[Manga] Chapter 342 Discussion

[Hunter]

Spoiler for spoiler chapter 343:

So let's get this straight. Sasuke defeated about a thousand opponents without killing them and without a scratch and then attack Orochimaru with extended chakra sword Asuma-like except the chakra blade is dozen meters long...?
.... Ok.

[Sabaku Kyu]

Spoiler:

No surprise here that Sasuke would eventually betray Oro. That line he gave about being a willing vessel always seemed like BS. But Oro had to be anticipating this turn of events, He should have something planned.

Originally Posted by Hunter

Spoiler:

So let's get this straight. Sasuke defeated about a thousand opponents without killing them and without a scratch and then attack Orochimaru with extended chakra sword Asuma-like except the chakra blade is dozen meters long...?
.... Ok.

Spoiler:

Yeah, I think Kishi kinda jumped the shark with that one. They could've at least made Sasuke look like he had been fighting.

[ILikeSquiReLz]

Originally Posted by Hunter

Spoiler for spoiler chapter 343:

So let's get this straight. Sasuke defeated about a thousand opponents without killing them and without a scratch and then attack Orochimaru with extended chakra sword Asuma-like except the chakra blade is dozen meters long...?
.... Ok.

LOL. This is funny. I'm not a Sasuke fan and have expressed this I'm sure, but I have never complained before about his Kishimoto "God given gifts" but I highly agree that this is taking things a bit far.

[Luminion Lancer]

Spoiler for 343:

-Well this isn't as big of a shock as I had thought it would be. Sasuke betraying Orochimaru was to be expected if Sasuke was to live after all. Can't say that I'm impressed with whole "Killing 1000 nameless Grunt ninja" thing though. Maybe it's just me but unless I see an actual fight then I'm not going to believe the whole "Sasuke is Uber" hype...Oh well, at least we know Orochimaru isn't going to take this lying down...

[Rurik]

Spoiler:

The only thing that interest me here is Orochimarus health condition, Could it be that Sandaimes Seal, it still working, even after the body switch? That would explained the badnaged arms.

[astayanax]

Spoiler:

Originally Posted by Rurik

Spoiler:

The only thing that interest me here is Orochimarus health condition, Could it be that Sandaimes Seal, it still working, even after the body switch? That would explained the badnaged arms.

I don't think so. I think it is more of a matter of Orochimaru spirit being so strong for the body that it just wears it out to uselessness. Also, it didn't help that he was fighting 4 tailed Naruto and taking blows that could wipe out Konoha clean.

I am excited, yet disappointed in seeing this tease now. It is obvious that it is going to fail although I hope we get to see Kabuto playing mind games again as he does best. For sure, Kishi is going to show Sasuke's weakness to the Curse Seal.

As for Sasuke's strength, I still don't understand why people are so surprised. Look at what Naruto has to do in order to beat Kakuzu (silly plot no jutsus aside); and he is arguably one of the weakest Akatsuki members. I am pretty sure that the AL and Itachi would be completely over the top as foes and should be even be out of the reach of any kage or Sannin beating them (Orochimaru already admitted this much).

One thing this chapter proves though if it is true; that Sasuke could had destroyed Team Yamato in seconds if he felt like it during their last confrontation which proved that Orochimaru was telling the truth after all about Sasuke being stronger than a 3 tailed Naruto.

[Sabaku Kyu]

Originally Posted by Rurik

Spoiler:

The only thing that interest me here is Orochimarus health condition, Could it be that Sandaimes Seal, it still working, even after the body switch? That would explained the badnaged arms.

Spoiler:

That is interesting. Wasn't it originally stated that Oro's soul merges with the body's original soul when the transfer takes place? Maybe the original soul is slowly lost over time leaving only Oro's soul (which is armless b/c of Sandaime). If this were the case, not only would the host body start to reject him because the original soul is losing its presence (sort of like how a body may reject a organ transplant it recognizes as foreign), but Oro would also begin to lose use of this arms since he relies on the arms of the original soul.

Originally Posted by astayanax

Spoiler:

One thing this chapter proves though if it is true; that Sasuke could had destroyed Team Yamato in seconds if he felt like it during their last confrontation which proved that Orochimaru was telling the truth after all about Sasuke being stronger than a 3 tailed Naruto.

Spoiler:

I don't think so. Like Fukitsu Naruto said, those were just nameless grunt ninja made to emphasize just how strong Sasuke is supposed to be. Just like Zabuza slaughtered over 100 genin at once during his chuunin exam. It was meant to show he was strong, but he certainly wasn't unstoppable. Sasuke's defeating them should'n't be used to gauge how easily he could've defeated Team 7 as none of those characters would ever be made to lose that easily.

[Rurik]

Originally Posted by astayanax

Spoiler:

I don't think so. I think it is more of a matter of Orochimaru spirit being so strong for the body that it just wears it out to uselessness. Also, it didn't help that he was fighting 4 tailed Naruto and taking blows that could wipe out Konoha clean.

