2010-12-05, 17:03 | Link #19461 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2010
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Well Dine states that all blame should lay on the culprits shoulders so just giving the people in Rokkenjima the opportunity to murder each other isn't enough. I doubt that Yasu is the culprit but having her not kill any single person trough out the games would surprise me.
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2010-12-05, 17:05 | Link #19462 | |
Junior Member
Join Date: Dec 2010
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It never actually states that the culprit has to kill anyone. And if Yasu engineers the whole thing... that pretty much qualifies her as the culprit, I'd say. Regardless, it's just a thought I had. |
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2010-12-05, 17:09 | Link #19463 | |
Blick Winkel
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Gobbled up by Promathia
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For instance, in a typical game the bomb kills everybody. However, in EP3, Eva solves the Epitaph, gets the remaining money from Yasu's gold stash, and survives. So depending on what happens throughout the games, different results may occur. In the Core Arcs, everything seems to change with the introduction of Erika Furudo. What I think happens is that Yasu solves the Epitaph and receives the gold. She uses the gold as bribery for the adults to follow through with her plan. However, once somebody else discovers the gold, they are no longer bound to Yasu's will (since they know where the gold is) and can kill people themselves. Maybe. I'm not too sure about that one. Edit: Even better: Once somebody finds the gold stash, they are no longer bound by Yasu's will and may hide somewhere safe. I take it that the adults may actually suspect that people are dying, but are too afraid to ruin Yasu's game because they want money. Once they are free from that, they can do whatever. |
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2010-12-05, 17:09 | Link #19464 | |
別にいいけど
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: forever lost inside a logic error
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I can hardly see why it should be different. There are two things that we know for sure about Yasu's full name: 1) Her last name is Yasuda 2) Her first name starts with the first Kanji of "Shannon" Why not Sayo? Even if it isn't Sayo it's still Sa-something or Sha-something.
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2010-12-05, 17:30 | Link #19465 |
Miss Kimi
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Residing as the 18th guest of Rokkenjima
Age: 28
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LOL, why did I never think about Yasuda Sayo? Goodness, that helps alittle. I don't really think its anything else. Well, it works because....
Spoiler for EP7 thingy...:
Decided to spoiler that because it's VERY BIG. I don't think anyone can contradict that XD
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2010-12-05, 17:58 | Link #19466 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2010
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I support this. For example, in the first episode, I distantly recall Eva unconcernedly challenging Battler to solve the mystery, before retiring with Hideyoshi to her room (there's a murderer about, who does that?!). My memory might be a little off, though (it's been three? years since I read it). The general acted murder mystery pattern was probably broken in the 4th, and perhaps 3rd, episodes, although I do believe at least some adults kept some act going (Kyrie in the 4th, for example).
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2010-12-05, 18:32 | Link #19467 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Meta-Meta-Meta-Space
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The way to get past EP1-4 though is to say that the faking occurred independently of the actual murders and if the people or the story doesn't discover the faked deaths, when the story picks back up at 6am, the people have already been murdered by then. (Although EP5 was different since the guest house was under watch by Erika.) There's also more about how the Key acts and why and other stuff. Check my signature, under Epitaph Fakery Theory. |
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2010-12-05, 18:57 | Link #19468 |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Meta-Meta-Meta-Space
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Oops.. sorry for the double post.. but I wanted to bring up the question of just how much Krauss knows. Now.. he isn't often alive long enough to really do anything about this... but anyways...
These things were said of Krauss: - Krauss was the one who had the island survey done, right? - Krauss was also the one who had Toraian built... - Krauss already has one gold bar, supposedly from the banker from years ago, and is the one to convince Natsuhi that the gold is real, if only in secret - When the siblings were going to call Krauss' bluff about Kinzo, he came back and told Natsuhi that he's going to leave it to Genji. What I'm getting at is, I wonder how much did he really think he was the head of the family... because I'm starting to think that he might have been doing what Yasu was telling him to do anyways. Of course Natsuhi knows nothing about this... Because, if Krauss does an island survey and constructs Toraian (which is strangely named after the Kuwadorian pattern) then... he must know about the submarine base and Kuwadorian, right? It seems to me it's Genji (and perhaps the others of the Beatrice faction) who has control over Krauss and Krauss just does what he's told. For money, perhaps. |
2010-12-05, 20:08 | Link #19470 | |
The True Culprit
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2010-12-05, 21:27 | Link #19473 | |
Mystery buff
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Gone Fishin!
