Gundam 00 Mecha, Weapons, and Technology

[LoweGear]

I'm with Rising Dragon in this case: all of us here know that the 00 Qan[T] is a Twin Drive System machine, and hence it uses both GN Drives in synchronous operation, rather then just relying on a single main one. Just because the 00 Qan[T] is assymetrical doesn't mean that one of the GN Drives is more important than the other, especially since we're given no reason to think that the GN Drives are unequal - in fact, we know that the 00 Qan[T]'s GN Drives are specifically made to operate in conjunction with the Twin Drive System. We've also never been given any reason to think that a Twin Drive machine can run off a single GN Drive without significantly hampering its performance, or even run at all.

Also, the shield being connected to the back doesn't matter. We know from the 00-Raiser that the Twin Drives are connected via the drive arms they're mounted on. Thus in its default state the 00 Qan[T] already uses both GN Drives in standard operation. Both drives connecting more directly via the shield attachment mechanism is just a function of the Quantum System, rather than the Twin Drive System. Hence, in this case it's likely that the 00 Qan[T] is emitting both of its GN Drive emissions into one port, rather than 1 GN Drive being the "main" one. And as Rising Dragon said, GN Drive location does not equal GN Drive emission location. Look at the Cherudim: Its GN Drive is located at its butt, yet all of its GN Particle emissions are going out its backpack, and this is from a single drive machine. The 00 Raiser also supports this case, since it has a third emission port on the O Raiser's body, and yet both its GN Drives are over the shoulders.

[Rising Dragon]

Originally Posted by Kuroi Hadou

No it's not.



... according to... what, exactly?

Since we're running on speculation at the moment, let's not forget that the shield drive could be the same as Cherudim: Charging the sword bits that are placed directly beside/around it. In that context, it makes perfect sense why the drive isn't emitting particles: They're being routed into the sword bits and beam gun in the shield.

Yes, I get that, but the nature of the Twin Drive System means that it's not used just for that. And similarly, the GN-Drive placement for the Cherudim isn't solely for the sake of the GN-Shield Bits, are they? After all, there's still armor and propulsion and the weapons to provide for...

We know from the 00 Raiser that the Condensers are designed to absorb the tremendous output from the Twin Drive System, which is likely why the 00 Raiser can barely work at all when it only has a single GN-Drive. The 00 Qan[T], with its superior TDS, would be even more reliant on that output. Everything it does would pretty much require that kind of output. So yes, while there is a GN-Drive where the particles are being emitted, they are not the product of that sole GN-Drive, the particles are being supplied by both Drives.

So yes, it is the same thing for the 00 Qan[T] as it is for the Masurao. GN-Particles from both GN-Drives emit from its back because that's what it's designed to do.

Originally Posted by LoweGear

I'm with Rising Dragon in this case: all of us here know that the 00 Qan[T] is a Twin Drive System machine, and hence it uses both GN Drives in synchronous operation, rather then just relying on a single main one. Just because the 00 Qan[T] is assymetrical doesn't mean that one of the GN Drives is more important than the other, especially since we're given no reason to think that the GN Drives are unequal - in fact, we know that the 00 Qan[T]'s GN Drives are specifically made to operate in conjunction with the Twin Drive System. We've also never been given any reason to think that a Twin Drive machine can run off a single GN Drive without significantly hampering its performance, or even run at all.

Also, the shield being connected to the back doesn't matter. We know from the 00-Raiser that the Twin Drives are connected via the drive arms they're mounted on. Thus in its default state the 00 Qan[T] already uses both GN Drives in standard operation. Both drives connecting more directly via the shield attachment mechanism is just a function of the Quantum System, rather than the Twin Drive System.

This. This, so much.

[Kuroi Hadou]

Originally Posted by LoweGear

I'm with Rising Dragon in this case: all of us here know that the 00 Qan[T] is a Twin Drive System machine, and hence it uses both GN Drives in synchronous operation, rather then just relying on a single main one. Just because the 00 Qan[T] is assymetrical doesn't mean that one of the GN Drives is more important than the other, especially since we're given no reason to think that the GN Drives are unequal - in fact, we know that the 00 Qan[T]'s GN Drives are specifically made to operate in conjunction with the Twin Drive System. We've also never been given any reason to think that a Twin Drive machine can run off a single GN Drive without significantly hampering its performance, or even run at all.

