Needless

[Ynot]

Spoiler for 109:

Originally Posted by Avvesione

Also, I'm kinda curious why Triple Six picked Gido to save Kasumi and Eve N in their lab. It seems kinda strange that they called him in and prepared the syringe for him to use to go rescue Eve N and stop the Angel from entering the Triple Six lab. Maybe there's something more to Gido that we don't know about and maybe that's why he joined Triple Six...

I wonder if it all wasn't just a setup by the 666 committee to provide Gido with enough motivation to take the final step and inject himself with Edenseed. I think it was Disk who said somewhere fragments/powers awaken when there's an urgent need and Gido was presented with an excellent situation to awaken power rivalling that of an Angel. Still it seems rather crazy when they already had a clone of the 2nd christ to risk their Eve with such a trick so it might as well be a "lucky coincidence".

The biggest question in my mind is, "is Gido willing to sacrifice Eve(taking back Kasumi's brain) to heal Kasumi?" Eve is her little sister and she can't possible be happy to be healed when her sister has to pay the price. Her dying wish was to become one with Karin and Gido would take that into account. BUT! He didn't just cart her out, showing her to everyone just for shits and giggles, right??

The only other thing I can think of is Gido trying to get all of the stigmata which according to Uten allows you to do anything. Perhaps he's hoping that includes healing Kasumi without having to sacrifice Eve. That would mean they are still short on one stigmata. Perhaps Arclight was allowed to do the dirty work so Gido could step in when almost all of the stigmata were collected. Saten has been very protective of Yamada and is working together with Gido. That makes me wonder if yamada has the last stigmata needed for pulling of a miracle and whether they know/suspect he has it.

Btw we've seen that guy who gave Gido the syringe once before in chapter 46. He was standing in the background while Ishiyama was saying something. Can't remember seeing him anywhere else though.

[Kurohane]

Spoiler for spoiler:

I doubt Cruz has it. I mean we don't even know the full extent of his powers. Really, if Saten wanted to get a stigmata off Cruz, he would have helped Simeon capture him and extract it llike they did with Teruyama. Instead he let him roam free. Plus he personally fed two stigmata holders to Arclight. I doubt Cruz would be treated no different if he had stigmata. When there was such a sure way to get it, I doubt he would have left it up toCruz himself to awaken it, especially when the progress has been so slow. Cruz has been at hi emotional limits plenty of times with no power awakening untill the last one after he personally saw Aruka die. We still don't know the full details behind that case.

The stigmata holder must be close, otherwise events wouldn't have unfolded as they have, but unlikely Cruz is the last one. Maybe Saten is secretly branding two stigmata, or Setsuna got her wish and she is the last one. Maybe even one of the other girls squad members have it.

[Avvesione]

Originally Posted by Sayo A.

Spoiler for 109:

Not sure why you think Gido's using that, given that (as far as we know) it has no offensive capability...

We don't know that but judging from appearance alone...

Spoiler:

...I'd say that both attacks are similar. That and Shield of Aegis has a fundamental Fragment in this arc and it appears that it was also the Fragment that Ishiyama and Gido used to dispel Seth's Stigmata Gravitation.

Also, if there's this whole Cruz/Stigmata/Kasumi/Mengroze thing going on, it might make sense that Saten and Gido and everyone else are looking for the final Stigmata in Cruz.

Originally Posted by Kurusu-Shirudo

Don't you think this whole arc and the past ones are ridiculing the anime adaptation?

-Cruz: needless, precious subject to the most deceiving person in the whole history.
-Blade: unable to beat Arclight in equal conditions, learns more fragments.
-Eve: The only part she has of Kasumi is half the brain, the body is Kasumi's little sister, Karin.
-Gido: needless, head of Triple Six, and one of the most powerful.
-Teruyama: one of the 12 holders of the stigmata, infused with Arclight's eden seed.
-Disk: capable of much more than you thought.
-Seth: one of the 12 holders of the stigmata, infused with Arclight's eden seed, killed.
-Solva: one of the 12 holders of the stigmata, killed.
-Mio: has been with the main cast since the aftermath of the PFZ.
-Setsuna: stays firm to her principles, brainwashed with Black Attraction.
-Kuchinashi: same as Setsuna.
-Arclight: achieves completion, the way he's betrayed is so much different.
-Riru: one of the 12 holders of the stigmata, gets to fight the main cast, past as a child shown.
-Saten: not Adam clone, doesn't have Zero, manipulates everyone and everything and successfully corners the two strongest needlesses.
-Ishiyama: needless, has great movility and reflexes.