Spoiler:

Well, I said it because he had Bandages on the arm, your suggestion also crossed my mind.

[Nuu]

Originally Posted by rman0099

Spoiler:

It will just be interesting to see if Sasuke has obtained MS. It is evident you can gain it without killing your best friend. Look at Kakashi. He obtained it YEARS after Obito's death, who he never actually killed. So the next chapters should be interesting. Will he kill Oro or leave him to die soon? Will Oro steal his body? Does Sasuke have MS?

Spoiler:

Yes but i believe Kakashi aqcuired the MS through a different way then Itachi. It also seems that Kakashi's ms is more ninjutsu based while itachi is genjutsu based but its also hard to base that of one attack from one..

Thats an interesting thought and is very plasible at this time frame since it was at this point in part one where the fight with the 3rd took place or pretty damn close

[gibits]

Originally Posted by Hunter

Spoiler for spoiler chapter 343:

So let's get this straight. Sasuke defeated about a thousand opponents without killing them and without a scratch and then attack Orochimaru with extended chakra sword Asuma-like except the chakra blade is dozen meters long...?
.... Ok.

Spoiler:

Well I think Sasuke could've just shocked all of them in an instant. Like a thunder-aga 5 (final fantasy reference for those not in the know). Look at what Naruto's new jutsu did, I'd be surprised if Sasuke didn't have a lightning jutsu of great range (and less fatal) than Naruto's.

Sasuke betraying people!? Why I never would've expected that from that ungrateful SOB! Anyway it looks like my wish of a Sasuke arc might come true afterall. Though it might end with Oro finally getting Sasuke's body. If what Oro said was true (that Naruto with 4-tails= Sasuke), then he should be able to handle Sasuke.

[Hunter]

Originally Posted by Fukitsu Naruto

Spoiler for 343:

Can't say that I'm impressed with whole "Killing 1000 nameless Grunt ninja" thing though. Maybe it's just me but unless I see an actual fight then I'm not going to believe the whole "Sasuke is Uber" hype...

Spoiler:

Oh come on, am I to dig your historic to find a post of yours about Yondaime beating 50 ninjas?
That's twenty times more than that for god sake.
I'm not shocked about Sasuke betraying Oro, I predicted that even before Sasuke left Konoha, I'm not shocked about Sasuke creating an uber chakra blade because I was expecting something like that since Asuma's fight.

But defeating over thousand ninjas without a scratch, without his cloth being at least a little dirty? No matter how he did it this is definitively a "Sasuke is Uber" moment.

[Sabaku Kyu]

Edit: original comment was incorrect

[astayanax]

Spoiler:

Originally Posted by Sabaku Kyu

That is interesting. Wasn't it originally stated that Oro's soul merges with the body's original soul when the transfer takes place? Maybe the original soul is slowly lost over time leaving only Oro's soul (which is armless b/c of Sandaime). If this were the case, not only would the host body start to reject him because the original soul is losing its presence (sort of like how a body may reject a organ transplant it recognizes as foreign), but Oro would also begin to lose use of this arms since he relies on the arms of the original soul.

I am not too fond of this theory because it implies that is should happen for each body Orochimaru takes over; which includes Sasuke. If Orochimaru knows this (and he should), why should he go out of his way into making Sasuke so strong when he is going to end up losing him as well and just have to find someone else.

Also if his armless soul take a body with arms, to me he shouldn't be able to use it (pretty much like how he can't after the 3rd used that jutsu) since he still would have no spiritual arms. We could ignore the spiritual arms of the body taken over since that belongs to someone else.

It would get very complicated very quickly which I think Kishimoto doesn't want to dwell into. A mere body rejection sounds more elegant and fits with his intense desire of getting Sasuke's body.

Spoiler:

I don't think so. Like Fukitsu Naruto said, those were just nameless grunt ninja made to emphasize just how strong Sasuke is supposed to be. Just like Zabuza slaughtered over 100 genin at once during his chuunin exam. It was meant to show he was strong, but he certainly wasn't unstoppable. Sasuke's defeating them should'n't be used to gauge how easily he could've defeated Team 7 as none of those characters would ever be made to lose that easily.

[/QUOTE]

Lets give Orochimaru and Sasuke some credit here. Look at what Sasuke wants to achieve; and look at the way he treated Naruto when they met post timeskip. While these 1k ninjas certainly aren't Sannin, Kakashis or the like; I can guarantee that they are scattered between genin to jounin strength. As hunter said, one of the 4th's greatest achievements was to beat 50 ninjas in an instant; and even he required a little bit of help from sub-ordinates. Sasuke on the other hand beated 1000 without using big attacks and without having any assistance... while not even getting touched and most likely in a non surprise attack. This deserves major credit.

