AnimeSuki Forums

morbosfist · 2009-07-21, 14:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness

like i said, only live ones

If you're going by living then Gino gets to be one of the top fighters by virtue of elimination. Guilford doesn't appear to be in much shape to pilot as well (light-sensitive eyes explain the glasses). Kallen and Suzaku either don't have machines or won't pilot any more, not that Kallen isn't still the best damn pilot alive. Xingke's probably dead. Only Tohdoh is left.

bladeofdarkness · 2009-07-21, 14:28

thats another thing
why do people say xing-ke is dead
you can see the shen-hu right there in the epilouge, and its HIS machine
not being in the wedding picture does not equal death
if it was nunnaly and suzaku would be dead

Nobodyman9 · 2009-07-21, 14:29

I'm not an expert on the subject, but I would say Xing-ke if he's still alive. If not, then Tohdoh.

incorrupts · 2009-07-21, 14:36

Supposedly, Suzaku is the best pilot. Then, Kallen goes and pwns him. Then, Bismarck is bragging about his abilities, then Suzu pwns him. {with his live Geass but still}
Point? Yeah, that a lot of pilots are labeled as "woah, dude you are the ACE!!11" but we never get to see them in a clear-fight battle, or, to see them in action for more than one small segment.
So, going by the ""- method, Kallen is the first one, and Suzaku is the 1/2 one. For everyone else, i would say it is not that safe to make assumptions.

kitten320 · 2009-11-16, 05:17

I'm not sure if it is the right thradbut has anyone noticed how C.C looks exactly like AMber from Darker than Black?

Or other way around, have noidea which show was done first.

Xander · 2009-11-17, 00:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by kitten320

I'm not sure if it is the right thradbut has anyone noticed how C.C looks exactly like AMber from Darker than Black?

Or other way around, have noidea which show was done first.

Amber does look a lot like C.C. but I wouldn't say it's a big deal.

Still, Darker than Black aired right after the first season of Code Geass ended...on the same time slot.

kitten320 · 2009-11-21, 15:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xander

Amber does look a lot like C.C. but I wouldn't say it's a big deal.

Still, Darker than Black aired right after the first season of Code Geass ended...on the same time slot.

Yeh I know, but I just can't look at Amber without thinking about C.C 0_0

It is the first time I see such big similarities and can't get them out of my head.

Avira · 2009-11-26, 07:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by kitten320

Yeh I know, but I just can't look at Amber without thinking about C.C 0_0

It is the first time I see such big similarities and can't get them out of my head.

Especially with their white body suits and similar 'mystic girl auras'...
They're just really, really alike it's almost a rip-off imo.
However, Amber is more childish and smiles more often whereas C.C. is the more mature counterpart.

I think Amber came first, wasn't there the DTB manga in which she appeared? I think the animes came after that or something....I don't know

Lolipopo · 2009-11-26, 10:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by kitten320

I'm not sure if it is the right thradbut has anyone noticed how C.C looks exactly like AMber from Darker than Black?

Or other way around, have noidea which show was done first.

And C.V. looks exactly like this girl in Negima (and more exactly that Amber) so who cares ?
It's not a first in the anime world, originality is a rarity these days.
And Amber and C.C. are pretty different when you forget the look. Really.

bladeofdarkness · 2009-11-26, 10:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avira

Especially with their white body suits and similar 'mystic girl auras'...
They're just really, really alike it's almost a rip-off imo.
However, Amber is more childish and smiles more often whereas C.C. is the more mature counterpart.

I think Amber came first, wasn't there the DTB manga in which she appeared? I think the animes came after that or something....I don't know

because walking around with a stuffed toy all the time is the definition of mature

at least amber has a REASON for acting immature (her powers)

Avira · 2009-11-27, 07:34

I dunno, I always had the impression C.C. was more....ladylike? Not the word I'm looking for but whatever.

And I wouldn't call her immature if that's what you mean. Cheese-kun just came with her pizza obsession, it's not like she loves toys in general (I seriously doubt that). Plus it was only supposed to be a 'cute' side of her, since C.C. is generally not a cute character imo.

