Driving (and discussion concerning driving)

[Paladinoras]

Originally Posted by mg1942

More on Nissan vs Porsche technological supremacy...

Spoiler for :

Exclusive: Nissan officially slams Porsche cheat claim



Will show tyres and video as evidence, offers Porsche driving tips

Nissan is standing firm on its claim to the production car lap record at the Nurburgring despite a blistering attack from Porsche.

And it has the tyres to prove it.

The German sports car maker accused Nissan of using special semi-race tyres when it set the Nurburgring benchmark at 7 minutes 29 seconds in April but the Japanese company is now going public with the actual Dunlop SP Sport 600 DSST CTT tyres used for the hot lap.

It is also offering video footage shot by the Japanese magazine 'Best Motoring" during the high-speed runs.

Nissan has also questioned the preparation of the customer GT-R used by Porsche for its in-house testing last month, where it claimed it could not get within 25 seconds of the Nissan time and that its 911 GT2 and Turbo were both quicker.

And, in a back-handed slap at Porsche, it has offered driving tips for anyone trying to get the best from a GT-R.

The man who led development of the Nissan supercar, chief engineer, Kazutoshi Mizuno, says the lap record car is a regular production GT-R.

“Testing a car with specialized parts such as unique tires or suspension has no meaning for us. The GT-R was designed from the start to be a supercar that could be driven anywhere, anytime and by anyone. For us, testing the car in standard production specification is far more relevant than creating a one-off vehicle that our customers cannot buy," Mizuno says.

Nissan has taken nearly a week to assemble the evidence it says clearly refutes the Porsche claims.

It has even offered to show the actual tyres from the record run, which were taken back by Sumitomo in Japan for promotional work, to prove they are identical to the rubber fitted to production cars.

"It is clear that there are some important facts that were not accurately represented," Nissan says in its official press release on the Porsche claims.

It states that the record run, by former F1 driver Toshio Suzuki, was even compromised by carrying around 50 kilograms of data logging equipment supplied by Marelli and camera equipment.

Without attacking Porsche directly, it has also questioned everything from the tyres on the customer car its rival used to its preparation and the skill of the driver - who Porsche describes as one of its chassis test engineers.

Nissan says there are two types of tyre fitted to the GT-R, and the clear inference from its reference to the Bridgestone Potenza RE070R is that these were fitted to the Porsche-run GT-R and not as quick on a track as the Dunlops it uses.

It has also indirectly questioned the preparation of Porsche's car by referring to the run-in and service procedure, as well as the special technique for driving the all-wheel drive supercar.

"We are aware that several auto makers have purchased the GT-R for their own testing and evaluation. Like all GT-R customers, we recommend that any auto maker buying a GT-R should follow the recommended run-in procedures, service schedules and maintenance to ensure the maximum performance from their car," Nissan says.

"In addition, we offer performance driving courses for prospective and current GT-R owners to help them get the best performance from their car. We would welcome the opportunity to help any auto manufacturer with understanding the full capabilities of the GT-R."

Nissan has gone into great detail on its work with the GT-R at the Nurburgring, including documenting its various track tests earlier this year and the method - the same one used by Sport Auto Magazine in Germany - it used to time the car.

And Mizuno even says the Nurburgring lap record was not the prime objective of the GT-R program.

“We have used circuits like the Nurburgring and Sendai extensively during the development of the GT-R. The fastest lap-time was never the objective but a simple parameter for us to measure the GT-R in a consistent way against other world class supercars," he says.

http://carsguide.news.com.au/site/mo...eat_claim_gtr/

LOL! Porsche is whining like a little child that the GT-R beat the living crap out of it's cars!!

HAHA! JAPANESE SUPERCARS FTW!!!

And, yeah I am biased, I love the GTR so much!!! R32 to the current GTR!

[Zoned87]

As far as super cars go ive always prefered the Corvette

[FLCL]

corvettes arent super cars at all what are you smoking

theyre just v8s in lighter bodies. most without significant work cant handle for dog crap

by your definition a supra is a super car...hardly.

[mg1942]

Originally Posted by FLCL

corvettes arent super cars at all what are you smoking

theyre just v8s in lighter bodies. most without significant work cant handle for dog crap

by your definition a supra is a super car...hardly.

Ever heard of 'super car' for the masses?

Corvettes, Vipers, and 1990s era high performance JDM (A-class) are super cars for the masses.

[FLCL]

the stock corvette is hardly a super car, c4s and c5s are around 300 horsepower...todays economy car in some variants is close to that.

i will give chevy this, theyve gotten a hint and are making a real push, took guts to scrap the shitty cavalier and make some very good stuff like the cobalt ss etc. they need to hire a designr though, theyre cars are still ugly as sin.

super cars for the masses...no....sports cars? yes.

im thinking of buying a 2000ish porsche boxster in a few years....turbo time

[Honda Boy Techy]

Don't care for the boxster at all. But the corvette ZR1 when it comes out is gonna be a beast.

