Nanoha Manga Discussion

[Keroko]

Originally Posted by Demi.

Eh, perhaps I wasn't clear enough, but I was referring to the future Nanoha franchise as a whole, not merely Vivid.

Okido, misunderstanding settled then.

Originally Posted by Demi.

That depends. Certain cute scenes can only be managed with fan-service, and that's exactly what that particular scene was. Sure, a lot of the cast is generally cute the entire time, but for some of the better moments you need to stop everything else and focus on one scene.

A's managed to combine fanservice and plot development virtually every time though.

Originally Posted by Demi.

but the series was more of a mess then what could have been solved by merely removing NanoFate fanservice.

Merely removing the NanoFate fanservice wouldn't solve anything, that I agree on (and it's not so much its presence, but more the way they handled it). Just like the irrelevant Fate scenes and the irrelevant training episodes, they're just one faulty cog in the whole machine. There are many things that made StrikerS less then it could have been.

That doesn't mean we should ignore its presence as a faulty cog though.

Originally Posted by Demi.

I'm honestly unsure how people claim StrikerS had a manageable cast of characters. I mean, it was somewhere in the 30's, and half of them where main characters.

Something like that yes, and it is manageable. There are several series that have done so, like Towards the Terra. However the price you pay for having such a big cast is that you need to watch your script far more closely, as you have nowhere near the same amount of room for fanservice and other scenes that add nothing to the characters or plot. If you want fanservice, you need to combine them with scenes that add to the plot of the story, or develop the characters. Any scene that does neither should not be in the final edit, and be replaced with a scene that does add to either, or even better, both.

Personally, I think that this is one of the advantages of the manga medium. While there is such a thing as contracts made for the amount of chapters and the like, the manga medium has far more freedom as it is not restricted to a set amount of episodes like an anime is. This means that fanservice, plot and character development can be spread out far more widely.

On that note, I wonder who exactly will feature in Vivid? Obviously Vivio and Nanoha, but who aside from them? Teana is doing her Enforcer work, so she's questionable. Subaru is doing her work at the Disaster Management, but she's still on Mid, so she's a likely candidate, but not a sure one. Being that Vivio goes to a school run by the Saint Church, that means it's highly likely that we'll get to see Carim, Schach, Sein, Otto, and Deed. Yuuno and Arf should make an appearance too, what with Vivio being a bookworm and all.

[BPHaru]

Originally Posted by Demi.

Well, It's true it wasn't vital to the plot, but It's just one of those moments, I guess...A learning experience for Vivio, if you will. A series that is largely reliant on cute characters, a few of those moments need to be thrown in from time to time. The series tries to take itself seriously, and succeeds at times, but this series still has a focus on moe appeal.

In my opinion NanoFate and now the Happy Family are a mayor part of the series so that kind of scenes in Stirkers were good to develop an even stronger and important bond between the 3 of them and to appeal to the fans who surely enjoyed of those scenes, but at the other hand were probably complaining about the excess of military issues, useless characters and complete filler episodes, whose in my opinion are big problems. If you want to remove something from the show "to make it better" I think they should start by prioritizing those points. But anyway it's not like if they were going to make a remake of Strikers, or at least not soon.

Cuídense y sigan sonriendo

[Nina.Wolken]

Originally Posted by Keroko

On that note, I wonder who exactly will feature in Vivid? Obviously Vivio and Nanoha, but who aside from them? Teana is doing her Enforcer work, so she's questionable. Subaru is doing her work at the Disaster Management, but she's still on Mid, so she's a likely candidate, but not a sure one. Being that Vivio goes to a school run by the Saint Church, that means it's highly likely that we'll get to see Carim, Schach, Sein, Otto, and Deed. Yuuno and Arf should make an appearance too, what with Vivio being a bookworm and all.

