Fate/Zero - Episode 3 Discussion / Poll

[kk2extreme]

Clinton - the best conquerer of the modern world, even Alexanda the great respect him

...better get some B-2 bombers ready

[Kaioshin Sama]

Alexander: "Once the B-52 bomber is mass produced we'll put an end to Gilgamesh in no time! AHAHAHAHAHAH!"

[TrueKnight]

^ B-52 is the Stratofotress, I think Alexander was referring to the B-2 Spirits. I wonder where would Alexander amass an abundant of funds purchasing the planes... maybe by conquering the New York Stock Exchange or robbing high profile banks like HSBC or BoA.

[Kaioshin Sama]

Originally Posted by TrueKnight

^ B-52 is the Stratofotress, I think Alexander was referring to the B-2 Spirits. I wonder where would Alexander amass an abundant of funds purchasing the planes... maybe by conquering the New York Stock Exchange or robbing high profile banks like HSBC or BoA.

I think he must ask this clinTON fellow, he surely knows the secret. I think it's high time he demanded to be brought before clinTON or clinTON before him.

I'm getting Simpsons flashbacks to that famous Halloween episode after watching this

[Triple_R]

Episode 3 was a very good episode, and likely an excellent set-up episode.

At this juncture, there are some notable, consistent highlights in Fate/Zero for me:

1. For the most part, Waver/Rider are comedy gold (Alexander the Great gushing over Clinton was particularly hilarious, lol). Given the very sober nature of this anime, Waver/Rider add much-needed balance by injecting a lot of levity into almost every scene that they're in. My one caveat here is that Waver can occasionally become a bit too whiny, undermining the otherwise perfect modern straightman/gregarious legend of history dynamic that he and Rider have going on. Not only as a fan of the pair, but also simply out of a desire for this show to not lose its comedic elements, I really hope that Waver/Rider are not one of the first pairs to fall.

2. Scene transitions are very nicely done. No scene is allowed to linger too long, and the lack of combative action (thus far) is ameliorated by making smart use out of a large cast with many colorful characters in it.

3. On the whole, dialogue is great. Aside from Waver/Rider, it's not particularly witty, but it does aid realism a lot, and add to the overall drama/suspense of the work.

4. Cliffhangers. This is three episodes in a row now with great cliffhanger moments at the end of the episode. It takes real skill to pull that off without it feeling contrived, and Fate/Zero is doing it so far. Wonderful work.


Now, as others have said, the pacing here is slow. I'm Ok with waiting some to get to the great action, but after a double-sized Premiere and two more episodes after, next episode is definitely the time to start rewarding viewers for their patience. I will be evaluating Fate/Zero Episode 4 in large part based on how rewarding I find the Saber vs. Lancer conflict to be. I don't expect it to be definitive given how early in the game it is, but I do expect it to be more than, say, a two minute sparring contest.

This is largely excellent setup, but it is now enough setup. Next episode will be time to start delivering the great action scenes. Thankfully, I'm confident that ufotable will.


9/10 for Fate/Zero Episode 3.

[Malkuth]

Well, at least Alexander succeded in conquering Persia, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Iraq, Egypt and all of middle east (even without the money and stealth bombers). Clinton like his predecessors, as well as followers only managed to pass by and turn all their allies into enemies

As for Gilgamesh, God, however I like him in F/UC, his story is one of a jerk that was slaughtering people and then angsting... OK, for its time it was good, but then it's not like there is anything else from then to compare it to

And finally King Arthur... what a loser... his wife cheats him with his best friend, his son betrays him, and pretty much he leads his coutry to destruction... trully the stuff of legends

[larethian]

Next week will be pure action, we can expect some character monologue here and there if they were to explain their powers, otherwise they will just remain a mystery.

Originally Posted by Clarste

Noble Phantasm is actually a pretty terrible translation, but you have to blame Nasu for that. Well, we're stuck with it. They're basically what Rider said they were: legendary weapons or skills that are associated with the hero. King Arthur's would be Excalibur for example. Excalibur is Arthur's sword. When you summon Arthur you get Excalibur as part of the deal, and frankly it'd be kind of pointless if he didn't have it. That's all a Noble Phantasm is. The series takes a lot of liberties with giving them magic powers and such though.

Being multiple people is this Assassin's Noble Phantasm, the "legendary skill" thing that Rider was talking about.

