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View Poll Results: Sakurasou no Pet na Kanojo - Episode 9 Rating | |||
Perfect 10 | 13 | 22.03% | |
9 out of 10 : Excellent | 14 | 23.73% | |
8 out of 10 : Very Good | 22 | 37.29% | |
7 out of 10 : Good | 9 | 15.25% | |
6 out of 10 : Average | 1 | 1.69% | |
5 out of 10 : Below Average | 0 | 0% | |
4 out of 10 : Poor | 0 | 0% | |
3 out of 10 : Bad | 0 | 0% | |
2 out of 10 : Very Bad | 0 | 0% | |
1 out of 10 : Painful | 0 | 0% | |
Voters: 59. You may not vote on this poll |
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2012-12-05, 18:49 | Link #141 |
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Taken all that into consideration, I don't think going back to England should be made to be a point against Rita. Even imo, London would be a better place for fine art than Tokyo, and simply wanting Mashiro going back to London is the same as wanting your children to have the best facility for their education.
On the issue about forcing Mashiro to paint, I think there's a lot of misunderstanding here, going back to England doesn't mean Mashiro will be force into drawing 24/7. Any good education institution in the world always let theirs student express individualism in their study while provide the best study enviroment to encourage the student to further their skills (meaning if she wants to study manga for art, I think they will let her do that, heck they might even let her go to Japan again for field trip study and arrange her to meet with some of the mangakas for inspiration). And if Mashiro truly loves painting, I believes going to a good studio or art institution in London wouldn't make her paint or work like slave, on the contrary, I think Mashiro would still very much enjoy her life there. But imo, Mashiro lacks common sense, therefore she won't be able to see things to that extent, and just to make it worse, she won't listen either. And she won't let people know how she feels about fine art, about manga, her life and her future as a whole. She lacks the capabilitiy to express them imo. So Rita can only act on what she thinks is best for Mashiro atm. And given if there's a person like Shiina in real life (talent but totally dependent), would you entirely suport her all the way for whahtever she decides without her even telling you her thought about the subject matter. If she's someone that can express her passion and is reliable like Aoyama, possiblly I will give in, but Mashiro? Unlikely
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2012-12-05, 18:52 | Link #142 | ||||||||
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I mean, if Michael Jordan stopped playing basketball at the age of 23, and suddenly decided to work as an average person in an average profession somewhere for the rest of his working life, that would obviously constitute a waste of talent. Quote:
Imagine if Michael Jordan did stop playing basketball (for good) in his mid-20s, and some basketball fans (from far in the future) watched a video tape of one of Jordan's final basketball games. Viewer A says "Wow, what an awesome basketball player! I could watch this all day!" Viewer B says "Yeah, I agree, but you know what's sad?" Viewer C answers "No, what?" Viewer B answers "He never played beyond his 23rd birthday." Viewer A replies "You gotta be shittin' me, dude!" Viewer B states "No, it's true. He stopped playing before the age of 23. I think he worked in a clerical role somewhere the rest of his life." Viewer C state "What an incredible waste of talent..." So for the rest of this viewing experience, these viewers aren't just thinking "What great talent!" in this awe-inspired way. No, instead they're thinking "What a horrible shame." And fans of the fine arts may feel much the same when they read about Shiina's life history if she doesn't pursue her painting talents beyond this episode. Quote:
But if Shiina stops being a painter now, and never picks it back up, she's not even 50% utilizing her talents from a career perspective. At worst, I'd say Jordan 85% utilized his talents from a career perspective. So it's a big difference. In any event, I raised Jordan just so people would get a more concrete idea of what's truly at stake here. I mean, I feel like a lot of people in this thread aren't even considering the greater good here. Quote:
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Shiina clearly doesn't have a moral objection to painting. Quote:
And even if you're not, it's almost beside the point. Whatever the motivations of the talented person, their talent in use will usually reap benefits for the rest of humanity. Having more star players makes a game more entertaining to watch, and more memorable an experience in general. Having more great paintings to behold makes for a more beautiful world and an aesthetically richer world. Having more great music to lisen to makes for a more serene and uplifting world. I'm sure most of us here have certain J-POP artists that we love, or seiyus that we love. Quote:
Finally, there's at least one major flaw I see from some of the arguments on this thread. "Trapped in a bird cage"? Really now? What makes anybody here think that Shiina doesn't like painting? If Shiina came out and said "I'm sick of painting. I hate it! I don't want to do it anymore!", then those arguing "trapped in a bird cage" would have more of a point. But she's not saying that at all. In fact, just how did this episode begin? I'm inclined to think that Shiina still likes painting, and she just needed a break from it for awhile, which is fine. But that certainly doesn't mean she should stop painting for good.
