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View Poll Results: The Disappearance of Haruhi Suzumiya - Rating | |||
Perfect 10 | 236 | 64.31% | |
9 out of 10 : Excellent | 95 | 25.89% | |
8 out of 10 : Very Good | 25 | 6.81% | |
7 out of 10 : Good | 7 | 1.91% | |
6 out of 10 : Average | 3 | 0.82% | |
5 out of 10 : Below Average | 1 | 0.27% | |
4 out of 10 : Poor | 0 | 0% | |
3 out of 10 : Bad | 0 | 0% | |
2 out of 10 : Very Bad | 0 | 0% | |
1 out of 10 : Painful | 0 | 0% | |
Voters: 367. You may not vote on this poll |
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2010-08-22, 04:14 | Link #321 |
Sav'aaq!
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Hyrule
Age: 51
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I'd say anything that can be speculated from (or that is made obvious by) the movie should be fair game. Like Ijuinkun's comments. This is a "reviews" thread, so you'd expect to see descriptions of events from the movie, and speculation about hinted-at future events (confirmation, maybe not so much). The "why" is quite obvious in context, at least the primary reason why. But the "when"... *cough*
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2010-08-22, 23:14 | Link #322 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2007
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The mere fact that Kyon encountered his future self is enough of a "why"--in the Haruhiverse, once you have become aware of your future actions, they become "locked in" (the "predetermined events"). If Kyon encountered his future self in the movie, then according to the rules of Time Travel that Mikuru's group operate under, Kyon must at some later point travel back to be encountered by his younger self in order to close the time loop.
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2010-08-23, 00:17 | Link #323 |
Anime Cynic
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: USA
Age: 35
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It does bug me quite a bit that everyone (especially Kyon) feels that they HAVE to do something a certain way. Okay, so you were saved, and you remember that it was yourself that did the saving. That does NOT mean you have to go back in time and actually do that! The fact that Kyon is alive means that SOMEHOW he was saved. Is he just going to disappear sometime if he never goes back? Where do you draw the line? Let's say Kyon goes his whole life without traveling back in time. Now he's on his deathbed, and there are no more chances to go to the past. Does he disappear then? If anything, now that he's back, he doesn't have to do a darn thing. He's alive! That's the end of it!
...Sorry, it just frustrates me when the only reasoning for a character's actions is "the plot requires it" or "it just has to be this way." That's a sign of poor writing, IMO. |
2010-08-23, 09:36 | Link #326 | |
Anime Cynic
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: USA
Age: 35
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Oh sure, humor is a valid reason to do that sort of thing. No argument here. |
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2010-08-23, 15:44 | Link #328 |
Senior Member
Author
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: dnal tuo dnif ot gniyrt sdnoces evif detsaw uoy
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The only thing I was really confused about was what happened to Kyon during those three days. Did he really fall down the stairs or were they just memories created by Yuki? Also, wouldn't that mean Kyon aged three days? Or maybe everyone's memories of the alternate universe were only replaced by the new memories Yuki created but that's not possible since
Spoiler for book 7:
I'm just totally confused on how this repairing worked |
2010-08-26, 11:55 | Link #329 |
Anime Cynic
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: USA
Age: 35
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You know, I just realized that while I introduced myself on this forum and in this thread by starting a three page debate on time travel, I never explicitly said how I felt about Disappearance. Let's remedy that.
It looks like the author of the Haruhi series hit upon the solution to make the most out of his fictional world. How did he do that? Observe: 1. Get rid of the loud, annoying, crazy character. 2. Play up the only character that has any sort of usefulness. 3. Resurrect #2's rival. 4. Let everyone else fade to the background. Upgrade it to movie form by adding great music and animation, and you have what's literally the best thing that could happen to the series (you know, short of developing the other characters). Did that sound sarcastic or cynical? I didn't mean it to. I really did like the movie, and I'm looking forward to its DVD release. I truly think that as a part of the Haruhi series, it's the best of the novels I've read/watched (the first one is best if we're judging each independently of the others). But...what can I say? I call things like I see them. |
2010-08-26, 23:14 | Link #330 | |
~Official Slacker~
Author
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Xanadu
Age: 29
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2: Koizumi had "some" usefulness as well... Well... Possibly 3: Asakura Ryoko is possibly the only rival you do not want revived no matter what 4: Agree
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2010-08-27, 09:36 | Link #331 | |
Logician and Romantic
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Within my mind
Age: 43
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The first book in the series was written to be self-contained. After been told that his stories could be continued, the issue became HOW. The SOS-dan wasn't actually much of a team at all, by the end of the first book. And if they are not much of a team then there is no long term prospects in them having adventures together. Hence major story arcs were created in order literally alter each member's position in the story. The filming of the student film and the event leading to Live a Live was written to mellow Haruhi out, so that Kyon can reign her in when necessary. Endless Eight and Disappearance is about adding humanising elements to Yuki, and more importantly NERF her to hell so she wouldn't become game-breaking and make all future stories impossible. As for Itsuki and Mikuru? I won't spoil, but they got their own arcs later. Disappearance is not written as a movie. It was one of the more popular books because the author admits that Yuki Nagato is his personal favourite. But in the end the franchise is about the SOS-dan; as in, all four of them, together. Mikuru, especially, get a HUGE storyarc, one that might well envelope everything all the way to book 10. But we will see about that. Just because Yuki was the focus in her movie doesn't mean the other characters don't matter anymore.
