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View Poll Results: Penguin Drum - Episode 20 Rating | |||
Perfect 10 | 30 | 46.15% | |
9 out of 10 : Excellent | 24 | 36.92% | |
8 out of 10 : Very Good | 6 | 9.23% | |
7 out of 10 : Good | 2 | 3.08% | |
6 out of 10 : Average | 0 | 0% | |
5 out of 10 : Below Average | 0 | 0% | |
4 out of 10 : Poor | 2 | 3.08% | |
3 out of 10 : Bad | 1 | 1.54% | |
2 out of 10 : Very Bad | 0 | 0% | |
1 out of 10 : Painful | 0 | 0% | |
Voters: 65. You may not vote on this poll |
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2011-11-27, 12:02 | Link #101 |
Cross Game - I need more
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: I've moved around the American West. I've lived in Oregon, Washington, Utah, and Oklahoma
Age: 44
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Poor Ron Paul, everyone just pretends he doesn't exist. Yeah. I actually almost mentioned Ron Paul. Unfortunately his positions on a lot of other issues make him a less attractive candidate. Primarily his foreign policy views. Not so much his desire to avoid war, as much as that he is isolationist. Many Tea Party members actually would like to pursue isolation- from an emotional stand point. But the practical concern is that if the US was to abandon it's treaty obligations... well what would that do to world stability? I think a lot of Tea Party members feel this would probably result in a worse world than the current one. They see America as the reluctant hero who keeps bad things from happening, but really wishes he could just go home. Therefor Ron Paul is likely to pick up a lot of Tea Party support, but people just feel worried about actually making him President.
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2011-11-27, 18:54 | Link #102 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2007
Age: 35
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Well, mentioning the scarcity of jobs and the plight of young people in finding employment the world over is really good, I think. I said it just a bit earlier, but Japan's been a deflationary economy for two decades, right? That was the second largest economy in the world (still the third). And they're still in that slump. In my view Japan really has always been a leading indicator. Their economic troubles have been a precursor to what the rest of this world will inevitably have to learn, about the natural structural limitations on what we call "growth", that exist in our reality. (Well, on just a personal note, that's also why I find Japan so interesting. Precisely because of that backdrop, that environment, fascinating new things can occur. Economic growth and survival is about creating value--human value. Specifically, the extraordinary successes that companies like SHAFT and Nintendo have achieved with relatively limited resources is something I find truly fascinating. Now those are some "Survival Strategies" right there.) To come specifically to the concept of the "chosen" and "unchosen". In a general sense, the context of life and death: those words carry the connotation of your fate being directly in someone else's hands. lol, sounds terrible, doesn't it. That's why, to believe that you are either one of them is pure complacency, imo. I don't believe in the "chosen", really; every truly successful person has struggled his damnedest to get where they are. Well, in the same way, I guess, to decide for yourself that someone else is "chosen" or "unchosen" might be, I think, to take away something precious. Kenzan talks about a "frozen world". If such a thing exists, that might really be a world of "Fate", of unchanging truths, wouldn't it. But if he himself is standing up to fight against it, how is it his place to decide for others that they are "unchosen" for themselves? Alternatively, if Kenzan believes that he has been "chosen" to save the unchosen rest of the world, then, perhaps, what are his actions in the end except pushing his arrogance onto everyone else. Going back to the politics, I think believing that being "chosen" is even possible is a fallacy in itself. Think back to the example of Japan. Fortune and prosperity now is not any guarantor of happiness in the future. The only true form of success that exists is that which you can grasp with your own hands by your own effort and ability. If now the entire global economy is stalling, then being "chosen" by Harvard or Wall Street is not any guarantee of security. Giants you thought could never fall, may very well fall, and fall hard. There is no such thing as "safety", so you must live, being prepared for inescapable sacrifice. Insofar as "chosen" and "unchosen" in this story refer to a belief in or reliance on "Fate", I do think that this story will move towards scrapping such ideas altogether. However, there is one more side to the coin of the "chosen" and "unchosen" story. That is, when you make choices for yourself, and are also chosen and accepted in return by someone else. This pertains specifically to romance. That is the miracle of mutual love. I think someone posted some translated tweets or something earlier, that this is indeed one of the themes Ikuhara wants to portray in this story. Last edited by Sol Falling; 2011-11-27 at 19:12. |
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2011-11-27, 20:02 | Link #103 | ||
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