I agree that, linguistics wise, Noble Phantasm may not necessary be the most accurate translation for 宝具. But it's definitely better than the one they use in Shakugan no Shana (what word did they use again?). Moreover, I find it exceptionally appropriate in Fate series, and do I need to explain why? In any case, so far, it seems like every group for every media of the franchise has stuck to it, which shows that it is an appropriate and satisfactory translation, unless someone can come up with a better one.

[ZeKeR]

Originally Posted by Malkuth

Well, at least Alexander succeded in conquering Persia, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Iraq, Egypt and all of middle east (even without the money and stealth bombers). Clinton like his predecessors, as well as followers only managed to pass by and turn all their allies into enemies

As for Gilgamesh, God, however I like him in F/UC, his story is one of a jerk that was slaughtering people and then angsting... OK, for its time it was good, but then it's not like there is anything else from then to compare it to

And finally King Arthur... what a loser... his wife cheats him with his best friend, his son betrays him, and pretty much he leads his coutry to destruction... trully the stuff of legends

well he was deemed the Great Rider of Macedon (again confirm this title for Alexander) and he is rightfully so... inb4 Cyrus (oh wait, he never rode with his army to battle right?)

also, I'm liking Kiritsugu's signature weapon: the Thompson Contender. I expected him to use modern guns that use modern bullets but I never expected him to use that humble Contender.....

also, DAT MAIYA.

[Shiryuu]

Hercules berserker vs F/Z assassins, taking bets.

[Jean Claymore]

Nice episode as always. Especially liked the Clinton scene. Man, Rider/Walvet really stand out in this dark atmosphere

Hm.. though been thinking their route's been kind of fast-forwarding. I mean, they do have nice plotlines and character developments compared to F/SN, but I also feel like they're missing a bunch of things uncleared... (can't mention due to the Thread's rules) They may be clarifying us later on (probably the next ep related to Kiritsugu's hand gun and his plan besides the all-action warm up between Saber and Lancer and some spectators watching them) though I wish they don't stuck up/rush in the halfways... 25 eps for F/Z series are just too short IMHO

Oh, and the cliffhanger was very good. Almost as exactly as I had expected Saber encountering Lancer.

[matapat]

Another great episode, love all the dialogue about Nasuverse lore that Deen's version of F/SN seemed to dance around and didn't handle as well. Kiritsugu's scene commenting on how weightless and frail his daughter seemed in comparison to his old handgun, and Maiya's "get it together, man!" kiss were touching.

Iri and Saber have some great chemistry too, I can just feel the Yuri fans stampeding over the Ghibli hills any minute now...

[Yu Ominae]

It'll be scary if "Rider" somehow gets those bombers and fighers...

And for once, I welcome his rule.

[blue_sora]

Originally Posted by creb

Well, her VA did play Gundam 00's Marina Ismail, who's one saving grace was her singing (Tomorrow). Though, I'm not expecting Maiya to break out in song in Zero.

Wow, really? I too thought that her voice is lovely and very fitting, never thought she is the same VA as Marina Ismail (pity she's my least favourite character in the show)

Anyway, I think that the anime did not clearly shown that Kiritsugu loves Iri, there's not one even single scene of him hugging her and Maiya already kissed him, so it's normal to doubt of his love towards Iri. He also puts Iri as a bait. And I think one kiss is enough to snap him out of it, but she kissed him again so it starting to look like using womanly pleasures to distract him from his depressing thought scene. Or Maiya just taking advantage of Kiritsugu.

[ProfileOF]

Good episode, charging for the next battle...
the TVA is rather close to the light novel and the visual quality is excellent
though the TVA shall be devided into two seasons for economic reason,
i think it is worthy for good quality

[ProfileOF]

Originally Posted by Yu Ominae

It'll be scary if "Rider" somehow gets those bombers and fighers...

And for once, I welcome his rule.

I wonder...
I don't think the world is calling for a conqueror like Rider
at least I've seen no democracy on him =w=
by the way, the world is too small for him and the only thing he will find is void after he rules the whole world

[ProfileOF]

why no one considering about the identity of Lancer?
or maybe he is so famous in western legend that everyone knows?

[viperdk1]

Originally Posted by jzmagic

Well I didn't know the Church would actually be willing to cheat to make it happen. And also in episode 2, they made it seem as though Kirei actually did betray Tokiomi.

Other Masters and/or Servants were watching it - that was necessary to make it seem as though it was an attack from Kirei on Tokiomi. Apart from anything else, no one knows about the alliance between Kirei and Tokiomi other than them and the priest - so such actions from Kirei make a lot of sense (otherwise the other masters would suspect something).

