President G.W. Bush dodges shoes in Iraq

[justinstrife]

Originally Posted by royalekitty

I'm proud of Bush for dodging those shoes, I mean.. they were coming at him pretty fast so it's kind of impressive.

The guy isn't in bad shape, and was in the military after-all. He had to have some skills.

[sa547]

All right, here's some bad news for those rooting for the guy: Muntadher al-Zaidi, the man who threw his shoes at then-U.S. President George W. Bush, is jailed for three years.

I predict that the prison sentence would only make some of his admirers angry.

[Shadow Kira01]

Originally Posted by sa547

All right, here's some bad news for those rooting for the guy: Muntadher al-Zaidi, the man who threw his shoes at then-U.S. President George W. Bush, is jailed for three years.

I predict that the prison sentence would only make some of his admirers angry.

That's sad...

Will he still be a journalist 3 years from now? Or will he plan on leading a resistance group after the 3-year term? Muntadher al-Zaidi started the "toss a shoe at corrupted politicians" trend. It is pitiful that he lost his job, got beaten up, and is now sent to prison for 3 years.

[Mystique]

Originally Posted by Shadow Minato

That's sad...

Will he still be a journalist 3 years from now? Or will he plan on leading a resistance group after the 3-year term? Muntadher al-Zaidi started the "toss a shoe at corrupted politicians" trend. It is pitiful that he lost his job, got beaten up, and is now sent to prison for 3 years.

Now here's a question we really gotta be asking ourselves.
If we replace Bush with Obama, would we be feeling 'sorry' for the guy who attempted to attack a head of an international state with a weapon?

[Solace]

Originally Posted by Mystique

Now here's a question we really gotta be asking ourselves.
If we replace Bush with Obama, would we be feeling 'sorry' for the guy who attempted to attack a head of an international state with a weapon?

We sympathize because Bush was a terrible President. If Obama ended up in the same position people would still sympathize with shoe thrower. Changing the face doesn't change the actions that led to the shoe throwing.

Now in four years, if Obama has somehow managed to be the same or worse than Bush, I don't think people will be throwing just shoes.

[justinstrife]

The shoe thrower is lucky the Secret Service didn't fill him full of lead for attacking the President...

[Vexx]

Stand back. I have a shoe and I know how to use it~!

[danin8r44]

Originally Posted by justinstrife

The guy isn't in bad shape, and was in the military after-all. He had to have some skills.

If you call skimping in the Texas Air National Guard military at all then yes.

[Shadow Kira01]

Considering that shoes are usually expensive, is it really worth it to toss it at a corrupted politician and never get it back? More over, tossing it can get oneself into some serious consequences; it's no laughing matter.

[Pixelation]

After ninja-dodging a throw and realizing it was a shoe, Bush should have said 'Well... that was random...' then finished his speech. It would have been priceless. XD

[Demongod86]

Originally Posted by Solace

We sympathize because Bush was a terrible President. If Obama ended up in the same position people would still sympathize with shoe thrower. Changing the face doesn't change the actions that led to the shoe throwing.

Now in four years, if Obama has somehow managed to be the same or worse than Bush, I don't think people will be throwing just shoes.

Just because Bush was a terrible president doesn't mean that we need to feel any sympathy towards this asshat.

He may have been a terrible president, but at least he tried, and put his best foot forward. So while I think GWB did a very lacking job as president, I will at least commend him for doing what he thought was in our best interests.

So frankly, I'm glad that ugly goon got a knuckle sandwich and some bars to go with it. You don't toss shoes at our president.

[danin8r44]

Originally Posted by Demongod86

Just because Bush was a terrible president doesn't mean that we need to feel any sympathy towards this asshat.

He may have been a terrible president, but at least he tried, and put his best foot forward. So while I think GWB did a very lacking job as president, I will at least commend him for doing what he thought was in our best interests.

So frankly, I'm glad that ugly goon got a knuckle sandwich and some bars to go with it. You don't toss shoes at our president.

I'm not going to say that what he did wasn't illegal, but you have to see his action in the grand scheme of things. Ultimately it doesn't matter whether Bush tried hard or not, he is a public figure and as such is defined by the policy of his presidency and its consequences, not by his personality. What the shoe thrower did was an act of protest and a rejection of, not a man, but the policies behind a man. The fact that it was assault hardly matters in this case, as it was directed not against Bush the man, but Bush the symbol of America and its policies and actions while under Bush. I dislike many of Bush's policies quite a bit and so agree with the shoe thrower on that level, but I still love my home country and so I see a problem with this being represented as a statement against America as a whole.