You know, little aspect that makes her more dynamic or something

And didn't Amber just get younger on the outside?

bladeofdarkness · 2009-11-27, 07:47

contrast ambers behavior before the heavens gate incident and after it
she is distinctively more mature back then

and when C.C's obsession for a toy almost leads to her blowing lelouch's cover in ashford in ep 5
but later fails to care enough to go and check on him in ep 7 after he just had his Raison d'être taken away (stating that it doesnt matter to her so long as he's alive) it stops being cutesy and raises unfortunate implications

Kyero Fox · 2009-11-27, 15:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness

contrast ambers behavior before the heavens gate incident and after it
she is distinctively more mature back then

and when C.C's obsession for a toy almost leads to her blowing lelouch's cover in ashford in ep 5
but later fails to care enough to go and check on him in ep 7 after he just had his Raison d'être taken away (stating that it doesnt matter to her so long as he's alive) it stops being cutesy and raises unfortunate implications

yea, not to mention her obsession for pizza....

Knightrunner · 2009-11-27, 17:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kyero Fox

yea, not to mention her obsession for pizza....

for an immortal character she was kind of boring compared to the other characters in code geass. i would have liked to see some unique tricks she learned over the years.

HollowScar · 2009-12-06, 08:26

I think tey should take characters from one anime and make them do a cameo in other anime's, so we could see more of them, from a different perspective.

twisted-pisces · 2013-10-06, 14:36

I'm not sure if this is the right place to post this question, and it might have been asked before >> Knowing me it has. But has anyone heard any rumors as to what V.V's real name might be or have been planned to be? I know C.C's name was planned to be Cera at some point. I'm just curious. Thanks all ^^

Sykosis · 2016-04-24, 14:27

Ooookaaaay

In terms of KMF pilots both living or dead, it goes:

Marianne >= Bismarck >> Suzaku ~ Kallen > Xing-Ke ~ Cornelia >= Gino ~ Luciano ~ Toudoh ~ Guilford ~ Cyborg Jeremiah ~ Rolo > Lelouch ~C.C. ~ Anya

Living only:

Suzaku ~ Kallen > Xing-Ke ~ Cornelia >= Gino ~ Toudoh ~ Guilford ~ Cyborg Jeremiah > C.C. ~ Anya

Aostri · 2017-12-30, 12:42

Spoiler for - to shorten potential quotes - :

-1. First and foremost we want to apologize to any and all who are reading this, when we first watched "code geass" we also ended up being what one might call Lelouch fan-girls and since most people who become disillusioned with him are to likely stop participating in "code geass" forums we fully understand that this thread is what one might call inappropriate.
The reason we are writing it anyway is that having read a few Lelouch over-glorifying threads and fanfics too many we just can't overcome the urge to vent out our frustration with the pest.
So once again sorry and lets get started.
0. "The world you want is a complete word, a dead world. Nobody wants that."
Before we can start debunking Lelouch proper we first need to set up a slight bit of preliminary groundwork.
At the end of the C's world arc Lelouch dismisses the Ragnarok project as essentially setting up the entire world on a permanent dose of refrain, however, what Charles actually describes is letting people freely see all the memories of both the living and the dead in the short run and transforming humanity into a single collective consciousness in the longer run.
Putting Lelouch not entirely meaningful objections aside, some other problems that come to mind are:
1. Content selection : Even if people can freely view each others memories it still doesn't guaranty that the memories they will chose to view and the manner in which they interpret each others memories will make them more sympathetic rather than more hateful to each other.
2. Information overload : Since individual human minds are only accustomed to dealing with their individual memories, having the capacity to access the entirety of the human memory archive would likely overwhelm most humans and simply drive them mad.
3. Past context in human timescale : The C's world gates and the codes were created in ancient times, is there a reason something along the lines of the Ragnarok project wasn't carried out back then? Is there a reason the gates and the codes were essentially abandoned? Were they in fact abandoned?
4. Past context in geological time scale : Would a collective consciousness actually be a step forward rather than a step back? Considering that the C's world is supposed to be a collective subconsciousness and and extrapolating point 0.2 to a greater extent, is it even possible for a stable consciousness of that magnitude to exist?
These problems also don't require a great amount of intelligence or thought to come up with however the point we wish to make is thus:
[qoute=Aristotle]The more you know, the more you know you don't know.[/qoute]
While at the very beginning of the Geass Order's research into the possibilities presented by the C's world everybody involved were undoubtedly very enthusiastic and certain that the solution to all of humanities problems were at hand.
Two or three decades later the top brass of the Geass Order ( aka Charles, V.V. , Marianne and C.C. ) were full of second guesses and doubts.
However, while Charles and Marianne could deal their doubts by deciding that there wasn't any rush and at worst they could leave the choice up to their progeny, C.C. could deal with her doubts because a few decades more or less weren't that significant and possibly she might be able to pass her code and thus her share of responsibility to someone else ( possibly the said progeny ), V.V. on the other hand not wishing to deal with the possibility of outliving Charles decided to ignore his doubts and try to forcefully push the project along by killing Marianne despite the fact that she was in, on and in support of the project.

