Higurashi - Game Discussion (spoilers lurk here)

[Sinless Idiot]

Originally Posted by NykylaiHellray

I know this will be a spoiler, but does that scene happen in the game, or is it a fan piece?

Spoiler:

The fight actually happens.

[ShadowRift]

Any kind souls out there willing to write up the correct order for the puzzle? I'm getting a serious headache here...

[Sushi-Y]

Originally Posted by ShadowRift

Any kind souls out there willing to write up the correct order for the puzzle? I'm getting a serious headache here...

Follow the order that the events occured in the 4 years, and remember the contents from each piece (because the requirements are contents from other pieces), you should be able to "solve" it if you're familiar with the story enough.

The only piece that had me guessing a while was 女王への協力依頼, which became available without me knowing.

If you're really stuck, break the pieces (pick them before they're available). That way, you'll get a visual cue (a blue box) around the broken piece when it becomes available.

Originally Posted by kj1980

Finished connecting all the pieces together, now onward to the main story of Matsuribayashi-hen.

Akasaka kicks ass!

I cleared it too. ^^;

Spoiler:

And what's with the unbelievable moeness anyway? ^^;

Spoiler:

"Iron Fist" Akasaka almost made me choke to death on coca cola from laughing so hard. Well, it's better than being Onsen I guess.

[kj1980]

Finished.

Spoiler:

Akasaka really kicks ass.

Okonogi: "I am Okonogi!"
Akasaka: "That's great"
Akasaka: "So what's your salary?"

Yep. That's quote is gonna stick with me for a pretty long time! www


Satoshi-kun, I somehow had a feeling he would be alive!
Kasai kicks ass as well.
Tommy kicks ass as well.
Basically, the adult men all are great! Hey, I'll even throw in Okonogi as well for the heck of it ww

Originally Posted by ShadowRift

Any kind souls out there willing to write up the correct order for the puzzle? I'm getting a serious headache here...

Be sure to check out the secret ending as well. If you missed reading the official forums, here it is:

Spoiler:

Copied, pasted and translated from #550387 on http://rena07.com/Cgi/sxi_cbbs/sxicb...0357&rev=&no=0

17　　18　　31　　16　　←1st page
11　　13　　27　　38

1　　15　　20　　14　　←2nd page
8　　19　　30　　37

7　　 2　　22　　29　　←3rd page
28　　21　　3　　　9

23　　 4　　24　　26　　←4th page
12　　 5　　36　　32

39　　35　　33　　40　　←5th page
34　　25　　 6　　10

41 onward, you should be able to figure it out.

1. Clear "Matsuribayashi-hen" through once
2. Go to "kakera tsunagi" using scenario jump (selecting "50ko no kakera" will not lead you to the secret ending so beware)
3. If you don't make any mistakes and connect the pieces together in the order stated above, a 52nd piece will appear. This is the secret ending.

[Sushi-Y]

Originally Posted by kj1980

Finished.

Spoiler:

Akasaka really kicks ass.

Okonogi: "I am Okonogi!"
Akasaka: "That's great"
Akasaka: "So what's your salary?"

Yep. That's quote is gonna stick with me for a pretty long time! www


Satoshi-kun, I somehow had a feeling he would be alive!
Kasai kicks ass as well.
Tommy kicks ass as well.
Basically, the adult men all are great! Hey, I'll even throw in Okonogi as well for the heck of it ww

For the grand finale of a series spanning over 4 1/2 years, that's all you have to say?

Spoiler for comments:

Then again, I guess there's really nothing much to say. Matsuribayashi-hen simply delivered the scenario that everyone wished for. Just like Ryukishi-san said in the end, everyone has their own "best end" scenarios, Matsuribayashi is nothing but one possibility among them. But still, when everything was over and done with, the biggest feeling left for me was "satisfaction". Really, even though the story of this final chapter has brought about a lot of feelings, in the end, what mattered was the strong feeling of "satisfaction" that remains. If you look at it that way, you can say Higurashi has been completely successful as an outlet of entertainment.

Sure, there were a few developments in the story that made me go "no way, that's just too convenient", but in the end, I realized that it doesn't really matter whether the story is realistic or not anymore, but whether or not it's doing its job to entertain the readers instead. Personally, I enjoyed every second of this chapter.

In terms of story, this chapter is where the "support" characters finally shined, isn't it? Thank god.