[Solace]

Well said.

[Vexx]

I think the question history will have to sort out is what exactly he was actually trying to accomplish during his administration. Certain motivations make a lot of sense but they weren't the ones officially given (which changed as the assertions didn't pan out).

[0utf0xZer0]

Three years? I get the impression most Canadians were for using short jail sentence as a deterrent back when it was cool to pie Canadian politicians, but people would have been screaming bloody murder if they handed out three years for it.

Originally Posted by Vexx

I think the question history will have to sort out is what exactly he was actually trying to accomplish during his administration. Certain motivations make a lot of sense but they weren't the ones officially given (which changed as the assertions didn't pan out).

We actually discussed some of this in one of my international relations classes. For all the shady connections surrounding his presidency, I still sometimes find myself wondering if Bush actually believed he was doing the right thing in quite a few cases. After all, Neoconservative foreign policy (imposing democracy by military conquest) actually makes sense - if you assume that everyone in the world thinks like democracy loving westerners and desires nothing more than to be freed. Totally disregards reality of course (although many western stereotypes about the muslim world are just as stupid), but it provides an easy to understand, simple theory of the world that more complex analysis can't.

[Alleluia_Cone]

The problem with the sentence handed down, irrespective of George W. Bush, is that it does not conform to the criminal intent impinged on the perpetrator.

In order to justify a battery charge you would have to argue that the shoe-thrower wanted to do actual harm to the president. I highly doubt that was the purpose of his little exhibition. At worst, the president might have gotten a bruise and been humiliated. Three years is not really a just punishment for that kind of behavior, which would qualify as an assault tort in the United States.

As a side note, to those who were surprised that George W. Bush managed to duck the show throws, it is my understanding that he is actually one of the more athletic presidents we have ever had, which is to say, that, I don't see Clinton being similarly successful had it occurred to him.

[Mystique]

Somehow, I believe that the show thrower did wannt do actual harm to the president in the name of all the kids and women that died during the war. I don't think it was planned in terms of 'throw this show at his head only', methinks he went with severly strong emotions.
Regardless of it meaning to represent a general bitter opinion or his own personal idea, people do not go around throwing hard objects at heads of international states in protest.
Yeesh why didn't any of you americans try hurling items at Bush during the 8 years then?
(Cause SS or FBI would have been on your asses in due time?)

Since most are saying how unfair it is for the punishment, it got me curious about the British guy who spposedly threw a shoe at the Chinese leader.
Ironically.... the Chinese leader's decision kinda twists things, tries to put him (and China) in a good, forgiving light.
Article

A smokescreen in hope for protesters in London to back off perhaps?
And then there's also the Swedish student who did it too, wonder what happened to them?

[Hage-bai]

Originally Posted by Alleluia_Cone

The problem with the sentence handed down, irrespective of George W. Bush, is that it does not conform to the criminal intent impinged on the perpetrator.

In order to justify a battery charge you would have to argue that the shoe-thrower wanted to do actual harm to the president. I highly doubt that was the purpose of his little exhibition. At worst, the president might have gotten a bruise and been humiliated. Three years is not really a just punishment for that kind of behavior, which would qualify as an assault tort in the United States.

These islamic countries haven't quite caught up with the nuances of western law yet. Afghanis for example get a minimum of 20 years to a worst case of death for "blaspheme" still today. Three years seems light in comparison to the way these countries handle things.

Its interesting to note the changes iraq is proposing in their constitution is a minimum of 3 years to a maximum of 15 years for assaulting any head of state. He got the minimum under their law. Thankfully he didnt hit Bush. His sentence would probably have doubled.

[kguthrie]

I think GWB is a secretly trained ninja and that is how he was able to dodge the shoe.

[Mystique]

Originally Posted by Hage-bai

These islamic countries haven't quite caught up with the nuances of western law yet. Afghanis for example get a minimum of 20 years to a worst case of death for "blaspheme" still today. Three years seems light in comparison to the way these countries handle things.

Its interesting to note the changes iraq is proposing in their constitution is a minimum of 3 years to a maximum of 15 years for assaulting any head of state. He got the minimum under their law. Thankfully he didnt hit Bush. His sentence would probably have doubled.

*high fives*
Different culture, harsher punishments too.
May be flippant of me to say so, but I can't help but think some people would be living under the mentality of 'steal something and we'll chop your hand off' in many non western states.

I guess they were trying to make an example of the journalist, perhaps too extremely, but the crime is no laughing matter, (victim omitted that is)