That's not what I'm arguing; to my knowledge I never stated otherwise. I'm saying that the shield drive wasn't directly contributing to the particle emissions we're debating about (as in, it wasn't emitting them directly from its chassis).

So yes, it is the same thing for the 00 Qan[T] as it is for the Masurao. GN-Particles from both GN-Drives emit from its back because that's what it's designed to do.

Except we also know that the shield is capable of directly emitting GN Particles. There are two different thruster systems on the 00Q: One on the back, one in the shield, as various model box art proves (unless they're no longer official, in which case none of the info we get from them is).

[Rising Dragon]

The boxart for the Masurao or Susanowo also show GN-Particles emitting from the side-binders, yet they never do that in the anime, which is arguably more canon than boxart, which rarely depicts an actual canonical appearance. (God knows the 00 Raiser didn't do its table-turning charge on the Reborns Gundam through the smokescreen while it was fully intact.)

[Kuroi Hadou]

That's it. I give up. You two win. I'm done with this thread, since I obviously don't know a thing about Gundam 00.

[LoweGear]

Originally Posted by Kuroi Hadou

That's not what I'm arguing; to my knowledge I never stated otherwise. I'm saying that the shield drive wasn't directly contributing to the particle emissions we're debating about (as in, it wasn't emitting them directly from its chassis).

If that's the case, then I would also say that the shield GN Drive isn't directly emitting GN particles in the scene in question. That doesn't mean however that the Shield GN Drive isn't emitting GN particles, just that it's routing them through its main emission port at the back of the 00 Qan[T].

Except we also know that the shield is capable of directly emitting GN Particles. There are two different thruster systems on the 00Q: One on the back, one in the shield, as various model box art proves (unless they're no longer official, in which case none of the info we get from them is).

From all accounts we have so far, the shield thruster system is only used when the 00 Qan[T] is using in Quantum Burst mode. Even in the final scenes where the post-Quantum Burst Mode 00 Qan[T] still has its shield attached to the back, it's not outputting any particles through the shield thruster at all.

It also should be remembered the boxart isn't exactly "canon" so to speak... hell, we have the most recent mistake of having the Raphael Gundam have pink beams and green GN Drive emissions on its boxart

[Rising Dragon]

Originally Posted by LoweGear

If that's the case, then I would also say that the shield GN Drive isn't directly emitting GN Drives in the scene in question. That doesn't mean however that the Shield GN Drive isn't emitting GN particles, just that it's routing them through its main emission port at the back of the 00 Qan[T].

I would certainly hope the GN-Drive isn't emitting other GN-Drives.

[LoweGear]

In any case, scorpiopt's original question isn't really a very difficult matter at all. The 00 Qan[T] is simply a machine that emits all its particles into a single port, and thus the massive GN particle emission during its Raiser Sword shot was simply a much larger emission, and that the "3 lines" is simply the standard diffusion effect as already mentioned.

[Rising Dragon]

Speaking of boxart mistakes, I recall the 00 Qan[T]'s boxart also showing the shield opening up a la Quantum Burst mode, so that might have something to do with it.

(I remember that distinctly as I pointed it out earlier and no one acted surprised, and then someone else pointed out the same damn function and everyone flipped out like it was the newest thing ever.)

(why no, I'm not bitter at all why do you ask)

[LoweGear]

Originally Posted by Rising Dragon

Speaking of boxart mistakes, I recall the 00 Qan[T]'s boxart also showing the shield opening up a la Quantum Burst mode, so that might have something to do with it.

(I remember that distinctly as I pointed it out earlier and no one acted surprised, and then someone else pointed out the same damn function and everyone flipped out like it was the newest thing ever.)

(why no, I'm not bitter at all why do you ask)

Thing is, you wouldn't be the first to point out the shield vent during the boxart reveal. In fact a lot of other people on other forums also share your sentiment... which makes that sentiment moot, since all of you can't claim to have "discovered" the presence of the vent on the boxart.

It's not really a matter to be bitter about. When we share news, we share it because we want other people to see it, not because we want to be "we're first!"

