AnimeSuki Forums

Colonel- · 2004-03-17, 13:28

Spoiler:

Last time i watch the oav was when i was a kid -.-

7hor · 2004-03-17, 21:34

They've changed lots of stuff that I can remember,

Spoiler:

Fntc · 2004-03-18, 01:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by 7hor

This is a an old remake of the OVA in the 80s, where Shin had a crusader and then got an f-5 II

Remember, the OVAs are a bastardization of the story of the original manga. Tons of stuff was removed, other events altered, and others changed beyond recognition. All sorts of cool stuff happened in the manga. xD

The TV series appears to be an even BIGGER alteration of the manga....

...regarding the odd mix of aircraft, remember that the original story takes place starting in 1979 (IIRC this is when Shin is first taken to Asran). The aircraft everyone starts off with are pretty believable at the time (Shin has an F-8, Mick an F-100, Greg an A-4, rebels have lots of Mig-17s and some MiG-21s etc.) What was unrealistic at the time is when Mick gets ahold of an F-14, Greg an A-10, etc. These are top-of-the-line brand new aircraft in this time period! In fact the story even mentions that these are near-impossible to get but somehow McCoy is able to get them (Greg offers McCoy all the money in his account to get the A-10, that must be a BUTTLOAD of money.... and poor old Shin's struggling to make his paltry $1.5 mil)

7hor · 2004-03-18, 01:49

Ah, I wasn't even aware there was manga :P Me=n00b

Sis-con Boya · 2004-03-18, 02:45

Antoine de Saint-Exupery Anime Kraze what the hell ?

What children's book, grrrrr

I had it as a school obligatory lecture when I was 18.
Didn't like it too much but I think it's widely considered as one of the "the Great Books". I've seen programs on Discovery about it.

ACTUALLY, you can pick up 60% of all girls by refering to that book, apparently chicks love it.

I mean, when I ask a girl what books does she like I often hear Little Prince this , Little Prince that.

anyways - I like Area 88 (and AniKraze thanks for subbing it) and this is my first post on Animesuki forums.

moose · 2004-03-21, 00:50

i am interested in the differnences in the manga and the ova summary. The manga I read had a different ending not like the ova and several parts were missing as far has the zanaki backdrop. Is this true or was i reading something wrong

Kasshin · 2004-03-21, 01:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sis-con Boya

Antoine de Saint-Exupery Anime Kraze what the hell ?

What children's book, grrrrr

I had it as a school obligatory lecture when I was 18.
Didn't like it too much but I think it's widely considered as one of the "the Great Books". I've seen programs on Discovery about it.

ACTUALLY, you can pick up 60% of all girls by refering to that book, apparently chicks love it.

I mean, when I ask a girl what books does she like I often hear Little Prince this , Little Prince that.

anyways - I like Area 88 (and AniKraze thanks for subbing it) and this is my first post on Animesuki forums.

I read it when I was ~10...

But I think it's a great book... not just for children definitely. But I think it was intended for children.

7hor · 2004-04-02, 23:23

Just watched 9, great ep, I love those super sams the enemy uses only while they are ya know, not over their base :P I want that t shirt of the crusader

Gold_Rogers · 2004-04-03, 01:20

Nothing wrong with referencing Little Prince...it's one of the best books I've ever read. I don't think it's childish at all. In fact, it uses very simple metaphors to describe human emotions and habits that might seem very complicated (even to adults).

I'm a softy at heart...

7hor · 2004-04-03, 17:05

Speed releases, good job by Anime-Kraze. I like how that mig23 took about oh 50 bullets, and the f-4s get grazed and BOOM. I know f-4s are the most manuverable fighters, but they are just always cannon fodder in the show

We all like corn XD

Sis-con Boya · 2004-04-04, 17:20

I've seen those episodes too. Nice, but I really can't stand this little guy who flies in Harrier - I've heard he wasn't in the manga - Lately they must include some little kawaii brat in every series

Ok, I don't know how to use those nice spoiler tags so anybody forgive me if it doesn't work

Spoiler:

Little Prince rulzzz

Rick_Hunter · 2004-04-04, 21:04

I'm going to attempt to dispel all of the myths that people have been saying about this show.

