Valvrave the Liberator - Spoilers & Speculation based on Previews, Website etc.

[Thess]

Originally Posted by Kurohane

Leaving the joke aside, I doubt this show will leave the world of humans.

They would have gotten sacrifices either way. It was a pick your poison situation. There's no guarantee they wouldn't have as many deaths if they actually did form a military state at that time.

They would have minimized the loses that's for sure. What happened to them was the scenario without resistance (the one without L-Elf, Cain flat out spelled it aloud).

I must be the only person in this fandom who doesn't want L-Elf to get a special mecha. Part of his balanced dynamics with Haruto is that he's human who thinks the plan and is the one who fights with skill while Haruto's the "monster" (used in an affectionate way) pilot with powers who isn't anything special without Valvrave and the kamitsuki injection. If L-Elf were to get a special mecha, it'll be the same of Haruto suddenly becoming a tactical genius and a good fighter. It ruins their cooperation. Think Okouchi's previous main male characters in Code Geass. L-Elf took from Lelouch his brain while Haruto the 'powers'. From Suzaku, L-Elf has the prime fit athlete form while Haruto inherits the speshful robot.

[NeutralZero]

a Cain vs L11 in actual combat will only result in L11's defeat or a repeat of S1...
Haruto in L11's body fighting Cain in unit 1 might even out the odd
since L11 has the body to be a match while haruto has the runes
and would help Haruto not to be drained out of his runes
though kinda sad if the memories that will be takern from L11 is similar to Haruto,
Memories of Liz...

[DevilHighDxD]

I'm hoping for a epic battle between Hito and Dainsleif, when Haruto start fueling with his memories and start to overpowering Cain. Dainsleif then split, cliffhanger along with the announcement of season 3. Please Sunrise, that will be the best Christmas present for me.

[Kurohane]

Originally Posted by Irenesharda

And there we have the problem. If Pino leaves Unit 1, all the valvraves shut down. So there would be no need to defeat VVV1, it's no longer a threat. However, Haruto can't destroy Dainsrave without destroying Prue, which Pino won't allow. And if both Pino and Prue leave their respective machines, neither one will work. The more you look at it, the less likely it is that there will be any definitive finale to a fight between VVV2 and VVV1.

If they lose Pino, they just need to find a replacement. Cain obviously has something in mind. We can't assume anything ourselves. However, we know Haruto doesn't have good chances. He is losing memories, and Hito is showing the same phenomenon when Marie piloted it. This battle won't take much time, as it will only last until Haruto runs out of memories, and then his life. It's possible the fight ends on a cliffhanger, like halfway through the episode. They both charge a Harikiri Blade and fire at the same time.

[finalfury]

Originally Posted by Irenesharda

I really want L-elf to get his own mech too. However, how exactly do you kill Cain? First, unlike the kamitsuki pilots, he hasn't made a contract with his machine, neither was he transformed by it like they were. He can use it simply because he was the original being the machine was made for when the scientists were trying to copy Magius genetics. So even if you destroy his Dainsrave, not counting the destruction of Prue, that probably won't also destroy him. Second, now that we've found out that the Magius can regenerate from lethal wounds, you can't really kill him with weapons or force. And lastly, even if somehow even then, you can destroy his body, that won't necessarily destroy his natural ethereal form which is still also immortal and can leave his human shell anytime.

Trying to kill him or any of the Magius is near impossible unless you're talking rune drainage, and like Lise, they have to already be near starvation for that.

And then you also have to take on the fact that Cain is still smarter and stronger than both L-elf and Haruto. Also, interestingly enough, unlike many super-smart villians he also seems strangely humble, not accepting a lot of praise for his plans despite how amazing they are. This makes me think that he's not going to let pride or overconfidence get the best of him very easily. I have no doubt he (like L-elf would) has plans A,B,C, and D, for what's going on. He also like L-elf, is very good at thinking on his feet and modifying his plans as he goes in case he's faced with any kinks.

