Nisemonogatari - Episode 01 Discussion / Poll

[Demi.]

Well color me surprised. I came in expecting the typical bout of mediocrity, and was presented with something far more rewarding.

The dialogue between Hachikuji and Araragi was especially hilarious...and my God, was Araragi always that much of a lolicon? Well, it's not like I can blame him when the only negative thing about this episode probably has him scarred for life. Hitagi is her name, and she's been a thorn at my side ever since her first appearance. Every time I feel satisfied with an episode Hitagi is there to subtract from every other positive aspect of the series.. I think this episode could have very well been a success because they tossed Hitagi in at the start, which gave me nearly an entire episode to forget about her.

[Archon_Wing]

Also, that's a great OP, almost like a continuation of "Staple Stable"

[warita]

While watching this episode, I kept wondering, if the first season was this ecchi intense as well. I mean, it wasnt just Hachikuji, it was also the whole conversation with his sister, where she was putting her acrobatic skills on display making her kimono drop to stomache upturning levels. Seriously, did her leg flashing add in any way to the plot? Wasnt it more contraproductive, because it was distracting like hell.... not to mention annoying?
I think there was some ecchiness in the first season too and all that "onii-chan crap" from that girl he saved was questionable, but the second season is going way too overboard with it I feel.

Otherwise, I had the feeling the second season has better graphics, the pictures looked clearer, colors stronger.... the scenes with Senjougahara were magnificent, I loved her facial expressions and the way she tilts her head to the side or backwards and gives Araragi a skewed look.

Scene exposition still SUCKS as badly as in the first season. I mean, we arent watching anything animated. As a matter of fact, it is a narrated comics, because the characters hardly move, it is just changing screen shots. I know the creators are trying to be original here, but maybe they are trying too hard.

Overall, I had no idea what the hell the first epidode was about, but I think that was intentional. If I had to summarise the first episode, I would say the second season will be mainly about Araragi-kuns interaction with his sisters and the problems, that will stem from it. The conversation he had with Hachikuji made it obvious he is unsure how to drop the message to them about his supernatural powers and the synopsis of the anime suggests that this will in fact happen, because his sisters will be involved in the plot a lot more than in the first season.

[Malkuth]

Originally Posted by warita

While watching this episode, I kept wondering, if the first season was this ecchi intense as well. I mean, it wasnt just Hachikuji,

Mayoi was at a similar level of ecchiness in the Bakemonogatari too.

Originally Posted by warita

it was also the whole conversation with his sister, where she was putting her acrobatic skills on display making her kimono drop to stomache upturning levels. Seriously, did her leg flashing add in any way to the plot?

Do animated talking heads add anything to the plot? Should these be removed too?

Originally Posted by warita

Wasnt it more contraproductive, because it was distracting like hell....

Something people do not realize is that anime fundamentally work by hearing the dialogue and watching a picture show (occasionally animated). If your eyes get distracted by a drawing so easily, better not set foot in any european museum or gallery

Originally Posted by warita

not to mention annoying?

How so?

Originally Posted by warita

I think there was some ecchiness in the first season too and all that "onii-chan crap" from that girl he saved was questionable,

Taken out of context... you do know that calling someone big brother/sister (without having that biological relation) is a way to address him/her with both respect and familiarity and not a sexual invitation to whatever perverted action other material has made you believe

Originally Posted by warita

but the second season is going way too overboard with it I feel.

What board is it going over? Knesset? The Holy See? Taliban assemblies? oh! wait maybe Republican Primaries

Originally Posted by warita

Otherwise, I had the feeling the second season has better graphics, the pictures looked clearer, colors stronger....

Agree...

Originally Posted by warita

the scenes with Senjougahara were magnificent, I loved her facial expressions and the way she tilts her head to the side or backwards and gives Araragi a skewed look.