This however somewhat backfired because..
1. "You have .. abandoned us!"
Lelouch oh poor Lelouch, left out in a cradle in the cold, found by slaves, grown by wolves, having none but the beasts of the jungle to learn from .. except that .. was he?

Start up ep.01 of R1 and watch the first the first 15 sec' carefully, what do you see?
A hidden C.C. watching over Lelouch, Nunnaly and Suzaku, far afield, watching the start of Brittania's invasion into Japan.

Spoiler for - by clicking on this spoiler I/we commit to being 18 years old - :

Now, yes, yes, obviously our Lelouch fangirl instincts tell us that it's all because Calulu=Love and C.C. had absolutely nothing else on her mind since Lelouch was born but stalk him until he has grown old enough to Frolic.Under.Commandofthe.King her brains out. But lets consider a slightly different explanation.

What we propose this to mean is this: The trigger for the beginning of the invasion was not the supreme commander of the entire invasion declaring that all his forces were in place, it was not his chief tactical officer confirming that the weather was right or his intelligence advisor informing him that their spies have disabled key defensive facilities, rather, it C.C. telepathically telling Marianne that Lelouch and Nannuly were a safe distance away from all planned combat areas.

But wait, if Charles and Marianne actually did care about Nunnally and Lelouch why the hell didn't they have a special op's team secure their safety ahead of the invasion or exile them to Switzerland or something in the first place.
To understand that you have to consider that a very common failing of parents is assuming that their children are magically better versions of themselves and that both Charles and Marianne are vaguely implied to have gone thorough a great amount of hardship when they were small.
Essentially Charles and Marianne wanted Lelouch and Nunnaly to experience the underdog and downside of life to build up their inner strength and give them a broader range of experience and insight than their siblings.

Ok, so Lelouch and Nunnaly spent a few days/weeks trudging through corps strewn villages, hiding from both British and Japanese forces in dirty roadside trenches, scraping for food, sleeping with fellow helpless refuges in abandoned burnt out houses, maybe even suffering some limited amount of abuse. Isn't it now time to bring them back so that they could educate the rest of the royal court?
If it was only up to Charles, we think that at this point he would have inducted both Nunnaly (after all her blindness was artificial and if her mind was strong her inability to walk would not have posed a great issue in the confines of a highly funded research organization) and Lelouch and then quite possibly made Lelouch into V.V. personal assistant. This might sound a bit sadistic but, it would have made L fairly safe since V.V. would have been directly answerable for his wellbeing and also with Charles assuming Lelouch to be a stronger and better version of himself, he could have reasonably expected Lelouch to make V.V. accept if not overly like him over time.

However, having made her way from being a peasant to being an empress it was not that unreasonable for Marianne to also aspire so as to see her child on the throne.
On the other hand since her ambition and determination have won his heart and since his ascension was wrought with hardship it is also not that unreasonable to assume that when Charles spoke of strength what he referred to was personal strength, and, that when he declared that it was the right of the strong to rule the weak, his ultimate meaning was not that the world should be ruled by the degenerate royalty and nobility that leeched upon his own strength, but rather, that once he has established the overall context of a single global government, the said decadent nobility is to serve as the furnace, catalyst and sacrifice that would forge, temper, synthesize and give rise to the truly strong that would be worthy of ruling such a unified world.
And who better to rule and preside over the strongest of the strong than the offspring of the two strongest people in existence.

And so to sum this all up : Lelouch wasn't abandoned in Japan, he was placed there.
Along with a loyal noble family that could give him shelter, provide for his education, and when the time and need came possibly even give him inroads into the knightmare industry.
Along with the worlds largest deposit of the worlds currently most precious strategic resource.
In a country whose military prowess and pride were greatly damaged and broken but not completely annihilated and subdued.
All this for the purpose of starting not a rebellion but an usurpation.

which brings us to ..
2. "you have to get your hands dirty" *BANG*
So if neither the situation in Japan nor Lelouch being in place to take advantage of said situation were accidental, what about Clovis? lets see what we are given about him:
1. He is an incompetent military leader.
2. He is an incompetent civic leader.
3. He is not a particularly inspiring orator.
4. He is a party animal.
5. He is a high ranking royal.
6. He has delusions about being the most likely candidate for the throne.
So what does this all sum up to? Basically, that he is an easy to manipulate buffoon with a lot of potential influence.
Question : Regardless of whether you want to usurp the throne, rebel against it or just murder the person sitting on it, what is the best use for an easy to control fool who happens to be the overlord of your home-turf?
Answer : Shoot him dead and draw a lot of attention while you still haven't accumulated the slightest bit of power????

