Spice and Wolf II - Episode 3 Discussion / Poll

[Zek]

Spoiler:

Can somebody explain the contract to me? Why does Lawrence have to raise money? It sounded to me like the offer was that Amarti would raise the cash and pay Lawrence just for the chance to propose to Horo, and she's not obligated to agree. Putting aside Horo's change of heart, why didn't Lawrence just plan to take his money and have Horo reject him?

[Intranetusa]

Originally Posted by Somnus

That being said, Amarti can burn in hell. If they end up...finishing what the previews show then I hope he burns before he gets there. Seriously, now I understand the hate from last episode's discussion.

I'll be there to cremate what's left of his ashes...

[aulzon]

Can somebody explain the contract to me? Why does Lawrence have to raise money? It sounded to me like the offer was that Amarti would raise the cash and pay Lawrence just for the chance to propose to Horo, and she's not obligated to agree. Putting aside Horo's change of heart, why didn't Lawrence just plan to take his money and have Horo reject him?

Basically Amati wanted to free Horo from her debt from Lawrence so he can marry her.
Amati values Horo's debt to Lawrence as 1000 silver coins.
So Amati is going to raise the money to pay off Horo's debt to Lawrence so Horo can be free to marry Amati.

This does not mean however that if Amati pays 1000 silver coins to Lawrence that Horo will leave Lawrence and marry Amati. Horo is just free to do what she likes. Even though, in a way, she is already free to do that. But the problem lies in the Yoitsu situation and Horo's despair.

[Zippicus]

Originally Posted by Ashlotte

Why in the blue blazes would you want them to not devote attention to this "particular problem" when its the crux of basically everything...Thats like wishing for a war movie not to pay much mind to the war. *boggle*

Ah anyway easily 10/10...While the easy going parts of the show are fantastic fun it's nice to see them already getting to the issues they've been lining up for this series since those dreams Horo had in episode 00. Her hysterics were both painful and sobering to see, but I can say I've found even more respect for the multi-facetedness that is her character now more then ever...

It's just that the overly dramatic relationship issues that have popped up are not the reason I was attracted to the show in the first place. The sooner they resolve this the better. I can understand why they introduced this into the story, it just didn't need to be on "11" (not sure how many will get that ).

[cicero]

Originally Posted by Yuutsu

I don't recall there having been a reference to Yoitsu being destroyed in the first season. Same thing with the first novel; instead, I think it was first hinted at in season 2, with a brief flashback to when a young Lawrence was still with his mother (in that inn-looking place).

I may be wrong though. I have pretty damn good memory, but I make the silliest mistakes and have brain farts at the most random moment.

That second line describes me as well actually. I'd forgotten entirely about episode 00. Maybe it was there. I'd go back and check but I'm currently isolated from all my videos (which is why I haven't checked already).

[Dark Wing]

It took me a minute to catch up but I'm glad I did because things are really starting to get interesting. God I love this series...

[Akitostarwind]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Somnus View Post
That being said, Amarti can burn in hell. If they end up...finishing what the previews show then I hope he burns before he gets there. Seriously, now I understand the hate from last episode's discussion.

I'll be there to cremate what's left of his ashes...

Just let me work him over before we kill him. But Lawrence needs to put forth a showing effort in front of horo to win her back.. but yes I rank horo just under belldandy by like .1% on those you don't ever want to see cry.

[Anh_Minh]

Originally Posted by MeoTwister5

Also am I the only one pissed off that Lawrence was so bold as to wager Horo's trust in him for money? He believed that Horo trusted him enough that he could use it to earn him a huge sum of money and that she would go with him at the end of the deal anyway. It begs the question whether Horo's trust in him was directly equatable to money (good lord) or if he was willing to sell her off to the highest bidder.

That doesn't speak well of him.

Well, what else could he have done? If he'd refused, he'd have passed either for an asshole forcing Horo to stay with him, or for a lovestruck idiot. Neither would be good for his reputation.

Originally Posted by Sorrow-K

That's what I thought, which reminds me of another point I forgot to bring up.

Lawrence probably has "known" about Yoitsu this entire time, but he's simply forgotten it until recently. His meeting with Deanna probably confirmed his suspicion about the legend which he'd been told in a distant past memory. So, I think sometime just before his meeting with Deanna, but long after he began traveling with Horo, was when he remembered about Yoitsu. I wouldn't say that absolves him of keeping the secret from Horo, but it's much less uncommunicative (for lack of a better word) than keeping it from her from the beginning.

What else could he have done? "Oh, hey, I've heard your town was destroyed. Maybe. I think." What good could it have done?

At first, it was just a vaguely remembered rumor he never investigated because he never planned to go there. Then it was a legend. He wanted to learn the present status of Yoitsu before filling Horo with worry. Or at least be a bit more certain of what happened. It's understandable and reasonable, even if it blew up in his face this time.