So, yeah, this last fight, I'm am really, really unsure if anyone is really going to defeat anyone.

My understanding of how immortality works in this series is that it only works if body parts are still connected to the main body. Thunder was shown to have had half of body blown off and since people are usually aware of when they are about to die after severe injuries, it is likely that limbs cannot be regenerated.

Also, in the case of the Fuhrer, I suspect that L-elf intentionally avoided removing his head from his body since L-elf had some speculations about that before. If Cain's ethereal spirit does come out, I don't think it will survive since Liselotte implies that their spirit forms cannot exist on the Earth's atmosphere for a long duration of time hence the need to jack someone.

@Thess: Lelouch had a mecha unit for a portion of the series tho. :c

Or if you really want to, have Haruto drain Cain's Runes via neck penetration. :v

[Thess]

Originally Posted by NeutralZero

a Cain vs L11 in actual combat will only result in L11's defeat or a repeat of S1...

I speculate Haruto will drain him of runes in his hito fight before L-Elf, X-eins and A-drei take him in combat. Or until Pino and Prue make up for the lost time and leave. It wouldn't surprise me L-Elf and Cain engage into a fist fight for a while and X-eins shoots Cain in the back, barking his "always bring a companion to watch your back" quote back at him to avenge H-neun.

[NeutralZero]

but that won't kill them
unless they're blown or got hacked in the most brutal/gore manner...

[Thess]

Originally Posted by NeutralZero

but that won't kill them
unless they're blown or got hacked in the most brutal/gore manner...

Of course not, but it'll give L-Elf time to decapitate him.

[Irenesharda]

Originally Posted by Kurohane

If they lose Pino, they just need to find a replacement. Cain obviously has something in mind. We can't assume anything ourselves. However, we know Haruto doesn't have good chances. He is losing memories, and Hito is showing the same phenomenon when Marie piloted it. This battle won't take much time, as it will only last until Haruto runs out of memories, and then his life. It's possible the fight ends on a cliffhanger, like halfway through the episode. They both charge a Harikiri Blade and fire at the same time.

But how do you find a replacement Magius who's willing to be imprisoned inside an engine for the sake of a group of kids that just decided to endanger your whole race?

However, yeah this is going to be one hard, if not impossible fight coming up. And even then that's not the end of it. Not by a longshot.

Originally Posted by finalfury

My understanding of how immortality works in this series is that it only works if body parts are still connected to the main body. Thunder was shown to have had half of body blown off and since people are usually aware of when they are about to die after severe injuries, it is likely that limbs cannot be regenerated.

Also, in the case of the Fuhrer, I suspect that L-elf intentionally avoided removing his head from his body since L-elf had some speculations about that before. If Cain's ethereal spirit does come out, I don't think it will survive since Liselotte implies that their spirit forms cannot exist on the Earth's atmosphere for a long duration of time hence the need to jack someone.

We really don't know enough about the Magius' abilities, we just found out this episode that they can regenerate, who knows what else they can do? However, it was said somewhere in an interview that the kamitsuki die when the mecha they are contracted too is destroyed. That's why Thunder and Kyuma died, because their mechs and especially their engine was destroyed. L-elf has theorized that cutting off the head may also kill them, but he also theorized that kamitsuki could be killed by a bullet to the head and he was proved wrong there, so really we don't know.

I'm thinking limbs could be regenerated since that's not really lethal and even humans could survive that. Also, they are shown to be able to heal from broken and torn apart limbs which means they can create new flesh and bone really fast. Its only a few steps further to heal an entire limb.

Now it's true that Lise says that exposure without a human shell could kill a Magius. However, she says it more as if it's a prolonged thing not instantaneous. She says something like "waiting for death" so that suggests it would take a while. In that kind of time, with so many humans around, Cain could easily find a new one if he had to. In their natural form all they have to do is enter the body through the mouth or some open area and they've already taken over.

