Madan no Ou to Vanadis [Light Novel]

[ImperialFlameGod8190]

Originally Posted by borisdrakoni

Most harem series rely on the slow, gradual development of relations between characters to supplement the plot. Otherwise with everyone completely conquered within a couple of volumes there would be no more room for progression, and for something that could go to 10+ volumes depending on popularity it would be a death flag. The only series that really springs to mind with a successful carnivorous protagonist would be Hagure Yuusha no Aesthetica, but I think it does well because it's an exception rather than the rule. In Tigre's case, there are some very concrete reasons for him not pursuing any of the girls so far, mainly involving assassination, the threat of death, he could be killed, etc.

You're missing something else. The reason why Madan no Ou isn't an effective harem is two things.
First is the type of harem lead that Tigre is. He doesn't want a harem he just gets one by the stories set up Tigre wants peace not love he just gets love by the stories set-ups and doesn't even play the role of a harem lead.
Two. even if the girls have affections for him he hasn't shown favor to any one girl over the other and the affections seem mostly in gratitude for what happened. I mean seriously He's seen ludmira Ellen and Rim naked and his only reactions are sorry my bad and moves on. The girls have done everything to try to be number one but he doesn't even have one or want one

[EvI]

it's exacly how imperialflames said, it's not that he is littly by little getting all of them, it's just that he doesn't want them...he has the chance but he prefer to not do that, he prefers to hunt,sleep and chat just like a child...if this was yaoi i would undertand his desinterest in girls, but this is a harem series ,hell this is going into the infinite stratos route where the protagonist seems to not have even a little of sexual desire...sorry i really get irritated when something like this appears...

edit:by the way can someone tell me what is write in this illustration? http://www.baka-tsuki.org/project/in...is_V7_cl01.jpg

[borisdrakoni]

Originally Posted by ImperialFlameGod8190

You're missing something else. The reason why Madan no Ou isn't an effective harem is two things.
First is the type of harem lead that Tigre is. He doesn't want a harem he just gets one by the stories set up Tigre wants peace not love he just gets love by the stories set-ups and doesn't even play the role of a harem lead.
Two. even if the girls have affections for him he hasn't shown favor to any one girl over the other and the affections seem mostly in gratitude for what happened. I mean seriously He's seen ludmira Ellen and Rim naked and his only reactions are sorry my bad and moves on. The girls have done everything to try to be number one but he doesn't even have one or want one

Maybe from growing up with and constantly being around Teita he developed a certain immunity from typical romcom situations? It isn't as if he fails to react to those occurrences. The reaction just isn't as over the top as what we've come to expect if it were to happen to a different bunch of characters. Though I do happen to agree with you at least in part. From what we've seen so far Tigre has displayed little to no self-interest in terms of pursuing personal happiness, though the same can be said of all of the girls as well to at least a certain extent. On the other side of the spectrum you see the ones who are acting with personal selfishness in mind like Thenardier, Ganelon, Valentina, Jermaine, Elliot, and Tallard, but they're the ones stirring up all the current trouble.

[kampfer91]

At least he did considered what they think about him , unlike some certain useless main chars who did nothing but stupid thing and still get the girls .....

Tigre did some fantastic jobs and cared anyone who have helped him , that is why he earned both respect and may be love from the girls

[ImperialFlameGod8190]

Originally Posted by borisdrakoni

Maybe from growing up with and constantly being around Teita he developed a certain immunity from typical romcom situations? It isn't as if he fails to react to those occurrences. The reaction just isn't as over the top as what we've come to expect if it were to happen to a different bunch of characters. Though I do happen to agree with you at least in part. From what we've seen so far Tigre has displayed little to no self-interest in terms of pursuing personal happiness, though the same can be said of all of the girls as well to at least a certain extent. On the other side of the spectrum you see the ones who are acting with personal selfishness in mind like Thenardier, Ganelon, Valentina, Jermaine, Elliot, and Tallard, but they're the ones stirring up all the current trouble.

His reactions aren't over-the-top they are nonexistent he's surprised and then he leaves or ignores it completely. Speaking of IS I was on my facebook and I saw a funnymama it had Cecelia wearing a shirt that says Fuck me hard. and she asks ichika what he thinks of her and he's just confused I wish I could find it again found it
http://funnymama.com/post/200729 this is the link to that photo idk why its not working

[Leonardunitylim]

Originally Posted by Kleeyook

Madan is a mild case, since there are many capable male characters besides Tigre, both his side and enemies. But most of the badass characters are female, male like Roland got killed off, the rest are enemies.

