Code Geass R2 - Episode 14 Discussion / Poll

[Dream_Traveller]

Over-zealousness alert...

[Ashura Shamshir]

Originally Posted by Eliarine

Shirley was more paranoid and irrational than suicidal, to be honest. If I remember correctly, it was more like "Nooooo I'll jump here so you don't come any clos-OH NOES I SLIPPED!.

And Suzaku has reasons to believe Lelouch could be behind it all. They may conflict with the fact that yes, he did try to save Shirley, but to him this is still the guy who geassed his sister into mass murdering the Japanese just to boost his reputation and never showed remorse.

Hello everyone man, what an awesome episode 9/10. Roll on episode 15

erm...I think whether Shirley jumped off on purpose, accidently slipped, or even hop-skipped and then jumped of the building is somewhat irrelevant. What is relevant however is Lelouches response to when Shirley was in freefall and that was witnessed by Suzaku himself. Not a lot of guys would do what Lelouche did for Shirley at the moment her delving into free-running backfired.

Why would Lelouche endanger his own life, and endanger it at a time when his primary goal of crafting a suitable world for his sister remains unachieved? Even though Lelouch may never have reciprocated Shirleys feelings, shirleys life was dear to him, so dear that he almost gave the greatest sacrifice he could in his attempt to save her. But by a stroke of luck they were both saved by a momentary awakening of kindness within Suzaku. How can Suzaku conclude so easily, that the perpetrator of Shirleys murder is Lelouche, when he himslef witnessed what happened atop that sky scraper?

[EternalMelody]

And Suzaku has reasons to believe Lelouch could be behind it all. They may conflict with the fact that yes, he did try to save Shirley, but to him this is still the guy who geassed his sister into mass murdering the Japanese just to boost his reputation and never showed remorse.

You forgot that Lelouch didn't want to geass Euphie. He did that accidentally and it was shown in that episode that Lelouch cried for that.

[k//eternal]

I think he was talking from Suzaku's perspective.

There aren't too many people with Geass around, and I don't think Suzaku expected her to have come into contact with any user other than Lelouch.

[Verist]

Originally Posted by edf91

You guys sure are crude - the main reason Suzaku is hiding the stuff from Nanaly is because he don't want her to know her beloved brother is the one that kill Euphie and doing all those horrible things as zero. Suzaku always treat Nanaly like a sister he never had, and he don't want to burden her with all the stuff. He rather let Nanaly think he is "bad" then let her into thinking Lulu is bad. Nothing crushes a young girl's world worse than having the closest person lie to her, which is what Lulu has been doing for a while now. I do believe Suzaku has the right thing in his mind when he does this - he is trying to make sure Nanaly is not part of the conflict between him and Lulu. Whether that is the right thing to do or not is a different question, but Suzaku is doing it for her sake - not like he cares what Lulu think what he is doing

As for asking the intelligence branch for information - you would be out of your mind if you still believe they are giving them good information. Suzaku has been questioning the information that the intelligence branch for a while - not openly, but definitely suspicious. I don't know what "excuse" they give for Lulu not being at Shirley's funeral, but either way, I doubt it will be something that Suzaku can accept.

And Shirley wasn't trying to kill herself early - she was hallucinating, and both Suzaku and Lulu can see that, and I tried to explain that earlier - unless Shirley shot herself multiple times, then it would at least make some sort of sense. Shooting yourself in the stomach while hallucinating would take some really strange explanation...

As for him suspecting Lulu being the killer, he is right in the sense that the only reason to kill Shirley was to protect Zero's identity, and he is right - except he got the actual killer wrong, as it is Rolo, not Lulu. It seems that he didn't know about Rolo's geass, as otherwise, it would be obvious who the potential killers can be, and Suzaku did speculate that only a geass user would be capable to killing Shirley that way.

For the most part I agree with many of your points, but Suzaku has changed. Now he he is hiding the potential drugging and torture of another person she cares about, Kallen (107). With a friend like Suzaku, who needs enemies.

[Anh_Minh]

Method, motive, opportunity. The last one can't be verified, but the first two...

Method: Suzaku "knows" that Shirley shot herself. (How his ME got to that conclusion is something best left unexamined.) So she either committed suicide, or was geassed into killing herself. Or, OK, was murdered and said murder was disguised as a suicide.

Motive: sure, Lelouch risked his life for her. But what if he learnt - after saving her - that she knew his identity? Shirley, in her speech on forgiveness, practically told Suzaku she knew. And, hey, Lelouch is pretty cold blooded. He killed Euphie.

So, yeah, from Suzaku's POV, with his gut feeling that the new Zero is, in fact, the old Zero, it's not that hard to suspect Lelouch.

[Ruezu]

Originally Posted by EternalMelody

If something bad happens to Kallen, I'll really kill him and his voice actor with my own hands, and slaugther their families.

One possibility : Kallen busted out of there and escapes with the new Guren.

2nd possibility : Suzaku wants Kallen to use refrain on Lelouch/Zero.

3rd possibility : Nunnally stops Suzaku and Kallen remains a normal prisoner.