Wait! What?! You're butthurt and distracted from birds and snails, but not from those legs that tried desperately to reveal her underwear to a chained, thirsty, and starving man

Originally Posted by warita

Scene exposition still SUCKS as badly as in the first season. I mean, we arent watching anything animated. As a matter of fact, it is a narrated comics, because the characters hardly move, it is just changing screen shots. I know the creators are trying to be original here, but maybe they are trying too hard.

Move to do what exactly? When Tsukihi and Mayoi (but not Hitagi) moved while talking, you interpret it as a distracting annoyance... you need to get your priorities straight here

Originally Posted by warita

Overall, I had no idea what the hell the first epidode was about,

Should guess that female thighs is a strong candidate

Originally Posted by warita

but I think that was intentional. If I had to summarise the first episode, I would say the second season will be mainly about Araragi-kuns interaction with his sisters and the problems, that will stem from it. The conversation he had with Hachikuji made it obvious he is unsure how to drop the message to them about his supernatural powers and the synopsis of the anime suggests that this will in fact happen, because his sisters will be involved in the plot a lot more than in the first season.

...

[Archon_Wing]

Originally Posted by Malkuth

Mayoi was at a similar level of ecchiness in the Bakemonogatari too.

Yep, it'd should be expected at this point.

Do animated talking heads add anything to the plot? Should these be removed too?

Well, it would indicate umm... they're talking? That's somewhat relevant?

Something people do not realize is that anime fundamentally work by hearing the dialogue and watching a picture show (occasionally animated). If your eyes get distracted by a drawing so easily, better not set foot in any european museum or gallery

Umm, well sometimes it depends on how well these images are meshed.

How so?

Maybe you should quote more than a few words? Honestly, why are you quoting pieces of sentences from a long post like that? It makes it look like you're trying to misrepresent the post. But, of course I know you wouldn't want to belittle people you respond to.

Wait! What?! You're butthurt and distracted from birds and snails, but not from those legs that tried desperately to reveal her underwear to a chained, thirsty, and starving man

And exactly how would you know one's behind hurt, besides the fact that maybe it's about 15 min into the episode, and we've been sitting for a while?

Move to do what exactly? When Tsukihi and Mayoi (but not Hitagi) moved while talking, you interpret it as a distracting annoyance... you need to get your priorities straight here

Umm, there are certain degrees of moments, and not every instance of non-movement and movement might be considered optimal.

Should guess that female thighs is a strong candidate

I can finally go with that.

...

Well, at least you finally quoted a substantial amount. Nice response I guess? Oh, I should try to be clever too, so here's an emoticon.

[warita]

It does feel kindo unsettling to be taken apart in such a manner.

Different people have different opinions and I think this anime is primarely about interesting dialogues. The leg flashing of under age girls, or even an elementary schooler is disturbing.....

Dont get me wrong, I actually like this anime. Maybe I should have stressed that part more in the first place. I watched Bakemonogatari and loved it and I have no intention of dropping Nisemonogatari at all.

Frankly, if I wacth a new series and I dont like it, mostly I dont even bother commenting on it.

[Malkuth]

@AW: Belittle, no, never! However much I disagree. Writing in a playful tone is another thing, now if one considers it offensive, PM, I will delete the post with an honest apology

As for quoting a wall of text, brick by brick, it's because there were so many distinct points I disagreed with scattered in that post that writing a generic reply to the whole thing would have sounded like another of Caster/Zero's rumbles

Originally Posted by warita

It does feel kindo unsettling to be taken apart in such a manner.

Sorry, didn't mean to sound aggressive, I just thought it practical

Originally Posted by warita

Different people have different opinions and I think this anime is primarely about interesting dialogues.The leg flashing of under age girls, or even an elementary schooler is disturbing.....

In real life, generally I can agree, but this is a work of fiction.

As for what to animate, I prefer watching Tsukihi's swedish gymnastics over a rich (yet minimalistic) background to talking heads, zoom in bouncing boobs (@Horizon), even zoom out to walking half circles (@F/Z). Bottomline I think we agree that there little of interest to animate when two people casually talk, however interesting their discussion is.

