Character Discussion - Kallen

[Vakir]

Originally Posted by Narona

You can be single and live a normal life.

Certainly. But it's typically considered in the minority. Lelouch, I think, would want Kallen to find happiness in every aspect of her life, and I think Kallen might be able to find love regardless. It doesn't matter who, or when, it can still happen.

It's not so much that you can be single and have a normal life as it is that Kalulu fans are COUNTING on her being single because they can't bear to imagine her moving on because it would sink their ship. So they sacrifice a character possibility at the expense of holding out for something that's improbable.

By the way, "not lead a normal life" referred to the "Church of Lelouch" comment, an obvious joke, mirite?

[Narona]

Originally Posted by Vakir

Certainly. But it's typically considered in the minority. Lelouch, I think, would want Kallen to find happiness in every aspect of her life, and I think Kallen might be able to find love regardless. It doesn't matter who, or when, it can still happen.

It's not so much that you can be single and have a normal life as it is that Kalulu fans are COUNTING on her being single because they can't bear to imagine her moving on because it would sink their ship. So they sacrifice a character possibility at the expense of holding out for something that's improbable.

Me I am not a kalulu fan and I will say something again

Being part of a minority doesn't mean that you don't live a normal life or that one side is obviously right and the other is wrong.

[dec4rhapsody]

Originally Posted by Vakir

Certainly. But it's typically considered in the minority. Lelouch, I think, would want Kallen to find happiness in every aspect of her life, and I think Kallen might be able to find love regardless. It doesn't matter who, or when, it can still happen.

It's not so much that you can be single and have a normal life as it is that Kalulu fans are COUNTING on her being single because they can't bear to imagine her moving on because it would sink their ship. So they sacrifice a character possibility at the expense of holding out for something that's improbable.

Did SuzaEuphie sink because Euphie is dead and there is a minor chance between Suzaku and Nunnally?

[Vakir]

Originally Posted by Narona

Being part of a minority doesn't mean that you don't live a normal life or that one side is right and the other is wrong.

By the way, "not lead a normal life" referred to the "Church of Lelouch" comment, an obvious joke, mirite?

Did SuzaEuphie sink because Euphie is dead and there is a minor chance between Suzaku and Nunnally?

No, but if there was an epilogue that showed them together, it technically would. I'm saying people are denying the hypothetical because they don't like it.

"Single can be normal" =/= "Kallen will stay single for sure"

[Narona]

Originally Posted by dec4rhapsody

Did SuzaEuphie sink because Euphie is dead and there is a minor chance between Suzaku and Nunnally?

Suzaku is still in love with euphie. Back in april I said that the show will end with him still in love with euphie, and I think I was right

And I don't see him loving someone else. He gave up everything for the sake of a better world but also because he is euphie's lover. And ZR was also to make euphie's wish comes true. What suzaku did in memory of her is beautiful in my eyes. Same goes for lelouch.

[dec4rhapsody]

Originally Posted by Vakir

By the way, "not lead a normal life" referred to the "Church of Lelouch" comment, an obvious joke, mirite?



No, but if there was an epilogue that showed them together, it technically would. I'm saying people are denying the hypothetical because they don't like it.

"Single can be normal" =/= "Kallen will stay single for sure"

Nope, SuzaEuphie is still canon even if Suzaku moves on.

As for Kalulu, their story is complete (by now), and Kallen ending up with some other guy will NEVER obliterate what happened between her and Lelouch.

[Vakir]

Originally Posted by dec4rhapsody

Nope, SuzaEuphie is still canon even if Suzaku moves on.

Well, sure, in the timeline where she was still alive. I'm talking about, you know, NOW or in the hypothetical future.

As for Kalulu, their story is complete (by now), and Kallen ending up with some other guy will NEVER obliterate what happened between her and Lelouch.

Ok. I'm not trying to obliterate Kalulu. I'm saying she's not emotionally destroyed from him dying. Distraught, hurt, sad, empty for a long time, but not destroyed. Recoverable.

Single is fine. It doesn't mean she needs to stay single. It doesn't mean she doesn't. But people should not sit there and say "oh, she'll never move on, ever." That's a huge conclusion to jump to and is just wishful thinking on the behalf of people who are so strongly Kalulu that they don't want her character to go anywhere else.

[lovecakecookies]

Originally Posted by dec4rhapsody

Nope, SuzaEuphie is still canon even if Suzaku moves on.

As for Kalulu, their story is complete (by now), and Kallen ending up with some other guy will NEVER obliterate what happened between her and Lelouch.

Exactly, that's why I can see her moving on, eventually, I don't think anyone can say she will never move on...or she will most certainly move on....

So I guess it up to your interpretation again..

[FoxxFireArt]

Originally Posted by Narona

Suzaku is still in love with euphie. Back in april I said that the show will end with him still in love with euphie, and I think I was right

And I don't see him loving someone else. He gave up everything for the sake of a better world but also because he is euphie's lover. And ZR was also to make euphie's wish comes true. What suzaku did in memory of her is beautiful in my eyes. Same goes for lelouch.

I know. Suzaku and Euphy never even got to kiss and express that love.

Look at C.C. So many centuries passed and never found even slight love.

It would of been nice for Kallen and Nunnally to meet again. Those two had a lot in common. Now more then ever. Both lost the brothers that they loved dearly.

