2005-12-19, 16:15 | Link #1 | |
Retweet Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: ニュー・オーリンズ、LA
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About Shinn and Kira...
The only posts I that I was able to remember saving were posts that involved long posts about Shinn and Kira, so If you have similiar posts about Shinn and Kira please post them here...
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So I think I finally understand you fans...Kira is above normal human thinking...nominal battle reasoning...average processing skills (in terms of the actual battle-situation)...So ya'll basically saying he's some sort of idiot-savant (for those don't know idiot-savant's are intelligence's contradictory enigma, which basically means he's smart enuff to think of war on a heightened-plane, but not smart enuff or plain ignorant to understand the Mobile Suits in the path of his heightend understanding needs to be examined to be beaten, when he was incapable of beating them thanks to this heightened plane of thinking)...I'm not calling him "Rain-man", but based on the logic of some of your defencing of him(4tran and Demongod aswell) I do bellieve he may fall into this category...which means some of you think Kira is somewhat retarted...I don't believe this at all...But to ignore the obvious points I've been raising he'd almost have to be...has)...
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2005-12-19, 16:16 | Link #2 | |||
Retweet Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: ニュー・オーリンズ、LA
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As for ep 28 it remains the best overall episode in the series IMO (Who knew it would be the last truley great episode of this entire series though) It's like you guys don't want any conflict or diverging dynamics (The stuff that has always made GUNDAM great)..If Shinn doesn't fire on Cagali you get a stale-a$$ boring-ass sequence of events instead of the great unpredictabilty and drama that episode produced...Your being a fan, I'm sorry...You want the AA side//Kira-Cagali side to be pampered and not challenged...Don't forget Heine and the victim's of the Taunhauser explosion who Shinn holds dear to his heart as he fire upon this unpredictable force who would become an established enemy of ZAFT...Shinn ain't got time to be listening to no speeches with Auel doing sub-water backstrokes beneath him...Your being bias...ofcourse it suprised me what he did, but that's what made that episode so great because it was the one episode in this entire series (besides the first 8) that was suprising and surpassed expectations...I don't know anybody that doesn't like ep 28 as an episode..During the episode discussion countless members talked how they watched this ep over and over 5-10 times over (I was one of them, thanks to Shinn's impulsive actions)... Quote:
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2008-07-04, 17:13 | Link #3 | ||||
Char clone
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Canada
Age: 35
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taken from this thread.
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And I agree that Athrun is probably the best, what with being undefeated in SEED mode and all. But I wouldn't say Kira is more skilled, I mean Kira just does the same tactics over and over. And as soon as anyone dodges he gets a look of shock on his face and finds himself troubled. Quote:
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Kira isn't any different, infact he's probably been manipulated more, what with Flay making him more aggressive and Lacus putting Freedom in hands, at which point he just goes on to fight for Lacus' ideals for the rest of his screentime. Same can be said for Athrun who finds himself fighting for Lacus' ideals in the final quarter of both series. |
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2008-07-06, 05:29 | Link #4 | ||
Tsubasa No Kami
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From the thread Eagles posted/linked to.
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Seriously, Shinn was never barbaric about how he fights. Or how he is, in entirety.
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2008-07-06, 10:52 | Link #5 | |||||
yare yare..
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Earth (:
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I never get why people get so worked up just because of one mere opinion. By the way, I'm still interested if you're gonna explain to me how flawless Shinn is next to Kira; I'll save you from talking about Athrun, otherwise it'd be off-topic. Quote:
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Also, what were those paragraphs for? You can read my mind? You know why I think Shinn is barbaric? But apparently, you didn't hit. Quote:
Basically, in a fair fight. He lost. He could've died and he never won back.
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2008-07-06, 14:13 | Link #6 | ||
Char clone
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Canada
Age: 35
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2008-07-06, 14:40 | Link #7 |
Silent Warrior
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Netherlands
Age: 38
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I didn't read the whole thread, but isn't the point that Kira is god himself in the Gundam series. Shinn is just another emo kid. Sure Kira was emo too, but hey you tend forgive someone with God mode. =o That and shinn also failed since he was the main character and got outshined/outclassed by the old cast. Either way shinn loses.
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2008-07-06, 17:32 | Link #8 | |
Gundam Boobs and Boom FTW
Join Date: Dec 2005
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As for GSD 34, Kira himself stressed that he wasn't remotely at his best in that fight. And while a lot of Shinn apologists called BS on that, Shinn from then on simply got trashed any time he saw Kira or Athrun. Shinn vs. Kira in space, also, is just flat out unfair. If Kira stomped Shinn on earth, then Kira + dragoons = owned.
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2008-07-06, 18:53 | Link #9 | |||
Char clone
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Canada
Age: 35
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Last edited by Eagles; 2008-07-06 at 19:36. |
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2008-07-06, 21:08 | Link #10 |
Bluefin Distribution
Scanlator
Join Date: Nov 2006
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There are no mind controlled weapons in CE as of now. The difference between the DRAGOON pods on the Providence and later models was that the Providence required its user to have a fairly good understanding of an x,y,z plane that is constantly changing according to one's own position. This is the "heightened spacial awareness" requirement. Later models have upgraded software that deal with the calculations.
