if the author was more confident with the material. EG: have Yukiteru's dad say he forgot his phone and ask to borrow one from Yukiteru, then Yuno, then Minene, only to get turned down ("missing", "don't have it", "no"). Yuno tells Yukiteru he's an enemy, Yukiteru's like "he's just a busy guy and needed to make a call", then it plays out like it did. Anyways, imho chalk Yuno's conclusion up to logic (+ lack of exposition) and not some magic future-knowledge or whatever.

2012-01-31, 17:07	Link #1267
monsta666 Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: London, England Age: 37	Can't really add to the comments regarding the remaining diary owners but the main thing I will say about this series is Yuno's manic obsession/love for Yukki. It is certainly unnerving and to me, it was more frightening than anything else. But I don't know, over time I begin to see a certain charm, could I even say respect? I mean for all her craziness to so blindly protect the one you love with complete and utter disregard for your own wellbeing is quite something. And she does seem to show some guilt with that kidnapping stunt she pulled off by allowing Yukki to tie her up so there is some guilt, some humanity in her. Although one cannot deny she is troubled person. I just wonder if they will go into any depth about what was the cause of her psychotic behaviour...

2012-02-06, 03:58	Link #1274
Malkuth Banned Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: London Age: 43	^ rape was indeed redundant, being about by her family and falling in love with that joke is enough to make her sympathetic. Other than that, more solid parenting, horrible CG tower exploding, Yukiteru changed his mind again, gore and sex got censored, and Yuno's victim list got one more addition... the usual, what was unusual is that someone got killed but not by her Also it was a nice choice not to put an extra after the episode's end.

2012-02-06, 05:03	Link #1276
Malkuth Banned Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: London Age: 43	^ censoring trivializes the crimes (be it rape, murder, torture, war, or whatever else)... there is no point to have a disturbing scene written, and then censor it, don't write it to begin with if you are afraid of scaring the audience or to be accessible to the masses. And it's quite funny the cult arc was my favourite, especially since it merged mosaic the mosaic part and after watching it uncensored it was really a harrowing experience, I wish the rest of the manga and the anime could keep the writing quality at that level (minus the dart destroying that scroll) for the duration of the story. As for animated hentai, usually it's worse but for very different reasons not subject to this thread

2012-02-06, 06:32	Link #1277
Sides Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Edinburgh Age: 42	Loved episode 17. Inclusion of the rape scene was managed in a good way. Mirai Nikki is a really dark story to being with shying back on scene like this would have weaken the whole concept. I am glad that they pull it through and showed that rape is serious matter, unlike those hentai stuff, where the victim suddenly starts enjoying being raped, WTF. A lot of shows tend to start half way through tackling a serious matter only to make a swift U-Turn at the last minute, so I welcome that the makers of this series have the guts to stay firm. Other than that, the way that portrayed how a group of people will take advantage of certain situation, thumbs up. This shit happens in real life, but most of the time people gang up to bully others, or to make themselves superior.

2012-02-06, 07:35	Link #1278
Fnights Yoku dekimashita! Join Date: Jun 2006	This is one of the few anime where i'm collecting the BDs. BDs are on another level of quality and very well made, and expecially without all these horrible black bands and blurs that ruin the immersion. Btw, this was a great episode. Was the mother of Yukki really killed by her father or from the one that manipulated him? Eh eh... 9/10.