By and large this is actually a result of Charles's failure of misunderstanding and overestimating Lelouch and assuming that thoroughly and personally humiliating Lelouch in front of the royal court would concentrate all of Lelouches hatred and resentment towards himself and thus allow Lelouch to deal with everybody else in the royal family in a rational and carefully considered manner.

Killing Clovis was quite possibly Lelouches greatest mistake in the entire series. Even without geassing Clovis, Lelouch could have had him assure Brittania's throne that area 11 was totally and completely under control and free of any meaningful anti-government activity whatsoever while in fact using it as a center of operations for setting up active rebellions and/or dormant sleeper cells worldwide.
Or at the very least doing a bit more of preparation before unveiling Zero..
3. "Geass is just another weapon, I've been planning to bring Brittania down all along"
By winning the world championship in chess?
To be fair, especially without geass, it was unreasonable to expect Lelouch to gain the resources and connections to do anything major for at least another decade. And so building up a bit of financial backing and maybe getting a few nobles to own him favors from chess gambling was a reasonable and even impressive rate of progress for a 17 year old.
However, considering that all ventures in gaining britannian based influence and support would be severely curtailed by the fact some/most factions in the Brittanian court would supposedly try to assassinate him and Nunnuly the moment they became aware that the two of them were still alive, wouldn't it have made sense to start making some contacts among the Japanese as well?
Especially..

to be continued..

Twi · 2018-01-05, 20:42

This is a character analysis video on Lelouch and Suzaku that I figured should be shared for discussion purposes:

YouTube

https://youtu.be/p0LYBRDFiOg

Sorry; dynamic content not loaded. Reload?

Aostri · 2018-04-06, 11:51

As we couldn't find a specific character thread for Nunnally we post this here.

Would it make sense to anyone that:
Rather than a sweet, innocent and helpless little angel Nunnally is in fact the true devil. Her ability to read other people is a geass that she gained while still in her mothers womb (explanation in the second paragraph). Because she had the ability to see into other people's minds she was not caught in the illusion that the world revolved solely around her. And because she has been wearing her own mask for her entire life, she never allowed it to falter, especially because she believed that if she did she would meet a fate worse than death.

Nunnaly's geass : Basically Marianne didn't make a contract with C.C. right off the bat, quite the opposite, for most of their time together she refused the lure of mystic power and chose to rely on her own strength. After becoming an empress and a mother she started to slow down. When she realized that she was becoming afraid of aging and of death, she came up with the idea that taking on a geass contract while being pregnant and having the aforementioned fears weighing down her mind, she might gain a geass that would allow her to use her children as spare bodies for herself.
A side effect of that was Nunnally gaining a mind reading geass while still being a fetus. With Marianne herself being the first "victim" of Nunnaly's geass, Nunnally was essentially born with a copy of Marianne's mind. Because Nunnaly gained her geass before having the capacity to see, it was touch based and didn't give her "geass eyes". And because Marianne perceived geass owners on the whole as dogs and lab rats of the Order, Nunnaly feared the possibility of her geass being discovered more than death.

2009-07-21, 14:28	Link #182
bladeofdarkness Um-Shmum Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: at GNR, bringing you the truth, no matter how bad it hurts Age: 39	thats another thing why do people say xing-ke is dead you can see the shen-hu right there in the epilouge, and its HIS machine not being in the wedding picture does not equal death if it was nunnaly and suzaku would be dead __________________

2009-11-16, 05:17	Link #185
kitten320 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007	I'm not sure if it is the right thradbut has anyone noticed how C.C looks exactly like AMber from Darker than Black? Or other way around, have noidea which show was done first. __________________ My anime list