1. OVA details--The basic story of Area 88, besides the glimpse of what it means to become a soldier and always want to return to civilian life, is the life on a mercenary air base. Area 88 is headed by Saki who, according to the OVA, is the son of the King of Asran (Aslan, whatever) whose brother leads the rebel forces (the russians) in an attempt to take over the sandbox that is their country. Mickey is obviously the token American pilot, but the way he gets his Tomcat is very peculiar. In the OVA, he gets it at the start of the 3rd episode and uses it right away in a massive dogfight with some MiGs. In fact, that's the way the episode starts--in the air. In the show, it's under the premise that he actually stole the F-14 and landed it somewhere in Africa. How he did this is beyond me, but Area 88 still wouldn't be the series it is if Mickey didn't have his Tomcat.

2. All dates about the original Area 88 manga point to 1987. However, many of us already know that the OVA/anime was created 1985. Being conservative, let's just say that the manga was created in 1980, ok? All of the plane designs that are seen in the show have histories that date back to at most the 1950s, making them optimal for export to other nations, so there is little chance that this a 'US needs liquidity, so it sells off part of it's air force' scenario. The F-4 Phantom II, for example, was in service by 1961 and in the Air Force reserve by 1980--perfect for export. (How they managed to put guns on a GUNLESS craft is beyond me. Likewise, the F-15 Eagle came into service in 1972. About 10 years later, Israeli F-15s decimated the Egyptian air force. My point here is that given types of planes being flown, it's completely logical that a menagerie of planes like this would exist at one base. One last point--Many of the planes seen in the show are still in service today, not scrapped. The F-4 wasn't decommissioned until about 1996, and it's still in use in a number of non-superpower countries today.

In addition, since Saki's position is that of ruler of his country, it is logical that he can buy all of these planes for his own air force. Keep in mind that the pilots are not buying the planes themselves, they're buying them THROUGH McCoy and the government. Notice how there's the opposite of the rebels using strictly Soviet designs while Saki's gov't forces use American and European designs. The only problem with Asran is the shortage of pilots, a fact that he overcomes with hiring mercenaries. The idea isn't completely hairbrained--in the 1960s, european mercenary pilots fought for Congolese rebels. However, it seems that it's mostly the rebels that use mercenary pilots because the national pilots are more than likely connected to the government. In the OVA, though, we do get to see the rebels hire an entire squadron of mercenaries (the Wolfpack--anyone remember the second air level from UN Squadron) to take out Area 88.

3. The six planes used in UN Squadron were:
F-8E Crusader
F-20 Tiger
F-14 Tomcat
A-10A Warthog
YF-23 Stealth Ray
F200 Efreet

No one in their right mind would believe that the Stealth ray is a real plane. Somehow, stealth technology leaked out and this is a programmer's conception. The only plane I have contention with is the Efreet--I don't know if that's it's real name. Plus, it looks too much like that psychicly controlled plane from the Clint Eastwood movie, Foxfire?

4. The animation for Area 88, the TV series is just that, a TV series. Just like Read or Die, the animators had to cut corners where they could to get the best product out of the show. I think that the animation now has definitely gotten better from animation in the beginning of the series. I hold episode 9, the canyon run, as proof. I also think that they were trying to go for the cell-shaded look, as that seems to be the fad nowadays. Two teams probably work on the background and actual animation and another team on the CG animation. The CG team more than likely does not have to worry about a 2D runway when they're showing a dogfight, and plus they would be hard pressed to gauge where a runway would be if they didn't have the cel.

Comparing the CG in this TV series to another series such as Macross Zero OVA is like comparing a pro to an amateur. It has nothing to do with advances; it's all about the time and money.

5. The OVA (or the manga for that matter, because I've only seen reviews for 6 issues) does not make any mention of Kitori or Kim. The animators probably used this to lure fans. They did use harriers in the OVA, however, they were only used by the more wealthy rebels and shot the hell out of the Area 88 pilots. And in UN Squadron, they were some of the most annoying planes, coming out of nowhere to fly straight at you.....from behind.