The thought that came to my mind when seeing characters like Tomitake, Irie, Oishi, and Akasaka finally releasing their full potential was "damn, what a thrill! what a man!!" For those of us who were disappointed at the uselessness of these guys in the past ("time announcer" Tommy, "onsen" Akasaka, for example), this final scenario delivered that thrilling satisfaction that we've all been wishing for. Although Ryukishi-san have a tendency to go a little overboard with the portrayal of action/combat scenes, he's spot on with the adrenaline factor. It's literally a thrill to follow the characters throughout all those battles. Shotgun Kasai killed me.

On the other hand, it's a little unfortunate that Keiichi and Rena, the two big main, didn't get to do much in this final world at all. Well, it's probably because they already had plenty of chances to shine in the past.

In exchange, Mion, Satoko, and Shion totally stole the stage. These aren't normal kids, I tell ya. Normal kids don't take out whole squads of military men with homemade traps, or totally pwn with expert judo technique this and automatic rifle that.

Hanyuu has that Ilya quality in her (normally adorable and moe, but also holds an intimidating serious side), which immediately made her one of my most favorite characters in the game.

As for Takano, the game made it so that you can't really hate her for what she tried to do. She's the enemy, someone opposing against our main characters, but she's not the "bad guy". To be honest, the most emotional moments in Matsuribayashi-hen for me are all Takano-related scenes. My eyes got teary everyime she cried "踏まないで".

The more you think and imagine about her situation, the more heartache you feel for poor Takanon, especially at the end.

Spoiler:

(´・ω・`)
(Tommy was super awesome in this scene though)

Compared to the "thrill" that began in the latter half of the scenario, the ending was a relatively calm one. No big bangs or fanfare. Yet, it feels strangely appropriate as well. If the show is over, then it's over, there's no need to forcibly end it with a bang. Although it would've been nice to see some portrayal of Rika and her friends living in the world beyond June 1983. A winter Hinamizawa would've been nice... Oh well, I guess we'll just have to create them in our own minds.

I saw the secret ending. It's really more like an "alternate ending", and I guess that's just it: there is no absolute ending anywhere. If we wanted, we can always make up our own endings and after-stories. Those people who wanted Satoshi to wake up in the end can always imagine it in their minds. ^^;

The collection of music tracks was, as usual, memorable and beautiful. dai-san's tracks are all wonderful, as expected. I love "being" for it's light and stylish melody, just listening to it gives you an energetic feel. On the other hand, I think his most impressive track of this chapater is probably "Futari. Hitori.", I don't know of many piano tracks that's as emotional as this track. Really, just beautiful. "you -destructive" is a very fun and energetic track as well, I guess you can also call it "Akasaka strikes back". A great remix of a great track.

The "spiritual/ambient" musics by pre-holder@137-san were all very soothing to listen to as well. The rhythematic "Over the sky" is my favorite.

The "action thriller" music tracks, such as DJ NETA-RAW "primal beat of horror" and "assault operations" were all spot on, and made those action scenes all the more exciting. Really, the whole latter part of the scenario, beginning from the 48 hours operation, can probably be adapted into a first-class action movie without problems. ^^;

Finally, the ending theme, "Sora no Mukou" with vocal, was very pleasant to listen to. I think it's worthy to be the ending song of such an epic story.

Anyway, as the grand finale of the series, Matsuribayashi-hen is really nothing but "one possible best outcome". There is no "absolute ending", which will probably disappoint some people. Personally though, I'm satisfied with this story, and that's all that matters in the end.

[Keriaku]

I have a question about Minagoroshi and Matsuribayashi, are they the 'answer arcs' to Tatarigoroshi and Himatsubushi? Or are they just completely seperate?

[LostBlue]

Minagoroshi is "the answer" to 90~99% of mystery. More or less, Minagoroshi is the answer to Tatarigoroshi tho.

I'm still painfully waiting for my Matsuribayashi but from what I gather it's more the epilogue to the series filling in the rest.

[aliensporebomb]

I just scanned this lightly but my question is:

is the manga-ka or authors of this game going to do another puzzle/mystery
series? The quality of the writing, the compelling nature of the characters make
me wish there were more.

[Sushi-Y]

Originally Posted by Keriaku

I have a question about Minagoroshi and Matsuribayashi, are they the 'answer arcs' to Tatarigoroshi and Himatsubushi? Or are they just completely seperate?