2009-11-27, 07:34	Link #191
Avira fanart-fan :D Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Germany	I dunno, I always had the impression C.C. was more....ladylike? Not the word I'm looking for but whatever. And I wouldn't call her immature if that's what you mean. Cheese-kun just came with her pizza obsession, it's not like she loves toys in general (I seriously doubt that). Plus it was only supposed to be a 'cute' side of her, since C.C. is generally not a cute character imo. You know, little aspect that makes her more dynamic or something And didn't Amber just get younger on the outside? __________________

2009-11-27, 07:47	Link #192
bladeofdarkness Um-Shmum Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: at GNR, bringing you the truth, no matter how bad it hurts Age: 39	contrast ambers behavior before the heavens gate incident and after it she is distinctively more mature back then and when C.C's obsession for a toy almost leads to her blowing lelouch's cover in ashford in ep 5 but later fails to care enough to go and check on him in ep 7 after he just had his Raison d'être taken away (stating that it doesnt matter to her so long as he's alive) it stops being cutesy and raises unfortunate implications __________________

2013-10-06, 14:36	Link #196
twisted-pisces Shadow girl Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Canada	I'm not sure if this is the right place to post this question, and it might have been asked before >> Knowing me it has. But has anyone heard any rumors as to what V.V's real name might be or have been planned to be? I know C.C's name was planned to be Cera at some point. I'm just curious. Thanks all ^^ __________________ Fanservice Fangirl

2009-07-21, 14:29	Link #183
Nobodyman9 Banned Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: U.S.A. Age: 35	I'm not an expert on the subject, but I would say Xing-ke if he's still alive. If not, then Tohdoh.

2009-07-21, 14:36	Link #184
incorrupts Banned Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Greece Age: 35	Supposedly, Suzaku is the best pilot. Then, Kallen goes and pwns him. Then, Bismarck is bragging about his abilities, then Suzu pwns him. {with his live Geass but still} Point? Yeah, that a lot of pilots are labeled as "woah, dude you are the ACE!!11" but we never get to see them in a clear-fight battle, or, to see them in action for more than one small segment. So, going by the ""- method, Kallen is the first one, and Suzaku is the 1/2 one. For everyone else, i would say it is not that safe to make assumptions.

2009-12-06, 08:26	Link #195
HollowScar Senior Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada Age: 33	I think tey should take characters from one anime and make them do a cameo in other anime's, so we could see more of them, from a different perspective.

2016-04-24, 14:27	Link #197
Sykosis Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2016 Location: Cape Town, South Africa	Ooookaaaay In terms of KMF pilots both living or dead, it goes: Marianne >= Bismarck >> Suzaku ~ Kallen > Xing-Ke ~ Cornelia >= Gino ~ Luciano ~ Toudoh ~ Guilford ~ Cyborg Jeremiah ~ Rolo > Lelouch ~C.C. ~ Anya Living only: Suzaku ~ Kallen > Xing-Ke ~ Cornelia >= Gino ~ Toudoh ~ Guilford ~ Cyborg Jeremiah > C.C. ~ Anya