6. We understand that a lot of this show if farfetched. I mean, who would create a massive frame of iron girders called the 'Fangs' to deal with low approaching planes only to have two Crusaders slip through because they flipped their wings up???? Deal with it. Don't get me started on how the hell Kanzaki supposedly takes over JAL and runs it in the ground within the span of Shin's mercenary contract. It's just not feasible, so we have to overlook that. The japanese have come up with weirder stuff like mecha, so seeing a pilot without a RIO is cake to me. Also, how exciting would it be if the show was nothing but missile kills? Pretty damn boring in my opinion. Shoot, dodge, shoot, dodge. The series blends the idea of the classic dogfight with modern technology.

Yes, I am a rabid fan of this series, ever since I played UN Squadron, so I guess I take stuff like this very seriously. This remake is already in my Top 10.

Togabito_Ion · 2004-04-04, 21:31

Oh oh... Kim's actually a fairly major character in the manga. Kitori and Makoto are TV series only characters, however Makoto's based off of another character in the manga- he shows up in the OVA as well- Rocky. I believe that Shin, Saki, and Mickey are all treated as the main characters in it.

The reason you keep getting 1987 for the manga is because that's the date that Area 88 was released in the US thanks to Viz. Unfortunately, Viz didn't get more than... I believe 40-some odd issues and eventually dropped it due to lack of interest. It's sad, because the manga is brilliant, I believe. However, the manga was originally published in the Sounen Big Comics magazine in 1979. I believe it ran at least 6 years on and off, as it is 172 chapters long. Vol 15 of 23 tankouban was published in 1984.

I'm betting that the TV series is an attempt to retell the story of the OVAs, but with a new 'twist' and pulling new sources from the original manga. They're making Kanzaki a bit more active of a character, as he and Saki actually play very major roles in the later half of the manga series.

The story that the OVAs take somewhat leads back to the events of around... vol 16 or so, if I can guess. It was a 'good end' to leave it off on, but the series, despite regular expectations, actually has a happy ending. Bittersweet, but it's happy. At least, it is for Shin.

Both the OVAs and the TV series, in my view, have been good adaptations of the original story. The only unfortunate thing, is that there's no way to do a series long enough to put all the nuances and such of the original manga into one run without butchering it. I think it's a brilliant show, The 'modernization' of Shintani's artowkr is really well done, in my opinion, and they've captured the characters very well.

That's a lot more than I can say about other manga-based series that are currently running right now.

Another random note- the planes, as they are listed in the manga are:

F-100D Super Saber (This was, I believe, Mickey's original plane in the manga)
Kfir C2 (Saki's jet)
A-4E Skyhawk (Greg's)
Seaharrier FRS.1 (Kim's)
F-8E Crusader (Shin's first plane)
J35F Draken (I'm not sure who this one belongs to)
F-5E Tiger II (Shin's second plane)
F-20 Tigershark (Shin's third plane)

Rick_Hunter · 2004-04-04, 23:11

If they could bring back Bucky, the only pilot to date to fly with a Captain Hook-style hook, then I would never think a bad thing about Area 88 ever again.

7hor · 2004-04-05, 00:31

The YF-23 was a real plane, but it was called the widow or black widow or something like that, it was in competition with the F-22, the yf-23 also had a very small cross section like the f-22, making it "stealthy." I'll have to boot up my game and see what it looks like in there, I remeber a few really weird planes in there playing it a long time ago

Panon · 2004-04-05, 01:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Togabito_Ion

The story that the OVAs take somewhat leads back to the events of around... vol 16 or so, if I can guess. It was a 'good end' to leave it off on, but the series, despite regular expectations, actually has a happy ending. Bittersweet, but it's happy. At least, it is for Shin.

A lot of people didn't like the OVA ending, but the manga ending was a HUGE copout.

I'm actually very interested to see which angle the tv series is going to take, or whether it's going to put it's own spin on thing.

Mickey and Shin's conversation at the end of episode 10 made me think they might be heading more towards the manga's style of ending.

Don Eunuch · 2004-04-11, 06:04

A question for those military hardware fans.
Can a anti-material sniper rifle round punch through a typical APC armor?

Also who is worse?