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2010-08-27, 11:18 | Link #332 | ||||
Anime Cynic
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: USA
Age: 35
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Eh, he just fulfilled the role of "guy who explains to the audience what's going on," like he always does.
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The problem, to me anyway, is that developing Haruhi is so uninteresting because the best way to show that she's becoming more normal is to show her doing normal things. Normal things are...normal. She's in the odd situation where in order to be interesting/funny, she has to be a complete nut, and in order to not be a complete nut, she has to be uninteresting/boring. I say the above largely with Sigh in mind. But other episodes, such as Live a Live and Day of Sagittarius, were good precisely because of the animated format in which they were presented. In writing, they lack the punch that they have in the anime. That's not necessarily a bad thing; for example, Haruhi's singing scene was better in the book because it was more realistic. The anime version will always be more memorable, though. Quote:
Spoiler for Yuki's punishment:
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It's hard to develop Mikuru, who was established pretty firmly as a moe character and nothing else (she's really defined by her powerlessness). It's hard to develop Itsuki, whose only power is denied as Haruhi mellows. It's hard to develop Haruhi, because the "right" outcome for her is one where she's content and doesn't cause all the trouble that drives the stories. Kyon's easier to develop for the opposite reason: he starts out complacent, and his growth is shown by how much he decides to interfere with everything else. Yuki's easy to develop too, for the same reason. She was designed as a passive observer, so her growth occurs as she takes action. Which characters gain the most from development? Kyon and Yuki. Which characters does Disappearance revolve around? Kyon and Yuki. That's why Disappearance is the best thing that could happen to the series. Last edited by Gamer_2k4; 2010-08-29 at 03:19. |
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2010-08-27, 15:01 | Link #333 | |
Power of 9 SoShi-ist
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: USA
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2010-08-27, 16:12 | Link #334 | |
Anime Cynic
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: USA
Age: 35
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2) This is a bit trickier, but I think it would completely invalidate the purpose of Mikuru's people as "time police." Right now, from what I understand, Haruhi's "moment of godness" three years ago screwed up the time continuum pretty badly. The future that the time travelers exist in is now in danger of not existing if time doesn't occur as they remember, so they go back in time to force events that no longer seem will happen independently. Otherwise, they face the same spontaneous exclusion from reality that I questioned about happening to Kyon. If they're not predestined to go back in time, and we accept the alternate reality theory, then they can just sit down and do nothing. Why don't they? Probably because relying on time traveling sliders to just pop in and save everyone is a ridiculously long shot (though I still maintain that logic dictates it's going to happen, since the future as it is DOES in fact exist). |
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2010-08-27, 17:02 | Link #335 |
Gamilas Falls
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Republic of California
Age: 46
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Kyon's probably of the mindset that "Well I saw myself...means that I go back at some point...sooner or later." Might as well be sooner since he remembers what he said to himself now...that and Mikuru(small) was there, thus it couldn't be that much in the future (or could it...since she's...well, a time traveler). He's not encountered any sliders (other than himself perhaps) so he has no confidence in that possibility...thus he's resolved that he must do this at some point.
That may be predestination, but it also could be a choice. It depends on just how he decides to go back and save himself...or where the idea came from in the first place. Could Kyon's will to live (via either Yuki or Haruhi hax) be strong enough to have willed himself to travel in time to save his bleeding butt. Basically "I need to live...how can I live I'm bleeding out. Oh I could just save myself after I get out of all this" Poof, Mikuru(small) shows up (crying) with Kyon himself also present (also someone to stop Ryoko). Did his will to survive start the time loop, or was it something completely different? Because so far Mikuru's time travelers seem to be correct in their ideas....seem to be. There is a few gray areas around Haruhi and Kyon and perhaps Yuki.
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2010-08-27, 17:45 | Link #336 | |
Power of 9 SoShi-ist
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: USA
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I tend to prefer things simple, and a predestinarian view isn't so ugly a concept to me. I do like that the series dealt with the loop issue by treating changes to history as divergent realities, though I don't suppose it would be safe to discuss that much further on this thread. |
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2010-08-27, 21:05 | Link #337 | ||
Sav'aaq!
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Hyrule
Age: 51
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Quote:
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2010-08-28, 21:10 | Link #338 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2007
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I'd like to see Asakura doing more adversarial stuff as a regular opponent/enemy as opposed to always jumping straight to the "gotta kill Kyon" part. It would be more interesting for me to see her actually forming and carrying out plots to get Haruhi to create the wanted information burst instead of just going straight for the same tactic that has already failed.
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Tags |
best movie ever, haruhi suzumiya |
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