[Kurohane]

Originally Posted by Irenesharda

But how do you find a replacement Magius who's willing to be imprisoned inside an engine for the sake of a group of kids that just decided to endanger your whole race?

However, yeah this is going to be one hard, if not impossible fight coming up. And even then that's not the end of it. Not by a longshot.

It doesn't even need to be a magius, but a kamitsuki. Akira, probably?

[finalfury]

Originally Posted by Irenesharda

But how do you find a replacement Magius who's willing to be imprisoned inside an engine for the sake of a group of kids that just decided to endanger your whole race?

However, yeah this is going to be one hard, if not impossible fight coming up. And even then that's not the end of it. Not by a longshot.



We really don't know enough about the Magius' abilities, we just found out this episode that they can regenerate, who knows what else they can do? However, it was said somewhere in an interview that the kamitsuki die when the mecha they are contracted too is destroyed. That's why Thunder and Kyuma died, because their mechs and especially their engine was destroyed. L-elf has theorized that cutting off the head may also kill them, but he also theorized that kamitsuki could be killed by a bullet to the head and he was proved wrong there, so really we don't know.

I'm thinking limbs could be regenerated since that's not really lethal and even humans could survive that. Also, they are shown to be able to heal from broken and torn apart limbs which means they can create new flesh and bone really fast. Its only a few steps further to heal an entire limb.

Now it's true that Lise says that exposure without a human shell could kill a Magius. However, she says it more as if it's a prolonged thing not instantaneous. She says something like "waiting for death" so that suggests it would take a while. In that kind of time, with so many humans around, Cain could easily find a new one if he had to. In their natural form all they have to do is enter the body through the mouth or some open area and they've already taken over.

They can regenerate wounds to a specific degree. They intake Runes form humans. They can use a specific language or I believe their thoughts to manipulate Runes to their bidding. They can hijack a human body and claim it as their own. I suspect that the need to change bodies comes from the fact that they slowly use the Runes of the bodies they are in so that after a specific time frame, their bodies can no longer supply the amount of the Runes they need in order to maintain their control over it hence the need to hijack another body. The usage of the Phantoms imply that Magius cannot ingest Runes via the fangs on their mouth or that the Runes of the humans need to refined in order for the Magius to be able to intake them into their bodies. Magius absorb the bodies Runes as the price of claiming the body, which could explain why they (Cain) lacks memories of the previous owner's past and why the Fuhrer doesn't currently know of the Karlstein Agency since even the Dorssia grunt soldiers (Season 1 episode 2) know of the Karlstein Agency. Season 1 finale implies that Magius can self-regenerate since Cain calls them a third generation immortal.

I think any doctor will tell you that re-attaching an entire limb is way easier than regrowing an entire limb. The information of the arm is sent to the brain, the brain re-configures the Runes to recover a specific portion of that body hence the regeneration. If the nerves of the body, which I suspect have a automatic messaging system that send info to the brain detailing the information on what needs to be regenerated, hence the regeneration process starting. If the brain cannot locate the nerves of the body part (the torn ones still were somewhat connected to the body IIRC), then regeneration cannot start I assume. This is my guess though so yea.....

I think their intake of Runes grows astronomically when they are in spirit form, which is why Pino and Prue are the closest things to a spirit form Magius that we will see in this series and even they need a vessel with Runes in it.

Don't bother replying to this. I'm too much of a hardheaded fool. Agree to disagree.

[Irenesharda]

Originally Posted by Kurohane

It doesn't even need to be a magius, but a kamitsuki. Akira, probably?

I've thought of that. If the pilots themselves can somehow manipulate and convert runes into energy in order to power their own machines, they wouldn't need Pino. However, they would probably need someone to teach them Magius speech for that. Haruto learned to do a bit instinctively, but I'm guessing they're going to need more than that to be able to run the machines on their own and eventually be able to use rune magic.

