Upcoming anime database (wiki)

[CrowKenobi]

Is there a table of contents page? Just going to the main page really doesn't help me when I don't know what pages have been created or whatnot.

[GHDpro]

Originally Posted by CrowKenobi

Is there a table of contents page? Just going to the main page really doesn't help me when I don't know what pages have been created or whatnot.

http://wiki.animesuki.com/wiki/Special:AllPages

See also: http://wiki.animesuki.com/wiki/Special:SpecialPages

[CrowKenobi]

The all pages link works, but to get to it without the direct link, you have to go through the special pages link... my point is if someone isn't familiar with how a wiki works, if they stumble upon the main page, how do they know where to go?

My suggestion: put a link to the all pages page into the navigation box and list it as All Pages (index) at least until we can come up with something better.

Nevemind, then... I only now saw the link to the upcoming anime page... >.<

[Slice of Life]

OK, I put in every anime I found at fansubwiki (except ongoing OVAs). Next I'll check anidb, ANN, NeoSam's list, Chartfag's poster, and Moonphase. But not today. Go ahead, expand the entries. And maybe somebody could make a nicer looking placeholder picture? Also, I think we can move discussions to the wiki discussion pages now.

[GHDpro]

Originally Posted by Slice of Life

Also, I think we can move discussions to the wiki discussion pages now.

Kinda depends on the topic, IMHO. As the wiki is already intergrated with the forum account-wise, there is no reason to use the forum for wiki discussions. Unless you have tons of pages which might all need their own talk page, using a forum for discussion is much easier I think.

[Slice of Life]

I'm almost through with adding anime from various sources but the connection today went from bad to dead, as far as editing is concerned.

[relentlessflame]

By the way, for some reason my account doesn't work on the Wiki site. It says "You have not specified a valid user name." Is it still working for everyone else? I wouldn't mind going in and making a few corrections to what's in there, at least.

[Slice of Life]

It still works for me.

[GHDpro]

Originally Posted by relentlessflame

By the way, for some reason my account doesn't work on the Wiki site. It says "You have not specified a valid user name." Is it still working for everyone else? I wouldn't mind going in and making a few corrections to what's in there, at least.

That might have something to do with the code I wrote to convert whatever username you may have entered at the login screen to the same case as on the forum, and MediaWiki attempting to enforce it's page title requirements upon usernames.

Meaning, "slice of life" => "Slice of Life" works fine, because it's an acceptable page title. But "relentlessflame" => "relentlessflame" is rejected, because MedaWiki insists on having a page title start with a capitalized letter.

I've now made a small change that will return the username back to MediaWiki the way it wants, so "relentlessflame" => "Relentlessflame". I figured that would be easier than try to hack MediaWiki into accepting anything as username, which might open up all kinds of other gotcha's.

Anyway, assuming that was the problem you were having, you should be able to login now.

Edit:
Sorry, I noticed I changed the wrong line. It should now really work.

[relentlessflame]

Originally Posted by GHDpro

Anyway, assuming that was the problem you were having, you should be able to login now.

Yes, thanks -- that was it! Now to do a bit of clean-up...

[GHDpro]

Originally Posted by relentlessflame

Yes, thanks -- that was it! Now to do a bit of clean-up...

I noticed you "cleaned up" the default dateformat, causing every date now to be displayed as YYYY-MM-DD rather than Month Day, Year. I find the latter format much easier to read.

Now you may argue "Just change your preferences", but that's not an option for 99% of all the future prospect visitors of this page - those who are not logged in.

On the other hand, if we keep the "mdy" default date format anyone who really wants to see the list in ISO format (YYYY-MM-DD) can always log in and change the preferences.

In conclusion, I propose to make the default dateformat for users who haven't changed their preferences or simply aren't logged in (guests) back to Month Day, Year.

[Slice of Life]

I vote for keeping it. I find writing out month names unnecessarily wordy in this context and always considered ordering time units by descending size the most natural way of specifying dates. It's also the default in this forum, so for consistency's sake ...

