Magical Girl Lyrical Nanoha the Movie 2nd A's Discussion Thread (spoilers)

[Nanya01]

Originally Posted by krisslanza

The only character who got more screentime, at other character's expense, was Lindy of all people.

Yuuno and Chrono's missing time? Went to her instead. I don't see you lashing out at her.

BTW, the reason I don't lash out at Lindy?

Because her facing down the Wolkenritter was one of the few GOOD points this movie had and could have made the movie better had she DONE something other than just facing them down.

[Sunder the Gold]

Originally Posted by Nanya01

Keroko, in StrikerS, it was more understandable since, you know, he's a librarian and the plot took place on a military base, so him showing up wasn't

I sure would have expected him, because he's never needed to be a soldier to help out before, he's just too damn useful to ignore, and there's no way he wouldnt make time to help his friends out more personally. (Where's my Caro&Yuuno training/bonding scenes? Or ErioYuuno male-bonding scenes?)

Also, Nanya, I think your well-justified rage is getting the better of you.

The movie wouldn't have been worse for excluding Yuuno entirely, but some bone for his fans is still better than none at all. At least think of it as a nettle in the pants of those who WANT him to disappear.

[Reckoner]

*yawn*

Just finished this film, and the only tears that were shed were tears of boredom. Count me pretty disappointed with this film.

The Good










The Bad

[-]Loli breasts AGAIN.

[-]Fate dream sequence is so irrelevant to the overall story going on, complete pandering to a character for the sake of it. Yes, it's nice development for fate, but within the structure of the film it didn't make sense to put it there.

[-]The action in Nanoha is plain terrible. There's no rhyme or reason to how fights are fought. Just tons of beam spamage, albeit pretty beam spammage, but it is incredibly mind numbing to watch.

[-]They introduce us to an internal conflict that Chrono and Lindy have with the Book of Darkness affair (aka daddy is dead), but not only do not they give his character arc any satisfying conclusion, they didn't show any of his thoughts or feelings on the matter. What a missed opportunity, and he feels shafted.

[-]Yuno who?

[-]This series is sexist against men.

[-]Dramatic tension? Where? No one ever suffers lasting consequences in this series. All the heroes prevail and survive, no scenes of sacrifice given. Engagement into the story is utterly eviscerated.

[-]Excessive amounts of nanofate pandering at the detriment of other characters.

[-]The Wolkies are plain retarded. They are completely unable to listen to reason when clearly they aren't villainous. Yeah lets destroy the world without considering any alternatives just because I couldn't listen to people tell me about the danger of my actions for 1 minute. A contrivance to make the book of darkness go berserk.

[-]Reinforce is a stupid character in the TV series, and a stupid character here. Did not change my mind.

[-]The fight that Lindy was involved in made no sense. Oh Nanofate are here with arf, but I'm just going to sit here after getting help and do nothing to assist everybody. Isn't Lindy supposed to be powerful? I mean c'mon.

[-]That last fight was a CGI monstrosity. This is a film for goodness sakes and that's what we get? Good grief.

[krisslanza]

Originally Posted by Akiyoshi

i have to agree with Nanya here, the movie 2nd is a massive c***tease when ut comes to fights. Save for the last part of the movie, the fights were incredibly bland, their only saving grace was the enhaced quality but aside of that the ones in the anime series make much more sense, are more complete and feel more rewarding for both the Aces and the Wolkenritter. None of the Signum vs. Fate moments in the movie were near as intense and flowing as their fights in the anime despite the pretty visuals.

As i've said the fight against Reinforce was needlessly strectched along with Fate's lotus eater, that time could've used to improve and make better set up and execution of the other fights in the movie. Tsuzuki wanted his epic NanoFate vs. Reinforce fight so badly that the rest of the movie had to suffer badly for it.

I doubt the Wolkenritter had equal screentime with Nanoha and Fate, but eve if that was true they didn't got to do anything meninful during said time. Pretty sad considerin it's their and Hayate's movie, not Fate's.

Also, am i the only one who was jarred at the whole "angrish and screaming vengeful Reinforce" during the last part of the movie? As cool as that fight was i still find the one in the series more impressive, Reinforce's calm and stoic behavior while stomping the aces while essentially saying "i don't care who you are or what power you posses, you're screwed the same" gave an immensely more powerful impression, Reinforce semmed more like a force of nature rather than an enemy, making the tears comin fron her cold face much more meaningfull. In the movie ...not so much, i wasn't as thrilled and convinced eith that crying woman despite the cool sinister device. Also Reinforce's SLB for the WIN! i prefer that over giant Drill any day of the week.