Yep, let's move to our expectations on who will appear in ViVid rather on who we fear that may be shafted .
According to the SSX, Teana, Caro, Erio, Lulu and the Yagami-ke should be out of the picture since they are not stationed on Mid. I'm not quite sure for Hayate thought, where is she supposed to work exactly?
But since ViVid takes place only one year after the SSX, there should not be too much changes. The authors may decide to make them appear however at least to give an update on their jobs and situations, but I don't really expect any of them to play a major role in the manga. Except maybe for Lutecia, if she is finally released ... they won't just keep her in this remote world forever .

Edit :

Originally Posted by BPHaru

But anyway it's not like if they were going to make a remake of Strikers, or at least not soon.

They should seriouly think about it. StS had too much potential that was stupidly wasted... that's a shame u_u".

[Kagerou]

Originally Posted by Keroko

On that note, I wonder who exactly will feature in Vivid? Obviously Vivio and Nanoha, but who aside from them? Teana is doing her Enforcer work, so she's questionable. Subaru is doing her work at the Disaster Management, but she's still on Mid, so she's a likely candidate, but not a sure one. Being that Vivio goes to a school run by the Saint Church, that means it's highly likely that we'll get to see Carim, Schach, Sein, Otto, and Deed. Yuuno and Arf should make an appearance too, what with Vivio being a bookworm and all.

Don't forget that there's also the possibility of introducing new characters (which is probably very high on the 'list of things to do' for both Vivid and Senki). Hell, they'd be kinda stupid not to; you can't recycle plot, you gotta add something to the mix.

Originally Posted by BPHaru

In my opinion NanoFate and now the Happy Family are a mayor part of the series so that kind of scenes in Stirkers were good to develop an even stronger and important bond between the 3 of them and to appeal to the fans who surely enjoyed of those scenes, but at the other hand were probably complaining about the excess of military issues, useless characters and complete filler episodes, whose in my opinion are big problems. If you want to remove something from the show "to make it better" I think they should start by prioritizing those points. But anyway it's not like if they were going to make a remake of Strikers, or at least not soon.

Cuídense y sigan sonriendo

...
....
.....
*Kagerou picks up a large trout and whacks Haru with it*

Dude, seriously, calm down about it.
Remember that one of the biggest draws of MSLN, sadly, is your precious ambiguous romance. Even if she doesn't show up in Vivid, don't forget about Senki, and given that it's called a Magical War Chronicle or something like that, as Kerokero said, fully expect her to show up.

...and why were the military things useless? MSLN has become a military setting, Haru, you can't just get rid of it. Not to sound completely like a total nerd, but honestly, they could tighten it up a bit and make it more consistent.

Useless characters? ...no, I don't think there were any useless characters; however, there were many that didn't get enough screentime; simply extending StrikerS wouldn't have been enough either because this was clearly of 7arcs just... not really doing a good job. StrikerS, although popular, was mediocre at best and pure QUALITY at worst.

As for the filler episodes, I agree with you. Do we really need half a series of useless training when it could have been spent on better ways to develop characters? -_-

[BPHaru]

Originally Posted by Kagerou

Useless characters?

I think "unnecessary" is a better word. In my opinion you can develop the same (pseudo)plot with 1/3 of the actual cast of Strikers series and half of the episodes getting a better series for the fans, but probably less income.

Cuídense y sigan sonriendo

[Keroko]

^ I'm porting my replies to this over to the Generic Discussion.

Back to the manga:

Originally Posted by Kagerou

Don't forget that there's also the possibility of introducing new characters (which is probably very high on the 'list of things to do' for both Vivid and Senki). Hell, they'd be kinda stupid not to; you can't recycle plot, you gotta add something to the mix.

Of course, but we can't speculate which new characters will appear.

Here's another one: What about the plot? Being Vivio-centric, I'd say we'll be getting a fair bit of Ancient Belka thrown at us.

[Kagerou]

Originally Posted by BPHaru

I think "unnecessary" is a better word. In my opinion you can develop the same (pseudo)plot with 1/3 of the actual cast of Strikers series and half of the episodes getting a better series for the fans, but probably less income.

Cuídense y sigan sonriendo

As usual, I'll say that's subjective to the individual watcher. They did a passable job (i.e. not completely terrible) with making any character totally useles...

