Ore no Imouto (Season Two) - Episode 14-16 [Series End] Discussion / Poll

[Akito Kinomoto]

Kirino only offended me when she taunted Manami and got punched for it. Driving Manami to violence is all kinds of ****ed.

[VORTIA]

Originally Posted by Akito Kinomoto

Kirino only offended me when she taunted Manami and got punched for it. Driving Manami to violence is all kinds of ****ed.

...but Manami came to fight! She was already planning on beating up Kirino months ago! She said so herself! It was pretty bratty of Kirino, but they both already knew it was going to come to blows anyway.

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by chaosprophet

This was an interesting analogy, but I think it is a bit more complex than that. Things like the setting of the story, what are the inner reasons that make the character act that way, does the other/s characters do something to deserve that reaction...

A lot of people believe that violence is unwarranted, period. That you don't get violent with someone who isn't getting violent with you.

This is a key distinguishing characteristic in how "spicy" a tsundere is, imo.

If you look at the "mild" tsunderes I listed, it's all verbal for them. Very rarely does it get physical for either of them.

If you look at the "medium" tsunderes I listed, it sometimes gets physical. However, there's usually a sort of safety valve here that takes the edge off of it (i.e. the tsundere shows a lot of dere, or the target of the tsun violence can take it without much trouble because of certain powers/abilities that he has).

If you look at the "strong" tsunderes I listed, it sometimes/often gets physical, and there's less of a safety valve here.

If you look at the "insanity" tsunderes I listed, it often gets physical, and the tsun to dere ratio strongly favors the tsun.

You have to admit that Kirino is extremely tsun, and often violent towards Kyousuke. Even if that's played for jokes, or has some sort of rationale behind it, that can get discomforting to many viewers after awhile (especially when its clear that it is in fact hurting the guy). It's a discomfort comparable to the discomfort some feel when eating food that's too spicy for them. But some don't seem to be bothered by all of this violence, so I think its comparable to how some aren't bothered by extremely spicy food and in fact like it.

[VORTIA]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

You have to admit that Kirino is extremely tsun, and often violent towards Kyousuke. Even if that's played for jokes, or has some sort of rationale behind it, that can get discomforting to many viewers after awhile (especially when its clear that it is in fact hurting the guy). It's a discomfort comparable to the discomfort some feel when eating food that's too spicy for them. But some don't seem to be bothered by all of this violence, so I think its comparable to how some aren't bothered by extremely spicy food and in fact like it.

See, the violence wasn't something I saw as tsun, it was something I saw as being a sibling. I don't know any siblings who didn't come to blows at some point growing up, often about totally stupid stuff. My sister punched me enough times that I never thought much of it in Oreimo.

[relentlessflame]

Originally Posted by Akito Kinomoto

Kirino only offended me when she taunted Manami and got punched for it. Driving Manami to violence is all kinds of ****ed.

This was very much on purpose, though (even if you may not think it was admirable). Manami was there to fight, but she had the moral high ground in terms of what she was going to say. And she had never shown any signs to Kyousuke that she had any resentment whatsoever towards Kirino, to the point where Kyousuke thought that Kirino's resentment was entirely one-sided and unfair. So it was necessary for Kirino to bring out Manami's true feelings, and not allow her to continue to pretend that this was entirely about morality when that really wasn't all there was to it.

Obviously, the way she went about it was childish, but so was the grudge they both held towards each other. Even Kyousuke, though upset by Kirino's behaviour, also admitted that Manami had been way too harsh to Kirino in the past. So in my view, Kirino's taunting was unfortunate but necessary from her perspective to not allow Manami to keep looking like the completely-innocent good-guy. She had to make Manami "lose her cool".

Originally Posted by Triple_R

You have to admit that Kirino is extremely tsun, and often violent towards Kyousuke. Even if that's played for jokes, or has some sort of rationale behind it, that can get discomforting to many viewers after awhile (especially when its clear that it is in fact hurting the guy).

In general this hasn't happened all that frequently in the second season. And the most memorable "violent" act from the first season was actually not canon (the "good ending" version of Episode 12). This isn't to say that she was never "violent", but I think it has not been her regular behaviour towards him for some time.

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by VORTIA

See, the violence wasn't something I saw as tsun, it was something I saw as being a sibling. I don't know any siblings who didn't come to blows at some point growing up, often about totally stupid stuff. My sister punched me enough times that I never thought much of it in Oreimo.