And this is just a part of it, I didn't list any of the characters that weren't in the non canon episodes.

From here on a lot is going to happen that will put the anime adaptation to shame.

Yeah, there were a lot of things the anime ended up getting wrong but I'm happy with how they guessed with what they had and tried their best considering they were only given 24 episodes to work with. Considering how massive a failure the anime as in terms of views and sales, it isn't surprising they had to rush an anime original ending and work with what little material they had. It's not great but it is respectable considering that the anime was doomed from the start.

Also, if they ever were to continue the anime (they probably never will), they could just start with Cruz waking up after the PF Blast, finding Mio and then having her tell him everything that /really/ happened (like make it a joke or something). I'd love to see 51-63 animated but I know that'll never happen.

Originally Posted by Ynot

Spoiler for 109:

I wonder if it all wasn't just a setup by the 666 committee to provide Gido with enough motivation to take the final step and inject himself with Edenseed. I think it was Disk who said somewhere fragments/powers awaken when there's an urgent need and Gido was presented with an excellent situation to awaken power rivalling that of an Angel. Still it seems rather crazy when they already had a clone of the 2nd christ to risk their Eve with such a trick so it might as well be a "lucky coincidence".

The biggest question in my mind is, "is Gido willing to sacrifice Eve(taking back Kasumi's brain) to heal Kasumi?" Eve is her little sister and she can't possible be happy to be healed when her sister has to pay the price. Her dying wish was to become one with Karin and Gido would take that into account. BUT! He didn't just cart her out, showing her to everyone just for shits and giggles, right?

The only other thing I can think of is Gido trying to get all of the stigmata which according to Uten allows you to do anything. Perhaps he's hoping that includes healing Kasumi without having to sacrifice Eve. That would mean they are still short on one stigmata. Perhaps Arclight was allowed to do the dirty work so Gido could step in when almost all of the stigmata were collected. Saten has been very protective of Yamada and is working together with Gido. That makes me wonder if yamada has the last stigmata needed for pulling of a miracle and whether they know/suspect he has it.

Btw we've seen that guy who gave Gido the syringe once before in chapter 46. He was standing in the background while Ishiyama was saying something. Can't remember seeing him anywhere else though.

Spoiler:

Yeah, I noticed him too, standing in the background. Guess he's Ishiyama's friend or something.

Also, just something I noticed while reading through 104 again:

Spoiler:

Riru was going to tell everyone who created her before Disk interrupted that she was stalling to buy Arclight time. Guess it works out to have that revealed later but do you suppose she was created by Saten, too, like Saten did for Arclight? Keep in mind that Riru was created to be joined with Arclight much like Eve was to be joined with Blade.

I wonder if she regrets being made by Saten now should that turn out to be true. If not, I suppose she was made by Gido and everyone at the Eve Project.

[Skieth]

Originally Posted by Avvesione

Also, just something I noticed while reading through 104 again:

Spoiler:

Riru was going to tell everyone who created her before Disk interrupted that she was stalling to buy Arclight time. Guess it works out to have that revealed later but do you suppose she was created by Saten, too, like Saten did for Arclight? Keep in mind that Riru was created to be joined with Arclight much like Eve was to be joined with Blade.

I wonder if she regrets being made by Saten now should that turn out to be true. If not, I suppose she was made by Gido and everyone at the Eve Project.

Spoiler for Spoiler:

I think the only objection there could be to Saten creating Riru is that he's never shown any interest in her or had a lot of interaction with her during the series. His primary concern has always been Eve, and Cruz. Guido and his team seem more likely to have made her, but if they did then she was either a back-up clone for Eve, or she was specifically created to be the transmitter for the Triple 6 end of humanity plan. The flashback from 106 mentions she was confined within some sort of capsule, so perhaps she was never supposed to be released.