I find it funny that Porsche was whining cause I believe both he ZR1 and that special version of the Dodge Viper both beat the GTR didn't they.

[FLCL]

the main allure of the boxster is its cheap price, very low weight, and incredible boost sensitive MR engine.

you can get one for around 10k these days

[MidnightViper88]

Pfft, Boxters are still 'verts...Give the Cayman about 5 years and then you'll see an affordable sports car that's truer on performance...

In either case about the Porsche whining, yeah, I mentioned it earlier, in terms of 'Ring times, GT-R < ZR-1 and ACR > ZR-1, so I don't think Porsche tried hard enough...

[Phantom-Takaya]

Maybe Porsche just doesn't have anything this time around. There's always next time.

[Max Thrillington]

Originally Posted by Phantom-Takaya

Ohh. Yes, I blew my tranny as well, but it wasn't stock. I had a stage 6 clutch and everything. It just comes to show that too much power to the engine coupled with frequent cornering does not bode well on the transmission.

Other than that, it lasted quite a long time before I started getting interested with drifting. With the turbos and supercharger working together, there wasn't much of an obvious boost lag since both covered both sides of the spectrum.

With the car's current setup, I haven't had any real problems, especially with the turbos and supercharger now gone. I also retuned the suspensions and transmission just to be sure. With the new billet pistons (with rings), sleeving, camshafts and rods in the new port and polished engine, I'm sure it'll last even longer than the last K.

just curious what kind of engine management you're using.

[FLCL]

ok sorry, if your twincharged, why have i never seen anything about it on hondatech...i hate to do this, but im calling your bluff...what engine management are you using like the above. to my knowledge most of the honda standalones are not programable for maps using both together.

I hate to say it...but do you know how FI works?

[FLCL]

ok sorry, if your twincharged, why have i never seen anything about it on hondatech...i hate to do this, but im calling your bluff...what engine management are you using like the above. to my knowledge most of the honda standalones are not programable for maps using both together.

I hate to say it...but do you know how FI works?

[Phantom-Takaya]

Originally Posted by Max Thrillington

just curious what kind of engine management you're using.

Originally Posted by FLCL

ok sorry, if your twincharged, why have i never seen anything about it on hondatech...i hate to do this, but im calling your bluff...what engine management are you using like the above. to my knowledge most of the honda standalones are not programable for maps using both together.

I hate to say it...but do you know how FI works?

FLCL, you double-posted, dude.

Engine management would be Greddy, though I'm not going into specifics since it took a lot of careful planning and research to do it. And the reason it's not on hondatech is because I've never bothered to say anything about it, and I still don't, in there, as you can tell. Granted, I did learn a few things from hondatech, though I had to learn quite a bit on my own and the Helm Inc (and Chilton) service manual. But, to be honest, I credit most of the work to my mechanic. There was a limit to what I could do, much less have the tools to do so. He was the one that steered me into really doing it, though it took him a few years to do so, and advised me how things generally worked and what to buy. Other than buying a little over $10,000 in parts, I know I spent a few thousand dollars sending the ECU to Hondata a few times ... and lots of waiting. So, having understood how the ECU and e-management worked over the years, I can only guess that the reason things took a long time and that I spent so much sending the ECU to Hondata was because he was doing it through trail and error, which really doesn't surprise me.

When I was pretty new to everything, the first things I put in were the exhaust system, catalytic converter, downpipe, headers and air intake. That's how I met my mechanic. The air intake was no problem, but I had hit a snag with the others. I knew how to put them on, but I didn't have the tools to do so. So, after searching around, I eventually went through who he used to be working for, meeting him in the process. Of course, due to company liability reasons, he couldn't let me help him, which changed after he left the company. After the parts swap, he talked to me about turbos and other parts that I could modify or add later on. At that time, I said, "I'll think about it." He also talked to me about some cars he and his son had worked on - which were pretty wild stuff - back in Minnesota. About several weeks later, I considered buying fuel injectors and the fuel rail, and of course a fuel management system. So, I asked him for advice before I threw some money around. As I recall, one of the things he asked me was about whether or not I would get turbos and/or superchargers in the future. Again, I said that I wasn't sure and maybe. I couldn't really say, but I would assume that's where he started setting my engine up for it. It eventually led to him suggesting about the twinturbo system,. Though, from the stories he told me about he and his son, I think he was more interested in the challenge of doing things that people don't typically do to cars. But before I get carried away with the story of the past...

As for FI, I'm assuming you're referring to fuel injectors, which, again, I had spoken with my mechanic before ordering them. And yes, I'm aware of how that plays a factor with the whole system, though that's not the only part that plays a factor.

