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Old 2011-12-03, 16:28   Link #1561
Kafriel
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Join Date: Jan 2009
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Try heal counters or focus with disables - those who lack a true gap closer are easily harassed. Best example would be Zilean's time warp, can shut down a spinning Rammus of over 700 MS, help your team position themselves and kite openly.

EDIT: Just saw the post above...and in that case frenzy sounds like it could use a beating with a nerf stick :P
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Old 2011-12-03, 18:41   Link #1562
Eisdrache
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Maybe I haven't figured out the right items for the bear yet but one downside I faced when using him was that he ran out of mana extremely fast after 1-2 combos.
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Old 2011-12-03, 18:51   Link #1563
Kafriel
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Easiest mana items would be Banshee's and Sheen, maybe RoA...but there's always mana regen in a philo stone, and if you get a catalyst early on, you shouldn't be facing problems while your pool's still small.
Jungle adjustments incoming for Europe, already out in NA.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Morello
Summoners,

Based on your feedback, we have made some changes to the jungle [to clarify, these changes are LIVE on North America]. See below for the release notes:

Increased total base Health in the jungle a bit, focusing on the larger monsters. This is to help accommodate single-target focused junglers.
Increased base Damage in the jungle a bit. This is to add some additional counter-jungling danger, as well as making sustain-based junglers, such as Warwick or Fiddlesticks, fill their specific niche again.
Increased Experience rewards of the jungle, both base and scaling. Simply put, this should make sure the jungler stays somewhere between the solo and duo lanes in most cases, as opposed to closer to the duo lane.
Reduced the Health scaling on the small golem camp. This is to adjust the difficulty/reward ratio on these monsters as the game goes on.
Moved around Gold and Experience rewards so that the Blue Wraith, the Giant Wolf, and the Medium Golem give a higher percentage of the reward for defeating their camp. This is a specific change to increase the viability of counter-jungling. Stealing big monsters will be more impactful.
Monsters now will start to accumulate more reward if they remain idle on the map for a certain amount of time. While we like there to be tradeoffs between ganking and farming, this should somewhat reduce the penalty of failed ganks and reward successful ganks more. Additionally, counter-junglers can steal these monsters and reset their “bank” of additional rewards.


We will continue to monitor the jungle changes, but please give these a try and see if they improve your experience. We’d like to thank everyone for their discussion and feedback on the new jungle. Everyone’s detailed feedback has helped us to continue making changes aimed at meeting our long-term gameplay goals while making your experience better.

Happy ganking!

Last edited by Kafriel; 2011-12-04 at 05:08.
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Old 2011-12-04, 12:49   Link #1564
-Sho-
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Well , we'll see. Honestly , the old jungle was fine , then new masteries came , it was ok.
But srly the new jungle. For what? As Riot said , for lv10 players who couldn't jungler....
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Old 2011-12-04, 15:31   Link #1565
Tacoshuriken
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I can't get used to the new jungle on anyone but Amumu, I dunno why... Blah.

Also, I hate Shaco, his ganks are like, rage inducing.
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Old 2011-12-04, 20:25   Link #1566
Eisdrache
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tacoshuriken View Post
I can't get used to the new jungle on anyone but Amumu, I dunno why... Blah.

Also, I hate Shaco, his ganks are like, rage inducing.
I played a few solo queue blind pick for first win and yes it was indeed terrible.