[Ynot]

Spoiler for spoiler:

Originally Posted by Kurohane

I doubt Cruz has it. I mean we don't even know the full extent of his powers. Really, if Saten wanted to get a stigmata off Cruz, he would have helped Simeon capture him and extract it llike they did with Teruyama. Instead he let him roam free. Plus he personally fed two stigmata holders to Arclight. I doubt Cruz would be treated no different if he had stigmata. When there was such a sure way to get it, I doubt he would have left it up toCruz himself to awaken it, especially when the progress has been so slow. Cruz has been at hi emotional limits plenty of times with no power awakening untill the last one after he personally saw Aruka die. We still don't know the full details behind that case.

The stigmata holder must be close, otherwise events wouldn't have unfolded as they have, but unlikely Cruz is the last one. Maybe Saten is secretly branding two stigmata, or Setsuna got her wish and she is the last one. Maybe even one of the other girls squad members have it.

I agree there are a couple of things which don't immediately add up, but there's still the matter of Blade not being able to learn Yamada's fragment after bumping heads. At the time it was presented as a joke, but I think it was a really big hint. The only other person this happened with was Saten in the beginning.

Now Blade has actually used the fourth wave a couple of times in this arc. I think it's because he has now unlocked more parts of his brain by learning other fragments from other people who also had parts in common with the "fourth wave". But he still couldn't learn Aegis shield so it's my guess Yamada's power is a lot more complicated and thus there's a good chance of him having a stigmata(or the potential to develop one).

Though I have to admit at the time yamada's power hadn't fully awakened and he still had a chip in his head so that might also have been the reason Blade couldn't learn it.

[Soji]

Spoiler for spoiler:

Pity I cant see the ch ,for now.
But from what you guys say and the traslation I know what the ch was about and I have to admit i looking foward for the next ch.
Now for the ch itself I would never imagine that Eve was Kasumi little sister, let alone that Kasumi was still alive,granted she is in coma but still alive.

I really think that both Gido and Yamada have the same power "shield of agies" like some people already say and from what I have understand that power was Kasumi power this make me wonder(like other)what kind of connection there is between Yamada and Kasumi.
Now that I thiking about it the first time that Cruz meet Eve he thought that she was Aruka,ok he was confuse from the hit that Eve give him still...I wonder if that scene not mean more than that.

Also I not think that Yamada have the last stigmata but he is something else and even if he have the stigmata Saten not need to kill him I remind you that Blade take Teryuma stigmata without kill him.
Anyway I'm really curios about the next ch(like I already say)and I hope that Saten explain why he is so inerest in Cruz.

[Kurohane]

Spoiler for spoiler:

I doubt Gido and Cruz have the same power. As someone, I think Sayo, said, Gido's power was used offensively, while Cruz's power is for defense. Also, that doesn't explain the eyes Cruz had during the awakening, if we assume that is a part of his power as well. The question is what kind of power those eyes hold, or what kind of being would have those kind of eyes. An angel? Did someone take the possible remains of the angel Gido faced (or from an encounter we don't know about) and performed experiments on humans? Or did they reverse engineer the DNA and used it to create a human-type angel. It would explain how Blade is unable to learn Cruz's power, because his power doesn't come from a fragment. However, one of the problems with this theory is that Disk didn't know about the existence of angels until a few chapters ago, so she couldn't have said that to Blade and Eve in their secret conversation. However, I also beleive she doesn't know everything as she was curious to what Aruka knew. No doubt Aruka knows EVERYTHING about Cruz.

[Soji]

Kurohane@

Spoiler for spoiler:

Ok I use the wrong word......I think family fit better this or Gido power is more strong because Gido know better is power.
But I agree with you about Aruka ,about the eyes ,they are something that I always wonder what they really are.
But see Aa reaction when he see Cruz with that eyes,I agree with you're theory that or(like we already thought)he gain the angel or whatever give him that eyes when Eve bring him back to life.
Next ch really need to give us the answer why Saten like Cruz so much

Then again maybe we find out that Cruz and Aruka are Eve brother and sister.....jokin.