And speaking of rune magic, that's another thing Cain has in his favor. Haruto's less than a novice in trying to use runes as a tool or a weapon, while Cain is an expert. Also, Dainsrave is covered in Magius writing, which makes me think that it too can utilize rune magic.

Originally Posted by finalfury

They can regenerate wounds to a specific degree. They intake Runes form humans. They can use a specific language or I believe their thoughts to manipulate Runes to their bidding. They can hijack a human body and claim it as their own. I suspect that the need to change bodies comes from the fact that they slowly use the Runes of the bodies they are in so that after a specific time frame, their bodies can no longer supply the amount of the Runes they need in order to maintain their control over it hence the need to hijack another body. The usage of the Phantoms imply that Magius cannot ingest Runes via the fangs on their mouth or that the Runes of the humans need to refined in order for the Magius to be able to intake them into their bodies. Magius absorb the bodies Runes as the price of claiming the body, which could explain why they (Cain) lacks memories of the previous owner's past and why the Fuhrer doesn't currently know of the Karlstein Agency since even the Dorssia grunt soldiers (Season 1 episode 2) know of the Karlstein Agency. Season 1 finale implies that Magius can self-regenerate since Cain calls them a third generation immortal.

The thing is, unless immortal's powers or limitations are clearly defined, we really don't know how far their abilities go. We don't know if they have a limit of damage they can take or not. The only things we do know is they can die from either the destruction of their contracted mech, or from complete rune depletion.

Also, from the way Cain said it back in episode 17, the Phantoms are simply a way to industrialize the rune collection process so that they can get more runes with less work and less danger of discovery. He also suggested that it was a way for them to a lot of runes all at once rather than person to person. I'm guessing that they did hunt back in the day, and probably still can, but like humans, why go out and shoot a deer when you can get it at the store? Also, Cain did say they were using the phantoms to prepare for this big ceremony they were supposed to have. They have yet to say what they ceremony was or is and I'm hoping they get to that before the end.

[finalfury]

So yea, Saki's "Haruto, help me!" line. Will it show up in the next episode since the other lines have already made an appearance?

[DevilHighDxD]

If the golden part of Carmilla is indeed spell for runes magic then it mean Dainsleif will be felling in the hand of the Kamitsuki.

@finalfury well yes, she is facing these ugly knock-off by herself. But since Saki is alive that mean Haruto did a good job of saving her .

[finalfury]

The Rune writing on Dainsrave seems to be more for limitation purposes. Previously, there was a negative effect on Plue when he was in Rave Engine 2. I assume the text are to limit the influence Rave Engine 2 has on Plue and allow him more freedom in terms of controlling and utilizing the Runes of Dainsrave.

[Irenesharda]

Originally Posted by DevilHighDxD

If the golden part of Carmilla is indeed spell for runes magic then it mean Dainsleif will be felling in the hand of the Kamitsuki.

What golden part? You mean in the future?

Originally Posted by finalfury

The Rune writing on Dainsrave seems to be more for limitation purposes. Previously, there was a negative effect on Plue when he was in Rave Engine 2. I assume the text are to limit the influence Rave Engine 2 has on Plue and allow him more freedom in terms of controlling and utilizing the Runes of Dainsrave.

I don't know, perhaps...though I thought Prue was having a hard time simply because VVV2 wasn't complete and therefore kind of short-circuited considering the power Prue was pouring through the thing. That's why it was breaking apart. Also, since Dainsrave has 4 engines, that should be enough to help Prue with the load.
I'm almost sure the writing is some sort of incantation, especially since its stated that Dainsrave has Magius technology incorporated within it, more than any of the others.

[Mad Pierrot]

Talking about the whole balance between protagonists in Code Geass Suzaku became stronger by using Lelouch's Geass to perform better moves. We could have the same with Haruto using the curse.

I would like the "Haruto, help me!" line to be deeper than "help me in the fight." It could be "don't die and help me not feel lonely."

