Magical Girl Lyrical Nanoha Character Creation and Discussion (second reincarnation)

[Kha]

Originally Posted by Keroko

Deshou? 221 should be apearing soon as well.

Talk about backlog breaking.

Originally Posted by Keroko

More sentai?

You never have enough sentai.

Though this is Kamen Rider to be exact.

A paladin Rider. 'Nuff said.

Though the main draw is that there's enough room to hold a Deck, a slot for cards in the front, a fist weapon and a sword that collapses into a gun for this entire set. Plus there's a small relation to a dragon here as well. With so many points going for it, and since Keroko's of the TSAB's, Kouya's Adeat weapon should resemble a device, and can be used in both human and worgen forms.

So, IXA belt.

Originally Posted by Keroko

Well, the manga already has the Mahorangers.

Whimsical, or for real? I was thinking of fooling about with the Bakarengers' namesake to give Kouya, since he has never been to school, the title of DekaBakaMaster.

Originally Posted by Keroko

Ah, but in the recent chapters she actually wears the outfit.

Gotta catch up! Butt...!!!!

Originally Posted by Keroko

I seem to be good at making references to stuff I've never read before.

The Power of Khrack Compels You.

[Saint X]

Originally Posted by Keroko

One bit of trouble here. Mid already had Neo Belka long before the Aces, as shown by Quint Nakajima.

I seem to forget that person

*gets pwned by the Nakajima sisters*

Line duly noted, removed and updated in master file.

*limps away*

P.S.: i just got re-established so i need to really catch up

[Jimmy C]

Originally Posted by Keroko

Heaven is hardly impenetrable concidering we have various intrusions in the anime and manga.

One intrusion in each case, conceeded. That ep of the anime was really ridiculous, I have to say. Even Keiichi noted the absurdity of the event. Snuck into Heaven and that's all she did?

Hmm, true, but the Combat Division is there for a reason. How about she is to deal with the threats before they become a problem for the field workers?

That puts them to good use. Go with it. Remember to add an interlligence department to find those problems early to make it work.

I imagine goddesses have schedules to keep, and the Combat Division is there to make sure the workers can stick to those schedules.

Some tasks may be time-critical, like the one in the current arc, but wish-granting missions aren't. Note how Peorth stuck around until Keiichi made his wish. But you're right, "distractions" should be preemptively neutralized if possible.

Really? But heaven had knowledge about its existence.

They had the creature itself by then, of course knew about it at the time.

I was thinking it was a natural inhabitant of the Demon World.

Seeing as how angels aren't exactly natural, I doubt that. Besides, where can it find angels in the Demon Realm and what would it otherwise eat?

Hmm, in that case I think I will make her a First Class, Limited. It would give me more reign on her powers, while not immediately making her one of the strongest in the AMG universe.

Making her First Class, Limited is a good choice. As for being the strongest, refer to Urd's First-class exam arc (187-192). That's the minimum power levels and abilities you can expect from a goddess with a first class license. Keroko needs to be someone who can pass that exam. Though you might have to think up something different for the last test. Something duty-related.

Originally Posted by keroko

Deshou? 221 should be apearing soon as well.

221 is next week. Ken's taking this week off.

[Keroko]

Originally Posted by Kha

You never have enough sentai.

Though this is Kamen Rider to be exact.

A paladin Rider. 'Nuff said.

Though the main draw is that there's enough room to hold a Deck, a slot for cards in the front, a fist weapon and a sword that collapses into a gun for this entire set. Plus there's a small relation to a dragon here as well. With so many points going for it, and since Keroko's of the TSAB's, Kouya's Adeat weapon should resemble a device, and can be used in both human and worgen forms.

So, IXA belt.

Keroko being from the TSAB doesn't mean kouya's artifact needs to be device-like. It's more the personallity of the ministra, which means Kouya needs to be a vivid Sentai fan (or at least think that's a good way to fight).

Originally Posted by Kha

Whimsical, or for real? I was thinking of fooling about with the Bakarengers' namesake to give Kouya, since he has never been to school, the title of DekaBakaMaster.

Whimsical, on the beginning of the festival arc there's a stage with several people performing.

Originally Posted by Jimmy C

One intrusion in each case, conceeded. That ep of the anime was really ridiculous, I have to say. Even Keiichi noted the absurdity of the event. Snuck into Heaven and that's all she did?