Originally Posted by warita

Dont get me wrong, I actually like this anime. Maybe I should have stressed that part more in the first place. I watched Bakemonogatari and loved it and I have no intention of dropping Nisemonogatari at all.

Frankly, if I wacth a new series and I dont like it, mostly I dont even bother commenting on it.

That's what I thought too. Does not change the fact that you find the visuals annoying, and I am pretty sure when Nadeko and Tsukihi join the fray you'll find them even worse

[Archon_Wing]

Originally Posted by warita

It does feel kindo unsettling to be taken apart in such a manner.

Different people have different opinions and I think this anime is primarely about interesting dialogues. The leg flashing of under age girls, or even an elementary schooler is disturbing.....

Dont get me wrong, I actually like this anime. Maybe I should have stressed that part more in the first place. I watched Bakemonogatari and loved it and I have no intention of dropping Nisemonogatari at all.

Frankly, if I wacth a new series and I dont like it, mostly I dont even bother commenting on it.

By now, you should really be acquainted with the amount of fanservice present in the series. The fanservice displayed is nothing compared yet to what has been the put on display the first season. You don't have to like it, but don't be surprised either.

As for having posts taken apart, sometimes it can be because there's small pieces that one just wants to bring up. On the other hand, the purpose of a sentence is to connect ideas into a coherent thought, and a paragraph is one that connects these thoughts into a larger thought. Disassembling into parts defeats the purpose of replying unless you are doing a reply of a reply which doesn't leave you much choice.

Originally Posted by Malkuth

@AW: Belittle, no, never! However much I disagree. Writing in a playful tone is another thing, now if one considers it offensive, PM, I will delete the post with an honest apology

As for quoting a wall of text, brick by brick, it's because there were so many distinct points I disagreed with scattered in that post that writing a generic reply to the whole thing would have sounded like another of Caster/Zero's rumbles

Well, it can get harder to read too if it the text is all over the place. I mean, sure we're viewing a franchise where we're used to that kind of thing, but yea.

[Shikijin]

Originally Posted by warita

It does feel kindo unsettling to be taken apart in such a manner.

Yeah, I think Malkuth has gone a bit too far. Not offensive, but maybe a bit rude.

There was fanservice even in Bakemonogatari, for example we got naked Hitagi in the second episode. Nisemonogatari kicked it up a notch. While one may argue it doesn't add to the story though, I personally think it doesn't detract from it either. Anyway, sexual tension will always be part of the Monogatari series.

About the scene exposition, I think you are misguided in that the series comes from light novels which were big on dialogues. It's not about originality, it's about how to make something that consists mostly of conversations appealing to the viewer of an anime.

The first episode is Araragi getting kidnapped. Now we got time to think how he will get out of that situation while slowly discovering what caused it in the first place.

[Malkuth]

Originally Posted by Archon_Wing

Well, it can get harder to read too if it the text is all over the place. I mean, sure we're viewing a franchise where we're used to that kind of thing, but yea.

Well, I assume viewers have read the original, so quotations in replies helps to address a post point by point, otherwise there wouldn't be the option to break it

Originally Posted by Shikijin

Yeah, I think Malkuth has gone a bit too far. Not offensive, but maybe a bit rude.

I PMed to clarify, so NP I probably got a little carried away since warito reminded me of an old friend that would have said the same thing these Austrians... so similar

[Sinestra]

What a great beginning i cant even express how happy i am the series is back. Love the OP didnt think i could like an OP as much as Staple Stable but apparently i was wrong.

[Reckoner]

Heh. I think the people who thought Hitagi was being cruel to Araragi may be surprised when it actually turns out she's protecting him just like she said she is. Sometimes you may really just have to chain him up to protect him .

[Chase]

Best part of the episode was the beginning for me with the Hitagi/Koyomi psychological torture scene. Good to see this anime finally back. OP is great as expected.

[Grey]

I somehow forgot how much fanservice Monogatari had. But I don't care. I somehow like the style.