[Sayo A.]

Spoiler for 109:

Originally Posted by Ynot

Btw we've seen that guy who gave Gido the syringe once before in chapter 46. He was standing in the background while Ishiyama was saying something. Can't remember seeing him anywhere else though.

Actually, that was the project chief talking about Triple Six, which confirms that the man in black is one of its members. Though that's not much of a revelation...
Incidentally, the heavy in the dark glasses (who presumably "escorted" Gido to the lab) appears in chapter 46 too. See if you can spot him!

[Ynot]

Spoiler for 109:

Originally Posted by Sayo A.

Incidentally, the heavy in the dark glasses (who presumably "escorted" Gido to the lab) appears in chapter 46 too. See if you can spot him!

I did spot him....41 chapters earlier! It looks like he also shows up in chapter five escorting Ishiyama(sixteen years later). Not sure whether there's actually more going on here than him being a "generic bodyguard" though.

[Homura7]

Let's bring this issue back.

Spoiler for spoiler:

When talking about biblical concepts in Needless we must take something into account. That these doesn't hold a symbolic meaning, nor religious, but refers to phsyical things.

And after what just happened in the latest chapter I have the hunch Arca by "The Right Hand and the Left Hand of God", she really meant Uten and Saten. Why she would, and why would she hide their names so Arclight wouldn't be able to fully grasp them is unknown.

It has been far proved she wasn't referring to her brother's fragment, she had no clue what it would turn to be, even less when Cruz can release using either of his hands.

Then what? In her final moments, was Arca warning her brother about those two? Why and for what. Could it be Arca knows about Saten's interest in Cruz? Could it be, since he's Saten's partner, that Uten is also involved?

This is interesting stuff I think we should discuss about

[Kurohane]

Spoiler:

Aruka may actually be referring to Kafka than Uten, because he was the former Uten before the Bermuda Athport needless came. She could be warning him or telling him to meet with them, one or the other. If she was warning Cruz, it doesn't make sense. During that time, Arclight was there, and I doubt she thought he would spare him. A warning of a future encounter when the current one is more pressing at the moment is a waste of your last words. I keep mentioning this, but Aruka was acting really desperate. She kept saying "There's no time, there's no time, They will eventually know your here". I keep asking who are they. It wasn't Arclight she was referring to because she was actually surprised to see him. I don't believe someone within Simeon snitched because she said "I see. You didn't trust me.", not "I see. He/ She gave me up."

Also, the fact she captured and restrained Disk is strange. Why would she go through the trouble when she could just kill her off? To get information? What kind of infomation would interest her and why is Cruz related to it? What was that syringe going to do, obviously not to get the chip. You need a surgery to remove it (or what Arclight did). This action was prompted only after they came to the city, meaning a change had to have happened in Cruz between the Bloody Rain arc and City arc. We could assume it may have been the light given to him by AnN, but Disk wouldn't know about that incident. The other choice is that pill. Disk said it was Eden's Seed, but since She and Blade are deliberately keeping Cruz in the dark about something, I can only take her words at face value. Plus, if it was Eden's Seed, they should have at least told him it was something that he cpuld lose his life over. The fact they would just give him something that could have just as easily killed him bothers me. Chances are it could have been something else, but what are the other options.

Another thing, the minute Aruka was killed and Cruz's powers manifested Blade and Eve just conveinently showed up. How did they know where Disk and Cruz were?

Here's a theory I've been thinking for a while now. The pill contained the ESP virus from Black attraction. Blade has learned that fragment and could have easily put his saliva into that pill. Cruz was knocked unconscious after taking that pill. Remember, after Eve was infected, when she next appeared she was unconscious as well. Also, I'm sure it can be used in many ways. You can let the person run around with their will, but give tiny suggestions from time to time, like brainwashing. Blade once commanded Eve to destroy the ESP virus, surely he can come up with this. The command right now could be "act as you normally would". What leads me to beleive this is this panel.



How can after being acknoledged by your hero can your eyes look so dead, like your in a trance? The only problem I have is finding a reason to go to such lengths.