The person who takes photos of people dying for money.
OR
The person who kills people in a war for money.

User15353 · 2004-04-11, 12:39

APC == Armored Personal Carrier ?

I'd say no ... or you'll need something really BIG ...

-> The Killer

7hor · 2004-04-11, 18:47

The sniper episode had me laughing though, lets say he could take out a APC, because he is taking out planes left and right, call in the other part of the military on your side, get the army to bring a tank, what is he going to do, put a round in the turret? :P

lt_shiro · 2004-04-11, 19:58

Sniper episode was the best so for this season. I wonder if He or She will return for next season of Area 88.

p.s. How long is this season?

2004-03-17, 13:28	Link #81
Colonel- Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Ca	Spoiler: Well, if Shin and his Tigershark returns to fight with the last 7 surviving aircraft (base commander among them, i remember that he'slike the son of the enemy's leader) against the enemy horde, then it stays true to the OVA Last time i watch the oav was when i was a kid -.-

2004-03-17, 21:34	Link #82
7hor Full Metal Physicist Join Date: Dec 2003	They've changed lots of stuff that I can remember, Spoiler: Sadly, the only example I can think is when Boris goes out and dies, Mickey and Shin were with him, Kim didn't even exist in the OVA. And don't think there was Kitori either.

2004-03-18, 02:45	Link #85
Sis-con Boya Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2004	Antoine de Saint-Exupery Anime Kraze what the hell ? What children's book, grrrrr I had it as a school obligatory lecture when I was 18. Didn't like it too much but I think it's widely considered as one of the "the Great Books". I've seen programs on Discovery about it. ACTUALLY, you can pick up 60% of all girls by refering to that book, apparently chicks love it. I mean, when I ask a girl what books does she like I often hear Little Prince this , Little Prince that. anyways - I like Area 88 (and AniKraze thanks for subbing it) and this is my first post on Animesuki forums. Last edited by Sis-con Boya; 2004-03-18 at 02:57.

2004-03-21, 00:50	Link #86
moose Junior Member Join Date: May 2003	great stuff i am interested in the differnences in the manga and the ova summary. The manga I read had a different ending not like the ova and several parts were missing as far has the zanaki backdrop. Is this true or was i reading something wrong Last edited by moose; 2004-03-21 at 01:01.

2004-04-04, 17:20	Link #91
Sis-con Boya Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2004	I've seen those episodes too. Nice, but I really can't stand this little guy who flies in Harrier - I've heard he wasn't in the manga - Lately they must include some little kawaii brat in every series Ok, I don't know how to use those nice spoiler tags so anybody forgive me if it doesn't work Spoiler: Also, I didn't enjoy the fact that Patrick was shot down so easily. At least he could have taken out the brat Little Prince rulzzz

2004-03-18, 01:49	Link #84
7hor Full Metal Physicist Join Date: Dec 2003	Ah, I wasn't even aware there was manga :P Me=n00b

2004-04-02, 23:23	Link #88
7hor Full Metal Physicist Join Date: Dec 2003	Just watched 9, great ep, I love those super sams the enemy uses only while they are ya know, not over their base :P I want that t shirt of the crusader

2004-04-03, 01:20	Link #89
Gold_Rogers Famous Dead Pirate Join Date: Mar 2004	Nothing wrong with referencing Little Prince...it's one of the best books I've ever read. I don't think it's childish at all. In fact, it uses very simple metaphors to describe human emotions and habits that might seem very complicated (even to adults). I'm a softy at heart...

2004-04-03, 17:05	Link #90
7hor Full Metal Physicist Join Date: Dec 2003	Speed releases, good job by Anime-Kraze. I like how that mig23 took about oh 50 bullets, and the f-4s get grazed and BOOM. I know f-4s are the most manuverable fighters, but they are just always cannon fodder in the show We all like corn XD