2017-12-30, 12:42	Link #198
Aostri Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2017	Troll post : Lelouch is a failure Spoiler for - to shorten potential quotes - : -1. First and foremost we want to apologize to any and all who are reading this, when we first watched "code geass" we also ended up being what one might call Lelouch fan-girls and since most people who become disillusioned with him are to likely stop participating in "code geass" forums we fully understand that this thread is what one might call inappropriate. The reason we are writing it anyway is that having read a few Lelouch over-glorifying threads and fanfics too many we just can't overcome the urge to vent out our frustration with the pest. So once again sorry and lets get started. 0. "The world you want is a complete word, a dead world. Nobody wants that." Before we can start debunking Lelouch proper we first need to set up a slight bit of preliminary groundwork. At the end of the C's world arc Lelouch dismisses the Ragnarok project as essentially setting up the entire world on a permanent dose of refrain, however, what Charles actually describes is letting people freely see all the memories of both the living and the dead in the short run and transforming humanity into a single collective consciousness in the longer run. Putting Lelouch not entirely meaningful objections aside, some other problems that come to mind are: Content selection : Even if people can freely view each others memories it still doesn't guaranty that the memories they will chose to view and the manner in which they interpret each others memories will make them more sympathetic rather than more hateful to each other. Information overload : Since individual human minds are only accustomed to dealing with their individual memories, having the capacity to access the entirety of the human memory archive would likely overwhelm most humans and simply drive them mad. Past context in human timescale : The C's world gates and the codes were created in ancient times, is there a reason something along the lines of the Ragnarok project wasn't carried out back then? Is there a reason the gates and the codes were essentially abandoned? Were they in fact abandoned? Past context in geological time scale : Would a collective consciousness actually be a step forward rather than a step back? Considering that the C's world is supposed to be a collective subconsciousness and and extrapolating point 0.2 to a greater extent, is it even possible for a stable consciousness of that magnitude to exist? These problems also don't require a great amount of intelligence or thought to come up with however the point we wish to make is thus: [qoute=Aristotle]The more you know, the more you know you don't know.[/qoute] While at the very beginning of the Geass Order's research into the possibilities presented by the C's world everybody involved were undoubtedly very enthusiastic and certain that the solution to all of humanities problems were at hand. Two or three decades later the top brass of the Geass Order ( aka Charles, V.V. , Marianne and C.C. ) were full of second guesses and doubts. However, while Charles and Marianne could deal their doubts by deciding that there wasn't any rush and at worst they could leave the choice up to their progeny, C.C. could deal with her doubts because a few decades more or less weren't that significant and possibly she might be able to pass her code and thus her share of responsibility to someone else ( possibly the said progeny ), V.V. on the other hand not wishing to deal with the possibility of outliving Charles decided to ignore his doubts and try to forcefully push the project along by killing Marianne despite the fact that she was in, on and in support of the project. This however somewhat backfired because.. 1. "You have .. abandoned us!" Lelouch oh poor Lelouch, left out in a cradle in the cold, found by slaves, grown by wolves, having none but the beasts of the jungle to learn from .. except that .. was he? Start up ep.01 of R1 and watch the first the first 15 sec' carefully, what do you see? A hidden C.C. watching over Lelouch, Nunnaly and Suzaku, far afield, watching the start of Brittania's invasion into Japan. Spoiler for - by clicking on this spoiler I/we commit to being 18 years old - : Now, yes, yes, obviously our Lelouch fangirl instincts tell us that it's all because Calulu=Love and C.C. had absolutely nothing else on her mind since Lelouch was born but stalk him until he has grown old enough to Frolic.Under.Commandofthe.King her brains out. But lets consider a slightly different explanation. What we propose this to mean is this: The trigger for the beginning of the invasion was not the supreme commander of the entire invasion declaring that all his forces were in place, it was not his chief tactical officer confirming that the weather was right or his intelligence advisor informing him that their spies have disabled key defensive facilities, rather, it C.C. telepathically telling Marianne that Lelouch and Nannuly were a safe distance away from all planned combat areas. But wait, if Charles and Marianne actually did care about Nunnally and Lelouch why the hell didn't they have a special op's team secure their safety ahead of the invasion or exile them to Switzerland or something in the first place. To understand that you have to consider that a very common failing of parents is assuming that their children are magically better versions of themselves and that both Charles and Marianne are vaguely implied to have gone thorough a great amount of hardship when they were small. Essentially Charles and Marianne wanted Lelouch and Nunnaly to experience the underdog and downside of life to build up their inner strength and give them a broader range of experience and insight than their siblings. Ok, so Lelouch and Nunnaly spent a few days/weeks trudging through corps strewn villages, hiding from both British and Japanese forces in dirty roadside trenches, scraping for food, sleeping with fellow helpless refuges in abandoned burnt out houses, maybe even suffering some limited amount of abuse. Isn't it now time to bring them back so that they could educate the rest of the royal court? If it was only up to Charles, we think that at this point he would have inducted both Nunnaly (after all her blindness was artificial and if her mind was strong her inability to walk would not have posed a great issue in the confines of a highly funded research organization) and Lelouch and then quite possibly made Lelouch into V.V. personal assistant. This might sound a bit sadistic but, it would have made L fairly safe since V.V. would have been directly answerable for his wellbeing and also with Charles assuming Lelouch to be a stronger and better version of himself, he could have reasonably expected Lelouch to make V.V. accept if not overly like him over time. However, having made her way from being a peasant to being an empress it was not that unreasonable for Marianne to also aspire so as to see her child on the throne. On the other hand since her ambition and determination have won his heart and since his ascension was wrought with hardship it is also not that unreasonable to assume that when Charles spoke of strength what he referred to was personal strength, and, that when he declared that it was the right of the strong to rule the weak, his ultimate meaning was not that the world should be ruled by the degenerate royalty and nobility that leeched upon his own strength, but rather, that once he has established the overall context of a single global government, the said decadent nobility is to serve as the furnace, catalyst and sacrifice that would forge, temper, synthesize and give rise to the truly strong that would be worthy of ruling such a unified world. And who better to rule and preside over the strongest of the strong than the offspring of the two strongest people in existence. And so to sum this all up : Lelouch wasn't abandoned in Japan, he was placed there. Along with a loyal noble family that could give him shelter, provide for his education, and when the time and need came possibly even give him inroads into the knightmare industry. Along with the worlds largest deposit of the worlds currently most precious strategic resource. In a country whose military prowess and pride were greatly damaged and broken but not completely annihilated and subdued. All this for the purpose of starting not a rebellion but an usurpation. which brings us to .. 2. "you have to get your hands dirty" BANG So if neither the situation in Japan nor Lelouch being in place to take advantage of said situation were accidental, what about Clovis? lets see what we are given about him: He is an incompetent military leader. He is an incompetent civic leader. He is not a particularly inspiring orator. He is a party animal. He is a high ranking royal. He has delusions about being the most likely candidate for the throne. So what does this all sum up to? Basically, that he is an easy to manipulate buffoon with a lot of potential influence. Question : Regardless of whether you want to usurp the throne, rebel against it or just murder the person sitting on it, what is the best use for an easy to control fool who happens to be the overlord of your home-turf? Answer : Shoot him dead and draw a lot of attention while you still haven't accumulated the slightest bit of power???? By and large this is actually a result of Charles's failure of misunderstanding and overestimating Lelouch and assuming that thoroughly and personally humiliating Lelouch in front of the royal court would concentrate all of Lelouches hatred and resentment towards himself and thus allow Lelouch to deal with everybody else in the royal family in a rational and carefully considered manner. Killing Clovis was quite possibly Lelouches greatest mistake in the entire series. Even without geassing Clovis, Lelouch could have had him assure Brittania's throne that area 11 was totally and completely under control and free of any meaningful anti-government activity whatsoever while in fact using it as a center of operations for setting up active rebellions and/or dormant sleeper cells worldwide. Or at the very least doing a bit more of preparation before unveiling Zero.. 3. "Geass is just another weapon, I've been planning to bring Brittania down all along" By winning the world championship in chess? To be fair, especially without geass, it was unreasonable to expect Lelouch to gain the resources and connections to do anything major for at least another decade. And so building up a bit of financial backing and maybe getting a few nobles to own him favors from chess gambling was a reasonable and even impressive rate of progress for a 17 year old. However, considering that all ventures in gaining britannian based influence and support would be severely curtailed by the fact some/most factions in the Brittanian court would supposedly try to assassinate him and Nunnuly the moment they became aware that the two of them were still alive, wouldn't it have made sense to start making some contacts among the Japanese as well? Especially.. to be continued..