Another thing that is more important for me is the titles. I reverted back the title for White Album. As I already wrote on the discussion page I'd like to stick to the titles AniDB considers the "correct" ones. In any case, I'd like to have a standard that settles all questions if it should be Lucky Star, Lucky☆Star, or Raki Sutaru immediately so we don't run into the danger of floating the thread with lengthy discussions of this kind for every third title there is. We don't need to take the AniDB standard if you have a better idea (but I don't want to use the ANN localized titles).

[felix]

Dates should be Time, Day Month Year, like this: 22:18, 19 February 2009

This is what wikipedia uses and its good because its easy to read (by everyone); this is in part due to it being the more universal way of mentioning a date (you don't have to re-think what is written). The format(s) which place the year first are very weird and annoying for a lot of people (I do believe only americans do this). There are also issues with the format for months, if space is a problem always just use the shorthand month format (ie. Dec, Feb, Nov), its only one character longer then the numeric format. One simple reason for this is that a lot of people use the YYYY-DD-MM format too so if you say 2009-06-03 I don't know what to think...

Slice of Life, default in this forum it may be... but I only really ever see Yesterday, Today etc so how is that a argument. Also please look at your join date.

[GHDpro]

I've made some changes to the page... I hope nobody minds.

Also, as it's nearly October already... I was thinking of putting the page "live". That is, publically advertise it on the site. While it's still early (quite a few images are still missing and a lot more ANN/MAL links still need to be added), I don't think we can wait to much longer or the info will be already obsolete by the time we're ready.

[Slice of Life]

I can live with links to CR's streams as they are now even though I see that their definition of "everyone" once again clashes with mine. I guess, "nobody" will continue to ignore them and grab the rips instead.

But I find the anime titles much less eye-catching than before when they were smaller but bold. I would revert that. Just to make sure we're seeing the same, in my browser it looks like this:

Spoiler for screenshot:

Next thing, a few thoughts about organization of pages. I would rename the "upcoming anime" page into "upcoming season". Or actually "current season" now. Simply because that's what it is, while the anime on it are either already past, current, or upcoming. Then we need a new page "upcoming season(s)" of course and soon also "past seasons(s)". The latter would include maybe the last 4 seasons directly and the rest only as links. But that's something we can still discuss in a year from now. To avoid unnecessary doubling the link list should get its own template with more general links (e.g. simply to the fansubwiki instead the correct season) and should be included on the "upcoming/current/past season" level.

And by all means, advertise the page! The idea behind a wiki page is not to keep it secret until it is perfect.

[GHDpro]

I had removed the bold style from the anime titles because in combination with <big> it was a bit... to big. I've now tweaked the font-size so that <big> is less and re-added the bold style. I hope it now looks better.

I don't think we have to worry to much about the semantics of "Upcoming anime" not being accurate near the end of a season. The reason I chose seperate page as the "portal" page is because it'll never change - people can easily bookmark it.

As for including not the whole Anime of Fall 2009 page, I was actually thinking about that too, but wasn't sure exactly how to do it right. However now that I've split up the page into several month sections, it actually makes it easier: we could encase only the upcoming month(s) into <includeonly> tags, so that you skip the September section.

As for season navigation: I was thinking about eventually implementing something like this.

Edit: Done. The upcoming anime page now only features entries from October and later and has it's own links section.

Originally Posted by Slice of Life

I can live with links to CR's streams as they are now even though I see that their definition of "everyone" once again clashes with mine. I guess, "nobody" will continue to ignore them and grab the rips instead.

I figured we can't avoid listing any Crunchyroll links. But I think the way they're implemented now shouldn't be obnoxious to those who can't view most CR content (that includes me btw).

[relentlessflame]

Originally Posted by GHDpro

In conclusion, I propose to make the default dateformat for users who haven't changed their preferences or simply aren't logged in (guests) back to Month Day, Year.

The problem with Month Day, Year is that it's an American standard, hence going with the YYYY-MM-DD ISO standard. If you must do a wordy version, Day Month Year (as in 30 September 2009) is more acceptable to me, but that's just a personal preference.