I was more surprised by the absurdity that nobody noticed she was there. I mean, sneaking into Heaven, sure, I can accept that. (Mara is a First Class Demon after all, I'd like to give her some credit) but the fact that nobody even so much as noticed her in that huge room despite sticking out like a sore thumb made me blink.

Originally Posted by Jimmy C

That puts them to good use. Go with it. Remember to add an interlligence department to find those problems early to make it work.

Right.

Originally Posted by Jimmy C

They had the creature itself by then, of course knew about it at the time.

Which then begs the question, when did Hild create it? And why?

Originally Posted by Jimmy C

Seeing as how angels aren't exactly natural, I doubt that. Besides, where can it find angels in the Demon Realm and what would it otherwise eat?

No clue, but it doesn't need Angels to survive, concidering Heaven held it for an unknown time (unless they were feeding it Angels, which I rather doubt).

Anyway, angel eater aside, similar threats would fall under the Combat Divisions duristiction I'd think.

Originally Posted by Jimmy C

Making her First Class, Limited is a good choice. As for being the strongest, refer to Urd's First-class exam arc (187-192). That's the minimum power levels and abilities you can expect from a goddess with a first class license. Keroko needs to be someone who can pass that exam. Though you might have to think up something different for the last test. Something duty-related.

*taps cheek* Well, since the exam isn't an integral part of her history, just mentioning it would be good enough. It would probably be a combat-based test, finding and neutralizing a threat. She would have passed that test without killing whoever was involved, as it was only a test after all, and it would have been before her many, many missions.

Originally Posted by Jimmy C

221 is next week. Ken's taking this week off.

Really? Bugger >_<

[Kha]

Originally Posted by Keroko

Keroko being from the TSAB doesn't mean kouya's artifact needs to be device-like. It's more the personallity of the ministra, which means Kouya needs to be a vivid Sentai fan (or at least think that's a good way to fight).

Then this fits even more:

But the main drawback is that its useless in Worgen form. Kouya is neutral to the fiery-screaming sentai acts, but I do feel that he might like the cool-sentai character type exemplified by DekaMaster, who is also worgen.

Gah what to do...

Originally Posted by Keroko

Whimsical, on the beginning of the festival arc there's a stage with several people performing.

Oh THAT. -.- I worried for little reason then.

Originally Posted by Keroko

Really? Bugger >_<

1 more week of grace.

[Keroko]

Originally Posted by Kha

Then this fits even more:

Spoiler:

But the main drawback is that its useless in Worgen form. Kouya is neutral to the fiery-screaming sentai acts, but I do feel that he might like the cool-sentai character type exemplified by DekaMaster, who is also worgen.

Funny fact: The initial draft of Tycho was a summoner using Yu-Gi-Oh cards and decks.

That was before I jedified him though. Speaking of which, have some new footage of Tycho in action:

Spoiler for saber fight:

Now I really feel motivated to start writing on Tycho's pre-Rogue days.

Originally Posted by Kha

1 more week of grace.

Wuss. Just marathon it. I did, from chapter 14 to... somewhere around 120 I think? not sure.

[Jimmy C]

Originally Posted by Keroko

Which then begs the question, when did Hild create it? And why?

Doesn't really matter. That it happened before the story began is good enough.

Well, since the exam isn't an integral part of her history, just mentioning it would be good enough.

I just wanted to point it out as an example of how capable she needs to be if you want to up her from Second to First Class. The first test is particularly important, I call it, "able to use an unfamiliar magic style in an unorthodox manner to achieve a desired result." You don't see something like that in a Bureau S-rank mage test.

Really? Bugger >_<

The notice is right there in 220's last panel.

[Keroko]

Originally Posted by Jimmy C

I just wanted to point it out as an example of how capable she needs to be if you want to up her from Second to First Class. The first test is particularly important, I call it, "able to use an unfamiliar magic style in an unorthodox manner to achieve a desired result." You don't see something like that in a Bureau S-rank mage test.

We don't know, seeing how we've never been shown an S-rank mage test. I sincerely doubt an S-rank test is a mere obstacle course like the B-rank test, most likely the S-rank test more along the lines of the test Fate took in the A's manga, where there are various stages and magic that need to be demonstrated along with the abillity to use them effectively in single- and group-combat.

