Character Discussion - Suzaku

[morbosfist]

Originally Posted by Aquaman OS

I don't see what else he could have done. He realized he couldn't get away from her when Gino asked him to switch "she's not someone who will let me do that" and realized he wasn't going to beat her when she chopped his leg off "I won't win." After that all he could do was dodge until she was in a positon where he couldn't and he would have fired it. There was no other way out of the situation since he couldn't escape, couldn't win, and Kallen wasn't going to finish him quickly due to her and Lelouch's rage at him. Unless he was going to try to fool himself he would eventually be thinking "this is it" and Geass would activate.

I'll agree that if he were truly out of options it would probably dwindle down to his Geass. However, if Luciano had the Geass, I don't think it would have gone off even though Kallen fried his ass. Even at the end, he wouldn't accept his death.

On the other hand, were we to assume that Suzaku simply fought to the bitter end and his live Geass activated then, what good would it do? He'd either have lost his arm or Kallen would have fried him. Suzaku is prone to giving up early when he realizes that it's pointless (or just wants it like with the Eleven soldier), which is what triggered this mess.

Originally Posted by UnnamedPhenemenom

You saw how Gurren was a beam of light and zipped through to destroy the Valkyrie squad. Do you really think a damaged Lancelot can run away from that?

Sometimes, running away is not always possible. Suzaku knew that fighting Gurren was futile and so was running away. The only thing that could save him was the FLEIA.

Every time that Suzaku dodged basically led to a piece of the Lancelot getting ripped off. Sooner or later, that's going to cause problems. Sooner or later, an important part of Lancelot would have been taken off and Suzaku would no longer be able to dodge anymore.

My point is not that running was futile, because Suzaku was royally fucked no matter how you look at it once he set his sights on harming Zero. My point is that Suzaku gave up rather than continue trying, which is what caused the Geass to activate. Had he not given up, he wouldn't have to worry.

[Sports72Xtrm]

Originally Posted by morbosfist

I'll agree that if he were truly out of options it would probably dwindle down to his Geass. However, if Luciano had the Geass, I don't think it would have gone off even though Kallen fried his ass. Even at the end, he wouldn't accept his death.

On the other hand, were we to assume that Suzaku simply fought to the bitter end and his live Geass activated then, what good would it do? He'd either have lost his arm or Kallen would have fried him. Suzaku is prone to giving up early when he realizes that it's pointless (or just wants it like with the Eleven soldier), which is what triggered this mess.

My point is not that running was futile, because Suzaku was royally fucked no matter how you look at it once he set his sights on harming Zero. My point is that Suzaku gave up rather than continue trying, which is what caused the Geass to activate. Had he not given up, he wouldn't have to worry.

Well if you have no options that will let you live what other choice can you make but to give up?

[prototype_sky]

Originally Posted by morbosfist

I'll agree that if he were truly out of options it would probably dwindle down to his Geass. However, if Luciano had the Geass, I don't think it would have gone off even though Kallen fried his ass. Even at the end, he wouldn't accept his death.

On the other hand, were we to assume that Suzaku simply fought to the bitter end and his live Geass activated then, what good would it do? He'd either have lost his arm or Kallen would have fried him. Suzaku is prone to giving up early when he realizes that it's pointless (or just wants it like with the Eleven soldier), which is what triggered this mess.

My point is not that running was futile, because Suzaku was royally fucked no matter how you look at it once he set his sights on harming Zero. My point is that Suzaku gave up rather than continue trying, which is what caused the Geass to activate. Had he not given up, he wouldn't have to worry.

I can't understand why people want Suzaku gone before the last mech battle.

Do you know how boring the Mech Fights would be without Lancelot.

I'm sorry Kallen grab and fry doesn't do it for me.

[morbosfist]

Originally Posted by Sports72Xtrm

Well if you have no options that will let you live what other choice can you make but to give up?

Keep fighting until the end. Suzaku's good at giving his all in suicide missions. Lord knows he got sent on enough of them in season 1.

Originally Posted by prototype_sky

I can't understand why people want Suzaku gone before the last mech battle.

Do you know how boring the Mech Fights would be without Lancelot.

I'm sorry Kallen grab and fry doesn't do it for me.

Not what I'm arguing. I don't want to see him die, either. I just find his ignorance of the Geass command he was complaining about one episode earlier annoying.

[prototype_sky]

Originally Posted by Sports72Xtrm

Well if you have no options that will let you live what other choice can you make but to give up?