So, you can think of this as a bluff, if you'd like, but that's the truth of it.

[Max Thrillington]

why a piggy-back fuel management? You converted your car to RWD, twincharged.. and you skimped on engine management for a piggy-back on a ROM tuned ECU?

That don't make any sense.

and FI = Forced Induction.

[FLCL]

Originally Posted by Max Thrillington

why a piggy-back fuel management? You converted your car to RWD, twincharged.. and you skimped on engine management for a piggy-back on a ROM tuned ECU?

That don't make any sense.

and FI = Forced Induction.

x2

FI=fuel injectors LOLOLOLOLOL

sorry but my respect level just took a PLUNGE.

I mean if your looking for a way to quick spool a big turbo, may i point @ the 100 dollar jesus known as 35 shots of Nitrous.

for the same price you couldve gotten a S2k, turbo parts, decent EFI management and kicked ass.

[Ryougi Shiki]

Recently I got a 500 dollar speeding ticket.

It was my first one, I've been driving for a while.

I was speeding about 10 mph over the 55 mph speed limit, which no one cares about. People in this area go 90 mph and never get anything done about it.

but then as soon as I passed the "Change to 35" sign and I was slowing down (hadn't slowed down completely yet) a cop car pulls me over. And says I was doing 65 in a 35. This is true, but he didn't have to pull me over the moment I passed the sign - it's my fault, and I should have slowed down a little bit earlier, but...

At least I don't need a car around here. I can just take the bus from my dorm.

[mg1942]

What kind of of car do you have? If you have a modded sleeper car like the Lexus SC series they might leave you alone.

[Phantom-Takaya]

Originally Posted by Max Thrillington

just curious what kind of engine management you're using.

Originally Posted by FLCL

x2

FI=fuel injectors LOLOLOLOLOL

sorry but my respect level just took a PLUNGE.

I mean if your looking for a way to quick spool a big turbo, may i point @ the 100 dollar jesus known as 35 shots of Nitrous.

for the same price you couldve gotten a S2k, turbo parts, decent EFI management and kicked ass.

Oh. Well, sorry for completely forgetting about force induction = FI. I don't do acronyms as you can tell. But that's fine. I'm not in it for the whole "respect" portion of it unless you're putting a dent on my car. And no, I don't really care for NOS. I've heard enough bad things about it that I'd stay away from it as much as I can. I can deal with getting injured and paying for thousands of dollars in accidents, but I don't want to have to deal with the higher risk of being roasted alive as well.

In either case, like I said, for now, I'm done with the whole setup. Being the fastest in a straight line is not that interesting to me anymore.

As for the S2000, in my point of view, the car is too "attractive" to people's eyes. Not at all what I want.

Originally Posted by Ryougi Shiki

Recently I got a 500 dollar speeding ticket.

It was my first one, I've been driving for a while.

I was speeding about 10 mph over the 55 mph speed limit, which no one cares about. People in this area go 90 mph and never get anything done about it.

but then as soon as I passed the "Change to 35" sign and I was slowing down (hadn't slowed down completely yet) a cop car pulls me over. And says I was doing 65 in a 35. This is true, but he didn't have to pull me over the moment I passed the sign - it's my fault, and I should have slowed down a little bit earlier, but...

At least I don't need a car around here. I can just take the bus from my dorm.

You can always contest it. From the amount of the fine, it sounds like he was ticketing you for going 30 miles (though I can be wrong) over the speed limit, so you can always plead that he clocked you when you had been able to visually read the sign and was proceeding to decelerate. Also, ask him to show you the locations that his speed gun clocked you at and to show you paperwork proving that the speed gun was in perfect working order that day. And also, make sure the citation code he gave you was correct down to the letter. Of course, you can always use that after trying this first: After appealing, you typically will get a court date in the mail. I don't know how much time they give you before having to go to court, but a week before the court date, ask for it to be rescheduled and make up a good excuse, then repeat. Keep doing this for as long as you can. Then try pleading your case. The reason why you should drag out the court date for as long as possible is because the officer will have to keep readjusting his schedule to meet the court date and he may eventually give up. The longer it takes, the less worthwhile it becomes for the officer. The only thing you can hope for is that when you finally decide to simply show up for court, it's not on the day that someone else had scheduled their court date that the same officer had ticketed.

[Max Thrillington]

nitrous oxide is a non-flammable oxidizer.

[Phantom-Takaya]

Originally Posted by Max Thrillington

nitrous oxide is a non-flammable oxidizer.

In the tank, which is its liquid state, yes. But once it leaves the vehicle in it's gaseous state, it becomes highly flammable, which is risky enough if it were to be ignited once it leaves the engine/vehicle during an accident. There's other factors, such as pressure, that can also affect the tank(s), itself(themselves).