Originally Posted by Jimmy C

The notice is right there in 220's last panel.

Yeah, I noticed after you told me. I didn't notice at first because I never read those dramatic speeches on the last page, its usually more of the same anyway.

[Liingo]

Originally Posted by dkellis

Ace attempt 1.0. Rip into it, please.

Spoiler for Lumina Celeste, the Unyielding Ace:

*snip*

EDIT: Added powers.

Originally Posted by dkellis

Apparently when I try to make Mary Sues, I'm the only one who thinks so.

Overpowered Character Attempt 2.0. I'm feeling a bit left out of the Everyone Yelling At Me that so characterizes this thread.

Spoiler for Mei Landau:

*snip*

Much like Keroko, those are no where near Sue levels or even levels that would warrant small rebukes. I don't see why you're feeling left out when the lack of yelling means that you're doing things right.

The personality that you give to your characters with the inclusion of small quips and other comments throughout the profiles really help to make them likable, another factor that makes it hard to dislike / find faults with the minor issues.

Re: Mina
As with Tsho, I can see strong hints to Amelia here, but is it only me that sees Zelgadis in the device? The dynamic seems very similar to what I remember of the two in my watch 4-5 years ago of the three series.

re: Mei
I love her spell names.They're absolutely brilliant.

[Keroko]

Which reminds me, Dk, what do you mean with feeling left out of the yelling? Do you mean that all we say is 'yes, that's a good character' to your characters or 'yes that's a good chapter' to your stories? Cause I seem to remember us literally ripping into your story centered around the Infinite Library.

You're not left out. When you stray, we yell at you. You just don't stray that much. Nothing wrong with that, heck, the only time I was yelled at was when I had my 'Keroko is a clone of the Saint King' routine, beyond that I've never been yelled at before when it came to my characters or stories.

[Kha]

Originally Posted by Keroko

Funny fact: The initial draft of Tycho was a summoner using Yu-Gi-Oh cards and decks.

You don’t say...

Anyway this card deck thing is a recent development for Kouya; and due to its potential to cover a lot of bases, I could throw the Worgen stuff out.

As it were, the Worgen bits were Nodoka-centric, as they were initially part of lore about books coming to life. Kouya is the son of a dog demon (as with Kotarou), and the Big Bad Wolf from a genderbending fairytale collection (You heard that right. ). The boy in his puppy form made contact with the Exploration Club after one particular rabbit chase went to Wonderland, and the rest is history.

Until I decided to add cards into the mix. It might be just me, but I may be putting too many ideas into one soup again (like Kha until 5th Ed. ) so I need to throw some out. Worgen, or Cards?

Originally Posted by Keroko

That was before I jedified him though. Speaking of which, have some new footage of Tycho in action:

Spoiler for saber fight:

Now I really feel motivated to start writing on Tycho's pre-Rogue days.

Though finish Negiha Keroko first. <_< / >_>

Originally Posted by Keroko

Wuss. Just marathon it. I did, from chapter 14 to... somewhere around 120 I think? not sure.

Revision comes first, then WoW, so I’m crawling along, smelling the Khrack.

[Keroko]

Originally Posted by Kha

Until I decided to add cards into the mix. It might be just me, but I may be putting too many ideas into one soup again (like Kha until 5th Ed. ) so I need to throw some out. Worgen, or Cards?

Hmm, since Kouya is supposed to be like Kotarou, and we know he has an animalistic form, I suggest going for the Worgen, and save the card system for another character.

Originally Posted by Kha

Though finish Negiha Keroko first. <_< / >_>

I know, I know.

Originally Posted by Kha

Revision comes first, then WoW, so I’m crawling along, smelling the Khrack.

Wow is currently in the backseat for me again.

[Evangelion Xgouki]

Originally Posted by Keroko

Huh, so that's why Asuna's name turned into a C, never paid too much atention to that before.

Oh well, one more time:

Spoiler for Pactio, this time with proper latin:

... It looks weird with C's instead of K's.

Other languages tend to do that

Originally Posted by Tempest Dynasty

He means it's incredibly rare. To roll an 18/00 is like a 0.5% to 1.6% chance, depending on what system you're playing on.