He had an option that conscious state didn't consider viable the use of the WMD.

[Sports72Xtrm]

Originally Posted by morbosfist

Keep fighting until the end. Suzaku's good at giving his all in suicide missions. Lord knows he got sent on enough of them in season 1.

Yeah but his suicide missions would have some impact on someone else's life. I might die but atleast the Britannians and Japanese will be safe. yada yada yada. Here it's just death and there's nothing he can do about it.

[morbosfist]

Originally Posted by Sports72Xtrm

Yeah but his suicide missions would have some impact on someone else's life. I might die but atleast the Britannians and Japanese will be safe. yada yada yada. Here it's just death and there's nothing he can do about it.

It's a war. Fighting to the end does have an impact. Every moment she's kicking his ass is one more for others to continue fighting without a god-mode Guren running around the field.

[Sports72Xtrm]

Originally Posted by morbosfist

It's a war. Fighting to the end does have an impact. Every moment she's kicking his ass is one more for others to continue fighting without a god-mode Guren running around the field.

That doesn't sound like too much of an impact. Oh I'll die to give you these three seconds to run before the Gurren uses its light speed to catch and fry all of you.

[morbosfist]

Originally Posted by Sports72Xtrm

That doesn't sound like too much of an impact. Oh I'll die to give you these three seconds to run before the Gurren uses its light speed to catch and fry all of you.

I'll agree that it isn't much, but the point is Suzaku is usually good about sticking to his guns to the end. Of course, we've sort of drifted off the original point. Suzaku felt he couldn't escape from Kallen even before they started fighting. Personally I think that's nonsense. She would have gladly kicked Gino's ass at his request so long as Suzaku didn't try to fuck with Zero in the interim. He locked himself into fighting her.

[hero147]

Originally Posted by Sports72Xtrm

That doesn't sound like too much of an impact. Oh I'll die to give you these three seconds to run before the Gurren uses its light speed to catch and fry all of you.

It wasn't that fast....*activates Sharingan*

Originally Posted by morbosfist

I'll agree that it isn't much, but the point is Suzaku is usually good about sticking to his guns to the end. Of course, we've sort of drifted off the original point. Suzaku felt he couldn't escape from Kallen even before they started fighting. Personally I think that's nonsense. She would have gladly kicked Gino's ass at his request so long as Suzaku didn't try to fuck with Zero in the interim. He locked himself into fighting her.

Agreed, Suzaku assumed it, Kallen didn't even reject to the idea, just teased him a little

[Orga777]

The problem is he wanted to try and stop Lelouch. With Kallen there he would not have been able to. Things kinda just fell apart there though...

[Vakir]

Originally Posted by morbosfist

As his Geass proved, there was still room to dodge. He couldn't win, but he could at least try to escape. Also, as soon as he saw the hand coming, it was basically,"I can't win, time to atone with death." Then his Geass activates. He knows when it activates, so he should be smart enough to make sure it doesn't.

Are you that dense? He couldn't escape, so the end result is the same. Even if he wasn't trying to atone right then and there, and did try to run, the same thing would've happened because he CAN'T outrun the Guren. The only alternative is to not fight at all, and we KNEW why he was fighting. We already explained why a dozen times.

I'll agree that it isn't much, but the point is Suzaku is usually good about sticking to his guns to the end. Of course, we've sort of drifted off the original point. Suzaku felt he couldn't escape from Kallen even before they started fighting. Personally I think that's nonsense. She would have gladly kicked Gino's ass at his request so long as Suzaku didn't try to fuck with Zero in the interim. He locked himself into fighting her.

No, Lelouch would send for the killing order anyway because he's pissed at Suzaku.

It wasn't that fast....*activates Sharingan*

Yes it was.

[FlareKnight]

Originally Posted by morbosfist

I'll agree that it isn't much, but the point is Suzaku is usually good about sticking to his guns to the end. Of course, we've sort of drifted off the original point. Suzaku felt he couldn't escape from Kallen even before they started fighting. Personally I think that's nonsense. She would have gladly kicked Gino's ass at his request so long as Suzaku didn't try to fuck with Zero in the interim. He locked himself into fighting her.

Could just adjust it to not being able to escape without sacrificing Gino. All he knew was that speed wise he wouldn't be able to run for it if Kallen was determined to take him out. Wasn't until the fight was going for....5 seconds that it became clear that he didn't have a chance in hell of winning. Besides with the Guren's power she could either ignore Gino or take him out and proceed after Suzaku. Gino was busy anyways so ignoring him wouldn't have been a problem.

