Suisei no Gargantia - Episode 12 Discussion / Poll

[Funkatron]

I was wondering if anyone noticed: in the first 2 minutes of the Striker vs Chamber fight at around 16:10, the music sounded like an homage/remix version of "The Dark Knight" Trilogy soundtrack

[SeijiSensei]

Hmm. Five pages and no speculation on how the Pinion x Lukkage x Bellows triangle is going to turn out? I could see him joining either of them as salvagers, or maybe they could all go into business together. I can only imagine how that would work out, and none of my imaginings suggest it would go well.

Except maybe for Pinion.

[yankky5]

Well hot damn we got another skynet

[Funkatron]

Originally Posted by SeijiSensei

Hmm. Five pages and no speculation on how the Pinion x Lukkage x Bellows triangle is going to turn out? I could see him joining either of them as salvagers, or maybe they could all go into business together. I can only imagine how that would work out, and none of my imaginings suggest it would go well.

Except maybe for Pinion.

I think that Pinion's leveling up Bellow might see him as a man now and act accordingly, if Lukkage doesn't jump him first

[SeijiSensei]

Thinking back on Lukkage's first appearance in the series, where she seemed to be portrayed as a lesbian S&M dominatrix, perhaps she'll take an interest in Bellows, and Pinion will be left out in the cold.

[Funkatron]

Originally Posted by SeijiSensei

Thinking back on Lukkage's first appearance in the series, where she seemed to be portrayed as a lesbian S&M dominatrix, perhaps she'll take an interest in Bellows, and Pinion will be left out in the cold.

That's assuming Bellows will reciprocate. Seriously, shippers: it takes 2 to tango, you know

[winkel]

Originally Posted by Funkatron

If Lukkage doesn't jump him first

Wasn't the implication last episode was that she already did jump him.

This episode... while I knew where it was trying to go, it made too many non-sequiturs along the way, such as:

-They didn't even explain the point of the ritual of dumping people into the sea. It was just "the big bad dark event of this fleet that everyone had to see to snap themselves and realize their actions." It seems the new fleet has not been given a single chance at all to explain their weird actions, only to establish that they are religious fanatics under the control of the Commander.

-Melty faltering in the middle of the sea. I can see that the point was she was traveling long and hard to reach Gargantia, and probably is very fatigued at that point, but did she just have to happen to faint and lose control right at that point? And Amy just happening to be close enough to her to catch her? It would have been a more believable scenario if she made it closer to the fleet and was saved from the ocean (or failing to reach the fleet, but that might be a bit too cruel).

[Jan-Poo]

Originally Posted by Marina2

Urobuchi: You mean.....if I make it a happy ending with no big revelation and a mindfuck involved, you will be surprise right? Ok. Everyone seems to able to predict what I am gonna do anyway. Maybe this way will surprise them more.

Hey, I can surprise everyone by piercing my hand with a knife for no reason, that doesn't mean it would be a smart move.

[Cloudedmind]

You know it's about to get crazy when Pinion let's HIS hair down.

It looks like the ritual finally snapped Ledo back to reality and he pushed to go against Kugel. I was also a bit surprised that Chamber was easy to convince but seeing as he said Strikers actions weren't in line with the GA's, I guess for him it wasn't much of a problem. In the end Ledo still had to make the decision himself, and I'm glad he did.

I think if the series had been longer they may have kept Kugel alive so we could get that talk between him and Ledo, but I don't think the talk we'll get between him and Striker can't be any less interesting. I mean just 2 episodes ago we got a great exposition from Chamber about the continued need to fight the Hideaze, which Ledo really seemed to consider. Of course I don't believe for a second that Ledo will change his mind now, but we may still get something interesting from Striker.

Now only to wait and see what that key does.

[Shinhwa]

Welp, we got an insane robot here.

[Theo]

I don't see why everyone's complaining about Striker spouting Alliance doctrine.

Those lines put by "Kugel"? That was all Striker and we enjoyed it right? Striker can still argue with Ledo and bring up Kugel's and the Alliance's points without much difference, right?

[Diveman]

Holy crap, and I thought Gen couldn't surprise me anymore with this series

[Irenesharda]

With Urobuchi personally writing the last episode of the series, I'm concerned for Red. I'm not sure if it's going to be all smiles and happy ending for him by the end of this.

I can think of five possible endings:

1) Chamber sacrifices himself for Red in order the destroy Striker and Red starts a new life on Gargantia, helping them adapt the tech so humanity can begin to thrive.

2) Both Chamber and Red sacrifice themselves to destroy Striker, and Gargantia and all Earth humanity will be forever changed by the visitors for beyond the stars.

3) The key is used for a warp gateway that Red and Chamber use to get rid of Striker, however they too get sucked in and end up back at the GA. Red uses what he's learned to change the GA and help the rest of humanity stuck in endless battle.

4) The battle is hard and many are lost, but Red with the help of Gargantia is able to destroy Striker. Everyone begins to rebuild and Red finds a new home.

5) Number 4, but at the very end, the GA show up, having traced Kugel and Red's signals.

[stormy001_M1A2]

I suspect if Colonel Kugel is still alive, things will not go that far on the cultist fleet. He is not exactly a "by the book person" as seen in 1st episode where he disregarded SOP to help a lowly ranked officer (2nd Lt Ledo/Red) during retreat.