2004-04-04, 21:04	Link #92
Rick_Hunter Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2004	I'm going to attempt to dispel all of the myths that people have been saying about this show. 1. OVA details--The basic story of Area 88, besides the glimpse of what it means to become a soldier and always want to return to civilian life, is the life on a mercenary air base. Area 88 is headed by Saki who, according to the OVA, is the son of the King of Asran (Aslan, whatever) whose brother leads the rebel forces (the russians) in an attempt to take over the sandbox that is their country. Mickey is obviously the token American pilot, but the way he gets his Tomcat is very peculiar. In the OVA, he gets it at the start of the 3rd episode and uses it right away in a massive dogfight with some MiGs. In fact, that's the way the episode starts--in the air. In the show, it's under the premise that he actually stole the F-14 and landed it somewhere in Africa. How he did this is beyond me, but Area 88 still wouldn't be the series it is if Mickey didn't have his Tomcat. 2. All dates about the original Area 88 manga point to 1987. However, many of us already know that the OVA/anime was created 1985. Being conservative, let's just say that the manga was created in 1980, ok? All of the plane designs that are seen in the show have histories that date back to at most the 1950s, making them optimal for export to other nations, so there is little chance that this a 'US needs liquidity, so it sells off part of it's air force' scenario. The F-4 Phantom II, for example, was in service by 1961 and in the Air Force reserve by 1980--perfect for export. (How they managed to put guns on a GUNLESS craft is beyond me. Likewise, the F-15 Eagle came into service in 1972. About 10 years later, Israeli F-15s decimated the Egyptian air force. My point here is that given types of planes being flown, it's completely logical that a menagerie of planes like this would exist at one base. One last point--Many of the planes seen in the show are still in service today, not scrapped. The F-4 wasn't decommissioned until about 1996, and it's still in use in a number of non-superpower countries today. In addition, since Saki's position is that of ruler of his country, it is logical that he can buy all of these planes for his own air force. Keep in mind that the pilots are not buying the planes themselves, they're buying them THROUGH McCoy and the government. Notice how there's the opposite of the rebels using strictly Soviet designs while Saki's gov't forces use American and European designs. The only problem with Asran is the shortage of pilots, a fact that he overcomes with hiring mercenaries. The idea isn't completely hairbrained--in the 1960s, european mercenary pilots fought for Congolese rebels. However, it seems that it's mostly the rebels that use mercenary pilots because the national pilots are more than likely connected to the government. In the OVA, though, we do get to see the rebels hire an entire squadron of mercenaries (the Wolfpack--anyone remember the second air level from UN Squadron) to take out Area 88. 3. The six planes used in UN Squadron were: F-8E Crusader F-20 Tiger F-14 Tomcat A-10A Warthog YF-23 Stealth Ray F200 Efreet No one in their right mind would believe that the Stealth ray is a real plane. Somehow, stealth technology leaked out and this is a programmer's conception. The only plane I have contention with is the Efreet--I don't know if that's it's real name. Plus, it looks too much like that psychicly controlled plane from the Clint Eastwood movie, Foxfire? 4. The animation for Area 88, the TV series is just that, a TV series. Just like Read or Die, the animators had to cut corners where they could to get the best product out of the show. I think that the animation now has definitely gotten better from animation in the beginning of the series. I hold episode 9, the canyon run, as proof. I also think that they were trying to go for the cell-shaded look, as that seems to be the fad nowadays. Two teams probably work on the background and actual animation and another team on the CG animation. The CG team more than likely does not have to worry about a 2D runway when they're showing a dogfight, and plus they would be hard pressed to gauge where a runway would be if they didn't have the cel. Comparing the CG in this TV series to another series such as Macross Zero OVA is like comparing a pro to an amateur. It has nothing to do with advances; it's all about the time and money. 5. The OVA (or the manga for that matter, because I've only seen reviews for 6 issues) does not make any mention of Kitori or Kim. The animators probably used this to lure fans. They did use harriers in the OVA, however, they were only used by the more wealthy rebels and shot the hell out of the Area 88 pilots. And in UN Squadron, they were some of the most annoying planes, coming out of nowhere to fly straight at you.....from behind. 6. We understand that a lot of this show if farfetched. I mean, who would create a massive frame of iron girders called the 'Fangs' to deal with low approaching planes only to have two Crusaders slip through because they flipped their wings up???? Deal with it. Don't get me started on how the hell Kanzaki supposedly takes over JAL and runs it in the ground within the span of Shin's mercenary contract. It's just not feasible, so we have to overlook that. The japanese have come up with weirder stuff like mecha, so seeing a pilot without a RIO is cake to me. Also, how exciting would it be if the show was nothing but missile kills? Pretty damn boring in my opinion. Shoot, dodge, shoot, dodge. The series blends the idea of the classic dogfight with modern technology. Yes, I am a rabid fan of this series, ever since I played UN Squadron, so I guess I take stuff like this very seriously. This remake is already in my Top 10.