[morbosfist]

Originally Posted by Vakir

Are you that dense? He couldn't escape, so the end result is the same. The only alternative is to not fight at all, and we KNEW why he was fighting. We already explained why a dozen times.

And as I have said, just because there was no escape does not mean his Geass would activate. Giving up is what did it. As for why he was fighting, he never had to fight. He eliminates his own options. He didn't have to humor Nina and he didn't have to fly out with the bomb.

Originally Posted by FlareKnight

Could just adjust it to not being able to escape without sacrificing Gino. All he knew was that speed wise he wouldn't be able to run for it if Kallen was determined to take him out. Wasn't until the fight was going for....5 seconds that it became clear that he didn't have a chance in hell of winning. Besides with the Guren's power she could either ignore Gino or take him out and proceed after Suzaku. Gino was busy anyways so ignoring him wouldn't have been a problem.

He obviously thought he stood a chance when Gino made the offer. Does he think so little of Gino's skills? It was only after he decided she wouldn't let him go and attacked her that the reality set it.

[Sports72Xtrm]

Originally Posted by morbosfist

I'll agree that it isn't much, but the point is Suzaku is usually good about sticking to his guns to the end. Of course, we've sort of drifted off the original point. Suzaku felt he couldn't escape from Kallen even before they started fighting. Personally I think that's nonsense. She would have gladly kicked Gino's ass at his request so long as Suzaku didn't try to fuck with Zero in the interim. He locked himself into fighting her.

Oh what was he supposed to do. People are dieing. Zero was invading Japan. What would you have him do? Sit down like a good little boy? Please, knowing Lelouch he probably would have given Kallen the order to kill Suzaku anyways even if he didn't chase after him.

[Vakir]

Originally Posted by morbosfist

And as I have said, just because there was no escape does not mean his Geass would activate. Giving up is what did it. As for why he was fighting, he never had to fight. He eliminates his own options. He didn't have to humor Nina and he didn't have to fly out with the bomb.

But if he's going to die, it's still going to activate anyway. Stop changing the rules of the "Live!" Geass. To "Live!" means he needs to actually live. If he's going to die, it happens anyway.

He obviously thought he stood a chance when Gino made the offer. Does he think so little of Gino's skills? It was only after he decided she wouldn't let him go and attacked her that the reality set it.

You choose to ignore the part where Lelouch specifically wanted Suzaku dead regardless. The Gino battle wouldn't have lasted long.

[morbosfist]

Originally Posted by Vakir

But if he's going to die, it's still going to activate anyway. Stop changing the rules of the "Live!" Geass. To "Live!" means he needs to actually live. If he's going to die, it happens anyway.

In fact I am not changing the rules. Suzaku's Geass only activates when he gives up or expects to die, not when he merely has a chance.

Originally Posted by Vakir

You choose to ignore the part where Lelouch specifically wanted Suzaku dead regardless. The Gino battle wouldn't have lasted long.

He only gave that order after their battle got underway.

[Orga777]

Originally Posted by morbosfist

And as I have said, just because there was no escape does not mean his Geass would activate. Giving up is what did it. As for why he was fighting, he never had to fight. He eliminates his own options. He didn't have to humor Nina and he didn't have to fly out with the bomb.

The bomb was already placed in the mecha before he got there. He can't just waste hours getting it taken off while all hell is let loose outside. And yes he had to fight since he was trying to talk Lelouch out of what he was doing. Of course it wasn't working since Lelouch wasn't going to listen anyway.

[morbosfist]

Originally Posted by Orga777

The bomb was already placed in the mecha before he got there. He can't just waste hours getting it taken off while all hell is let loose outside. And yes he had to fight since he was trying to talk Lelouch out of what he was doing. Of course it wasn't working since Lelouch wasn't going to listen anyway.

It was a gun. He can just detach it and drop it. I'll give you the second point.

[MonkeyDude]

Originally Posted by Orga777

The bomb was already placed in the mecha before he got there. He can't just waste hours getting it taken off while all hell is let loose outside. And yes he had to fight since he was trying to talk Lelouch out of what he was doing. Of course it wasn't working since Lelouch wasn't going to listen anyway.

Yeah since it definitely takes hours to remove an attached rifle on a mech Just had to quote this for utter stupidity!