[Manga] Chapter 458 Discussion

[Hunter]

Welcome to the weekly manga chapter discussion thread. This thread is created early to discuss spoilers and speculation about the upcoming chapter.

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[itachi29al]

Spoiler for Confimered spoiler:

Source: NF
Verification: Confirmed
Credits: Stream

Yamato on the cover

Those who created the mercenary organization called Akatsuki were advisors of different countries. They were making money (earth kage).
They stopped that, and it is unknown what they are doing now (5th mizukage)
(It's the fault of the 4th mizukage... Here, the 5th reveals the 4th was likely manipulated by someone)
The sand tried to use Akatsuki to destroy Konoha (Gaara's father)
The hokage says they are sure talking a lot (Danzou's shutting up)
The Raikage gets angry at the others kage
Those that could control bijuus were Madara, the first Hokage, the fourth Mizukage, and Killer Bee.

The neutral country gives an idea:
How about an alliance of the five countries?
With the hokage, whose country still has the bijuu as supreme commander?
The Raikage says "what!?" and it stops there.

We see the face of the 4th mizukage (nice man) when they talk of people able to control bijuus. Wasn't that supposed to be Tobi? At least Kisame said so (didn't say it was the 4th though, might have been the 3rd)

Spoiler for a differen version to the same:

A simple spoiler to start with
The spine has Yamato ><

The ones who made up the mercenary force called Akatsuki were advisors of many countries
The Tsuchikage used the Akatsuki to make money
The Godaime Mizukage interferes, saying her country has no knowledge of this since they're isolated
(This is the Yondaime Mizukage's fault... That is, the Godaime reveals that it is possible the Yondaime has been manipulating someone)
Suna planned the Konoha Crash using the Akatsuki (Well, Gaara's father did)
The Hokage is sceptic, questioning whether they should interfere with these advisors (Danzou is silent¹)
The Raikage vents his anger towards the other Kage
Those able to control the Bijuu: Madara, the Shodai Hokage, the Yondaime Mizukage, Killer Bee

Then the neutral power states their opinion
How about making an alliance of the Five Countries?
Then the Hokage, whose country still has its Bijuu, will take supreme command (since there's no hope for the rest). What do you think?
upon hearing that, the Raikage ask "What the hell!?"

And it ends with this　

the Yondaime Mizukage's face is revealed (a gentle man), but (with the Bijuu controlling story) the Tobi = the Yondaime Mizukage things seems to still be okay (since Kisame called him the former Mizukage-sama)

¹ This could also mean that he refuses to explain himself

wow, just a lot of talkin

[lonewolf777]

Originally Posted by itachi29al

Spoiler for Confimered spoiler:

Source: NF
Verification: Confirmed
Credits: Stream

Yamato on the cover

Those who created the mercenary organization called Akatsuki were advisors of different countries. They were making money (earth kage).
They stopped that, and it is unknown what they are doing now (5th mizukage)
(It's the fault of the 4th mizukage... Here, the 5th reveals the 4th was likely manipulated by someone)
The sand tried to use Akatsuki to destroy Konoha (Gaara's father)
The hokage says they are sure talking a lot (Danzou's shutting up)
The Raikage gets angry at the others kage
Those that could control bijuus were Madara, the first Hokage, the fourth Mizukage, and Killer Bee.

The neutral country gives an idea:
How about an alliance of the five countries?
With the hokage, whose country still has the bijuu as supreme commander?
The Raikage says "what!?" and it stops there.

We see the face of the 4th mizukage (nice man) when they talk of people able to control bijuus. Wasn't that supposed to be Tobi? At least Kisame said so (didn't say it was the 4th though, might have been the 3rd)

Well, I doubt as Mizukage, Madara would look like himself. Or, maybe, based on what Godaime Mizukage said, maybe he was just controlling the 4th to such an extent that Kisame would call them one and the same. Maybe Mizukage knows more about Madara than she's putting on, and isn't indulging the details in the interest of her country?