[Ynot]

Spoiler:

Originally Posted by Kurohane

Aruka may actually be referring to Kafka than Uten, because he was the former Uten before the Bermuda Athport needless came. She could be warning him or telling him to meet with them, one or the other. If she was warning Cruz, it doesn't make sense. During that time, Arclight was there, and I doubt she thought he would spare him. A warning of a future encounter when the current one is more pressing at the moment is a waste of your last words.

I was thinking along those lines too. the funny thing is both Kafka(the former Uten) and Saten have helped Yamada before already!

Originally Posted by Kurohane

I keep mentioning this, but Aruka was acting really desperate. She kept saying "There's no time, there's no time, They will eventually know your here". I keep asking who are they. It wasn't Arclight she was referring to because she was actually surprised to see him. I don't believe someone within Simeon snitched because she said "I see. You didn't trust me.", not "I see. He/ She gave me up."

A more literal translation would have been "There's no time. You being here will eventually be known". So she probably wasn't having anyone special in mind but was more talking in general.

Originally Posted by Kurohane

Also, the fact she captured and restrained Disk is strange. Why would she go through the trouble when she could just kill her off? To get information? What kind of infomation would interest her and why is Cruz related to it? What was that syringe going to do, obviously not to get the chip. You need a surgery to remove it (or what Arclight did). This action was prompted only after they came to the city, meaning a change had to have happened in Cruz between the Bloody Rain arc and City arc. We could assume it may have been the light given to him by AnN, but Disk wouldn't know about that incident. The other choice is that pill.

Well perhaps at first she did want to get information about Yamada from Disk so she could lure him to her. Once Disk was restrained the need to kill her apparently wasn't as pressing anymore.

Aruka would operate on Yamada now because instead of fleeing and staying out of the hands of Simeon he actually came to their headquarters. The chances of someone discovering the chip are getting too high so she wants to take it out and destroy/hide/? it. Also she now has the gear to actually perform surgery. That syringe looks like your average anaesthesia. Operating on someone without it would be such a hassle.

Originally Posted by Kurohane

Disk said it was Eden's Seed, but since She and Blade are deliberately keeping Cruz in the dark about something, I can only take her words at face value. Plus, if it was Eden's Seed, they should have at least told him it was something that he cpuld lose his life over. The fact they would just give him something that could have just as easily killed him bothers me. Chances are it could have been something else, but what are the other options.

Wait, wasn't that part where they kept something secret from Yamada just the fact he was a Needless? Them not telling him anything doesn't really surprise me if the pill just contained edenseed. It's not likely he would suffer from something which he already had in his body. At least not in the quantities they gave him. Besides telling him right there and then would have ruined the surprise of Yamada's awakening for the reader so I think this is just one of those choices which are made more because of the manga's audience than anything else.

Originally Posted by Kurohane

Another thing, the minute Aruka was killed and Cruz's powers manifested Blade and Eve just conveinently showed up. How did they know where Disk and Cruz were?

That is a bit odd. I always figured either Disk managed to contact them somehow telling them on which floor they were(we didn't get a shot of Disk being surprised when Eve and Blade came through the window) or perhaps they saw the release of power from Yamada's awakening.

Originally Posted by Kurohane

Here's a theory I've been thinking for a while now. The pill contained the ESP virus from Black attraction. Blade has learned that fragment and could have easily put his saliva into that pill. Cruz was knocked unconscious after taking that pill. Remember, after Eve was infected, when she next appeared she was unconscious as well. Also, I'm sure it can be used in many ways. You can let the person run around with their will, but give tiny suggestions from time to time, like brainwashing. Blade once commanded Eve to destroy the ESP virus, surely he can come up with this. The command right now could be "act as you normally would". What leads me to beleive this is this panel.

How can after being acknoledged by your hero can your eyes look so dead, like your in a trance? The only problem I have is finding a reason to go to such lengths.

That seems really out of character for Blade. But why would he want to do that to Yamada anyway? The picture you showed got corrected in volume fifteen. Yamada's eyes look a lot less "dead" there.