Usually it is other way round, soldiers will try their best to keep their commanding officers alive in most circumstances.

So if he is alive, I don't think he will be so extreme in defending/enforcing GA's philosophy like combat AI did or fight another survivor from GA like Ledo/Red.

[Gravitas Free Zone]

Originally Posted by winkel

-They didn't even explain the point of the ritual of dumping people into the sea. It was just "the big bad dark event of this fleet that everyone had to see to snap themselves and realize their actions." It seems the new fleet has not been given a single chance at all to explain their weird actions, only to establish that they are religious fanatics under the control of the Commander.

-Melty faltering in the middle of the sea. I can see that the point was she was traveling long and hard to reach Gargantia, and probably is very fatigued at that point, but did she just have to happen to faint and lose control right at that point? And Amy just happening to be close enough to her to catch her? It would have been a more believable scenario if she made it closer to the fleet and was saved from the ocean (or failing to reach the fleet, but that might be a bit too cruel).

The ceremony: It showed that the fleet was doing things the way that the Alliance used to... and that Ledo no longer agreed with it. The dumpees were generally elderly, plus that kid that looked like Bevel and Ledo's brother and triggered the flashback shots. We know from Chamber that the Alliance destroys people that it doesn't consider worthy of support, so the parallels are all there. We learned from Gargantia that the rain is relatively infrequent, so it served as an event trigger, as well as providing another contrast between the Gargantians getting together to collect rain and the Apocalypse Now fleet getting together to drop people into the ocean...

As far as Melty conveniently running out of energy just before Amy saved her, that's just plain old dramatic license.

[LKK]

Originally Posted by Kaoru Chujo

That is another bit of illogic, in my opinion. She should immediately recognize Ledo, it seems to me. That is logical, but it is also one of Asimov's three laws of robotics: 1. A robot may not injure a human being or, through inaction, allow a human being to come to harm; 2. A robot must obey the orders given to it by human beings, except where such orders would conflict with the First Law; 3. A robot must protect its own existence as long as such protection does not conflict with the First or Second Laws.

Of course, a military robot by its nature goes against the first law, so perhaps military robots have other laws. And Striker may have "gone crazy" and jumped the rails of its original programming, anyway.

What does a fictional idea that Asimov invented for his short story Runaround have to do with the fictional world created for Suisei no Gargantia? There is no reason for anything in this fiction to operate by the ideas of another fiction.

Originally Posted by Irenesharda

As for Kugel, he's been dead for a pretty long time. I think Red's been on Earth for around 6 months or so, I think? (someone correct me if I'm wrong)

Ledo has been on Earth for closer to a year. You forgot that he spent the first 6 months in suspended animation in Chamber at the bottom of the ocean. I agree that he's been awake for about 6 months for a total of a year's worth of time on Earth.

Originally Posted by winkel

-Melty faltering in the middle of the sea. I can see that the point was she was traveling long and hard to reach Gargantia, and probably is very fatigued at that point, but did she just have to happen to faint and lose control right at that point? And Amy just happening to be close enough to her to catch her? It would have been a more believable scenario if she made it closer to the fleet and was saved from the ocean (or failing to reach the fleet, but that might be a bit too cruel).

Amy didn't just happen to be close enough to catch her. Melty was signaling the Gargantia when she lost consciousness. I thought I saw a return signal as well. Plus a look of relief on Melty's face before she lost consciousness. My conclusion is that Amy saw Melty's signal, responded, and then immediately launched to meet her mid-air. Amy's presence wasn't a coincidence; she was responding to Melty's communication.

[SeijiSensei]

Originally Posted by Endless Knackwurst

As far as Melty conveniently running out of energy just before Amy saved her, that's just plain old dramatic license.

Indeed. Anyone who watches anime and objects to implausible coincidences is not going to be watching for long. There's an equally unlikely coincidence in this week's Space Brothers, too. It comes with the territory.

[Shinhwa]

In all truth, I am sure Chamber may have turned out the same as Striker if Ledo was dead.

[Polarpew]

shit! robot rebellion! iRobot/Matrix much? This also proves that the robots dont require human pilots and perhaps never has?

[Irenesharda]

Originally Posted by stormy001_M1A2

I suspect if Colonel Kugel is still alive, things will not go that far on the cultist fleet. He is not exactly a "by the book person" as seen in 1st episode where he disregarded SOP to help a lowly ranked officer (2nd Lt Ledo/Red) during retreat.

Usually it is other way round, soldiers will try their best to keep their commanding officers alive in most circumstances.

So if he is alive, I don't think he will be so extreme in defending/enforcing GA's philosophy like combat AI did or fight another survivor from GA like Ledo/Red.

Umm, sorry but Kugel is as dead as you can get. There is no "if he is alive". The guy is dust, bone, hair, and bits of leathery flesh.

Originally Posted by LKK

Ledo has been on Earth for closer to a year. You forgot that he spent the first 6 months in suspended animation in Chamber at the bottom of the ocean. I agree that he's been awake for about 6 months for a total of a year's worth of time on Earth.

Okay, then that makes perfect sense then as even in the best conditions a body will decompose to bone in about a year, maybe a little longer in a sterile environment. So, yeah, Kugel's probably been dead since or on arrival.