Like I mentioned in the Q&A thread, although the answer chapters do answer some of the mysteries in the question chapters, that's not their main purpose. For example, Meakashi-hen may have the same development as Watanagashi-hen (but seen from a different view), but it doesn't mean they are the same. By Tsumihoroboshi-hen, the scenario won't look like any of the previous chapters anymore, but at the same time, you should begin notice the hidden "rules" that govern over the fate of our main characters. Minagoroshi-hen pretty much completely cleared up everything for us, and showed us what was needed to "beat" the tragedy. Matsuribayashi-hen is where all the puzzle pieces from the previous chapters are finally connected together, and showed us what it's like to win against fate.

Originally Posted by LostBlue

I'm still painfully waiting for my Matsuribayashi but from what I gather it's more the epilogue to the series filling in the rest.

It's still the longest chapter of them all, so I'd call it the "grand finale" or something. ^^;

Personally, it feels more like Minagoroshi-hen part 2. After all, it's pretty much a direct continuation of Minagoroshi.

Originally Posted by theacefrehley

Any chance of a big spoiler text regarding the last two answer arcs when the anime is over? hehehe

You mean like a summary?

Maybe someone will do it. Not me though. ^^;

Originally Posted by aliensporebomb

is the manga-ka or authors of this game going to do another puzzle/mystery series? The quality of the writing, the compelling nature of the characters make me wish there were more.

Since he does both the art and the writing, maybe the title "original creator" fits him best. ^^;

Ryukishi07-san will certainly write more stories in the future (it may not be the same genre as Higurashi though), but for now, he's just trying to take it easy. After all, he has devoted 4 1/2 years of his life writing and producing this series, now that it's finally over, he'll probably need some time to rest before beginning another project.

[Freakman]

As for spoilers, I'm thinking of translating Minagoroshi (instead of people getting spoiled brutally and massively). My time is limited though, so I can't promise anything, but I'd like to do it nonetheless.

[Rasuberi]

If someone does translate it, I'll have to avoid the translation/summary like the plague. o__o; *currently very unpatient to play the sound novel's*

[Freakman]

Finally done with Matsuribayashi, and my opinion is pretty much the same as Sushi. I feel extremely satisfied by what I read.
My hat off to Ryukishi-dono.
If the last 2 chapters (at least) can be translated, then I sure hope something comes to fruition. I feel bad for the anime viewers.

An advice to the viewers : DON'T GET SPOILED.
It's not worth it, compared to the awesomeness Minagoroshi & Matsuribayashi are.

Spoiler:

Although one could say Matsuribayashi is totally predictable anyway.

[Keriaku]

Now that people have finished Matsuribayashi, I'd like to know, who is Frederica Bernkastel and what does the red Na in the title mean?

[Sushi-Y]

Originally Posted by Keriaku

Now that people have finished Matsuribayashi, I'd like to know, who is Frederica Bernkastel and what does the red Na in the title mean?

I don't know about the red na, but Frederica Bernkastel is:

Spoiler for spoils everything, watch out:

Spoiler:

Spoiler:

A consciousness that came into existence from the congregation of the minds of all the Furude Rikas in the looping worlds. Frederica is the narrator in Minagoroshi and Matsuribayashi-hen during all the "overworld view" scenes where we learned of the rules of the tragedy, the worlds that ended in failure, the puzzle pieces, and the keys to beating the tragedy.

In other words, Frederica is the consciousness that's born from all the Furude Rikas that ever existed, and thus have the knowledge of everything that has ever happened to her. Simply put, Frederica = A Rika who exists outside the game and knows everything.

In a sense, she's kind of like an omniscient observer of the game.

[sagematt]

Originally Posted by Sushi-Y

I don't know about the red na...

I always thought the な was because of なな (seven == 07), thus being a direct reference to 07th Expansion. It always seemed pretty obvious to me, but I might be wrong anyways

[LostBlue]

Huh, never thought about that.
Good guess.

That's kinda like where Rena's name comes from:
Ryu guu Rei na
Ryu kishi 0 7 (Rei = zero, Na = seven)

Ryuuguu (竜宮) = Dragon's Palace
Ryuukishi (竜騎士) = Dragon Knight

Interesting.