As I was saying, if they had just done a better job, a lot of people wouldn't feel this way -_-.

[Evangelion Xgouki]

Originally Posted by Keroko

^ I'm porting my replies to this over to the Generic Discussion.

Back to the manga:



Of course, but we can't speculate which new characters will appear.

Here's another one: What about the plot? Being Vivio-centric, I'd say we'll be getting a fair bit of Ancient Belka thrown at us.

I'm hoping for some flashback chapters of Vivio and Ix

[Nina.Wolken]

Originally Posted by Evangelion Xgouki

I'm hoping for some flashback chapters of Vivio and Ix

If it turns like when I excpected to have a flashback concerning Nanoha's accident when she was 12, we will have 2 pages at best .
Plus Vivio and Ix never met in the past, right? Didn't they came accross each other (well, via video) for the first time in SSX? I don't think they would make a flashback for that .

[LoweGear]

Doesn't really have to be flashbacks of the both of them together, just flashbacks for them individually on what they were up to in the Belka Era

[Nina.Wolken]

Originally Posted by LoweGear

Doesn't really have to be flashbacks of the both of them together, just flashbacks for them individually on what they were up to in the Belka Era

Right... I don't know why I focused on them together ^^'.
I would like to see the old Sankt Kaiser, he seemed to have been pretty warlike though. And he was not Vivio per se... Total different appearance and personnality it seems.
As for Ix, I don't know if she did much in the old time : waking up, looking at the Marriage going rampage and going back to sleep. Not the most exciting life IMO.
Well, hopefully there is more behind that, so they may want to explore a bit of their past, but as I said, I'm not excpecting to much flashback.

[Evangelion Xgouki]

Now flashbacks that would be cute would be seeing her first learning how to use search magic to help out Yuuno in the Infinite Library. Oh the adventures there

[Nina.Wolken]

Originally Posted by Evangelion Xgouki

Oh the adventures there

Oh the bunch of pages I would gladly skip .

[TheShinySword]

I can tell you what I'd like... Zaffy .__. *draws sad circles on the ground* I'd go for a panel, just one little panel and 7arc making his continued guardian services canon >.<

[Bananoha]

Originally Posted by TheShinySword

I can tell you what I'd like... Zaffy .__. *draws sad circles on the ground* I'd go for a panel, just one little panel and 7arc making his continued guardian services canon >.<

This!

He was Vivio's bodyguard for a while, so he deserves at least one little thing! Right, right!? :<

[NorthernFallout]

Well...considering he was seen a fair while with Vivio in a lot of scenes, the Vivid spin-off might hold something...

[Deathkillz]

Zaf? Who is zaf?



I know an Arf but...

[Evangelion Xgouki]

Originally Posted by TheShinySword

I can tell you what I'd like... Zaffy .__. *draws sad circles on the ground* I'd go for a panel, just one little panel and 7arc making his continued guardian services canon >.<

Well given his role in Vivio's development they had better include him in the manga. I highly doubt that Vivio would outright forget about him as she got older. Plus it'd be cute for her to still call him Zaffy~

Originally Posted by Deathkillz

Zaf? Who is zaf?



I know an Arf but...

...

Have you not watched A's or StrikerS?

Zafira of the Wolkenritter.

Zafira, the blue wolf.

Zafira, the mighty Shielding Guardian Beast.

Zafira...the babysitter.

[Keroko]

Oi oi, rubbing salt into an open wound is rude you know.

That said, Zafira was with the Yagami-ke in the epilogue, so I think his continued services are limited. He might make an appearance, but I really wouldn't expect a full-time baby-sitter Zaffy any time soon.

[TheShinySword]

Zafira the one. The Only. The greatest. MAGICAL BABYSITTER! With a fanclub of one.

*Curls up in a corner holding a Zafira plushie*

:<
Keroko why must you crush my dreams. *sniff*

That being said despite the unlikely hood of Zafira's nose even appearing I'm still going to read ViVid.