This movie is filled of moments with characters about to make something awesome but being contantly put away from screem the moment they're about to succeed. If anything, this movie makes me to remind how damn good the series is in comparission with what i'm seeing here. After i watched the movie i was left with great motivation to see A's tv again amd relive how truly awesome those fights and moments were in the original canon.

The problem with the fights isn't a problem with the movie itself. It's an issue of time.

Off the top of my head, A's had about... 5 or 6 fights, I think? I don't recall exactly, but each of them were probably about 10 to 15, or maybe more in length.

Let's assume there was 4 fights before the finale, and each of those 4 took 15 minutes, that'd be an hour right there - nearly half the movie's running time. The finale was split over into two episodes, I believe, so let's say that bit (plus the triple breaker) was about 45 minutes. In a 2 and a half hour movie, you'd already have to use 1 hour and 45 minutes in fights alone.

You'd be left with under an hour to actually fit in the entire actual plot of A's. Which just isn't going to happen without basically having to absolutly butcher the plot down to its bare minimum and cut out all the characterization and everything else.

Unless SevenArcs wanted to go the Peter Jackson route and crank out four hour length movies, you just can't really cleanly take a 12 episode, 6 hour (ish) series and get everything in it into a neat two and a half hour movie.

[Cannonball]

They totally should've gone the Peter Jackson route. Four hours would've been perfect!

[Nanya01]

Originally Posted by krisslanza

The problem with the fights isn't a problem with the movie itself. It's an issue of time.

Issue of time, you say?

Huh...

Why would you say that?

It's not like the fact that they were pressed for time seemed to bother them with showing certain scenes that did little to advance the plot, now did it?

That seems to be the ONLY defense anyone can give to anyone who has criticisms of the movie...

"Oh, they were pressed for time."

We KNOW that!

It's the directors and editors JOB to make sure that DESPITE being pressed for time, they STILL get character development down pat, a coherent plot, minimal (if any) plot holes and, if the movie is supposed to have action and combat in it, you need to make sure that you dedicate enough time to it.

So, you and the others who keep saying that certain things needed to stay? Like the Lotus Dream Eater, for example...

Well, Keroko points out just what could have been done with that.

[krisslanza]

Originally Posted by Nanya01

Issue of time, you say?

Huh...

Why would you say that?

It's not like the fact that they were pressed for time seemed to bother them with showing certain scenes that did little to advance the plot, now did it?

That seems to be the ONLY defense anyone can give to anyone who has criticisms of the movie...

"Oh, they were pressed for time."

We KNOW that!

It's the directors and editors JOB to make sure that DESPITE being pressed for time, they STILL get character development down pat, a coherent plot, minimal (if any) plot holes and, if the movie is supposed to have action and combat in it, you need to make sure that you dedicate enough time to it.

So, you and the others who keep saying that certain things needed to stay? Like the Lotus Dream Eater, for example...

Well, Keroko points out just what could have been done with that.

They're pressed for time and opted to focus more on correctly telling the plot and developing the characters, rather then axe all that and just show you a bunch of flashy fight scenes and then completely cut out the plot.

Because I'm sure if they did that, you wouldn't come in here complaining "The fight scenes were good, but were was all the plot and characterization!?"

A's as a series was so good because everything was basically perfectly paced. You can't bring that into the movie because, as stated, it was "perfectly" paced. And how are you going to perfectly pace everything in about a third of the time?

No matter what you do, something has to suffer for it. Just because you seem to loathe developing Fate's character, doesn't mean SevenArcs feels they should shaft the characterization of Nanoha and Fate, just so you can get a few extra minutes of fighting or screentime to someone else.

[Rising Dragon]

"Correctly telling the plot and developing the characters". Yeah, sure. That's why we got moron!Signum and company, huh?

[krisslanza]

Originally Posted by Rising Dragon

"Correctly telling the plot and developing the characters". Yeah, sure. That's why we got moron!Signum and company, huh?

It's hard to appear intelligent when your memory has more holes then swiss cheese and you react more on instinct and a vague idea that something good might happen if you keep going.

[Rising Dragon]

Except, y'know, how the movie gave evidence that their memories weren't full of holes and they knew things would only go to hell when the Book was completed, like usual.

Lookit all dat proper development, amirite?

C'mon, if you're going to use the argument, use it correctly. We got an idiot Signum because they needed a way to get the Book to go berserk and they axed the only reasonable method of doing so beforehand. Don't try and convince us that it was "proper" for Signum and company to behave that way.