[bladeofdarkness]

dont see why people (who i assume like kallen) would wish for her to stay hung up on lelouch rather then move on and be happy
staying single is an option
but it denies her a whole world of expiriances that many consider to be the most importent in life

[Vakir]

Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness

dont see why people (who i assume like kallen) would wish for her to stay hung up on lelouch rather then move on and be happy
staying single is an option
but it denies her a whole world of expiriances that many consider to be the most importent in life

No, it's not Bizzaro-Vakir: I completely agree, and that's what I'm getting at. People who choose to be single aren't rejects and aren't malformed social abominations (as made clear by Narona), but for someone like Kallen who hasn't felt something like that fully reciprocated, she'd be denying herself a lot of potential happiness if she didn't at least give it a shot.

[Skellington2612]

I'm saying people are denying the hypothetical because they don't like it.

Aren´t you doing the same? People posts here what they think could happen or what they would like to happen... you too deny what you don´t like...

[Narona]

Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness

dont see why people (who i assume like kallen) would wish for her to stay hung up on lelouch rather then move on and be happy
staying single is an option
but it denies her a whole world of expiriances that many consider to be the most importent in life

Even if she chooses Gino ;p ?

I kiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiid

But again, it doesn't mean she can't be happy if she stays single. That was what was discussed here

[Vakir]

Originally Posted by Skellington2612

Aren´t you doing the same? People posts here what they think what could happen or what they would like to happen... you too deny what you don´t like...

No, I'm talking about why these hypothetical situations undermine certain things about her character or experience. I'm explaining the causal WHY in my opinion. Trying to paint me as a hypocrite isn't going to work. And even if I don't like them, nowhere did I say they were impossible, either. Just that it would be character assassination for many of them.

[yvj]

Originally Posted by Vakir

Explain how Kallen did not get necessary closure. Because as far as I'm concerned, the experience and things she learned from her time with Lelouch, the Black Rebellion, and the whole series converged to make her a better person regardless of whether she got some in the end. If you don't think that's how these experiences turn out, you've clearly never been dumped or had an open ended relationship in your life, which is extremely admirable and rare. But you'll find you learn a little from anything. Kallen's development wasn't wasted, I think (read: think, my opinion) you're just disappointed to see the couple not become canon.

For the most part we won't agree. This is obvious.

Long story short your opinion has been noted. I disagree with some things.

1) For me Kallen got closure. I would have preferred it to have been done better. I thought it was weak how she found it out, (just as it was weak how Nunnally found out) and when she found out. I believe she should have realized what was going on when it wasn't so freaking blunt and in her face. Her character was in a way wasted because in my view she was built up for something more (especially something more relevant to the plot) When you have the director saying the character is essential. You tend to think good things.

I actually think Kaguya's alleged route to the truth was actually better, but I realize weak closure is still closure.


2) I was fully prepared for Kalulu not to happen. As the C.C situation was just as possible. SO kalulu does not factor in as much in my dissatisfaction as it could have. Others wanted Kalulu to really happen. I'm not going to fault them at all because the storyline could have gone that way without much of a stretch.

And if he is alive. Than why is not a possibility, that if she learned of this, she would seek him out?

Originally Posted by Vakir

Except the only reason you'd believe she would stay single and not lead a normal life is because you only want Kalulu to exist. Any prospect of her moving on and getting with anyone else would shatter your OTP, but it would also be unrealistic. Kallen is an attractive older teen in a new, loving world who never even had a stable relationship in the first place (never had a kiss, am I correct?). Throw the bias aside a moment. You really think she'd stay celibate and single?

I have my bias obviously. My personal view has been stated above.

But I see the other side of the argument. Its possible that no one can live up to her memory of Lelouch. Psychologically its not as unrealistic as you claim.

I can see the hypothetical situation certain people are talking about. And that's why I'm here arguing.

[bladeofdarkness]

contrery to popular belif i dont dislike gino
i think he's a shallow choice for a love interest
but i dont dislike him
he just has no real reason to be paired with kallen since there is nothing in the story that makes it a realistic option

[Micante]

Originally Posted by yvj

I have my bias obviously. My personal view has been stated above.

But I see the other side of the argument. Its possible that no one can live up to her memory of Lelouch. Psychologically its not as unrealistic as you claim.

I can see the hypothetical situation certain people are talking about. And that's why I'm here arguing here for no reason.

No one's memory of Lelouch is exactly filled with roses and happiness... I'm not sure anyone would want their potential lovers to live up to the memory of Lelouch.

[Vakir]

Originally Posted by Micante

No one's memory of Lelouch is exactly filled with roses and happiness... I'm not sure anyone would want their potential lovers to live up to the memory of Lelouch.

Kallen's memories of Lelouch are pretty rosy-colored for various reasons. Naturally she has some darker stuff involving him too, but for the most part it's positive. C.C. as well.

[lovecakecookies]

Originally Posted by Micante

No one's memory of Lelouch is exactly filled with roses and happiness... I'm not sure anyone would want their potential lovers to live up to the memory of Lelouch.

LOL... Yeah.. thats true sort of..

[Micante]

Lelouch has been a lot of things throughout the series, but an ideal lover is definitely not one of them.