Fate/Zero - Episode 24 Discussion / Poll

[Kimidori]

Originally Posted by EssTEss

You need to stop putting words in my mouth. Of course the anime doesn't have to be exactly like the novel, but i didn't even mention anything about that, just that they could've handled some scenes better. And yeah, the novel fight wasn't cheesy. It was awe inspiring and thrilling. If i were in charge of directing though, we'd be discussing (arguing...whatever) what should have/could have been rather than what is here, so no. And of course the LN will be better even if it was less cheesy. Never heard the phrase "The book is always better"? It's a given they will be different, but just because it's not as good doesn't mean it can't be close.

nah, i just read it the LN scene (Vol.4, Act 16 Part 6), it was just as chessy if not more when i imagine it in visual form. as i said, there no way to animate this scene without making it cheesy, any less chessy than what animated in this ep would make the fight underwheling

Originally Posted by EssTEss

Why couldn't he dodge back? The keys were only to the left and right of him.

kirei is coming for him in the front like a bullet, dodge back mean that he will be punched or kicked by kirei

[Aesthetic Shampoo]

Originally Posted by Kimidori

nah, i just read it the LN scene (Vol.4, Act 16 Part 6), it was just as chessy if not more when i imagine it in visual form. as i said, there no way to animate this scene without making it cheesy, any less chessy than what animated in this ep would make the fight underwheling

Books and novels are run by a powerful graphics card called imagination
It's only cheesy because you imagined it to be.

Originally Posted by Kimidori

kirei is coming for him in the front like a bullet, dodge back mean that he will be punched or kicked by kirei

Dodging back means he would have gained some more time before Kirei would've reached him, giving him an advantage to shoot and kill first.

[zero7090]

say about the ship troll logic

A ship got 300 people
B ship got 200 people

if people on A ship can split into to 2 ship then why the f does kiri need to repair A ship and abandon B?

[Raviel]

I'm pretty sure the entire point of those scenes was to illustrate how Kiritsugu's mentality works which is to sacrifice the minority for the sake of the majority

[ookamigirl]

An all out battle. All vs all.
Master vs Master (Kiritsugu vs Kariya through middleman) & Servant vs Servant (Saber vs Beserker).
Things are getting pretty dramatic as the end nears.
The grail also finally appeared in its real form.
Kiritsugu's flashback and chat with "Irisvel" was pretty interesting.
Poor Saber... just out of luck with her wishes.

[Kataryn]

I was disappointed in the Saber vs Berserker scene. I hoped it would more emotional, specially when Saber killed Lancelot. He didn't even explain why he went berserk like he did in the novel. Hopefully the Blu Ray DVDs add more to that scene.

[Raviel]

This episode + reading the parts of the LN that should be covered in the next ep REALLY makes me wish they have another season of Carnival Phantasm featuring the F/Z cast more, they could really use the happiness.

Also I can see a ton of comedic potential for the F/Z cast, adding Kariya and Berserker to the Sakura segments in Carnival Phantasm would be pure gold. Hell, I'd love to see an Iri/Illya/Grail-kun segment or a new version of the Grai'ls birth in F/Z featuring Grail-kun

Although I'm getting pretty off topic now XD

[sento]

Originally Posted by whatbob1

Non novel readers will probably love this episode, novel readers will be disappointed / hate this episode. You can check other type moon forums such as BL, where pretty much everyone there hated this episode

Don't go around outright making up things, because that's not true. The only complain in BL is the skipping of things and some minor details, just like here.

The only place they "hated it" was 4chan, and that's mainly because they didn't use EMIYA as battle track (talk about just subjective).

Originally Posted by whatbob1

Kotomine is clearly stronger. UFOtable had to nerf him and make him try to bitch slap a bullet, instead of like in the novel where he falcon punches it. Come on UFOtable .

It wasn't exactly a Falcon Punch either, it was supposed to be a Bajiquan defensive stance command spell powered and the bullet running up the length of his arm. Here, they changed it to the bullet entering his flesh and he changing the direction of it with a command spell powered movement, avoiding it to hit his vitals.

Originally Posted by EssTEss

Books and novels are run by a powerful graphics card called imagination
It's only cheesy because you imagined it to be.

Even Urobuchi said that it's supposed to be ridiculous and chinese martial arts movie-like. And that's how they did it.

[Nausky]

Personally, I think I'm glad that they didn't use EMIYA as the battle track. I like it, but I don't feel like that would have fit the scene at all.

[Qilin]

I finally got to watch this monster of an episode, and my feelings are mixed.

The Kiritsugu vs. Kirei showdown was as awesome as was continually hyped, so no problems there. In contrast, the Saber vs. Berseker fight was obviously incomplete. There was little backstory to speak of and hardly any dialogue (unless you count Saber wallowing in self-pity as dialogue). It was a huge bust.

Moving on, it seems Kariya gets what appears to be the most pathetic death in the entire series, arguably on par with that of Kayneth. But still, at least Kayneth experienced some glimmer of hope before his death. On the other hand, Kariya here seemed just like an empty shell, all spent and useless. Even I have to sympathize with him for getting such an unemotional death scene. I might not have liked him as a character much, but he was probably the closest to being an ordinary person in the entire cast. As such, he was also among the more interesting personalities from a psychological perspective. I will miss him. I swear that Urobuchi might be takings a few pages from Shakespeare into his writing.