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2010-12-05, 22:25 | Link #19475 | ||
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Meta-Meta-Meta-Space
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In other words, he didn't get the land survey done; Yasu did. They just used Krauss' name. So for Toraian, for example, they could've just told him, "We're building this; it's called Toraian. Don't ask why." But the thing is maybe there were a few things they ended up letting him know; like the gold. And the Epitaph Fakery. |
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2010-12-05, 23:26 | Link #19477 | |
Senior Member
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The guesthouse was built within the last few years by Krauss.
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2010-12-05, 23:38 | Link #19478 | ||
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
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The Van Dine rule does forbid servants from being the culprit, and his novels really give the impression that he considered the servants accessories instead of characters. He wasn't a jerk who discriminated against them, he just didn't think of servants as potential culprits for a good detective story. Why? Because it would "too easy of a solution." Quote:
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2010-12-06, 00:04 | Link #19479 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Meta-Meta-Meta-Space
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So I doubt Krauss had really that much control over it being built, leading me to think that he is willingly following orders... at this point at least. For this reason and the others... It just makes me suspicious as it seems now of the male siblings, Rudolf and Krauss know something is up. How much they know is not a given... EDIT: Speaking of which, Rudolf and Krauss are also usually the ones to 'die' first... or really die first. So... who knows they know? Besides the people unlikely to have committed murder... |
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2010-12-06, 00:42 | Link #19480 |
Senior Member
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Early deaths:
Kinzo: T1(3) Krauss: T1(1,2,5) Natsuhi: T1(2,4,6) Jessica: T1(5), T2(2,4) Nanjo: never Eva: T1(2,4,6), T2(1) Hideyoshi: T1(2,4), T2(1,5) George: T1(5), T2(4) Rudolf: T1(1,2,4) Kyrie: T1(1,2,6) Battler: T1(6) Rosa: T1(1,4,5,6), T2(3) Maria T1(5,6), T2(3) Genji: T1(3,4,5) Shannon: T1(1,3) Kanon: T1(3), T2(2,6) Gohda: T1(1,3) Kumasawa: T1(3) So Rosa's most likely to die early, dying at the first twilight four times and the second twilight once. Doubtful deaths: Episode 1: First twilight (shed): Battler gets a good look at Rudolf, Kyrie, Krauss, Rosa, Gohda, but never sees Shannon; only Kanon and Hideyoshi do. It's an bad place to fake a crime. Shannon probably isn't there. Second twilight (guest room): Battler gets a good look at Eva & Hideyoshi. Probably dead. Fourth twilight (boiler room): Kinzo is definitely dead. Fifth twilight (boiler room): Kanon is still alive when Battler last sees him. Sixth, Seventh, Eighth twilight (parlor): Battler gets a good look at Nanjo, Kumasawa, Genji. Ninth twilight (entrance hall): Battler gets a good look at Natsuhi. Tenth twilight: Jessica, George, Battler, Maria Episode 2: First twilight (chapel): Battler gets a good look at Krauss, Natsuhi, Eva, Hideyoshi, Rudolf, Kryie. real Second twilight (Jessica's room): Battler gets a good look at Jessica, but Kanon is missing. Kanon is faked, but Jessica? Servants room: Bodies of Nanjo & Kumasawa disappear. ??? Seventh & Eighth twilight (courtyard): Battler gets a good look at Nanjo & Kumasawa and this is a bad place to fake. real Fourth, Fifth, Sixth twilights (Natsuhi's room): Battler gets a good look at George, Gohda, Shannon, particularly Shannon. real Ninth twilight: Nobody Tenth twilight: Battler, Rosa, Genji, Kinzo, Maria Episode 3: First twilight (scattered through mansion): Battler doesn't see any of the victims at the time. (He later sees Shannon, but never sees the others.) ??? Second twilight (garden): Battler gets a good look at Rosa & Maria and this is a bad place to fake. real Fourth, Fifth, Sixth twilight (mansion): Rudolf, Kyrie, Hideyoshi. Need to check. ??? Seventh, Eighth twilight (arbor): Battler gets a good look at Krauss & Natsuhi, and this is a bad place to fake. real Ninth twilight (parlor): Battler gets a good look at George and Shannon. real Ninth twilight (???): Battler is never mentioned as seeing Nanjo. ??? Ninth twilight (parlor): Battler is shot by Eva. real Tenth twilight: Jessica, Eva Episode 4: Second twilight (arbor): Battler gets a good look at George. real Ninth twilight (shed): Bad place to fake, but Battler can't get a good look at Gohda & Kumasawa. ??? First, tenth twilight (dining room): Battler gets a good look at Natsuhi, Eva, Hideyoshi, Rudolf, Rosa, Maria. real Various: Battler can't find Kanon, but gets a good look at others. ??? on Kanon, others real
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