I don't recall ever getting into a physical fight with either of my sisters. I also don't recall them hitting me much.

That being said, I know that some siblings do have the occasional fight that involves blows. But it's generally not entirely one-way. The male sibling might not actually punch his sister, but he might do something like pull on her hair or throw her to the ground in response to her punching him.

The thing with Kirino-Kyousuke is that the violence is entirely one-way, so it feels to many viewers like the classic case of a tsundere beating up on the male lead.

Originally Posted by relentlessflame

In general this hasn't happened all that frequently in the second season. And the most memorable "violent" act from the first season was actually not canon (the "good ending" version of Episode 12). This isn't to say that she was never "violent", but I think it has not been her regular behaviour towards him for some time.

Well, that's good to read at least. Thanks for the info.

[Akito Kinomoto]

@VORITA and relentless:
That wasn't a strike against the writing itself but a gut WTF reaction to Kirino. Regardless of how well justified a character's actions are, the action itself can still make me go "REALLY?!"

[chaosprophet]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

A lot of people believe that violence is unwarranted, period. That you don't get violent with someone who isn't getting violent with you.

This is a key distinguishing characteristic in how "spicy" a tsundere is, imo.

If you look at the "mild" tsunderes I listed, it's all verbal for them. Very rarely does it get physical for either of them.

If you look at the "medium" tsunderes I listed, it sometimes gets physical. However, there's usually a sort of safety valve here that takes the edge off of it (i.e. the tsundere shows a lot of dere, or the target of the tsun violence can take it without much trouble because of certain powers/abilities that he has).

If you look at the "strong" tsunderes I listed, it sometimes/often gets physical, and there's less of a safety valve here.

If you look at the "insanity" tsunderes I listed, it often gets physical, and the tsun to dere ratio strongly favors the tsun.

You have to admit that Kirino is extremely tsun, and often violent towards Kyousuke. Even if that's played for jokes, or has some sort of rationale behind it, that can get discomforting to many viewers after awhile (especially when its clear that it is in fact hurting the guy). It's a discomfort comparable to the discomfort some feel when eating food that's too spicy for them. But some don't seem to be bothered by all of this violence, so I think its comparable to how some aren't bothered by extremely spicy food and in fact like it.

Again I think the context is more important then anything else. The safety valve you commented about is a context that is taken in consideration. And even then if you look back at Mikoto's case, she also does it with other people, for instance Kuroko. But again the reason she isn't considered too tsundere by many is because one would look at the context, in this case Kuroko often doing things to her that deserve punishment, the fact the story is in a setting where you have lots of fights and people with supernatural powers, and also those scenes are played for laughs.

To bring another example to table I was okay with Kirino tsun, but really dislike Taiga's on the beginning of Toradora. I won't go on deep as this isn't the right topic, but the gist of it is that I felt her actions excessive, without good justification and against someone who did nothing to deserve it.

Of course, in the end how much and what contexts are acceptable depends on the person. What I'm trying to argue is that others factors can affect how much a person feels the "spiciness" of the character. So one could like Kirino even they're not that tolerant of tsundereness if they think the context justify it. Which happens to be my case. I do like the whole "character acts tough but have a weak/soft side" but when it comes to violence and aggressiveness I can't take much if I find it unjustifiable.

[VORTIA]

Yeah, I can't see Kirino on Taiga's tsundere level either. Taiga broke into somebody's home and tried to kill them with a bokken over a misunderstanding over a letter. Even my Louise loving self was relatively horrified.

[Grimoire]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

2. I've learned over time that tsunderes are like hot wings. The "tsun" is the spicy sauce, and the "dere" is the delectable meat. Now, some people like spicy food and some people don't. Likewise, some people like the spice of the tsun and some people don't.

Now, even amongst people who like spicy food, there are different threshold levels. If given a choice between "mild, medium, or strong", I'll usually choose "medium". "Strong" is usually too much for me, even though I do like spicy food. But for some spicy food lovers, the spicier/hotter the better. It can't get too spicy/hot for these folks. "Bring on the insanity wings!" is what these people say. So those insanity wings are like rare delicacies for those that love them.

Well, if tsunderes are hot wings, then Kirino is an Insanity-level hot wing. It's for people who like their tsun spice at the spiciest level possible. Other tsundere/hot wing comparisons to further clarify...


3. Kirino carefully guarded her otaku passion from her non-otaku circle of friends at school. I think some otakus can relate to this, and so this makes Kirino more popular with them.