Ah...that makes a lot more sense to me

Originally Posted by Kha

And when its Zeit! adeatime!, I wonder Kouya gets as his powerup weapon... I had a Hand of Ragnaros at first, then the Dragon's Call and the Stormherald fought for the spot. Something related to dragons and fits well with the shaman outlook...

Better wait and check out what they'll be adding in WotLK since Northrend has a HUGE connection to dragons (if the zone Dragon's Blight and all the skeletons I saw when I was running around there last night are any clues).

Originally Posted by Kha

Difference is, I've always been playing. No regrets.

Deshou?

Originally Posted by Kha

Then IXA's Fake Fuestles will FINALLY have some effect apart from Lyrical magic instruments.

Hmm...you read my Kiva breakdown. Think I should start typing it up for here?

Originally Posted by Kha

DK, I saw your post, but I'm in a bit of a rush; I'll review it later. Sorry...

And with the choice of Zafira's various forms for Kouya, comes a little bit of Khrack that took quite a while to hit...

And so, from Toushoukan Sentai Bakarengers, comes...

...the BakaMaster.

*FLEEEEZ*

You got the first part of the name right

Originally Posted by Keroko

Yeah. No.

Awww...

Originally Posted by Kha

Now just need to put the last touches. Rereading the chapters I've stopped at has been giving me a massive flood of inspiration.

Oh boy...

Originally Posted by Kha

Ah kk... I've decided to settle for a belt anyway:



...goes with his newfound sentai outlook.

Maybe I'll need to go through with my other OC idea...

Originally Posted by Kha

Talk about backlog breaking.

Better get crackin' then

Originally Posted by Kha

You never have enough sentai.

Originally Posted by Kha

Though this is Kamen Rider to be exact.

And you can never have enough of that either

Originally Posted by Kha

Then this fits even more:

Spoiler:

But the main drawback is that its useless in Worgen form. Kouya is neutral to the fiery-screaming sentai acts, but I do feel that he might like the cool-sentai character type exemplified by DekaMaster, who is also worgen.

Originally Posted by Keroko

Funny fact: The initial draft of Tycho was a summoner using Yu-Gi-Oh cards and decks.

That was before I jedified him though. Speaking of which, have some new footage of Tycho in action:

I was actually scribbling ideas on porting over an OC from that series

Originally Posted by Kha

Revision comes first, then WoW, so I’m crawling along, smelling the Khrack.

*needs Northrend to be less laggy >_>*

[Kha]

Originally Posted by Keroko

Hmm, since Kouya is supposed to be like Kotarou, and we know he has an animalistic form, I suggest going for the Worgen, and save the card system for another character.

*gives Sakura Zaki her cards back*

Saber: You are still not using them?
Me: Guess not. They aren't called Sakura Cards for nothing.

Now its home-free for me to go cool-sentai with Kouya via in-jokes. But I still haven't an Artefact. :/ Any ideas? I'm kinda dry at the moment...

Originally Posted by Keroko

I know, I know.

Just checking.

Originally Posted by Keroko

Wow is currently in the backseat for me again.

@Eva: Need Northrend to be WHAAAAAAT?!

EVAAA!!!

*strangles the beta-tester lottery winner*

[Evangelion Xgouki]

Originally Posted by Kha

*gives Sakura Zaki her cards back*

Saber: You are still not using them?
Me: Guess not. They aren't called Sakura Cards for nothing.

Originally Posted by Kha

@Eva: Need Northrend to be WHAAAAAAT?!

EVAAA!!!

*strangles the beta-tester lottery winner*

*Immune*

I didn't win the beta-test lottery . I merely asked a guildy who works at Blizz if he had any beta keys to spare

Oh, and DECULTURE!!

[Keroko]

*headlocks Eva* That's even worse!

[Comartemis]

I'd be extremely jealous if I were still playing WoW... but since I'm not...

[Evangelion Xgouki]

Originally Posted by Keroko

*headlocks Eva* That's even worse!

Gah! @_@

[dkellis]

Originally Posted by Liingo

Re: Mina
As with Tsho, I can see strong hints to Amelia here, but is it only me that sees Zelgadis in the device? The dynamic seems very similar to what I remember of the two in my watch 4-5 years ago of the three series.

re: Mei
I love her spell names.They're absolutely brilliant.