[Rising Dragon]

That it was revealed on other forums isn't my problem. My issue was that I was the first to point it out here, to no reaction--and then a week or two later someone else pointed it out and everyone here reacted then. And that's what annoyed me.

[LoweGear]

I've had my share of "missed reaction" moments myself, and all I can say is it's not really anyone's fault if a post observation is missed due to either being in a deluge of other discussions, or other such things. Not everyone reads every post on these forums extensively as we do

[SonicSP]

Since I've been away for the last two days, thought I'd give my two cents on the previous debate now that I've read it.

I personally in the opinion that the Twin Drive System would need to be roughly at the same level of output due to the fact that they are synchronized. So I do not believe that the backpack vernier is producing particles from only one Drive. They are two reasons why I say this is the case. First off, the GN Drive is located in the torso (inside a 3rd Gen-ish looking Chassis), not the backpack as depicted with the MG 00 Qan(T) model. The smaller core Drive is only inserted through the backpack and into the 3rd Gen-ish Chassis during installation (as seen in the movie). Secondly, because the Twin Drive are always synchronized, any midpoint in between them would have to contain large amount of particles from both Drives. In this case the backpack would act very much like that since its the main connection point between the torso Drive as well as the shield Drive. The backpack in this case is akin to Exia's cone, in which case it does not actually generate any particles but is very well connected (almost extension-like) to the actual GN Drive (which would be the Twin Drive in general in this case). It is slightly possible that backpack may contain a bit more particles from the torso Drive due to it being a closer proximity (As well as the shield having its own responsibilities to contribute), but being in constant connection with the shield Drive while not actually being a GN Drive would suggest that both Drives would have a large hand in the streams located in the backpack.

Its also important to note that figuring out which Drive produces which would be sort of moot in a Twin Drive System, mainly because the entire system is basically one giant powerful Drive. The Drives may be the main stars in the show, but everything in between would be just as important since the Drives are flowing particles and other stuff to and from each other. Unlike a single Drive in the 3.5 Gen which is a system in itself, the Twin Drive as a unit goes beyond each Drives and into actual other parts of the suit. Wherever your tapping the powerplant system from, as long as its part or near of said system the effectiveness in tapping would be similar to doing it with the Drive Components and only less effective if tapped away from the whole Twin Drive System flow in general (as opposed to just the Drive Components).

Also, its important to note that producing the same particle production output does not necessarily extend to external visible output (which is particles you purposely want to direct outward for whatever reason). Its just how you direct the output that the Drives make. Susanowo, Masurao, Cherudim and Aheads are examples of this in which case the Drives produce particles but are not appearing to release anything. So you can have for example the shield Drive externally release a lot of particles and still not have any visible torso Drive output (which is impossible because it does not have any direct exclusive release valves anyways) because the actual production may be directed to other systems that are not visible.

In the Raiser Sword example, I'm of the opinion that the Twin Drive spikes out larger particles in Trans-Am so it would need a large external release output just to ensure that it does not overload as well as to counterbalance the shot/sword generated from the front like KH said.

[GN0010 Nosferatu]

Can't we all just get a long!

[SonicSP]

But we are getting a long, we're all just discussing stuff like we're always do.

[GN0010 Nosferatu]

Nah, I sensed...discrepancies.

[Scorpiopt]

Never thought my question cause so much discussion o.o

[T-T-Thunder!]

I've got another question in regards to the Brave, or in fact the whole Flag/Enact series.

What's the purpose of that "light tattoo" that flashes across their visors every so often? Just a dramatic thing, or has this ever been given an actual purpose?

I was just noticing that my RD Brave Custom comes with two extra faces showing two different "flashes" on the visor, yet only comes with one beam saber. Kinda weird.

[GN0010 Nosferatu]

If I recall correctly, the visor and flash effect is to intimidate enemies.

[SonicSP]

Originally Posted by T-T-Thunder!

I've got another question in regards to the Brave, or in fact the whole Flag/Enact series.

What's the purpose of that "light tattoo" that flashes across their visors every so often? Just a dramatic thing, or has this ever been given an actual purpose?

I was just noticing that my RD Brave Custom comes with two extra faces showing two different "flashes" on the visor, yet only comes with one beam saber. Kinda weird.

Likely just a visual thing to complete the "powerful war machine" feel. Kind of like Gundams and their eyes "lighting up" effect.