[Homura7]

Spoiler for spoiler:

Blade using ESP Virus with Yamada doesn't make any sense, so that possibility is discarded. Blade and Eve knowing where they were has an easy explanation. Remember when Disk informed Blade Yamada was already in Simeon HQ? She told him the exact location, and then Blade probably saw the big explosion in that floor and launched there.

And yes, I forgot Kafka is the former Uten. Since he told Yamada they would meet again in the future, I suspect Arca somehow got aware of that and of Saten's protective behaviour towards him.

She was telling her brother to stay still, that they had no time. She obviously wanted him to return to the Black Spot once she was done with whatever she was going to do.

So her final words might be something along the lines of, "as long as you stay nearby those two you'll be fine".

Arca's mind changed long ago, she didn' t want her little brother to die anymore, and in the end ended up risking her life for him and her death triggered the awakening as a complete needless of Yamada.

[Kurohane]

^

Spoiler for spoiler:

I thought so too that it didn't make any sense. I just thought the syringe Aruka was trying to give him was some sort of vaccination to remove a foreign element from his body. Also, there would be no point of telling him about the chip now or removing it for that matter. If it was about the chip, she could have just had him hidden away until everything settled down or had him secretly taken back to the black spot through some close connections of hers, but since the Black Spot is still under an air strike, sending him back would be counterproductive. Also, Arclight said so himself that the chip was hidden in the safest place. The only reason he found out was because she took this action. If she wanted the chip to remain safe, she was best leaving Cruz alone, and not draw attention. I knew the theory was crazy but still I wanted to share it.

[Ynot]

^

Spoiler for spoiler:

It might be a safe place but as long as Yamada is keep getting himself into trouble, delivering himself on the doorstep of Simeon the risk is ever increasing. She already gave him a chance to make himself scarce and what does he do!? He goes to Simeon's freakin headquarters! Time to get that sucker(chip) out of there while she actually had the means to do it. Now maybe she thought the advantage of having it started to outweight the risk of it being it being discovered so she might have wanted to destroy it or maybe she decided to send it off somewhere else. One thing is for sure you can't trust Yamada to stay away from trouble.

She took a chance trying to do what she thought was best and lost.

[Kurohane]

^

Spoiler for spoiler:

Still, he never would have found it was in his head if not for looking into Aruka's memories. Cruz himself didn't know, so Blackout Invoke wouldn't turn up anything. If Cruz was captured, Simeon could have taken all his belongings and searched his mind and still wouldn't find anything. It is the safest place because no one expected the chip to be inside him, let alone in his brain.

[Ynot]

^

Spoiler for spoiler:

Welll she obviously didn't want to take the risk anymore. Searching her mind would have turned out the truth and with someone as trusting as Arclight it's a small wonder he hadn't already searched her mind as soon as she let her brother get away in the first chapter. Yamada was still being searched for by Simeon, the risk of them examining him and accidentally finding it was still present.

But let's assume she didn't want to destroy the chip. If they'd execute Yamada there's also the chance the chip would've been destroyed in the proces.

When they put the chip in his head he wasn't on Simeon's wanted list. Now he is. That's a big difference. She gave him a chance to disappear and he didn't take it. The only way she could remove the chip without the tools was by killing him. She had to act now while she had the chance.

[Kurohane]

^

Spoiler for spoiler:

However, Cruz wasn't there last lead, so I doubt they considered him such a prominent resource. Apparently, there are some resistence members left or I guess those who worked with them as a thrid party due to Chapter 50, when Saten was reported to be searching for others involved. Plus, considering how Simeon considers Cruz, I bet they didn't consider much out of him and would do a simple search, interogation and disposal, nothing going beyond skin boundaries. Yes, there was a risk, but it was less of a risk then what Aruka actions lead to. Her suspicious behavior gave it away completely. Your acting on your own in your own boss' house, how risky is that?

[Ynot]

^
Pretty risky, but if she felt she didn't have another choice it's no more than logical. NOW she had the tools to perform the operation to extract the chip without killing Yamada. They might have found the chip if they had captured Yamada or they might have destroyed it unknowingly. And who knows whether they could've found a slight hint in Yamada's brain with Blackout Invoke which could lead them to suspect Aruka to know more. Like I said before, She took a chance trying to do what she thought was best and lost.