2018-01-05, 20:42	Link #199
Twi Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2011	This is a character analysis video on Lelouch and Suzaku that I figured should be shared for discussion purposes: YouTube https://youtu.be/p0LYBRDFiOg Sorry; dynamic content not loaded. Reload? __________________

2018-04-06, 11:51	Link #200
Aostri Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2017	As we couldn't find a specific character thread for Nunnally we post this here. Would it make sense to anyone that: Rather than a sweet, innocent and helpless little angel Nunnally is in fact the true devil. Her ability to read other people is a geass that she gained while still in her mothers womb (explanation in the second paragraph). Because she had the ability to see into other people's minds she was not caught in the illusion that the world revolved solely around her. And because she has been wearing her own mask for her entire life, she never allowed it to falter, especially because she believed that if she did she would meet a fate worse than death. Nunnaly's geass : Basically Marianne didn't make a contract with C.C. right off the bat, quite the opposite, for most of their time together she refused the lure of mystic power and chose to rely on her own strength. After becoming an empress and a mother she started to slow down. When she realized that she was becoming afraid of aging and of death, she came up with the idea that taking on a geass contract while being pregnant and having the aforementioned fears weighing down her mind, she might gain a geass that would allow her to use her children as spare bodies for herself. A side effect of that was Nunnally gaining a mind reading geass while still being a fetus. With Marianne herself being the first "victim" of Nunnaly's geass, Nunnally was essentially born with a copy of Marianne's mind. Because Nunnaly gained her geass before having the capacity to see, it was touch based and didn't give her "geass eyes". And because Marianne perceived geass owners on the whole as dogs and lab rats of the Order, Nunnaly feared the possibility of her geass being discovered more than death.