It is ALWAYS the shittiest player on the team who rages the most.
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Old 2011-12-05, 06:35   Link #1567
Kafriel
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New jungle does have its merits...faster respawn time makes it less of a cookie-cutter (jungle, gank till respawn, then jungle some more) and I like the idea of a gold accumulation system, it will make the fight for jungle territory all the more important. Exp needs some serious adjustments though...
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Old 2011-12-05, 07:13   Link #1568
Kotohono
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kafriel View Post
Exp needs some serious adjustments though...
I think the exp is ok now actually since the change, though I wouldn't complain about a buff to it. But this is just from my experience jungling skarner mostly.
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Old 2011-12-05, 07:25   Link #1569
Kafriel
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My problem is that you don't hit LV4 until after lizard+1 camp, and with awareness now deep in the mastery tree, it can delay a gank until it's too late.
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Old 2011-12-05, 18:40   Link #1570
Kotohono
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kafriel View Post
My problem is that you don't hit LV4 until after lizard+1 camp, and with awareness now deep in the mastery tree, it can delay a gank until it's too late.
I agree that level 4 thing is annoying, but wraiths and wolfs are up by then now with the quicker respawns, so I always just clear one of them quickly depending on which lane I plan to gank.
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Old 2011-12-05, 19:49   Link #1571
DragoonKain3
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I think the new 'gank time' is when you're lvl 3, not lvl 4. This is because you get to 3 just from wolf/blue/wraith/red, and the new jungle is easier that you can get your CC/gap closer/gank skill at lvl 3 instead of 4 and not hurt much in jungle.

So yeah, those who can easily gank before lvl 6 is roughly at the same power level as before. No, my problem with the new jungle (even the hotfixed one) is that you don't hit lvl 6 yet even when clearing both buff camps and TWELVE small camps.

Which means, even if you just continually farm the jungle nonstop, you don't hit 6 until after you clear Blue for the second time. And at 7:30+ clear time to lvl 6, this really hurts junglers who rely on their ults for their ganks, like Amumu, Warwick, and Fiddlesticks.
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Old 2011-12-05, 19:53   Link #1572
Hooves
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So, the people who jungle will just have to pray that the laners will eventually back out so they get more experience for a bit? I was thinking the exact same thing about some gankers relying on their ults. Which will in turn, rotate when to expect ganks to something earlier or later depending on who jungles.

With this jungle nerf to help people 10+, it in turn affects how jungling rotates around, especially when you need to gank someone. I seriously still don't see the need to change jungling at all. You can't exactly expect someone to become a master jungler at a low level. So just leave the job to people who played more matches and watched their jungler play. Or maybe it's because the jungler population is low (which would be strange to see).
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Old 2011-12-05, 19:56   Link #1573
Kotohono
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DragoonKain3 View Post
And at 7:30+ clear time to lvl 6, this really hurts junglers who rely on their ults for their ganks, like Amumu, Warwick, and Fiddlesticks.
Amumu and ww I'd agree, but fiddle can gank without his depending on lanes since his fear and silence can bring enough CC without it to pick up a kill still.
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Old 2011-12-06, 01:34   Link #1574
Kafriel
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Quote:
You can't exactly expect someone to become a master jungler at a low level.
Qft I remember my first few jungle attempts, sometimes I'd die at blue, and little by little I'd make my way to red...and die there :P But after a while I managed to find the proper items/runes/masteries and was able to survive, even with just a sliver of health left. It's definitely much harder than laning and requires precise timing and cooperation (i.e. people NOT stealing your first buff for bloody mid).
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Old 2011-12-06, 01:56   Link #1575
Witch of Uncertainty
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Finally got to convert the loadingscreens and splashart/icons etc to the chinese art. Oh god, so much better...

Spoiler for Annie:

Spoiler for Irelia:

Spoiler for Lux:
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Old 2011-12-06, 16:40   Link #1576
Eisdrache
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I always preferred chinese Annie. Irelia on the other hand ......

Once I can unlazy myself I'll change as well but that requires :effort:
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Old 2011-12-07, 02:27   Link #1577
Kafriel
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Ahri mechanics preview Sounds like fun
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Old 2011-12-07, 05:24   Link #1578
Tacoshuriken
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Join Date: Jul 2011
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Age: 30
Just what we need, more assassins!!
ಠ_ಠ
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Old 2011-12-07, 06:09   Link #1579
-Sho-
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Her ulti seems like Akali's mechanics. And she's AP carry.
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Old 2011-12-07, 07:02   Link #1580
Kafriel
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Akali needs a target, this one might not. I'm expecting a triple skillshot ulti and all of her skills being like Taric's Dazzle.
Quote:
Just what we need, more assassins!!
B-b-but...they rawk! Usually underestimated too, most people go for a tanky dps mix, and it's usually the assassins who get dumped in the trash tier.
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