2004-04-04, 21:31	Link #93
Togabito_Ion Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Dallas, Texas Age: 45	Oh oh... Kim's actually a fairly major character in the manga. Kitori and Makoto are TV series only characters, however Makoto's based off of another character in the manga- he shows up in the OVA as well- Rocky. I believe that Shin, Saki, and Mickey are all treated as the main characters in it. The reason you keep getting 1987 for the manga is because that's the date that Area 88 was released in the US thanks to Viz. Unfortunately, Viz didn't get more than... I believe 40-some odd issues and eventually dropped it due to lack of interest. It's sad, because the manga is brilliant, I believe. However, the manga was originally published in the Sounen Big Comics magazine in 1979. I believe it ran at least 6 years on and off, as it is 172 chapters long. Vol 15 of 23 tankouban was published in 1984. I'm betting that the TV series is an attempt to retell the story of the OVAs, but with a new 'twist' and pulling new sources from the original manga. They're making Kanzaki a bit more active of a character, as he and Saki actually play very major roles in the later half of the manga series. The story that the OVAs take somewhat leads back to the events of around... vol 16 or so, if I can guess. It was a 'good end' to leave it off on, but the series, despite regular expectations, actually has a happy ending. Bittersweet, but it's happy. At least, it is for Shin. Both the OVAs and the TV series, in my view, have been good adaptations of the original story. The only unfortunate thing, is that there's no way to do a series long enough to put all the nuances and such of the original manga into one run without butchering it. I think it's a brilliant show, The 'modernization' of Shintani's artowkr is really well done, in my opinion, and they've captured the characters very well. That's a lot more than I can say about other manga-based series that are currently running right now. Another random note- the planes, as they are listed in the manga are: F-100D Super Saber (This was, I believe, Mickey's original plane in the manga) Kfir C2 (Saki's jet) A-4E Skyhawk (Greg's) Seaharrier FRS.1 (Kim's) F-8E Crusader (Shin's first plane) J35F Draken (I'm not sure who this one belongs to) F-5E Tiger II (Shin's second plane) F-20 Tigershark (Shin's third plane)

2004-04-04, 23:11	Link #94
Rick_Hunter Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2004	If they could bring back Bucky, the only pilot to date to fly with a Captain Hook-style hook, then I would never think a bad thing about Area 88 ever again.

2004-04-05, 00:31	Link #95
7hor Full Metal Physicist Join Date: Dec 2003	The YF-23 was a real plane, but it was called the widow or black widow or something like that, it was in competition with the F-22, the yf-23 also had a very small cross section like the f-22, making it "stealthy." I'll have to boot up my game and see what it looks like in there, I remeber a few really weird planes in there playing it a long time ago

2004-04-11, 06:04	Link #97
Don Eunuch Lin Er Join Date: May 2003	A question for those military hardware fans. Can a anti-material sniper rifle round punch through a typical APC armor? Also who is worse? The person who takes photos of people dying for money. OR The person who kills people in a war for money.

2004-04-11, 12:39	Link #98
User15353 Inactive Member Join Date: Apr 2004	APC == Armored Personal Carrier ? I'd say no ... or you'll need something really BIG ... -> The Killer

2004-04-11, 18:47	Link #99
7hor Full Metal Physicist Join Date: Dec 2003	The sniper episode had me laughing though, lets say he could take out a APC, because he is taking out planes left and right, call in the other part of the military on your side, get the army to bring a tank, what is he going to do, put a round in the turret? :P

2004-04-11, 19:58	Link #100
lt_shiro Junior Member Join Date: May 2003 Age: 43	Sniper episode was the best so for this season. I wonder if He or She will return for next season of Area 88. p.s. How long is this season?