Senjougahara and Araragi.... Reminds me of Bakuman and their "serious humor" discussion.

[Archon_Wing]

Originally Posted by Malkuth

Well, I assume viewers have read the original, so quotations in replies helps to address a post point by point, otherwise there wouldn't be the option to break it



I PMed to clarify, so NP I probably got a little carried away since warito reminded me of an old friend that would have said the same thing these Austrians... so similar

lol, people better should have watched the original before coming here. I guess it's been a while for some though. May have filtered out certain parts they didn't like. Like for Oreimo, I filtered off half the series.

Originally Posted by Reckoner

Heh. I think the people who thought Hitagi was being cruel to Araragi may be surprised when it actually turns out she's protecting him just like she said she is. Sometimes you may really just have to chain him up to protect him .

I dunno... a lot of oppressive governments have used that excuse before.

"We're taking you in for your own protection"... and they never appear again.

Arararagi might just be doomed to a desolate, yet very sexy fate of never being seen again.

[Kanon]

Originally Posted by Shikijin

Yeah, I think Malkuth has gone a bit too far. Not offensive, but maybe a bit rude.

There was fanservice even in Bakemonogatari, for example we got naked Hitagi in the second episode. Nisemonogatari kicked it up a notch. While one may argue it doesn't add to the story though, I personally think it doesn't detract from it either. Anyway, sexual tension will always be part of the Monogatari series.

Let us also not forget that there was a detailed panty shot in the first five seconds of Bakemonogatari. There has always been fan service in this series, and there always will be. It's an integral part of its appeal.

[Shikijin]

Originally Posted by Kanon

Let us also not forget that there was a detailed panty shot in the first five seconds of Bakemonogatari.

That part would technically belong to Kizumonogatari though. And there are people who say Bake had the best beginning...

[Candyshark]

Wasn't there a post saying Isin doesn't like that his characters are portrayed in very sexual manner?

[Sol Falling]

Originally Posted by Candyshark

Wasn't there a post saying Isin doesn't like that his characters are portrayed in very sexual manner?

Pretty doubtful, dude. Nishio's the one who wrote most of this fanservice in the very first place; it's not SHAFT that's responsible for this series having heavy fanservice elements (though it would be SHAFT that's responsible for it being adapted with such high quality, . Nishio x SHAFT is a pretty godly combination, I don't think this can be overstated, lol.).

Originally Posted by Archon_Wing

I dunno... a lot of oppressive governments have used that excuse before.

"We're taking you in for your own protection"... and they never appear again.

Arararagi might just be doomed to a desolate, yet very sexy fate of never being seen again.

I don't think even this is necessarily accurate though. Yes, Hitagi chained Araragi up, but I don't think she'll be keeping him chained up against his will. Like I said, all of this S&M stuff is mostly play, and I think that Senjougahara is playing in this sort of situation is her asking Araragi to trust her, or at least hear her (that she feels like he needs to be protected). I mean, I pretty much doubt that Hitagi would actually think this stuff is okay if she were serious. However much she might tease Koyomi, she knows he's not that much of a perverted masochist.

The point is that Hitagi and Araragi are capable of communicating and listening to each other. That Araragi is currently chained to a desk is immaterial; there's no way Hitagi would actually keep him locked up there indefinitely. Similarly, I think that Araragi is capable of understanding and learning from Senjougahara's concerns about him. So the reason he's not fighting back right now is because he doesn't need to.

[applejuice]

Can't believe there is people even in here who speaks stupid eechi arguement... >_>

Originally Posted by warita

Scene exposition still SUCKS as badly as in the first season. I mean, we arent watching anything animated. As a matter of fact, it is a narrated comics, because the characters hardly move, it is just changing screen shots. I know the creators are trying to be original here, but maybe they are trying too hard.

You don't call it 'SUCKS'. You call it EFFICIENT. As I said before, that's Shaft's major technique; increasing quality of certain animation greatly, and reducing frames in other scene while keep changing the cut scene frequently with Shaft's unique style.