Sushi-Y that spoiler tag is too tempting... must resists, must resists... a few more days and I will know... must resists... why are US Customs so cruel? T_T

[sagematt]

Oh, so that's the solution to Rena's name. I didn't even notice about that >.<
(And it kinda follows the same logic I used for な. Buu ;_; )

[aliensporebomb]

Originally Posted by Sushi-Y

I don't know about the red na, but Frederica Bernkastel is:

Spoiler for spoils everything, watch out:

Spoiler:

Spoiler:

A consciousness that came into existence from the congregation of the minds of all the Furude Rikas in the looping worlds. Frederica is the narrator in Minagoroshi and Matsuribayashi-hen during all the "overworld view" scenes where we learned of the rules of the tragedy, the worlds that ended in failure, the puzzle pieces, and the keys to beating the tragedy.

In other words, Frederica is the consciousness that's born from all the Furude Rikas that ever existed, and thus have the knowledge of everything that has ever happened to her. Simply put, Frederica = A Rika who exists outside the game and knows everything.

In a sense, she's kind of like an omniscient observer of the game.

OH MAN I KNEW IT!

Spoiler:

You sure you want to read?

Spoiler:

I had posted a message to one of the episode threads (20? 21?)
where I theorized that each set of characters (Mion, Keiichi, Shion,
Satoki, Rika, etc.) were all different from arc-to-arc (not the same)
and each story arc was what happened in a different universe of
sorts.

So there is an overlying omniverse with little universes inside it
each with a different set of outcomes depending on events in the
"universe".

In other words, there's a handful of each character in existence
at any given time. Some live, some die, some get hit by the
disaster while in another continuum the city doesn't get hit.

Some people got hit by the curse, some didn't. Few escaped
some kind of tragedy.

And that's why some characters were normal in one universe
and "psycho" in another and in one Mion was Tsun while another
was dere.

It's brilliant - it goes one further than "was it twin Mion or Shion"
doing something when you've got potentially 12 Sonozaki sisters
in six universes. Too much green hair for some people!

Another discrepancy - in some episode Rena appeared like a
mentally unstable person right on the edge of freaking out,
another she appeared as a master crime solver.

Brilliant.

It still doesn't answer all of the questions but it gives a very
plausible answer for the anime watchers who haven't played
the game why there was such disparity in character behavior
from arc-to-arc.

Kudos to the manga-ka - a smart cookie I do believe.

[Sushi-Y]

Originally Posted by aliensporebomb

OH MAN I KNEW IT!

Spoiler:

You sure you want to read?

Spoiler:

I had posted a message to one of the episode threads (20? 21?)
where I theorized that each set of characters (Mion, Keiichi, Shion,
Satoki, Rika, etc.) were all different from arc-to-arc (not the same)
and each story arc was what happened in a different universe of
sorts.

So there is an overlying omniverse with little universes inside it
each with a different set of outcomes depending on events in the
"universe".

In other words, there's a handful of each character in existence
at any given time. Some live, some die, some get hit by the
disaster while in another continuum the city doesn't get hit.

Some people got hit by the curse, some didn't. Few escaped
some kind of tragedy.

And that's why some characters were normal in one universe
and "psycho" in another and in one Mion was Tsun while another
was dere.

It's brilliant - it goes one further than "was it twin Mion or Shion"
doing something when you've got potentially 12 Sonozaki sisters
in six universes. Too much green hair for some people!

Another discrepancy - in some episode Rena appeared like a
mentally unstable person right on the edge of freaking out,
another she appeared as a master crime solver.

Brilliant.

It still doesn't answer all of the questions but it gives a very
plausible answer for the anime watchers who haven't played
the game why there was such disparity in character behavior
from arc-to-arc.

Kudos to the manga-ka - a smart cookie I do believe.

Like I said in the very beginning when the anime started. All characters are the same throughout all scenarios. Any differences you see in a character's personality/behaviors is not because he/she is a "different person". For example, Rena in Onikakushi-hen is exactly the same as the Rena in Watanagashi-hen.

The difference, then, is caused by an outside factor instead. It may be environmental, or situational.

The most important thing to remember about Higurashi is this:

The different plot development in each scenario is responsible for the differences in the characters, not the other way around. All characters "start off" the same across all scenarios.

So what caused the differences in plot development (if a world is "reset", shouldn't it just repeat itself again?)? that's something the anime probably won't address directly, but if they can handle Tsumihoroboshi-hen right, you should be able to understand why.

And Higurashi is a sound novel, so I would call Ryukishi07-san the "author" instead of "mangaka".

[aliensporebomb]

How about Ryukishi07-sama, visionary genius?