Poor voice actor.... O_o

[Eliarine]

Originally Posted by EternalMelody

You forgot that Lelouch didn't want to geass Euphie. He did that accidentally and it was shown in that episode that Lelouch cried for that.

For the last time, Suzaku doesn't know that.

[edf91]

Originally Posted by Verist

For the most part I agree with many of your points, but Suzaku has changed. Now he he is hiding the potential drugging and torture of another person she cares about, Kallen (107). With a friend like Suzaku, who needs enemies.

I never said he didn't change - he pretty much said so when he bring out the refrain - forgot his exact words, but he basically said I cannot force myself to follow the rules when everybody else is breaking them, especially if he want to stop Lulu.

Originally Posted by Ashura Shamshir

erm...I think whether Shirley jumped off on purpose, accidently slipped, or even hop-skipped and then jumped of the building is somewhat irrelevant. What is relevant however is Lelouches response to when Shirley was in freefall and that was witnessed by Suzaku himself. Not a lot of guys would do what Lelouche did for Shirley at the moment her delving into free-running backfired.

Actually, what is more relevant is whether Lulu knows Shirley remembers everything when Lulu rescue her - Suzaku's thinking was that Lulu kills Shirley because she remembers who is Zero. He knows Lulu cared for her, but from his prospective, Lulu is the same person who killed one of the sister that he likes (and can do no harm).

Originally Posted by Ashura Shamshir

Why would Lelouche endanger his own life, and endanger it at a time when his primary goal of crafting a suitable world for his sister remains unachieved? Even though Lelouch may never have reciprocated Shirleys feelings, shirleys life was dear to him, so dear that he almost gave the greatest sacrifice he could in his attempt to save her. But by a stroke of luck they were both saved by a momentary awakening of kindness within Suzaku. How can Suzaku conclude so easily, that the perpetrator of Shirleys murder is Lelouche, when he himslef witnessed what happened atop that sky scraper?

Suzaku never questions Lulu's feeling toward Shirley, as he knows Lulu cared about Shirley - Suzaku is speculating that if Shirley threaten to tell everyone who Zero really is, Lulu would kill her.

[Izayoi]

If Suzaku really did use refrain on her then it would be the downfall of his moral, and soon will be downfall of he, himself. I will look forward to it if he really does what I expected. As for Charles and V.V, apparently V.V was the one who killed Lulu's mother and lied to Charles. While in this episode Lulu made a major mistake in having to kill the researcher all based purely on his emotions, soon his army might fall apart.

[EternalMelody]

Even if Suzaku injects Kallen with Refrain, I don't think Kallen is gonna switch sides. After all if she does, who's gonna fight for the Black Knights? Toudou? Against Suzaku, Gino, Anya, and if it's true, Kallen? Also the supposedly most powerful knight Bismarck Waldstein?

[SkoolRumble4Ya]

Kallen will not switch. She is also fighting for her brother dreams to free Japan. Kallen is way too loyal to switch sides.

[Izayoi]

They are not trying to make her switch side, but to know if Lelouch is really Zero since she knows too.

edit: Actually I think Suzaku did it for lulz.

[FuzzyWuzzy]

Suzaku did it.
As for V.V killing marianne, no one knows.

[snarf2691]

hmm with the idea that vv lied about sending assassins to kill lelouch. could it not be just him sending rollo and orange, but the truth was that assassins were sent to kill him in the past but marianne protected him?

[Izayoi]

Originally Posted by snarf2691

hmm with the idea that vv lied about sending assassins to kill lelouch. could it not be just him sending rollo and orange, but the truth was that assassins were sent to kill him in the past but marianne protected him?

But it seems to be that V.V hates Marianne rather than Lelouch, so far no motive have shown for why she wants to kill Lelouch and he only views him as some brat prince. But it is very doubtful, might have been that he hated Marianne BECAUSE she protected Lelouch and interrupted his plan.

[Angrypokstick]

you are not the first person i ve seen today to come up with that idea. But its a good idea nonetheless. Though i believe its more probable that with the way V.V seem to resent Marianne 's name when mentioned its more likely that he sent assassins to kill both Marianne and Lelouch that day but only succeeded in killing Marianne.

edit: damn Setsilya~ ninja-ed me...

[FuzzyWuzzy]

Marianne protected Nunnally and not Lelouch.
You guys have wild theories.... it just makes me laugh.

[Izayoi]

Originally Posted by FuzzyWuzzy

Marianne protected Nunnally and not Lelouch.
You guys have wild theories.... it just makes me laugh.

Dear, they shot Marianne and she fell on Nunnally. Lelouch suggest because she was a commoner, royals didn't liked her and when she was shot, they covered it by saying it is terrorism. Even Clovis, Cornelia, Euphie, didn't know about who send the assassin and Cornelia actually try to find who planned it and failed so far; it only means someone who is covering the assassin is strong in the royal powers like V.V. I love when trolls speaks out loud... it just makes me laugh.

[Panarchus]

Seems that Suzaku and Lelouch both become hypocrites in this episode.