Originally Posted by Triple_R

1. For the most part, Waver/Rider are comedy gold (Alexander the Great gushing over Clinton was particularly hilarious, lol). Given the very sober nature of this anime, Waver/Rider add much-needed balance by injecting a lot of levity into almost every scene that they're in. My one caveat here is that Waver can occasionally become a bit too whiny, undermining the otherwise perfect modern straightman/gregarious legend of history dynamic that he and Rider have going on. Not only as a fan of the pair, but also simply out of a desire for this show to not lose its comedic elements, I really hope that Waver/Rider are not one of the first pairs to fall.

To me, that point makes a lot of sense - Waver is what can best be described as a fish out of water. Sure, he's done the research about the Holy Grail War and understands what occurs, but in terms of coming to terms with the immense situation he now finds himself in, I believe he's way in over his head.

Have to agree that their scenes are comedy gold, though - between everything that goes on, it's nice to have something to punctuate the gritty 'realism' (very loose realism, naturally) of the rest of the series. Have to say that it does make it hard to take either Waver or Rider seriously, mind - though considering Waver's background, that is something I've come to expect.


I genuinely felt sorry for Irisviel in this episode as we found out more about her. To know that her travel to Japan was the first time away from the castle for her and that she was nothing more than a 'doll' for the Holy Grail War... definitely not fair for her. Worse still, we get the scene between Maiya and Kiritsugu.

Yes, Kiritsugu loves Iris (and Ilya) - but to me, it seems at first as though Maiya thinks otherwise. Either that, or someone previous said, Kiritsugu was depressed and Maiya kissed him to break him out of it (Iris said when he is happy, it causes him pain - maybe that is down to the fact that both Iris and Ilya are 'dolls' for the War? Then again, it may be something more).


I see Gilgamesh (Archer) is unimpressed with murdering Assassin for no reason - can't say I blame him, seeing as how the shadowy trickster is still alive . Have to admit though that I think he's an asshole (though that too isn't surprising - he has the title of "King of Heroes").


Finally, I am intrigued as to why Archibald elected not to show himself (if he was even there) - though then again, he doesn't want to give himself away as Lancer's Master (though I'm not sure why that would be a problem...). Same with Kiritsugu (that crafty sod has a reason though - weapons and seeing whether he can confuse people into believing Iris is Saber's Master).


Cracking episode (the slow pace of the show works for me - sorta gives off a vibe that everything is being meticulously planned by all characters concerned...well, not Uryuu or Waver, naturally) - I just hope that the battle between Lancer and Saber next episode is not a short one.

[Haak]

Originally Posted by ProfileOF

why no one considering about the identity of Lancer?
or maybe he is so famous in western legend that everyone knows?

At this point I'd say it's impossible to say unless we go by the hint in the ending theme.

Anyway episode three is great. I find it funny how they've had to actually compress a lot and still take 4 episodes to get to the first big action. Makes me wonder just how much they plan to add on later.

I also love how totally in tune it is to the real world. "The biggest problem is this Clinton guy"

[ProfileOF]

Originally Posted by Haak

At this point I'd say it's impossible to say unless we go by the hint in the ending theme.

Anyway episode three is great. I find it funny how they've had to actually compress a lot and still take 4 episodes to get to the first big action. Makes me wonder just how much they plan to add on later.

I also love how totally in tune it is to the real world. "The biggest problem is this Clinton guy"

actually i can read no more information in the ending theme than the pair of weapon Lancer is holding...
for Fate series i think we have to be patient on the pace, there are too many backgrounds to introduce and the TVA has already done a great job, i didn't expect the quality to be this good...

[playmaker2k]

I like how this series is going. It's a whole lot more mature then FSN with all the grey viewpoints from the characters. Gilgamesh is still a prick and that's good to know. Saber looks sleek in her bodyguard suit and Rider always brings the funny to the series. Food, Sex, Sleep, and Conquer. (It sounds better than war to me.) A manly man in anime form.

He reminds me of one of my friends too. Whenever we hit the club, we always make it known who'll be the wing man that night by whoever lands the first strike on their target. Lockon Stratos would be proud.

I can't wait to see the upcoming battle since it looks like Lancer wields dual weapons too.

On a side note: Who's a Yuri fan? (raises hand) > This guy!!! Saber x Rin 'til the sky falls!

This will work out for me just fine. I think it's fair since the ladies have their Waver/Iskandar pairing. So don't judge me.