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2012-12-05, 19:00 | Link #144 | ||
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That's a lot of things to assume- are you sure you're discussing Sakurasou or some other Anime you think it should be? Quote:
The entire premise of your argument is that someone is forcing Mashiro to go back against her will, fine so where's the gun pointing at her head? wheres the shackles and head bags and black wIndow vehIcles? Where's the blackmail and threats against her friends and generally making her life difficult? The answer? There isn't any because nobody is forcing her. There is a difference between forcing and persuading. Your entire argument is base on an illusion of an invisible enemy that doesn't exist is this story.
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2012-12-05, 19:29 | Link #145 | |
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Oh what else, it's not like she has ever complained about her life either. Am I that disrecpectful to try my hardest convincing her to go back to the way it was? When all I got was a simple "I want to go Japan and draw manga"? Well, that's a lot of assumption for the plot, but I just want to express how I feel about this I you have a child that is only 6, 7 years old, and someday for a mysterious reason doesn't want to go to school, would you accept that without knowing why? Yes, it is given that you have to go yourself investigate about the school if there's any issue, but would it be quicker if your child would just talk about that with you, right?
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2012-12-05, 19:47 | Link #146 | |
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With regard to which is better, neither. This conversational grows pointless and drives towards procrastination, so I'll leave you all to your own devices with some final thoughts on the whole "masterpiece" part of what's apparently in everyone's equation: Take a painting. A painting tells a mute store, if one at all, manga expresses more feelings (though characters, plot, etc), but at the cost of excessive repetition and simplification of expression for the purpose of conveying underline emotion—that is the basic definition of both, but strip the definition away and you'll notice the difference is still present, why is that? Is it simply a matter of opinion? No. It's a matter of perspective; when dealing with time, things far away are much bigger then things up close, even if in reality they are of equal size. To take it one step back, let's say I'm a fan of typography (that's an art too, in case you were too busy abusing it every day to realize), if that were the case I'm obviously going to root for Mashiro to be a famous typographer and have her own typeface, "the Mashiro". Does that make painting and manga lesser art forms? Of course not. But by the common logic here (and well just about everywhere else people repeat what they've been brainwashed to think) it would, since it would go beyond inspiring young artists, it would inspire everyone who used it; even if was only a quaint typeface used in titles of books and such, the glyphs can hold as much power as a masterpiece. So, do you know why people don't talk about typefaces, their history, and the people who invented them? The same reason you think of manga as a lowly art now, the reason is because it's part of your every day life, and as such is closer, too small to notice. You think the so-called "grant masters" just became grand over night... most sold their work for food, many appreciated their work, but it was the same appreciation we might give now to a good series. "It is good." Of course now it's larger then life... since it's no more. So then how does one embody that? You don't, it's impossible because you do not live in the same time, and the time has passed long ago. So in cases like Mashiro one can never be what people like Rita want them to be. What they see and interpret with their limited understanding is merely an illusion from lack of an equivalent—no amount of wanting will change that, no amount of needing will make it true. You can not make a masterpiece, time and society make things into a masterpiece. If art is too alien to understand, look at books, look at old movies (the "classics" as it were), people even look at cartoons as "masterpieces." So to be blunt, Mashiro just can't make a "masterpiece," it's not up to her. And going by the plot (ie. all the hard work she puts in) there exists a possibility she is aware of this.
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2012-12-05, 19:54 | Link #147 | |
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Please read this. Key excerpt: He was claimed to be "America's most-collected living artist" before his death[5] with an estimated 1 in every 20 American homes owning a copy of one of his paintings.[6] That's massive circulation, and it's based on paintings. This man is also very well-known with widely circulated works. There's absolutely no reason to think that a great painter can't reach the same number of people that a great mangaka can. In fact, if anything, I'd wonder if the opposite is an issue (that a great mangaka can't reach the same number of people that a great painter can). I mean, consider the number of people who are familiar with "The Scream" painting or "The Mona Lisa" vs. the number of people familiar with... well, any manga, really.
