Hyouka - General Discussion

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by Skane

Reverse the genders and look at it from that perspective. It will probably help erase the "Beauty Can Do No Wrong" bias.

Cheers.

... It just occurred to me that if you genderbent Hyou-Ka, the male Eru would seem a bit creepy and stalkerish.

[novalysis]

The Genderbending of Hyou-ka.....

Yes, I think I can see where this is going.

Male Eru would certainly be reviled as a Stalkerish, overly-rich, spoiled brat who demands the attention of poor, harassed, introverted Female Houtaro, who would be a more snarkier , unique take of the same character archetype popularized by Rei Ayanami, and reinforced in recent times by Yuki Nagato. Genderbend Houtaro at his most apathetic, and imagine a dead-pan, quiet voice, and you'd get a similar character. Haters of this show would then be tarring Hotarou as Yuki Nagato boring Expy 99245 instead of Generic Harem protagonist 33563.

And Doujin authors would be hard at work exaggerating and sexualizing those tendencies to their logical conclusion.

[Kaihan]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

... It just occurred to me that if you genderbent Hyou-Ka, the male Eru would seem a bit creepy and stalkerish.

Just great, image of how the ending song would be like just flashed into my mind.

Quick Edit: Made it since I was pretty bored

[ronelm2000]

Originally Posted by novalysis

The Genderbending of Hyou-ka.....

Yes, I think I can see where this is going.

Male Eru would certainly be reviled as a Stalkerish, overly-rich, spoiled brat who demands the attention of poor, harassed, introverted Female Houtaro, who would be a more snarkier , unique take of the same character archetype popularized by Rei Ayanami, and reinforced in recent times by Yuki Nagato. Genderbend Houtaro at his most apathetic, and imagine a dead-pan, quiet voice, and you'd get a similar character. Haters of this show would then be tarring Hotarou as Yuki Nagato boring Expy 99245 instead of Generic Harem protagonist 33563.

And Doujin authors would be hard at work exaggerating and sexualizing those tendencies to their logical conclusion.

...you just had to say it.

Now we're "forced" to entertain your argument and enter into a new fanbase much like the Haruhi ones. XD

[ThereminVox]

Originally Posted by novalysis

The Genderbending of Hyou-ka.....

Yes, I think I can see where this is going.

Oh God, it begins. I'll see you all on page 498 of the Oreko fanart thread.

I love reading about how the ways in which Houtaro and Eru process information are in perfect opposition to one another, but in practice are complimentary. It's actually a really obvious dynamic in hindsight.

[rulfo]

Spoiler for episode 4:

A decent ep but kinda slower

[mod edit: removed novel spoiler]

Judging by how things went, I can expect that next ep will be a little bit packed.

Next up, Gatoh + Kigami + Horiguchi combo. I'm very interested how this arc's closure will be handled.

[Flawfinder]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

... It just occurred to me that if you genderbent Hyou-Ka, the male Eru would seem a bit creepy and stalkerish.

If you gender-bent Chitanda, you'd just get Haru from Tsuritama. And I like Haru.

And if you gender-bent Houtaro and gave him glasses, you would get Daria from...Daria. And I love Daria.

[felix]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

... It just occurred to me that if you genderbent Hyou-Ka, the male Eru would seem a bit creepy and stalkerish.

You mean she doesn't feel like that already?

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by felix

You mean she doesn't feel like that already?

I'll admit that I, probably like a fair number of guys, can fall a bit into the "Beauty Can Do No Wrong" trap. And Eru is very beautiful.

Creepy + Beautiful = Eccentric (a more neutral term)

Stalkerish + Beautiful = "Dude, why are you not responding better to her?! She shouldn't have to chase after you in the first place!"

[ars89]

Interesting theory by Houtarou once again. I doubt that will satisfy Chitanda givin her last line.

[DragoZERO]

I think this was my least favorite episode so far. Not enough snarky comments from Houtarou.

[FlareKnight]

Originally Posted by ars89

Interesting theory by Houtarou once again. I doubt that will satisfy Chitanda givin her last line.

Spoiler for Ep4:

Think the message being sent that while this theory sounds good it is wrong. Of course that's the risk you take with plausible theories. Everything he said there could very well be true, but that doesn't mean that's what happened. I think the lines ignored and what Chitanda said at the end are key to looking at this. Would Houtarou's theory if true have made Chitanda break down in tears, her uncle be unwilling to console her and something she'd possibly make herself forget? Also while subjective think the words that "it was, most definitely, not the story of a hero" makes me wonder what really happened. Of course possible that some of that Houtarou said was right, but that there was something much bigger that happened.

Of course maybe looking for something more from this, but it definitely doesn't feel like this mystery is over quite yet.

[Eater of All]

My conspiracy theory of the day is that Houtarou deliberately withheld the truth from Chitanda. What Houtarou presented was pretty much just connecting everyone's research into one story. Too anticlimatic. Also, the way that preview focuses on Houtarou is really screaming that he has more to say.

Not that I can even guess what the truth might be.

[Qilin]

I can imagine experiencing episode 4 in the light novel format instead of the anime, and I can guess that it would be somewhat dry.