[Nvis]

Originally Posted by Irenesharda

I think L-elf's going to be needed to run this country. Haruto doesn't inherit L-elf's intelligence when he gets into his body, or else he wouldn't need sticky notes.
and Haruto isn't smart enough or has enough will to lead an empire on his own. So I don't think he's going to die or get permanently taken over.

However, there is again the problem that I don't think Haruto has the skill to challenge Cain, and especially not in the VVV2.

Haruto does get some or most of L-Elf's skills. Like how he skillfully shoot a-drei in the eye and dorssian soldiers. And epic piloting of Valvrave.

[Thess]

Originally Posted by Nvis

Haruto does get some or most of L-Elf's skills. Like how he skillfully shoot a-drei in the eye and dorssian soldiers. And epic piloting of Valvrave.

Just the physical ones: those are muscular reactions. Please do re-watch episode 7, he has no grasp or understanding of how L-Elf plans things even in his body: he marvels at them when he reads his sticky notes. They don't need his soldier skills to run this but his brain. They are, as Cain put it, brainless without L-Elf. Haruto, on the other hand, is entirely replaceable in his major skill: pilot Hito. I suspect Satomi will become Hito's pilot, that explains why his future self uniform has yellow and red (gold&red could be the upgrade of Hito like Carmilla is green and gold). You could argue they could ask another one among his friends, but they don't have reasons to help them. X-eins has always put his friends over everything, he would try to kill them for taking over L-Elf (he never wanted F-6 to be killed, he's pretty soft with his buddies). A-drei is unlikely to lend a hand, after all he only cares about Dorssia (and L-Elf). In fact, removing L-Elf would imply removing the alliances he has within the military: contact with Royalists and Karlstein. The world wouldn't take kindly that a monster stole the body of the man who just revealed them the truth, completely endangering the plan.

Naturally, bad writing could dismiss logic, however as far as things stand. There's no characterization justification or plot justification. L-Elf is an irreplaceable asset while Haruto is not. If Haruto wants a new body, he can always jack Q-vier or someone he wouldn't absolutely require to keep the place afloat or is the human face of the liberation. Past episodes prove fairly clearly that right now, they are nothing without L-Elf and they collapse helplessly like dominos without his guidance. Haruto prefers to die than make L-Elf cry (episode 22), so I'm to buy he'll purposefully stay in his body?

Of course, I don't think Haruto will die, my theory is that he might become the new Valvrave Engine. Pino will be set free. The curse will end with him: he will turn it into a blessing.

As for the last battle: Haruto will take on Cain in the Valvrave. L-Elf and his group will give the finish blow after Cain is rune depleted and out of it perhaps. That's what I think. X-eins might give the final blow. He's the character set up with a personal motive against Cain, far more than L-Elf and Haruto.

[Triple_R]

A few months ago, just before the finale for Season 1, I posted up some comprehensive speculations for the finale. You can see them here. As you can see, I had a pretty good record on "Key Points" (4 out of 5), but my "percentage likelihood of character death" was rather far off.

In any event, I found it a fun little exercise, so I'm going to do the same sort of comprehensive finale speculations for the big finale itself. The following is what I think will happen in the finale:

Spoiler for Big Finale speculations:

Key Points: Dorssia's government changes. Amadeus dies, while A-Drei becomes the new Monarch of Dorssia. L-Elf and/or Shouko successfully start a new country where human and Kamitsuki live together in peace. Haruto Dies. ARUS and its people become opposed to both Dorssia and the new country arising from the ashes of Module 77.


More detailed speculations: L-Elf decides to make Amadeus tell him everything he knows about the Council of 101. L-Elf also captures ARUS President Anderson and uses him to blackmail ARUS into backing off and returning their forces to Earth.