IS, STnBD, Kenshin no Keishousha, Magika no Kenshi simply made sure all other male characters are weaker or downright pathetic compared to female just so that we could have harem setting, the first two examples are really horrible for male since even enemies are all female while the latter two still have a male sidekick.

Your reasoning is logical with that setting, but it's still annoying when we take into account the world setting, too convenient setting.

Seriously, can't we have badass male protagonist with badass male side characters and enemies?

LOL.. If there is a "shounen" tag in Madan, then yes by all means, insert a couple of badass sidekick male character. However, once you insert another badass character and to be able to stand side by side with the main and AS EPIC as the main, there is gonna be one heck of a time. When it happens, it is not harem. It could very well be reversed and get complicated where 2 or more guys are fighting for 1 girl and that 1 girl likes only one guy so on and so forth. That is just a side note for the romance side. On the other note, i must say that roland getting killed off in 4 chapters isn't amusing at all. They could have developed some friendly rivalry D=

[Mars Mode]

Originally Posted by ImperialFlameGod8190

His reactions aren't over-the-top they are nonexistent he's surprised and then he leaves or ignores it completely. Speaking of IS I was on my facebook and I saw a funnymama it had Cecelia wearing a shirt that says Fuck me hard. and she asks ichika what he thinks of her and he's just confused I wish I could find it again found it
http://funnymama.com/post/200729 this is the link to that photo idk why its not working

You cannot compare Tigre to Ichika, when in a lot of situations Tigre himself had to cool off, to make his tool calm himself down. One prominent example of this Ludmira herself said to him shall I make it cool for you. The reactions of Tigre are more subtle and down to earth. Is fine to overreact but is also fine if the reactions are a little more subtle such is the one scene with the bath with Ellen that teached him not to overreact. And later we have a more clear evidence of his reaction when Lim had access to the bath.

[Rasen]

Originally Posted by Mars Mode

You cannot compare Tigre to Ichika, when in a lot of situations Tigre himself had to cool off, to make his tool calm himself down. One prominent example of this Ludmira herself said to him shall I make it cool for you. The reactions of Tigre are more subtle and down to earth. Is fine to overreact but is also fine if the reactions are a little more subtle such is the one scene with the bath with Ellen that teached him not to overreact. And later we have a more clear evidence of his reaction when Lim had access to the bath.

Tigre's actually pretty normal in his sensibilities and interactions.

Ichika's just dense.

[ImperialFlameGod8190]

o know im not comparing them at all u were talking about somebody who has no brain cells so I gave u the king of brainless

[Leonardunitylim]

Ma ma ... Lets not quarrel about who is a better lead and what's not. Anyone have any intesrest on whether Sophie developed any feelings for Tigre? :P

[Ryan Ashfyre]

Originally Posted by Leonardunitylim

Ma ma ... Lets not quarrel about who is a better lead and what's not. Anyone have any interest on whether Sophie developed any feelings for Tigre? :P

Can't rightly discount the possibility in the future, but not right now at least. Sophie's always been portrayed as the kind elder sister that's looking out for Ellen, much in the same that that Sasha is; and characters like them have always been tough nuts to crack (pardon the rather crude metaphor) as far as my experience goes.

Save some significant plot twist flipping everything on its head (which really isn't Madan's style romance-wise), I'd give it at least another couple of years.

[XFire]

Originally Posted by Ryan Ashfyre

Can't rightly discount the possibility in the future, but not right now at least. Sophie's always been portrayed as the kind elder sister that's looking out for Ellen, much in the same that that Sasha is; and characters like them have always been tough nuts to crack (pardon the rather crude metaphor) as far as my experience goes.

Save some significant plot twist flipping everything on its head (which really isn't Madan's style romance-wise), I'd give it at least another couple of years.

.......................

Spoiler for spoiler:

Does saving her from pirates and holding her while she cries tears of relief count as a plot twist?

[Leonardunitylim]

Originally Posted by XFire

.......................

Spoiler for spoiler:

Does saving her from pirates and holding her while she cries tears of relief count as a plot twist?

Spoiler for spoiler:

and let's add on the part where Sophie blushes and feels secure when Tigre is embracing her. Such a dramatic turn of events LOL

[Ryan Ashfyre]

Originally Posted by XFire

.......................