Spoiler for episode 4:

Yep. Like I said, the episode was pretty dry outwardly.

The entire episode was spent exchanging theories and really old texts. It could have been boring if it wasn't for the excellent use of visuals and background music.

But anyway, I think I'm now coming to grips with the juxtaposition of the story's mystery genre and the Classic Literature Club. Throughout the episode, they found themselves profiling the intentions and the contexts of the various writers of their sources. This is similar to how the very act of reading a novel can be compared to solving a mystery. What is the author trying to say? Why did the author use certain words? What does this say about the author's context? What is the intention behind the work?

Simply pursuing the answers to such questions is a mystery in itself. Of course, there are those who would argue that personal interpretations are much more important than the author's intention for a work, but delving more into a story's context makes it more meaningful. Though, there's always the chance that I'm reading too much into this.

That aside, Oreki certainly came up with a good theory considering the facts already presented, but the unanimous approval of his theory by everyone felt weak. They could have pondered a bit more on a few minor details of his theory, considering that he made quite a few jumps in his explanation. Instead, they agreed with him and called it a day. It just felt somewhat off.

Anyway, it looks like the story isn't over yet, looking at the last moments of the episode.

[Dr. Casey]

Damn, this series is definitely picking up. I loved the mental workout this episode gave me (The mystery aspect is something that Hyou-ka's done very well, to the point where even the laughably mundane mysteries of the first two episodes interested me), and I really like the group dynamics between the leading four. The series might have started off low-key (I actually found the first episode boring, though I enjoyed the second and third), but I can tell that it's going to transform and blossom into a really nice story.

[FlareKnight]

Originally Posted by Eater of All

My conspiracy theory of the day is that Houtarou deliberately withheld the truth from Chitanda. What Houtarou presented was pretty much just connecting everyone's research into one story. Too anticlimatic. Also, the way that preview focuses on Houtarou is really screaming that he has more to say.

Not that I can even guess what the truth might be.

You have a good theory there. It wouldn't be the first time that Houtarou hasn't told the whole truth after all. He also mentioned at the start that he doesn't want to have to take responsibility for whatever they learn affecting Chitanda's life. Could easily see Satoshi pausing their trip home to ask what Houtarou really thought about what happened.

Either way I'm curious to find out just what really happened and how this is all going to turn out.

[LC]

Great episode as always. The stylistic touches make it stand out. I sorta wish that the girls were more correct in their "theories" compared to the boys though, especially Eru, since we already know of her intelligence.

[Guardian Enzo]

My God, it's beautiful. No detail is too small - it's breathtaking to see.

As for the show, I thought this was a very good episode. The girls are gorgeous but still fairly boring, but Fukude is an interesting character - especially his speech on the bikes at the start of the episode. It really does sound like a statement of defiance for his lifestyle, disguised as something else - and a rather dignified and well-stated one too.

[rulfo]

@Qilin

I never imagined it would be a wall of text fest in this ep. Horray for presentation.
A good direction nonetheless for handling this part of the story.

On a side note Oreki was pretty cool in the toilet. Man that sounds kinda wrong.

[Metaneo]

I've never really been one for posting theories (or posting at all.) But I have a hard time turning down a good mystery.

Originally Posted by Eater of All

My conspiracy theory of the day is that Houtarou deliberately withheld the truth from Chitanda. What Houtarou presented was pretty much just connecting everyone's research into one story. Too anticlimatic. Also, the way that preview focuses on Houtarou is really screaming that he has more to say.

Not that I can even guess what the truth might be.

Yeah, I have to agree, seems like Houtarou was withholding information, both the preview and Chitanda's words at the end make it obvious there's more to it then that.


Let's break it down like Houtarou would shall we?


Facts

1: Chitanda said her uncle would tell her everything, anything she asked about he would tell her. Yet for some reason he refused to tell her about this incident. But being as stubborn Chitanda is she kept pushing untill she got an answer.

Why would her uncle refuse to tell her about this incident? What could have happened that he'd be stubborn about not talking about?


2: Chitanda's reaction to being told what happened. She cried, she kept crying, and her uncle didnt try to console her.

What could Chitanda have been told that would cause her to react like this? Why wouldnt her uncle try to console her at all? But most importantly, why would she want to forget something so important?


Putting these pieces of information together with the conclusion Houtarou came to (assuming he's witholding info from Chitanda,) The most likely truth I can come to is.....

Spoiler for My Conclusion:

Murder....
or atleast someone was severly injured. Chitanda's uncle, or anyone for that matter, would not want to talk about such an incident. His stubborness over talking about it would certainly be justified.

Chitanda's reaction to what her uncle told is also important, telling a small child about a murder, I believe, would get that kind of reaction. Her uncle didnt try to console her because there was nothing he could do to console her. Most likely as to why she would want to forget being told what happened, she wouldnt want to associate the uncle she loved with such a horrific incident.

This could also explain the delay on the expulsion from school. The murder took place in June, but the crime wasnt discovered until October.

I'd put more down but I lack information and time to do so, as it is past midnight here.

Feel free to tear this theory apart btw.