[james0246]

Interesting. So are the Kage talking about Madara's Akatsuki when they descibe them as being "advisors" or are they still talking about Pain/Nagato's Akatsuki?

Also, it is nice to know that others could control the Bijuu, even if it is unclear how they did it (was the 4th Mizukage Madara? Does Kirabi control the Bujuu independent of him being a Jinchuuriki?).

[Vindi89]

Originally Posted by james0246

Interesting. So are the Kage talking about Madara's Akatsuki when they descibe them as being "advisors" or are they still talking about Pain/Nagato's Akatsuki?

Also, it is nice to know that others could control the Bijuu, even if it is unclear how they did it (was the 4th Mizukage Madara? Does Kirabi control the Bujuu independent of him being a Jinchuuriki?).

That may actually explain his good relations with the bijuu within if he was somehow able to manipulate it's feelings towards him.

[X_Danny_X]

what is up with Kishi and th Sharingan, in every arc, there has been a new character popping up with them or pwning someone with it.

now Danzou has one and somewhat looking to restore his old self, i wonder if its to get his other Sharingan eye, wouldn't surprise.

this chapter went like i expected, alot of talk.

[james0246]

Originally Posted by Vindi89

That may actually explain his good relations with the bijuu within if he was somehow able to manipulate it's feelings towards him.

That's what I was thinking. This could very well be the reason that Kirabi was chosen to be a Jinchuuriki.

Whatever the case, I think this will probably be the death bell for those hoping for Kirabi to teach Naruto how to utilize his Bijuu. If the power is somehow unique to Kirabi, then it probably can't be taught, or if it is a power unique to a Jinchuuriki of the Hachibi, then it probably cannot be learned. Either way, this route does not appear to be the way for Naruto to gain control of his inner beast.

[Cub-Sama]

This spoiler just pushes the 4th Mizukage = Madara since all the facts fit together:
The graduation exam of blood mist is similar to the requirements to get the mangekyou sharingan
Madara was known to Kisame as the former mizukage meaning that Madara was either a retired Mizukage or the Mizukage during the time of the Seven Ninja Swordsmen of Blood Mist
Due to the Fourth Mizukage's ways Kirigakure is a bit isolated (similar to how the Uchiha were isolated due to Madara)
People with bloodlines were wiped out and since Madara has the sharingan he might of ordered this hoping there would be no one else with a bloodline that could stop him like the First did using his Mokuton
Strong and ruthless army that could not be beaten easily similar to the Uchihas

[Phenomenal]

Originally Posted by itachi29al

wow, just a lot of talkin

At least it is relevant and it moves the plot even more.

[james0246]

Originally Posted by Phenomenal

At least it is relevant and it moves the plot even more.

...and there is no one begging and crying on the floor/ground...yet. (I can just see Naruto jumping into the discussion next chapter, yelling and screaming, and then falling to the ground and asking to lick the Raikage's shoes all the while saying that "Violence is bad, Mmkay.")

[AddiKtioNn-BlaCk]

Whew!
Other people can control Bijuu's too.
That rules out Naruto getting a sharingan to control his. Doesn't mean Kishi doesn't give him one anyway.
Killerbee is going to teach how to control it, i bet you.

[james0246]

Originally Posted by AddiKtioNn-BlaCk

Whew!
Other people can control Bijuu's too.
That rules out Naruto getting a sharingan to control his. Doesn't mean Kishi doesn't give him one anyway.
Killerbee is going to teach how to control it, i bet you.

Except, since Yugito never had any real control over her's, and she lived for near 30 years in the same village as Kirabi, it seems unlikely that the skill could have been taught, or else why wouldn't Kirabi have taught Yugito?

[JustRob]

Originally Posted by james0246

Except, since Yugito never had any real control over her's, and she lived for near 30 years in the same village as Kirabi, it seems unlikely that the skill could have been taught, or else why wouldn't Kirabi have taught Yugito?