Spoiler for spoiler:

Does saving her from pirates and holding her while she cries tears of relief count as a plot twist?

Spoiler for spoiler:

Did Ellen suddenly fall for Tigre when he saved her from Roland?

As I'm sure you know, that's not the way Madan's played out its characters' relationships. Ellen and Mira are certainly a given at this point, but they've still a fair way to go in their own respects.

My broader point with respect to Sophie is that it's not in line with what we've seen thus far for her feelings to do a near complete 180 from having a slight interest in Tigre to having fallen for him simply because he played the hero once or twice.

Characters like Sophie and Sasha, for as far as I've been led to believe, have higher standards than that and it would only seem to cheapen the whole experience if it happened any other way.

[bakapervert]

Originally Posted by Ryan Ashfyre

Spoiler for spoiler:

Did Ellen suddenly fall for Tigre when he saved her from Roland?

As I'm sure you know, that's not the way Madan's played out its characters' relationships. Ellen and Mira are certainly a given at this point, but they've still a fair way to go in their own respects.

My broader point with respect to Sophie is that it's not in line with what we've seen thus far for her feelings to do a near complete 180 from having a slight interest in Tigre to having fallen for him simply because he played the hero once or twice.

Characters like Sophie and Sasha, for as far as I've been led to believe, have higher standards than that and it would only seem to cheapen the whole experience if it happened any other way.

Spoiler for is this discussion really need spoiler?:

Being saved from near death and being saved from week of imprisonment where each day you fear being raped and in the end you're going to be sold to slavery is far different in impact. Sophie should be far more grateful to be saved in her situation compared to Ellen's near death. If that kind of rescue cannot make Sophie at least view Tigre as romantic interest, I don't know what else can.

[sapper]

^^ agreed Ellen fell for him IMO because he's down to earth, calm and c'mon lets face it good looking. Not only that but because his demeanor for what he wants is not selfish and I think all the girls see that in him. And to boost it off he's saved each girl not only physically but mentally as well. The vanadis have alot of pressure on them from not just their king but their people and soldiers so I think Tigre helps alleviate them when they need it most. That and the fact that he's always there to save them some how.

[Leonardunitylim]

Originally Posted by sapper

^^ agreed Ellen fell for him IMO because he's down to earth, calm and c'mon lets face it good looking. Not only that but because his demeanor for what he wants is not selfish and I think all the girls see that in him. And to boost it off he's saved each girl not only physically but mentally as well. The vanadis have alot of pressure on them from not just their king but their people and soldiers so I think Tigre helps alleviate them when they need it most. That and the fact that he's always there to save them some how.

And to top it off, he bears his own responsibilities, meaning never giving the vanadis counterparts any trouble (With the exception of bathing incident and sowing jealousy D= ). He is like always there for the vanadis so they see him as a very precious being that they cannot lose no matter what happens

[Lender]

After SAO became super popular i thought LN authors would rethink this harem stuff. I mean, even before the anime make the LN a mega hit SAO sells were strong (about 100k+), and the autor did what no other had courage in ages, he put the the protagonist and the female lead "together" (literally) in the first volume.

I think this proves you don't need to make the protagonist completely blind/uninterested in womans in order to make your LN popular.

I'd really like Tigre and Eren to get a girlfriend/boyfriend realationship after volume 5, at least Tigre would have a good excuse to ignores the other females (dating Ellen).

[sapper]

Originally Posted by Leonardunitylim

And to top it off, he bears his own responsibilities, meaning never giving the vanadis counterparts any trouble (With the exception of bathing incident and sowing jealousy D= ). He is like always there for the vanadis so they see him as a very precious being that they cannot lose no matter what happens

Exactly. I think the it proem I see in the future is when all the vanadis and princesses get together along with lim and Teita it's gonna be an all out war with him not knowing what's going on because keys face it he's good with tactics and is a smooth talker but dense when it comes to their feelings but I think there's gonna be a polygamy loophole somewhere for sure but that's just me XD

[Mars Mode]

Some people say he is dense, so why not say Ellen is dense too.

I really dont understand, the only reason why they are dense(if you can call it that), is because the position they carry in this moment, which is why they chose to willingly ignore their obvious feelings, and are still measuring if they are willing to risk their position and responsabilities for love. Come on guys they are still relatively young once they confirm to each other Im willing I dont think anything can stop them.