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2012-12-05, 20:12 | Link #148 |
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Join Date: Sep 2009
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She's already a world class artist, given the setting, she has gotten the approval of the art world, all that left for her now is to push the boundaries and create even more amazing artworks. And if you watch the episode again, Rita was very careful with her word choice to suggest Mashiro's potential to create a masterpiece that will go down in history. Everything she said was about Mashiro's potential, not about her actual cappability to create one atm yet.
Yes, you might argue that it's just Rita's illusion. But if Mashiro stays in her art world and continues fine art, that possibility still has more chance to come true rather her quit painting altogether (I'm not suggesting that though, just saying hypothetically). And givenRita's character, I would think she know more about Mashiro's cappability than you are, I don't think she would go that without taking everything into consideration. Let me ask, fine art and manga, which is it do you honestly think Mashiro has more chance to be successful at? And which part do you think she should take right fnow or her future, in your opinion? And please don't answer she should do whatever she likes.
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2012-12-05, 20:31 | Link #149 |
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Age: 54
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Why can't some people accept that extreme answer is usually not the correct answer? Nobody should cover their ears against other people's suggestion. Everyone should think for themselves and take responsibility for their own action. No one should remain silent to what they perceive as need of those near them. No one should force their will upon other people. At this point in Mashiro's life, nothing is yet taken off the board, and no option should be ignored. Possibility of Mashiro being both the artist and mangaka should be explored. People like Rita should also reconsider their obstinate position and try to be flexible. Being flexible and giving up is not the same thing. It is a fact that Mashiro needs help in many things. Thus Mashiro and people around her should try to see if there is a way for her to grow both as mangaka and painter.
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2012-12-05, 20:46 | Link #150 | |
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2012-12-05, 20:57 | Link #151 | |
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2012-12-05, 21:41 | Link #152 |
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No, it's not so much of Rita- I've noticed that suddenly we have a mysterious villain or group of villains behind the scenes pushing up their glasses smugly going 'just as planned' while pulling the string to take away Mashiro's freedom for their own purpose!
...In other words, people have been making up imaginary bad guys for this series -_-
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2012-12-05, 21:41 | Link #153 | |||
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Join Date: Sep 2012
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Shiina is not a child and by no means retarted. She clearly knows what she wants and she clearly know what she is doing. Nuff said. Quote:
"The freedom is at the moment lost when people like you force others to drop their dreams and their lifes and make them do what you want them to do." Quote:
Your nonsensical statemet that she should not be allowed to live her life how she wants, because she has to do what other people expect from her. Which is absolutely in conflickt with fundamental humans rights and that is neither acceptable nor tolerable. So I ask you again because you avoided to answer the question. Is Shiina just a tool or a human being with rights, such as freedom to chose for herself what she does with her life? What do you believe? And talking around the bush is not allowed. Just a straight answer. Option A or option B. Is she just a tool or a human being with rights? |
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2012-12-05, 21:56 | Link #154 | |
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All I have to say is that for Shiina to be what she is right now, she is extremely lucky. You understand the title of this anime right? It's Sakurasou's pet girl, and I think there's a valid reason for that.
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2012-12-05, 22:00 | Link #155 | |||
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Seriously if you're not going to discuss things that are happening IN the anime then what are you doing here? Quote:
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Last edited by Chaos2Frozen; 2012-12-05 at 23:26. |
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2012-12-05, 22:01 | Link #156 |
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Join Date: Jul 2010
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Seems like my guess about Ryuunosuke's gender was dead wrong. If this were a more harem-oriented show, I would have been right
Perhaps Rita herself aspires to be a great artist but her talent is not even close to that of Mashiro and she's crushed that Mashiro, who has the talent that she wishes for, chose another path? I don't think Rita is merely concerned about 'what's good for' Mashiro, that's my guess. |
2012-12-05, 23:04 | Link #158 |
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Join Date: May 2004
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Probably because she saw a manga that was to her a piece of art. A manga that told a story with great artwork. We know there is manga like that and it had something her paintings did not.. A painting emotes emotions but it does not portray how the artist feels other than that. Shiina probably wants to express herself in a way she has never done.
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2012-12-06, 00:01 | Link #159 | |
Where are the good animes
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2012-12-06, 00:11 | Link #160 | ||||
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Yet here is a person who has the ability to do exactly just that, but doesn't use the ability. They are actively throwing away something truly special. I think it is understandable if someone can interpret this as not appreciating what they have. The key here being of course that Shiina hasn't actively proclaimed any dislike for art, she just for some reason likes manga. It is like being a waster of food when there are clearly starving people around in your country. Quote:
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