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Anyway, I can see that on one hand we have various example of people who have lost hope and their self-worth. You could say they decided they were "unchosen" on their own, which in itself highlights the fallacy in such belief. Examples of this are Tabuki, Yuri, and also Himari. Now, by saving little Himari, Shouma sort of validates her misguided point of view. He "chooses" her, and so she ends up ascribing her entire self-worth to him. I think that’s why she tells Sanetoshi she doesn't want to “chase”. She knows if she does, there’s a chance she won’t get the "fruit". Basically, she knows that if she chases after Shouma, there’s chance she might lose him, and she’s dead afraid of that because Shouma’s the only thing that gives meaning to her life. It’s interesting how Ringo provides a very stark contrast to Himari’s misguided logic. Shouma risked his life for Ringo, but it’s not like she was “chosen” or anything. Yet this experience alone inspired her to pull herself together and become stronger on her own. Unlike Himari, Ringo, as she is now, doesn't need external validation, she’s her own person, or to use your own words: her fate is in her own hands. She might decide to chase after Shouma (maybe she's already doing it) but if he doesn't "choose" her, she will do as she said: "accept that fate and become stronger". Now, in now way "accepting fate" means no to fight for what you want. This is clear to me now. But if you do fight, there's alway only two possible outcomes: you either win or lose. If you lose, "accepting fate" means not being a sore loser, but rather use the experience to "become stronger". On that context, being "chosen" (romantically speaking) might be a miracle, but only provided you are already your own person. Otherwise we're in Tabuki (and possibly Himari) territory all over again.
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2011-11-27, 21:19 | Link #104 |
On a mission
Author
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I'm confused lol. But it was a fun watch, and the factory of ragequit always makes me laugh so 8/10.
It was a nice theme to pick of being chosen and not chosen. It is by some twist of fate that some of us are fortunate to be here, while many less fortunate may not have had the chance. This goes along with the show's concept of "destiny". A lot of things in life are simply out of your control that determine who you are. One man's treasure is another man's trash. Sometimes strangers to you may be just mere generic "lowlifes that will never amount to anything" but if they're someone you know and care about it completely changes. In any case, this family is "fake". Does it really matter though. Is this relationship simply determined by cut and dry issues like genetics, or is the concept and feelings something far more important than the definition would have us believe?
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2011-11-28, 07:27 | Link #105 |
Guess what time it is?
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada
Age: 38
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I think I just crossed the Lewis Black Threshold, which I would like to define as that moment in an Ikuhara show when you take stock of where you are, and just hear Lewis' voice in your head saying "Fuck, I don't have enough bread crumbs to get home."
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2011-11-28, 07:46 | Link #106 | |
✘˵╹◡╹˶✘
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Australia
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Everyone always believe more or less in luck, fate,being chosen. Some may think their love life driven by fate (dreaming of meeting their "chosen one"), others may believe their whole existence was chosen to carry out one deed (positively: devote whole life for social development works; negatively: become a terrorist or mass-murderer). Criticising the whole belief is like grouping someone dreaming to win lottery (being chosen by luck) to be no different with cult leaders, pyscho murderer. Or in this case, a kid dreaming on being chosen to live a happy life (with a loved one, with a family), with a (slightly) maniac who believed he is chosen to carry out world justice That's my first complain, at your unparalleled comparison. My second complain is how you state the mentioned belief "a misguided logic". Isn't it simply is just a case of determinism here? Hence I really can't understand the ground for your statement, other than if you are a total libertarian
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Last edited by risingstar3110; 2011-11-28 at 08:04. |
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2011-11-28, 17:05 | Link #107 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
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Eh... Himari is a fictional character. Why would I waste my time "criticising" her "decisions" and "actions" if they are merely a tool to highlight certain themes? I'm just trying to figure out those themes. You're taking this way too seriously. If you don't like my posts don't read them. I'm sure there's an ignore list or something you can use.
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Last edited by Kazu-kun; 2011-11-28 at 19:19. |
2011-11-29, 17:47 | Link #109 | |
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Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Australia
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The debate over a fictional character will reflect your own belief/value over certain issues, that's why we took it so serious, isn't it? There's no contest here to win
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2011-12-01, 06:29 | Link #112 |
is this so?
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Gradius Home World
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Watched this episode today, and I was literally moved to tears on Shouma and Himari's encounter when they were still children.
The touching drama scenes (Himari x Shouma), as well as the disturbing scene of children going to be cooked and cat being squashed would haunt my mind for sometime..
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Last edited by Liddo-kun; 2011-12-01 at 07:32. |
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