[Hunter]

Originally Posted by gibits

Spoiler:

Well I think Sasuke could've just shocked all of them in an instant. Like a thunder-aga 5 (final fantasy reference for those not in the know). Look at what Naruto's new jutsu did, I'd be surprised if Sasuke didn't have a lightning jutsu of great range (and less fatal) than Naruto's.

Spoiler:

Kind of doubt it since the dozen of ninjas shown at the end of chapter 342 are wounded with kunai and such. Still, if he used an incredibly large Chidori Nagaishi (and that means battlefield large) this is still unbelievable. If that's the case I hope it was a CS2 thingy.

Well I will be nice and wait for the actual release to start whining. Who knows, maybe it will be presented badass enough to make me forget about complaining ^^

[Luminion Lancer]

Originally Posted by Hunter

Spoiler:

Oh come on, am I to dig your historic to find a post of yours about Yondaime beating 50 ninjas?
That's two hundreds times more than that for god sake.
I'm not shocked about Sasuke betraying Oro, I predicted that even before Sasuke left Konoha, I'm not shocked about Sasuke creating an uber chakra blade because I was expecting something like that since Asuma's fight.

But defeating over thousand ninjas without a scratch, without his cloth being at least a little dirty? No matter how he did it this is definitively a "Sasuke is Uber" moment.

Spoiler:

-Uh, Hunter-san I'm not Yellow Flash. I don't think that I've ever made the comment that over-glorified Yondaime Hokage. But whatever, I'm not going to get into a discussion as to whether or not Sasuke is amazing.

[Hunter]

Originally Posted by Fukitsu Naruto

Spoiler:

-Uh, Hunter-san I'm not Yellow Flash. I don't think that I've ever made the comment that over-glorified Yondaime Hokage. But whatever, I'm not going to get into a discussion as to whether or not Sasuke is amazing.

Spoiler:

Don't misunderstand me, I'm not saying overglorifying or anything like that : just acknowledging that what the 4th did wasn't small feat.
And don't worry I really do not intend to enter any "Sasuke-is-amazing-no-he-is-not" discussion. I just thought that basically saying "oh well beating 1000+ ninjas isn't impressive" was a bit over the top

[kikko_s]

Spoiler:

It looks like things are actually starting to move faster with regards to Sasgay. The part about him activating the curse seal at the end just kind of makes me think he'll be taken over after all. The more you use it, the more you lose yourself to Oro. Oro has to have some sort of special seal or jutsu to just bring you down if you're under his curse.

[Xellos-_^]

All this talk about Sasuke's power but no one has talk about the other part of the chp.

Spoiler:

Sakura is FEEDING Naruto in hospital.

That is a significant step forward in thier relationship. Hinata fans better hope she shows up soon or she might as well not show up at all.

[Sazelyt]

Originally Posted by Hunter

Spoiler:

Don't misunderstand me, I'm not saying overglorifying or anything like that : just acknowledging that what the 4th did wasn't small feat.
And don't worry I really do not intend to enter any "Sasuke-is-amazing-no-he-is-not" discussion. I just thought that basically saying "oh well beating 1000+ ninjas isn't impressive" was a bit over the top

Spoiler:

Beating is sure impressive, but I would like to wait to see how he had achieved that.

If it took him a lot of time or using cursed seal effects to beat that many, I will not put him above Yondaime, although he will still be at high level.

But, who knows, if Sasuke used a Sharingan based powerful technique, to stop that many opponents, and taking many almost at the same time, similar to Yondaime's technique, then I might change my opinion and put him close to Yondaime (although still below, cause Yondaime used only his intelligence, rather than a bloodline based technique).

For the other stuff:

Spoiler:

I wasn't expecting Sasuke to betray Oro right now, especially after saying that he cannot beat Itachi alone just a few weeks ago. And, I doubt he developed MS during that time, if he couldn't done so in 2.5 years. So, if he cannot beat Itachi, why betray now. Without MS, it is pretty obvious to me that he cannot kill Orochimaru, and he cannot kill Itachi without Orochimaru's help.

For Oro's bandages around both of his arms, I believe what Rurik said. It is possible that Sandaime's seal has started to affect his current body. Although, I don't think the seal around his arms correspond to that, they seem to be more like slowing down the effect of the curse - as a counter seal (just like what Kakashi did for Sasuke).

Now about Sasuke, it is obvious that, he is not completely bad inside, although he tries to be so from the outside. However, there is one question comes to mind; when he tried to kill Naruto last time, was he thinking that Naruto is a part of his "don't mind killing" group? If no, maybe we will see him unite with Naruto and the others earlier than expected. If yes, then he has most probably lost some pieces in his brain.

The best thing about the chapter: it is most likely that we will not stuck with a dysfunctional family for a long time.

[Negs]

Originally Posted by Sabaku Kyu

Spoiler:

Yeah, I think Kishi kinda jumped the shark with that one. They could've at least made Sasuke look like he had been fighting.

Spoiler:

haha, I agree. And props to you for using that expression. Kishi has a total boy-crush on Sasuke.