Like someone else above me, I really liked your analogy, i'm sure I'll be using it sometimes in the future, hope you don't mind. And the 3th point I can relate to, I guess Kirino tried her best to keep a balance between her -Two worlds- her Otaku side and her normal side.

BTW! Completely off topic~ But Man oh man, I know I myself don't contribute to much to the discussion, but what I have learned over the years is that anime-fans get really passionate when defending a character/point of view. Since everyone is talking about Kirino right now, I'll stay on the side, but don't even start on Kuroneko I'll defend that boat with my life if necessary =P

[relentlessflame]

Originally Posted by Grimoire

Since everyone is talking about Kirino right now, I'll stay on the side, but don't even start on Kuroneko I'll defend that boat with my life if necessary =P

Well, honestly (and as soon as I say this I imagine I'll be proven wrong), I haven't seen very many people who dislike Kuroneko. She's the tragic heroine of this story who sacrifices her romantic interest for her best friend. Some people may say that she was making a bad decision in doing so... but she had known from the get-go that Kirino's feelings were something to be contended with. The fact that she sticks around after going through all that to continue supporting Kirino and Kyousuke, and remains their friends through it all shows a heck of a lot of fortitude on her part. Seeing her rejected was painful no matter what, even if she admits that she knew on some level that this was going to happen. I hope that she and Kirino can remain friends for a long time (and the bonus story that came with the first Blu-Ray disc implies that they do), because you indeed won't find many more loyal and considerate than she was. Honestly, Kirino and Kyousuke would never have reconciled and acknowledged their feelings if not for her role in their lives.

I fully-support a Gokou family spin-off story.

[jrod]

Originally Posted by relentlessflame

Well, honestly (and as soon as I say this I imagine I'll be proven wrong), I haven't seen very many people who dislike Kuroneko. She's the tragic heroine of this story who sacrifices her romantic interest for her best friend. Some people may say that she was making a bad decision in doing so... but she had known from the get-go that Kirino's feelings were something to be contended with. The fact that she sticks around after going through all that to continue supporting Kirino and Kyousuke, and remains their friends through it all shows a heck of a lot of fortitude on her part. Seeing her rejected was painful no matter what, even if she admits that she knew on some level that this was going to happen. I hope that she and Kirino can remain friends for a long time (and the bonus story that came with the first Blu-Ray disc implies that they do), because you indeed won't find many more loyal and considerate than she was. Honestly, Kirino and Kyousuke would never have reconciled and acknowledged their feelings if not for her role in their lives.

I fully-support a Gokou family spin-off story.

I agree. Fushimi-sensei has done well in moulding the character of Kuroneko.
The tragic heroine is an appropriate description.
Her role just makes Oreimo bittersweet, at least for Kuroneko fans.
And bittersweet stories are often well-remembered.

[Soverence]

Originally Posted by relentlessflame

Well, honestly (and as soon as I say this I imagine I'll be proven wrong), I haven't seen very many people who dislike Kuroneko. She's the tragic heroine of this story who sacrifices her romantic interest for her best friend. Some people may say that she was making a bad decision in doing so... but she had known from the get-go that Kirino's feelings were something to be contended with. The fact that she sticks around after going through all that to continue supporting Kirino and Kyousuke, and remains their friends through it all shows a heck of a lot of fortitude on her part. Seeing her rejected was painful no matter what, even if she admits that she knew on some level that this was going to happen. I hope that she and Kirino can remain friends for a long time (and the bonus story that came with the first Blu-Ray disc implies that they do), because you indeed won't find many more loyal and considerate than she was. Honestly, Kirino and Kyousuke would never have reconciled and acknowledged their feelings if not for her role in their lives.

I fully-support a Gokou family spin-off story.

Agreed, even as a Kirino fan mainly, I still liked Kuroneko's character quite a lot. Actually in general, I felt most of the characters in this series were quite like-able for one reason or another, I can't really name one character I disliked (yes, even as a Kirino fan I still liked Manami's character).

Kuroneko plays the most important role in leading to the ending, sacrificing her own happiness for that of her friends. I was really glad about the scene of the 4 of them at the cafe where Kirino and Ruri fought over anime like they always did basically saying nothing has really changed between them even with all the funny business with Kyousuke. Just about everyone has that one loyal friend who would be willing to stand beside you in thick and thin and for Kirino/Kyousuke that friend is Ruri if you ask me.