Haruto and Akira are still shook up over Yamada's death, but are showing relief over seeing L-Elf succeed. That's until Cain dramatically engages Haruto in battle, causing Akira to scream out to Haruto! But before she can help him, she's cut off by the psychotic-looking Q-vier engaging her in battle as well. Cut to the Valvrave logo (OP will be cut to save every second possible for this finale).

The two big mecha battles are Haruto vs. Cain and Akira vs. Q-vier. Cain is winning his battle, while the other battle is a stalemate. Haruto is leaking runes fast, and fears he will not have enough to win this battle. He's then saved by Saki flying triumphantly to the rescue to knock Cain back, and buy Haruto some time.

Saki shouts to Haruto to leave Cain to her, and for him to get to safety. Haruto agrees, but with the caveat that he will be back to save her. Haruto seeks out L-Elf for a Rune Snack, and L-Elf obliges (the preview shot where L-Elf bares his neck, as though preparing to be bit by a vampire).

While all this fighting goes on, A-Drei goes on TV to make a grand patriotic speech to the Dorssian people. He implores everyone to stand up against the fiends that are eating his country alive. He tells them to seize all government buildings, and to take their country back. We briefly see Shouko watching A-Drei's speech with a mixture of admiration (in him) and shame (in herself). But Shouko is inspired by A-Drei's speech, and will later give a dramatic speech herself.

After getting his L-Elf snack, Haruto rushes back into battle, arriving just in time to prevent Saki's death at Cain's hands. Haruto and Cain engage in an epic battle, while at the same time we see Shouko delivering a speech. In her somewhat tearful speech, she talks of Haruto's great sacrifice (appropriately mixed with scenes of him now fighting Cain), and how her and her people cannot allow that sacrifice to be in vain. She pleads with her people, and the people of Earth, to accept the Kamitsuki.

Hearing this gives Akira the second breath she needs, as she had just been losing to Q-viers. Renewed by Shouko's speech, Akira shouts loudly while bringing death and destruction upon Q-viers.

However, Haruto is losing memories fast. He watches Shouko's speech on his display in the hopes that doing so will help him not forget her. But it is all for naught, as he forgets about her anyway. Instead, she ironically ends up being a costly distraction to him.

"...Who is that? Giving that speech? I feel like I should recognize her, but I don't. Why am I watching her? Wait! Aren't I supposed to be fighti..."

And then Cain delivers the finishing blow to Haruto. Saki and Akira cry in horror at the sight. Saki is completely enraged, and vows to avenge her fallen friend and romantic crush. Her and Akira double-team Cain, and Cain is able to parry back Akira, but Saki proves too much for him. Saki destroys Cain's mecha and he dies at her hands.

That is the climax. We then move to the epilogue. Due to not having much screen-time during the action-y parts, Satomi and Takahi get a bit of screentime here, as they try to comfort Akira over the deaths of Haruto and Yamada, as well as reflecting on the heroism of both (especially Haruto). The next scene focuses on the naming of the new empire from which Module 77 will be born.

New Dorssian Monarch A-Drei is in attendance, to signal a diplomatic bond between his country, and that of his friend L-Elf.

The leader of the new country will be either L-Elf or Shouko. But the Founder will be declared to be Haruto, the great hero who gave his life to make this all possible.

In the final scene of the epilogue, we skip ahead to future!Saki and future!Satomi explaining this all to the Prince. And then we get a brief scene setting up... Valvrave Season 3! The episode ends with a promo for Valvrave Season 3, which will be centered around the time of Future!Saki and Satomi.


Now, percentage likelihood of character death in final episode (excluding during time-skip):

Cain - 75%

Amadeus - 75%

Q-Viers - 70%

Haruto - 55%

President Anderson - 45%

Akira - 33%

Shouko - 25%

Iori - 25%

L-Elf, Rion, X-Eins, Kriemheld - 3%

A-Drei, Takahi, Takumi, and Otomaya - 2%

Satomi and Saki - 1% (only because you can never be 100% certain with anything in Valvrave )