The point is, the user is still having to position the pods and fire him/herself with controls inside the cockpit. This is a different concept from the funnel/bits in other Gundam universes that react to the pilots brain waves and moved as if they were extensions of that person's body. Keep in mind that the only sort of Newtype ability Kira had was when he somehow knew that Mwu was in that windam when it crashed.
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2008-07-07, 06:30 | Link #12 | ||||
yare yare..
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Earth (:
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Actual loss or not, it's futile. The fact that you agreed that the fight in Phase 34 was an unfair one(with Kira being at fault) already means that there is no actual loss there too. Quote:
Anyways, I'm not interested to find you a clip. I only know that he did say that. If you want to disprove me, you're the one that's in the liberty show me that he did not say that. Quote:
He didn't die, doesn't mean he didn't lose. Fight differently? All he does is use his ASS and flung it everywhere where it hits. Oh yeah, and his boomerangs that always seem to only hit grunts. ...and he didn't even figured the strategy to beat Freedom by himself. Rey was the one who pointed it out to him and he trained himself with simulation battles. You're making me laugh when you say that you'd disagree that Kira is better than Shinn. Back in SEED, did Kira ever had a chance to train in simulation battles to face Athrun, Yzak, Dearka and Nicol?
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2008-07-07, 11:52 | Link #13 | ||||||||
Char clone
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Canada
Age: 35
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So have any proof other than Shinn's encouter with Kira while not in SEED mode? |
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2008-07-07, 14:03 | Link #14 | ||
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
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As to the unfairness of Kira's situation when Freedom got impaled, or any unfairness in combat for that matter, I'm not sure how it'd matter. Combat is all about putting your enemy in as unfair a position as possible, so that'd be the optimum tactic in just about any circumstance.
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2008-07-07, 22:01 | Link #15 |
Tsubasa No Kami
Artist
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Combat in war has never been about playing fair. But, to some degree, it had to be fair, or else the other side would never have a chance of winning at all. If they were to even the odds out to a degree, or use their own strengths to compensate their weaknesses, that should always be the point. It's going to be the turning point of that war, whether for good or for worse to either side. If it was to be unfair like giving Kira "super skills" with regards to how he treated Shinn and the rest of the "villains" in Destiny, then it's another matter entirely.
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2008-07-07, 23:37 | Link #17 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Somewhere at Earth
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Shinn made the right choice to join Zaft to make revenge against the enemy that invade and killed his parents there's no way he will join Orb with there sugarcoated words and posturing words that's why his angry attitude at Cagalli words were a disillusioned, false belief, distrust.
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2008-07-08, 12:54 | Link #18 | |||||||||
yare yare..
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Earth (:
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By the way, I don't have doubts if Kira didn't have any handicaps, because Shinn could've died in Phase 34 as well. When he magically thrusted Kira with his ASS, Kira could've thrusted/slashed his beam saber through Impulse's cockpit/body. But, he still chose to thrust it through its head. Yep. Kira lost. But only because he still chose not to kill even though he was on the verge of death. Impose of disadvantage or not, I don't care. I can accept that he lost. But if you were to say he lost to Shinn fairly, then it's debatable. Quote:
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With your first statement, it's like you're saying without preparations, Shinn cannot take on Kira in Strike Freedom. Yet you're still labeling him to be more skilful than Kira. Oh, the irony. Quote:
If you want to compare Shinn in Impulse with Kira, you'll have to compare him with Kira in Strike, not Kira in Freedom. Quote:
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You're saying as though Shinn didn't have backup: Rey, Lunamaria, the ability to recharge battery asap, the ability to replace parts as soon as it's destroyed. You don't have to make a comeback saying Strike could too. Yes, Strike could, but only with the aid of the SkyGrasper and it doesn't replace parts as fast as Impulse could. Also, I could say the same for Shinn. When Shinn got into his SEED mode, the mobile suits were like cannon/ASS fodder. Quote:
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2008-07-09, 11:01 | Link #19 |
Pancakes
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: In Your House. No, really, look properly.
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In space, Kira pawned Shinn as well. Anyone here who have watched final plus episode would have seen that Shinn could not even pose a threat to Kira when he uses his DRAGOONs. Again, he was being too much of a saint, so instead of using his DRAGOONs to tear Destiny to pieces, he aimed forward, which is blockable by Destiny's shields. Plus, in that battle, you cannot say that Shinn had a disadvantage because of his mental state, blah, blah, blah, cause he already knows that Kira and Athrun have survived and ready to fight him.
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2008-07-09, 11:44 | Link #20 |
Taiyou no Tsubasa
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Atlandia
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I dun see any points in discussing about someone that has been blessed to become an ultimate god like Jesus Yamato vs a normal being like Shinn
Win or lose , I dont need to know that Capable of using tactics or not , I dun really sure Mental state unstable or sth like that....etc , not really care All I can say is that Kira's fighting abilities is >> than Shinn's ( the way how he treated his enemies was enough for me to see that clearly ) , and that what's the director wanted , they made Kira to become that strong so he cannot lose to anyone in fighting abilites ( correct me if I m wrong ) P.S : all I said was about fighting abilites and only fighting abilites , not tactics or leadership or anything else |
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