I honestly wonder if we are going to see something like a spin-off story, there is certainly enough characters that aren't fully explored that you could do so but I feel like most of the "spin-off" scenarios are covered in the two games.

[Kakurin]

Originally Posted by Chysamere

I notice that no one attacked my core message - that Kirino has no redeeming qualities and that Kyousuke's actions are completely irrational.

Although this has been replied to, that nobody bothered to replying to your "core message" is due to your post being a very obvious flamebait, even if you didn't intend it to. Your opinion is just so one-sided, only looking at the negatives, completely ignoring (concious or unconcious) the positives, that it doesn't matter what other people will present as evidence, opinion etc. Furthermore, the "core message" you raised has been replied to over and over again, in this thread, in the novel thread and in the Kirino thread. I don't know about the others, but I have gotten a little bit sick and tired of answering the same one-sided rant over and over again. But for the sake of it, I just do it again (so that in the future I can just repost this one, whenever I feel like replying to something like this ).

First off, Kirino stand is hurt by the perspective of the story: It is told from the perspective of Kyousuke. And Kirino behaves tsundere (or bratty, or abusive as others have called it), almost exclusive towards Kyousuke. She may behave like 90% tsun, but that is because we only get to see a small portion of her character (to draw an analogy, it would be like if we only got to see Kuroneko in class - at least before Kyousuke got her to be more open - that is, somebody who appears to be anti-social and sometimes quite rude).

But still, if one isn't completely fixated on her negatives, one can pick up her positive sides a number of times. She is very mindful of her friends, has a very caring side and is also selfless when it comes to the well-being of those she loves. She is a very hard worker (more on that later), and has a strong sense of responsibility. To mention some examples:

1) When she met Ayase on the set the first time, who was new there, she openly approached her and offered to guide her and share her own experience.

2) She cared very much about Ria, and even by Kyousuke's admission, she is actually a very good onee-san.

3) When she arrived back home from America, she went forward and gave every one of her friends a call to apologize / telling them she's back, instead of just sending a text, which would have been more convenient.

4) In the anime, she came up with the idea to go to Saori's for a surprise birthday party.

5) Kirino told Kyousuke if some girl in the future confesses to him, he should give her serious thought for she really did love her, even though in her heart, she despised Kyousuke going out with anybody. And when Kyousuke was sad after the break-up she took it upon herself to look for Kuroneko, even if it meant them getting back together.

6) Even though she thought she would miss the Meru-fest due to the shooting taking longer, she never complained or got annoyed and did everything to the very satisfaction of the photographer.

Originally Posted by Chysamere

All her "Star" qualities are accidents of birth or luck, nothing more.

Honestly, that shows you haven't been paying attention, or just hate Kirino so much, that you ignore facts. Yes, she looks good, but she went to look for that model job, without relying on her parents, when she was like 13. Furthermore, it is an insult to every model to say that you just need to look good. She worked her way up.

As some others have mentioned, she was slow in her childhood. But through determination and hard work (practice), she became a good athletic. "Model athlete", however? She got shown her limits in America, when she was completely outclassed.

Saying, her qualities are luck is to completely ignore a central trait of Kirino: She's one of the hardest workers you'll ever see. When she has made up her mind to do something, she will work her hardest to achieve it and not give up, even if it goes bad. Just remember her America experience, she set herself a challenge, and even though it pained her that she failed to achieve it, she didn't give up, prompting Kyousuke to tell her while cryingthat she didn't need to work so hard. Also, during that race with Ria, Kyousuke stated that what he thought was somebody with natural talent was in the end somebody who just worked harder than everybody else. Just like he was overtaken by her back in the past, she was overtaken by Ria, but instead of giving up (and be jealous) like him, she faced that challenge.

[Xero8420]

Well, I got a mixed thought about this series finale. Both positive and negative, but about 2/3 of my thoughts in this post goes to negative. Anyway, the positive one first.

And so, Kirino earns her happy ending here. Congrats, good for her. It shows how much hardship she has been through most of the time in order to rekindle her relationship with Kyousuke ever since childhood, especially her grudge against Manami, whom she blamed for 'stealing' her beloved onii-chan from her. Now, her final boss is defeated. My, it sure is very painful for Manami's loss since then. It looks like this series explained well on Kirino's perspective, as well as to justify the reasons why Kirino was doing to win over Kyousuke.