Originally Posted by Cats

One simple reason for this is that a lot of people use the YYYY-DD-MM format too so if you say 2009-06-03 I don't know what to think...

Some people do use "YYYY/DD/MM", but keep in mind that this is different from "YYYY-MM-DD" with dashes, which represents the ISO standard date notation (ISO 8601). Also, it will be obvious from the way we're listing it given that it's sorted by month. I can't say that I've personally ever seen anyone write the date YYYY-DD-MM with dashes, only slashes. Because it's used fairly widely on the Internet (since it's MySQL's default date format as well), I don't personally think many will be confused.

Originally Posted by Slice of Life

I reverted back the title for White Album. As I already wrote on the discussion page I'd like to stick to the titles AniDB considers the "correct" ones.

I would be all for this, except for the fact that the AniDB title is completely wrong in this case. The official title is just "White Album", and the "continuation" is a note for the sake of the readers. This is consistent with the way it's listed on Japanese sites. I assume that AniDB just added the 2 to differentiate things in their list, but I don't think we should subject ourselves to their "errors"... but I suppose that defeats the point of defining a certain external site as a reference. I personally would rather see us be the standard for accuracy, but that's just me...

Originally Posted by GHDpro

As for including not the whole Anime of Fall 2009 page, I was actually thinking about that too, but wasn't sure exactly how to do it right. However now that I've split up the page into several month sections, it actually makes it easier: we could encase only the upcoming month(s) into <includeonly> tags, so that you skip the September section.

Personally, though I understand the point of the Upcoming Anime designation (and things that started in September are technically no longer upcoming), I have to admit that the new layout feels weird to me, especially given that there are new shows that started a few days before the cross-over, and people will consider "Fall 2009 shows". To have them not there just feels weird to me. On the other hand, I can see why I wouldn't want to see September's OVAs and Movies in that list because they're old news. So... I don't know what the solution is, but it just feels weird to me. I guess I'm mostly used to the presentation on MoonPhase that keeps the whole new season at the top until the month before the next. Granted that you can get that by going to the "Fall 2009" page, but yeah... I don't know -- need to think about it some more.

Anyway, will try to add more thumbnails later today.

[GHDpro]

Originally Posted by relentlessflame

Personally, though I understand the point of the Upcoming Anime designation (and things that started in September are technically no longer upcoming), I have to admit that the new layout feels weird to me, especially given that there are new shows that started a few days before the cross-over, and people will consider "Fall 2009 shows". To have them not there just feels weird to me. On the other hand, I can see why I wouldn't want to see September's OVAs and Movies in that list because they're old news. So... I don't know what the solution is, but it just feels weird to me. I guess I'm mostly used to the presentation on MoonPhase that keeps the whole new season at the top until the month before the next. Granted that you can get that by going to the "Fall 2009" page, but yeah... I don't know -- need to think about it some more.

Well I "removed" September 2009 from the page more-or-less as a demonstration that it can be done that way (only include a part of a season list). Next time though, I recommend we wait a little longer before removing the previous month, say not before the 15th of the next month.

[relentlessflame]

Originally Posted by GHDpro

Well I "removed" September 2009 from the page more-or-less as a demonstration that it can be done that way (only include a part of a season list). Next time though, I recommend we wait a little longer before removing the previous month, say not before the 15th of the next month.

Yeah, if you did that, I think that would be okay.

[Slice of Life]

Three things:

1. With changing the upcoming anime list month-wise, uninitiated users won't be confused, so I'm fine with it. And the titles look much better again.

2. Here is a v0.01 for winter: http://wiki.animesuki.com/wiki/Anime_of_winter_2009/10. Only December so far, and Anidb is down at the moment, so I can't put in the links.

3.

Well I "removed" September 2009 from the page more-or-less as a demonstration that it can be done that way (only include a part of a season list). Next time though, I recommend we wait a little longer before removing the previous month, say not before the 15th of the next month.

Why not put it in again, then?