2010-04-14, 00:52 | Link #8021 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Meta-Meta-Meta-Space
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My fear though is that EP7 and EP8 will be the end simply because he'll just give us the answers. And we wont' really have that much solved. ;__; |
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2010-04-14, 01:07 | Link #8022 | ||||||
Maelstorm-Fenrir
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I'm going to propose something else. The 7th game, will be called. "Nightmare of the Golden Witch" It would fit Bern perfectly. |
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2010-04-14, 01:11 | Link #8023 | ||
Dea ex Kakera
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Sea of Fragments
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If you assume both that Eva is innocent and that Nanjo can't climb out the second floor window, you get to a fairly weird place, theory-wise. It would mean that he could only escape the guesthouse through a first floor window. Note that since it is impossible to ascend to the second floor from the inside without passing through the lounge, no path exists between this window and the second floor that can be safely used when people are in the lounge. I'll make a couple more initial assumptions:
Nanjo could have snuck out a first floor window while Eva was out, but she was only gone for a few minutes at most. That isn't enough time for Nanjo to follow Krauss and Natsuhi to the arbor, strangle them, and return to the guesthouse before Eva returned to the lounge. After that point, she remained in the lounge until Jessica and Battler came looking for George, at which point Nanjo evidently came downstairs. Even though he could have snuck out, there would be no way for him to get back inside and up to his room without alerting Eva. Since he couldn't have committed any crimes, there's no reason for him to lock the windows and lie about it unless he was conspiring with Natsuhi, Krauss, or George. With Nanjo eliminated, the only people who could have killed Natsuhi and Krauss are George, Hideyoshi, and Kyrie. Hideyoshi and Kyrie were both staked in lethal locations and there are no trick stakes, so they can't be faking and must have mortal wounds at the very least. It's highly unlikely that they'd be able to go out in the storm, overpower two people by strangling, and drag them to the arbor in that condition, so we can probably eliminate them as suspects. That leaves only George as a potential murderer. According to Battler, he left the cousins' room to make coffee sometime between 4:00 and 5:00, but the magic scenes claimed that George flew out the window around 5:45. This is roughly the same time that Krauss and Natsuhi disappeared, so it's possible that they saw George leaving and followed him or vice versa. It is odd that they would leave without informing Eva, but we could speculate about various motives, so the possibility can't be ruled out. So according to this logic, George murdered Natsuhi and Krauss, then went to the mansion and was murdered by Kyrie or Hideyoshi. It all happened in the space of about 15-25 minutes, which is how long it took Battler's group to arrive at the mansion. Also, only George could have staked Natsuhi and Krauss, but he has an ironclad alibi (Battler) for the earlier stakings, so there must still be another staker. |
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2010-04-14, 01:13 | Link #8025 | ||
Maelstorm-Fenrir
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I don't think Ep7 will give us an answer. I think it will gives us more clues. I'm pretty sure Bern is just going to show us the horrible side of everyone or at least people who we haven't seen that side yet. Unless he has changed what he wants to do with Umineko I don't think that will happen. He wants the reader themself to figure it out. We he feels a good amount of people have finally got it, he will not make any more eps. Quote:
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2010-04-14, 01:26 | Link #8027 | ||
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Buffer overflow
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2010-04-14, 01:31 | Link #8028 |
BUY MY BOOK!!!
Join Date: May 2009
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8 episodes seems probable. It would be a bit odd to have 4 arcs in 3 and more in 4. It's not that it's impossible or new for him or anything, but it seems to fit thematically. Also, the pacing of things do seem to be forcing things to a climax in 7 and then probably to some sort of resolution in 8.
Also, to clarify what chrontrig said: If you look in the ep5/6 extracted images, he's renamed everything that was 1-4 to 5-8. The amusing thing is that anything labeled 7-8 in ep6 is just leftover ep3-4 stuff not yet overwritten, so you have the summary for Alliance labeled "ep8." That certainly seems like a hint to me! Unless there'll be a When They Cry 5... EDIT: Oh, and in a somewhat funny display of general laziness, if you look at the Character TIPS in ep5, anyone who doesn't die in ep5 still has the "death portraits" from ep4, even though you can't actually see them. |
2010-04-14, 01:36 | Link #8029 | |||
Maelstorm-Fenrir
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2010-04-14, 01:44 | Link #8030 | |
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Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Buffer overflow
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2010-04-14, 01:48 | Link #8031 | |
Maelstorm-Fenrir
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2010-04-14, 02:15 | Link #8032 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2010
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Of course...doesn't this mean that Beatrice, the third personality, counts as a human as well, and there's now too many on the island? |
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2010-04-14, 02:21 | Link #8033 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Meta-Meta-Meta-Space
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The English translation is not set in stone that 人間 == humans and 人 == people, but I think you catch the drift. So it was stated that 'even if you welcome (include) Erika, there are 17人' Two lines from EP6: - そなたを迎えても、 - 17人だ。 So the Shkannon theory gets around this by saying that Sh+Kan+Anyone else still == 1 person. |
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2010-04-14, 02:55 | Link #8034 | |
Maelstorm-Fenrir
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How do you kill a personality, it never existed in the first place, it was all in your head... So technically it could also return whenever Shanon wants it to. The Kanon persona could come back after when they are in the servants room in ep 2 after it has been said. Kanon is dead. So does that mean that is what 'demon Kanon' was, just Shannon going mental in front of them calling herself Kanon for a short while. XD Edit my new theory for ep2. During the servant room scene. Shannon went mental and killed Nanjo and Kumasawa while claiming to be Kanon. Gohda and Genji made up this story about a 'demon Kanon' because they don't want anyone to think Shannon did it on purpose. |
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2010-04-14, 03:07 | Link #8035 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: HK, China
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From LyricalAura's analysis on the death of Krauss and Natsuhi in Ep3:
.... If Eva's telling the truth, she only left Natsuhi and Krauss alone for a couple minutes to wash her face ... You had this additional assumption as well.
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2010-04-14, 03:26 | Link #8037 | |
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At least, this is how the theory goes. There's a section from EP6 about pieces, translated here.
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Last edited by chronotrig; 2010-04-14 at 03:38. |
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2010-04-14, 05:18 | Link #8038 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: HK, China
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And once the vessal is destoryed, it cannot be resurrected. What was Kanon's vessal? We knew that Sakutarou existed as a real stuffed animal. But Kanon in your theory was an "imagination" or intangible "identity"? The analogy does not carry well.
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2010-04-14, 11:17 | Link #8039 | |
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Join Date: Sep 2007
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Also, Kanon exists as more than just an idea in Sayo's head. It's also a personality that many people know and consider to be a separate person. So, what are the most obvious conditions for the character "Kanon's" death? When the people who think he exists believe he is dead. In other words, when Sayo stages his death and decides to 'remove him from the game board'. That's what it means for Kanon's vessel to be destroyed. And, as Ange said, a piece can be revived even after its vessel is destroyed as long as the conditions for that piece's existence are satisfied again. However, that doesn't mean it's easy for Sayo to satisfy those conditions.
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Last edited by chronotrig; 2010-04-14 at 11:32. |
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2010-04-14, 16:00 | Link #8040 | |
Endless Witch-Doctor
Join Date: Mar 2010
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So let's bring this back to 07151129. George is the recipient of the message. George was also killed by Kyrie. So we could say that Kyrie wrote the message to lure George into the parlor and get killed. "If you say it, a small Golden Land will be opened" What is a Golden Land? If it's like the epitaph says, where the souls of all the dead and even the lost love are resurrected, then maybe that would make George think Shannon would come back to life. So how did George know the message means "Golden Land"? |
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