And for the negative side... Oh man, I'm very sorry if my ranting could overly exaggerating, but I had to get this off my chest. I would make sure it isn't has a bait in it, even though it's biased.

Sigh... So where am I going to begin with?

TL;DR…

Cynical Rant

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Well, I rated this 1/10 for the first time. Sorry... But I felt like wanna give a piece of mind on how bad things have turned out.

[Kakurin]

Originally Posted by Xero8420

TL;DR…

Cynical Rant

Sorry; dynamic content not loaded. Reload?

If you rewatch it and pay close attention, it doesn't really come out of nothing. Only, those little hints got interpreted as normal siblings' care in the past. A big hint was him crying while asking Kirino to come to Japan with him, because he misses her so much that he "might die" if she doesn't come back. Another hint is him sticking that Purikura to the fridge and to his phone. Then, him getting all jealous when she comes with Mikagami, stating if he wants to get his acceptance, then he must show more care than him, which, however, isn't possible because he cherishes her the most. Yet another hint is Episode 9 with them looking for Kuroneko, where he thinks "Kirino-san's so cool. I could fall for her", without the slightest bit of sarcasm in his voice. Last but not least, him not trying to make a real move on Ayase, when she's with him the entire time. The thing is, these are all subtle hints, that comes together in the end and Kyousuke himself doesn't realize the extent of his feelings until after the breakup with Kuroneko. The plot is not really done if you follow everything from the beginning by closely going for the details.

And he didn't reject them because the author had to bend a way for a Kirino ending. Kyousuke loves Kirino - very much. He realized himself, that it wouldn't be fair to keep the others on a leash, when he loves somebody else more than them. Do you consider it better, if he doesn't reject them, while he prefers Kirino? What he did was harsh, but it enabled all of the others to move on, instead of hoping he might have a change of heart someday. This Kyousuke's-a-scum-for-rejecting-everybody is something I really don't understand. I think somebody's a scum if he tries to keep multiple girls around him, as quasi-backup, because that shows his feelings towards everybody is shallow and he's using them in the worst possible way.

As for Ayase, in the novel the Ayase rejection was part of the last volume, so you should consider it part of the OVA narrative. Of course it's harsh for Ayase-fans, that she doesn't appear there, but in the end, she's a minor (or better sounding, supporting) character. The main characters of Oreimo are Kyousuke, Kirino, Kuroneko, Saori and Manami. Where I see a problem, was the anime staff trying to ride Ayase's popularity for higher sales. For example by forcing that Episode 2 in, which was completely unnecessary and simply a waste of precious time, that then lacked in other areas (even though I found it quite funny). Through that, they got the hopes and expectations of Ayase-fan's up to a degree, they were sure to disappoint.

And people thinking Kyousuke might come back to Kuroneko are not supported by the plot. Kuroneko herself cut the bridge behind Kyousuke by organizing that "biggest curse of her life" (blasting his admittance of loving Kirino with those loudspeakers into the Tokyo nightsky).

[Xero8420]

Originally Posted by SigUp

If you rewatch it and pay close attention, it doesn't really come out of nothing. Only, those little hints got interpreted as normal siblings' care in the past. A big hint was him crying while asking Kirino to come to Japan with him, because he misses her so much that he "might die" if she doesn't come back. Another hint is him sticking that Purikura to the fridge and to his phone. Then, him getting all jealous when she comes with Mikagami, stating if he wants to get his acceptance, then he must show more care than him, which, however, isn't possible because he cherishes her the most. Yet another hint is Episode 9 with them looking for Kuroneko, where he thinks "Kirino-san's so cool. I could fall for her", without the slightest bit of sarcasm in his voice. Last but not least, him not trying to make a real move on Ayase, when she's with him the entire time. The thing is, these are all subtle hints, that comes together in the end and Kyousuke himself doesn't realize the extent of his feelings until after the breakup with Kuroneko. The plot is not really done if you follow everything from the beginning by closely going for the details.

Maybe season 1 OVA was the one to begin with. But still, the subtle hints were the one I don't like about it, as it would easily get a wrong idea for some people, even for me.