Originally Posted by Zek

Spoiler:

Can somebody explain the contract to me? Why does Lawrence have to raise money? It sounded to me like the offer was that Amarti would raise the cash and pay Lawrence just for the chance to propose to Horo, and she's not obligated to agree. Putting aside Horo's change of heart, why didn't Lawrence just plan to take his money and have Horo reject him?

He doesn't actually have to make money - he could have sat on his thumbs. But that'd be missing an occasion to make a profit, which to a merchant is a no-no. Besides, he'd feel more secure if he could mess up Amati's plan - especially now.



And guys, I really don't see what you reproach Amati. So he fell in love with Horo. Can you blame him?

He's mistaken about her relationship with Lawrence - but that's essentially because she lied to him, and he chose to believe her. Heck, he's not that far off either - Horo and Lawrence aren't actually lovers.

[Shiroth]

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

And guys, I really don't see what you reproach Amati. So he fell in love with Horo. Can you blame him?

He's mistaken about her relationship with Lawrence - but that's essentially because she lied to him,and he chose to believe her. Heck, he's not that far off either - Horo and Lawrence aren't actually lovers.

I'm pretty sure a lto of people see Amati as the bad guy in this, and don't really care for his feeling, or his side of the story. A shame i know, because like you've pointed out he's done nothing wrong. Just listening to what he's being told, and fell in love.

[MeoTwister5]

You have to hand it to Amati though, he's willing to almost ruin himself financially for a chance at Horo. That's a very noble and romantic gesture, if not a bit extreme. Too bad Lawrence still isn't catching on.

[Mr. Anime]

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

And guys, I really don't see what you reproach Amati. So he fell in love with Horo. Can you blame him?

He's mistaken about her relationship with Lawrence - but that's essentially because she lied to him,and he chose to believe her. Heck, he's not that far off either - Horo and Lawrence aren't actually lovers.

yea i dont dislike amati either, basically he s a rly good guy^^. Maybe a little bit naive, but thats kinda cute. ANYWAY LAWRENCE TAKE HER BACK AND MAKE HER URS

[Kaguya]

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

He doesn't actually have to make money - he could have sat on his thumbs. But that'd be missing an occasion to make a profit, which to a merchant is a no-no. Besides, he'd feel more secure if he could mess up Amati's plan - especially now.

But it is a choice which must not be chosen.

Making Amati's plan go wrong shows that Lawrence does not trust Horo.

[Anh_Minh]

On the contrary: she said it herself. She wants to see him exert himself. He's cuter with his back to the wall, and it shows he values her (as opposed to taking her for granted).

[golthin]

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

On the contrary: she said it herself. She wants to see him exert himself. He's cuter with his back to the wall, and it shows he values her (as opposed to taking her for granted).

Horo is Wicked...Still, Lawrence is at fault too, he allowed another man to take his lady on a date.
Mark tried to explain this to Lawrence...Lawrence might be a good merchant but he is naive when it comes to thing of the heart.

[Mr Hat and Clogs]

Good episode, good episode. Horo's breakdown was sad to see, the girl really is afraid of being alone. I'm looking forward to whats going to happen next, it's interesting and a little sneaky.

You guys really are being a bit harsh on Amati, he's just a boy that's love struck. His methods are odd by modern standards though. Either way all this will be a good experience for him no matter the outcome!

[silverwolf0]

Isn't the whole debt thing a scam anyway? Why is everyone in on it and talking about it like they take no moral issue with it and its just business? Horo lied about her situation and the gang is running with it to basically ruin Amarti. I wasn't much into the whole emotional part of the episode because I just had a big question mark over my head about the whole marriage ordeal, not to mention the victim being a generous friend/benefactor at that.

[Anh_Minh]

No, she really is in debt to Lawrence. For all those apples at the end of arc 1, and various expenses he's incurred since he met her. Of course, you have to subtract what she's helped him with - the bargaining for the pelts, and her share of the gold smuggling.

Though it's true her debt's not as big as what Amati's willing to pay, but he probably wanted to sweeten the pot for Lawrence. Give him an offer he couldn't refuse.

Also, he's not going to be ruined: he couldn't be a good husband and provider as a pauper. He's confident he'll have not only the 1000 silver coins, but enough funds to continue his business.

But yeah - as I said earlier, it's skirting dangerously close to a con. Lawrence is fortunate everyone can see it only happened because of Amati fell head over heels, and that he (Lawrence) never wanted that.

[typhonsentra]

For those of you terrified by the episode preview....

Spoiler:

Don't read too much into it. Check the tint they use when they open the scene. Notice anything familiar?

And yeah, it can't be said enough how well Koshimizu handles her character, her and Fukuyama really bring to life an already very well written story.

And for the question above: Yes she's in debt but nowhere near for the amount she quoted Amarti.

So yeah, it's still a scam.

[Daniel E.]

Originally Posted by typhonsentra

For those of you terrified by the episode preview....

Spoiler:

Don't read too much into it. Check the tint they use when they open the scene. Notice anything familiar?

Yeah, I though so too.

That part is probably Lawrence just imagining the worst possible scenario.

[kamehameha]

what day is this anime usually subbed on lol. need to watch episode 4