Now, while the action segment of the episode was a bit flawed, the show continues to deliver consistently on its beautiful characterization. This time, the focus is on Kiritsugu and his struggle against his ideals. Again, we are treated to a heaping dose of tragedy as Kiritsugu realizes that all the sacrifices were all in vain. All he wanted was an escape from the never ending cycle of "killing a few to save many", so he killed even more people for it, only to realize that it was all in vain. His revelation of the grail's true nature can probably be likened to him realizing the true form of his utilitarian ideals.

The last scene with him forcing an unwilling Saber to destroy the grail was the icing on the cake.

[GDB]

Originally Posted by EssTEss

Books and novels are run by a powerful graphics card called imagination
It's only cheesy because you imagined it to be.

Which, in turn, means that it's only not cheesy because you imagined it to be as such. So your own words just turned that argument into one of opinion. Congratulations, there's no more use in arguing it.

Seriously, is the next week of this topic just going to be bitching for 20 pages about minor or even imagined slights? The only one with any real grounds is the Saber vs Berserker fight, since even an anime-only watcher can tell it's horrendously chopped up.

[GoldenLand]

I've rated this ep 10/10. It has a few flaws, but it was just a wonderful ep. I'm an anime only viewer (albeit having read a ton of spoilers) so I expect if I were a LN reader that I would be judging more harshly.

- Kiritsugu vs Kotomine was excellent and suspenseful. I wondered how much of their budget they spent on that.
- Kiritsugu inside the grail was a little confusing, but very well done nonetheless. Quite moving to have Kiritsugu's reasoning shown to him, and rejected.
- Although I was wanting Kiritsugu to win that fight, by the end, when Kotomine was defeated, I couldn't help sympathising with what he said about wanting his wish. Kotomine's character has been handled so well.
- My main criticism is that the Lancelot-Saber fight was short. I'd been led to believe that there would be plot exposition there, but in the end there wasn't...and it's a bit of a let down. Lancelot's identity was built up by the plot, and yet he hardly got any attention.
- Woah, Gilgamesh was creepy.
- Saber's voice actress was excellent in this ep. Saber's desperation was conveyed so well. Actually, all of the voice actors and actresses were amazing this ep. Iris? Amazing. Kotomine, Kiritsugu? Amazing.

[Haak]

I haven't watched the episode yet. I just wanted to say that from what I've heard, I'm going to wait for the BluRay version. The episode is probably great and all but that's not good enough. I want it to be perfect.

Unfortunately it looks to be a long wait.

[Sheba]

Originally Posted by EssTEss

Dodging back means he would have gained some more time before Kirei would've reached him, giving him an advantage to shoot and kill first.

And risking throwing off his aim? Someone already said it, his gun alone gave him the advantage of range, and Kirei was going straight at him, not strafing, not running in circles.

[ReinhartX]

so 25 is the final episode next week??

anyways i was hoping to have the scene where saber and gil fought in the city in flames exactly where it happened in the first minutes of the first episode of F/SN

also i wonder if we get to see a little shirou at the ending lol

[Seihai]

Originally Posted by ReinhartX

so 25 is the final episode next week??

also i wonder if we get to see a little shirou at the ending lol

Yeah, next week should be the last one.

According to the preview of the episode, I'd assume so.

[klare]

Kiritsugu vs Kirei was good, but Saber vs Berserker ended so suddenly

a few thing i dont get: what happen to Kariya? why Berserker hated Saber so much? why is Gil still around after his master was defeated?

and they really love to strangle Iris to death...

[GDB]

Originally Posted by klare

a few thing i dont get: what happen to Kariya? why Berserker hated Saber so much? why is Gil still around after his master was defeated?

Kariya: his body couldn't take the pressure from Berserker and the worms anymore, so he died a lonely, pitiful death in a sewer.
Berserker: I'll leave that for the BD, since I'm sure it'll be on there.
Gilgamesh: Archer class has Independent Action skill, which allows them much, much more time to stick around without a Master. I believe it's around 2 days as opposed to mere seconds/minutes/hours that other Servants would get.

[Kimidori]

Originally Posted by GDB

Kariya: his body couldn't take the pressure from Berserker and the worms anymore, so he died a lonely, pitiful death in a sewer.
Berserker: I'll leave that for the BD, since I'm sure it'll be on there.
Gilgamesh: Archer class has Independent Action skill, which allows them much, much more time to stick around without a Master. I believe it's around 2 days as opposed to mere seconds/minutes/hours that other Servants would get.

Gil have A+ rank in Independent Action skill, which help him remain in this world indefinitely even without a Master.

[DragoZERO]

Originally Posted by Haak

I haven't watched the episode yet. I just wanted to say that from what I've heard, I'm going to wait for the BluRay version. The episode is probably great and all but that's not good enough. I want it to be perfect.

Unfortunately it looks to be a long wait.

Don't wait. What was sacrificed was not essential to the over all major plot. Watch it. Waaaatch it!