[bhl88]

I wonder how much the sales of the TV series are compared to the movie....

[Dr. Casey]

Originally Posted by Reckoner

*yawn*

Just finished this film, and the only tears that were shed were tears of boredom. Count me pretty disappointed with this film.

The Good










The Bad

[-]Loli breasts AGAIN.

[-]Fate dream sequence is so irrelevant to the overall story going on, complete pandering to a character for the sake of it. Yes, it's nice development for fate, but within the structure of the film it didn't make sense to put it there.

[-]The action in Nanoha is plain terrible. There's no rhyme or reason to how fights are fought. Just tons of beam spamage, albeit pretty beam spammage, but it is incredibly mind numbing to watch.

[-]They introduce us to an internal conflict that Chrono and Lindy have with the Book of Darkness affair (aka daddy is dead), but not only do not they give his character arc any satisfying conclusion, they didn't show any of his thoughts or feelings on the matter. What a missed opportunity, and he feels shafted.

[-]Yuno who?

[-]This series is sexist against men.

[-]Dramatic tension? Where? No one ever suffers lasting consequences in this series. All the heroes prevail and survive, no scenes of sacrifice given. Engagement into the story is utterly eviscerated.

[-]Excessive amounts of nanofate pandering at the detriment of other characters.

[-]The Wolkies are plain retarded. They are completely unable to listen to reason when clearly they aren't villainous. Yeah lets destroy the world without considering any alternatives just because I couldn't listen to people tell me about the danger of my actions for 1 minute. A contrivance to make the book of darkness go berserk.

[-]Reinforce is a stupid character in the TV series, and a stupid character here. Did not change my mind.

[-]The fight that Lindy was involved in made no sense. Oh Nanofate are here with arf, but I'm just going to sit here after getting help and do nothing to assist everybody. Isn't Lindy supposed to be powerful? I mean c'mon.

[-]That last fight was a CGI monstrosity. This is a film for goodness sakes and that's what we get? Good grief.

urusai, baka




is what a Japanese fanboy of the series might say, but since I'm not Japanese and aren't particularly defensive of the series, I'll just say nice review, was fun to read. I lol'd at the 'Good' section being completely blank. I take it you don't enjoy much of the Nanoha franchise in general? I vaguely remember you not caring much for the Loli Years (aka the original along with A's) but liking StrikerS, but I'm not sure if that's right.

[Triple_R]

I find it funny that Reckoner went on to rate this movie 6/10 when he has not one good thing to say about the film. That's a mighty generous rating given the actual content of his review.


And apparently Fate and NanoFate fans shouldn't get any nice things at all in the Nanoha movies. It's apparently some grave crime to have some nice scenes just to make those fans smile. Since, after all, everybody knows that making fans smile is completely divorced from the concept of providing good entertainment...

[bhl88]

Originally Posted by Reckoner

*yawn*

Just finished this film, and the only tears that were shed were tears of boredom. Count me pretty disappointed with this film.

The Good
...
...
...
...
...
...
...
...
...
... lol.

Yeah, there's nothing here XD.

[Archon_Wing]

Oh yea. lolitits fail. GD it Seven Arcs, you're not making porn anymore.

[bhl88]

Originally Posted by Archon_Wing

Oh yea. lolitits fail. GD it Seven Arcs, you're not making porn anymore.

Origin of Nanoha: porn.

[Archon_Wing]

That's why I said "anymore"

[Triple_R]

The transformation scenes were all there was to the ecchi fanservice. At least from what I can remember of the movie.

Outside of transformation scenes, there's nothing particularly sexualized in how the characters in this movie are presented, imo. And personally, I'm thankful for that.

VRO and Strike Witches shows that you can get a lot more fanservicey than this.

[bhl88]

Originally Posted by Archon_Wing

That's why I said "anymore"

XD yeah I guess

[Nanya01]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

And apparently Fate and NanoFate fans shouldn't get any nice things at all in the Nanoha movies.

I was going to be snarky about this, but I won't.

Instead, I'm going to point out that every piece of official artwork that comes out of Japan tends to focus around NanoFate or Fate (or if it's ViVid, Vivio and Einhart). And even if it doesn't Fate's usually in the artwork itself.

So, it's not that you can't have nice things (again, resisting the urge to snark here), it's that a lot of us might be getting kind of tired of it and were hoping for something different. Again, I was mainly looking for awesome action sequences (and Determinator!Nanoha) because I knew that was all I had a chance of seeing in the movie that I would enjoy.

But, as I've said for the past 20+ pages, that wasn't delivered.