Do we know Yugito couldn't control her bijuu?

[Cub-Sama]

Originally Posted by james0246

Except, since Yugito never had any real control over her's, and she lived for near 30 years in the same village as Kirabi, it seems unlikely that the skill could have been taught, or else why wouldn't Kirabi have taught Yugito?

Did you notice how she could go 2 tails on will and still retain control the only person with no real control so far over their bijuu is Naruto and that is because his bijuu has the most chakra, intelligence and pride.

[lonewolf777]

Originally Posted by Cub-Sama

Did you notice how she could go 2 tails on will and still retain control the only person with no real control so far over their bijuu is Naruto and that is because his bijuu has the most chakra, intelligence and pride.

Except when he says 'Stupid fox, give me some of your chakra!'

[james0246]

@JustRob and Cyb: She turned into a miniture 2-Tails, not the full 2-Tails (this was all revealed in the data book, mind you, not the manga). In other words, she was using a Bijuu Shroud (like Gaara, Naruto, and Kirabi). But, you are correct that she "let the cat out" (so to say), but she was stated as having control over the chakra itself (somehow...maybe this wis what Kirabi taught her? If it is, I stand corrected.). Whatever the case, she did not have complete control over the actual 2-Tail like Kirabi has been shown to posses.

In regards to this chapter, just how bad are these Kage or these Samurai that they do not notice Sasuke and the gang (who appear to be listening in on everything)? I can understand Zetsu and partially Karin, but Juugo, Suigetsu and Sasuke?

[lonewolf777]

Originally Posted by james0246

In regards to this chapter, just how bad are these Kage or these Samurai that they do not notice Sasuke and the gang (who appear to be listening in on everything)? I can understand Zetsu and partially Karin, but Juugo, Suigetsu and Sasuke?

I was wondering the same thing at the end of last chapter; I find it hard to believe that they don't notice. Maybe they know and that's why they didn't (unless the spoilers missed something) say anything about Sasuke specifically, and will take impending action against them any minute.

[JustRob]

Originally Posted by james0246

@JustRob and Cyb: She turned into a miniture 2-Tails, not the full 2-Tails (this was all revealed in the data book, mind you, not the manga). In other words, she was using a Bijuu Shroud (like Gaara, Naruto, and Kirabi). But, you are correct that she "let the cat out" (so to say), but she was stated as having control over the chakra itself (somehow...maybe this wis what Kirabi taught her? If it is, I stand corrected.). Whatever the case, she did not have complete control over the actual 2-Tail like Kirabi has been shown to posses.

In regards to this chapter, just how bad are these Kage or these Samurai that they do not notice Sasuke and the gang (who appear to be listening in on everything)? I can understand Zetsu and partially Karin, but Juugo, Suigetsu and Sasuke?

Then he could still teach Naruto something. Naruto can control up to three tails, with some tips and training he might be able to master four tails or more and keep control. Imagine how sweet that would be.

Also, yeah I think the Kages already know. But you know Kishi loves his lil boy Sasuke, so you never know. And it's a manga, it doesn't have to make sense. However I think they already know and in two or three chapters, hell is gonna break loose.

[Rahan]

Actually, the databook says she can control her transformation into the cat at will thanks to her harsh training.

I don't see how it's different from what we saw of Bee.

[Phenomenal]

Originally Posted by james0246

...and there is no one begging and crying on the floor/ground...yet. (I can just see Naruto jumping into the discussion next chapter, yelling and screaming, and then falling to the ground and asking to lick the Raikage's shoes all the while saying that "Violence is bad, Mmkay.")

Well that's more believable then crashin in and screaming "JOIN MY NAKAMA" in a race for peace and then Rakaige saying "YEAH SURE, WHY NOT." Not gonna happen, The characters in Naruto actually have alot of depth, motivation and intellgience than that [As we saw last chapter]. Naruto's approach was respectable and it made sense.

And I totally beleive that Naruto won't be doing what you assume he will be doing.