About Mina: the Amelia/Zelgadis mechanic was one of the factors inspiring that, yes. Mostly it's the much more generic Bokke/Tsukkomi interplay, with the Eternal Optimist and the Cynical Pessimist respectively. Since Mina likes to do her JUSTICE speeches (SEIGI NO MIKATA) like Amelia, I figured I should continue in that vein.

About Mei: the basic character idea was inspired off of a specific established character this time, and the spell names are in the exact same style. (In fact, "No Touching" is a direct port.) If anyone knows what I'm talking about, it's Cantrip (aka Cindy Smithers) on page 90 of the Teen Champions sourcebook of the HERO System. Other than Foxbat, Cantrip is possibly my next favourite Champions character ever.

Originally Posted by Keroko

Which reminds me, Dk, what do you mean with feeling left out of the yelling? Do you mean that all we say is 'yes, that's a good character' to your characters or 'yes that's a good chapter' to your stories? Cause I seem to remember us literally ripping into your story centered around the Infinite Library.

You're not left out. When you stray, we yell at you. You just don't stray that much. Nothing wrong with that, heck, the only time I was yelled at was when I had my 'Keroko is a clone of the Saint King' routine, beyond that I've never been yelled at before when it came to my characters or stories.

The ripping for the Infinite Library thing happened because of the concept, and after I reworked it, there was no comment whatsoever. No comments make me nervous, because it was the no comments which caused the problem in the first place. The concept was a straight canon contradiction, which doesn't require a lot of ripping, especially since I wasn't making an alternate fanon at the time.

The thing about feeling left out is because I can't point to any of my characters and go "look, this was a Mary Sue, but the OC thread helped me fix it". I've noticed that when a character gets Busted by the thread, it becomes somehow more memorable, with people bringing it up over and over again in the incessant flamewars which burst out due to something or other.

Any Publicity, and all that.

Truth to tell, the comment was made as a side remark to a larger problem I have about this whole exercise in general. It all started with... I believe it was tshouryuu's remark about how labelling an OC as an Ace is near-immediate grounds for Mary Sue-ism. Upon that, I set out creating an Ace character just to see if this was applicable in all cases. I don't usually create high-powered characters, because I don't feel confident in my abilities to provide a suitable setting for the characters to utilize their powers, and so I thought it would be a nice change of pace.

I asked, several times, what qualifies as an Ace, and I pushed her power levels as high as I felt comfortable with. I fully expected Lumina to have to be nerfed. Instead, I was told that she needed to be buffed.

Since pushing the power levels didn't make Lumina a Mary Sue, I decided to push the backstory, and tried again with Mei. Angsty past, mysterious conspiracies, unconventional Device, the works. And now I'm told that she's an interesting character rather than a Mary Sue.

This is deeply worrying. I specifically set out to make Mary Sues twice, and both times were told that I failed in that endeavour. While this might seem to be beneficial ("DK can't make a Sue, so all his characters must be balanced!"), it highlights something which I have no idea how to solve:

I am not creative enough to come up with a Mary Sue even with active effort.

It's that mental barrier which worries me. After all, the most important thing about writing is to be able to write, to just set the words down, and then edit them later as needed, rather than second-guessing yourself all the time and ending up with nothing at all. This inability to create a Sue on demand implies a subconscious second-guessing mechanism in my mind, rendering me incapable of creating and thinking with wild abandon.

I am the sort of writer who writes spontaneously, running on raw inspiration when it strikes. I need to be able to think "with wild abandon", or I'll end up never writing anything.

Now you see why this worries me so much. Why can't I create a Mary Sue? What is it, in my mind, which prevents me from making one?

[Sheba]

You are way too sane to make a Mary Sue. Maybe there are a mental lock to stop you from picking references that are way too much for Nanoha. Now, if you were trying to port Dio Brando from JoJo Part 3, Kira Yoshikage from JoJo Part 4, Gold Experience Requiem from JoJo Part 5, Stairway to Heaven from JoJo Part 6, an Antediluvian vampire from Vampire the Masquerade, Yukari Yakumo from the Touhou or taking inspiration from those, alarm bells shall rightfully ring.

Know what? It is not wrong to not be able to make a Mary Sue.