And he didn't reject them because the author had to bend a way for a Kirino ending. Kyousuke loves Kirino - very much. He realized himself, that it wouldn't be fair to keep the others on a leash, when he loves somebody else more than them. Do you consider it better, if he doesn't reject them, while he prefers Kirino? What he did was harsh, but it enabled all of the others to move on, instead of hoping he might have a change of heart someday. This Kyousuke's-a-scum-for-rejecting-everybody is something I really don't understand. I think somebody's a scum if he tries to keep multiple girls around him, as quasi-backup, because that shows his feelings towards everybody is shallow and he's using them in the worst possible way.

I remembered I say I respect his decision to reject girls and take it as a man, but the way he executed was harsh and unforgivable. I try not to badmouth him in a rabid way, but the way the author made him act like a dense jerk.

As for Ayase, in the novel the Ayase rejection was part of the last volume, so you should consider it part of the OVA narrative. Of course it's harsh for Ayase-fans, that she doesn't appear there, but in the end, she's a minor (or better sounding, supporting) character. The main characters of Oreimo are Kyousuke, Kirino, Kuroneko, Saori and Manami. Where I see a problem, was the anime staff trying to ride Ayase's popularity for higher sales. For example by forcing that Episode 2 in, which was completely unnecessary and simply a waste of precious time, that then lacked in other areas (even though I found it quite funny). Through that, they got the hopes and expectations of Ayase-fan's up to a degree, they were sure to disappoint.

Oh my god... Why? Why they do this to us? That's even crueler for using us as a tool for milking sales.

And people thinking Kyousuke might come back to Kuroneko are not supported by the plot. Kuroneko herself cut the bridge behind Kyousuke by organizing that "biggest curse of her life" (blasting his admittance of loving Kirino with those loudspeakers into the Tokyo nightsky).

I acknowledge that all girls' routes were closed in the end of the series. And clearly I respect the author's decision for Kirino, even though I personally don't like the way he executed the ending. But it's a surprise that there are some Kuroneko fans who are still persistently refuse to accept that it was the end of the line for Kuroneko.

[Kakurin]

Originally Posted by Xero8420

Maybe season 1 OVA was the one to begin with. But still, the subtle hints were the one I don't like about it, as it would easily get a wrong idea for some people, even for me.

That's your opinion and I respect it. As for me, to quote relentlessflame:

Originally Posted by relentlessflame

While a more obvious ending may have been more-easily accepted, I have to admit that I am fond of the "puzzle" aspect of it all too. It's not quite as carelessly written as some think at first glance.

It is interesting watching the episode (and rewatch them) going for all the subtleties, and realise that the author really worked his way towards that ending.

Originally Posted by Xero8420

I remembered I say I respect his decision to reject girls and take it as a man, but the way he executed was harsh and unforgivable. I try not to badmouth him in a rabid way, but the way the author made him act like a dense jerk.

Hmm, I don't think it was executed harsh and unforgivable. Ayase and Kanako basically launched a surprise attack (especially Kanako planned that), so what was he supposed to do? In my opinion there was no other way. As for Kuroneko, I also see no problem with that. He had promised her to give her an answer back in Episode 10, so he was fulfilling that promise. And he really was sorry and also expressed this. I really don't see how his actions are unforgivable.

Originally Posted by Xero8420

Oh my god... Why? Why they do this to us? That's even crueler for using us as a tool for milking sales.

Well, that's the nature of business, though I think in this case the negative effects on pacing should have convinced them to do otherwise.

Originally Posted by Xero8420

I acknowledge that all girls' routes were closed in the end of the series. And clearly I respect the author's decision for Kirino, even though I personally don't like the way he executed the ending. But it's a surprise that there are some Kuroneko fans who are still persistently refuse to accept that it was the end of the line for Kuroneko.

There are always people who cling to their dreams. But I think the PSP games are there for this purpose. There you can date the girl you like the most and enjoy the dating process. Though you would want to be careful what to say to Ayase. You can get cut up quite a few times.

[Thailog]

Originally Posted by Xero8420

I remembered I say I respect his decision to reject girls and take it as a man, but the way he executed was harsh and unforgivable. I try not to badmouth him in a rabid way, but the way the author made him act like a dense jerk.

I think that both Kuroneko's and Ayase's rejection scenes were handled better in the Light Novels.

To clarify, both scenes appear as flashbacks during the sequence where Kyousuke is chasing after Kirino who ran away after he told her that he is in love with someone. At that point, the reader still doesn't know who Kyousuke is referring to which makes the buildup toward his confession to Kirino much stronger. Both scenes are a bit more detailed as well.

[DorkingtonPugsly]

Kinda disappointed by that 'pretend' ending.