Code Geass Favourite Characters Poll

[Blue_Mercy]

Originally Posted by Airi

LET'S LOVE HIM!!!!!! PLEASE!!!!!!

Um....no thanks. Sometimes I think a person may take Suzaku's side to get a rise out of other people or they are angry at Lelouch for ruining the SuzakuXEuphie pairing.

[Var]

Originally Posted by Blue_Mercy

Um....no thanks. Sometimes I think a person may take Suzaku's to get a rise out of other people or they are angry at Lelouch for ruining the SuzakuXEuphie pairing.

Or they could identify with the person they think is actually the good guy, even if he is the antagonist. I mean, that's how most of the first season portrayed him up till the end. Until, finally, they showed just how messed up he was.

[DeotoxSlayer]

Originally Posted by Narona

Lelouch, C.C. .



They need more love, seriously :/

I agree on Ougi...I mean how can the guy be less popular that the emperor, and have only two more votes that Clovis???


I still can't beleive Nina's last name is Einstien...makes me wanna punch Tanaguchi for ruining the Good name of Einstien by giving it to such a stupid character., and I'm also extremely disappointed that Nina has more votes that Tamaki, and Rivalz.

[Narona]

Originally Posted by DeotoxSlayer

I agree on Ougi...I mean how can the guy be less popular that the emperor, and have only two more votes that Clovis???

That's a shame . Ougi is a good guy and we also know that Viletta has a 'good side' . They need to be loved .

[Kobukson]

Originally Posted by Blue_Mercy

Um....no thanks. Sometimes I think a person may take Suzaku's side to get a rise out of other people or they are angry at Lelouch for ruining the SuzakuXEuphie pairing.

To KrimzonStriker: Lol! I do admit I do quite a bit of anti-Lulu targeting and concede that it is more likely that Lulu isn't as convoluted as I speculated he might be. I think part of my issue might be as Blue Mercy said with the whole "He screwed SuzakuXEuphie!!!".

However in Suzaku's defense, while his "good guy" policies may have arisen from selfish rather than altruistic intentions (faking), that isn't too dissimilar from Lulu's own creation of the Japanese revolution; both have done actions that have led to side effects others desired (saving civilians, creating the free Japanese state) despite the fact their motives weren't driven by the corresponding ideologies we'd expect from them.

I'll be interested to see how a broken hearted Suzaku plays out in R2 and whether we'll see more depth into the whole "Lulu is treating (almost) everyone like pawns in a chess game" theory.

[ashlay]

Originally Posted by Narona

That's a shame . Ougi is a good guy and we also know that Viletta has a 'good side' . They need to be loved .

there'll be a new thread for s2 in good time. now that we know how awesome ougi is, I'm sure he'll get more votes this time around.

Originally Posted by Kobukson

I'll be interested to see how a broken hearted Suzaku plays out in R2 and whether we'll see more depth into the whole "Lulu is treating (almost) everyone like pawns in a chess game" theory.

nope, we won't. You heard Ougi in episode 11: "Those who understand hatred should also understand sorrow." Lelouch can never treat his friends or his subordinates or even random civilians as mere chess pieces.

[zalem]

Originally Posted by Kobukson

However in Suzaku's defense, while his "good guy" policies may have arisen from selfish rather than altruistic intentions (faking), that isn't too dissimilar from Lulu's own creation of the Japanese revolution; both have done actions that have led to side effects others desired (saving civilians, creating the free Japanese state) despite the fact their motives weren't driven by the corresponding ideologies we'd expect from them.

It's different in that Lulu knew perfectly well and admitted to using the Japanese to further his own ends. He doesn't believe in all that "allies of justice" crap....he said himself that it's something the people like to hear. The stuff Zero says is said to gain people to his side, to manipulate. He doesn't believe in any of it. Lulu's goals are perfectly selfish and he recognizes this. He knows perfectly well what he is doing. Of course, I suppose people will think he's a bastard because of that but I sympathize with him. What annoyed me about Suzaku is that he wasn't recognizing that what he was doing was hypocritical at all. He just kept going on and on with his self-righteousness. Of course, things are different with him now so I'm really curious where they go with his character.

[Dann of Thursday]

Well, I think Lelouch himself likes the idea of allies of justice but knows that such a thing cannot truly exist. He may believe some of it would be nice to have in this world, but right now he needs to focus on the goals in front of him. He really isn't all that selfish since selfish implies you are doing it for yourself. Lelouch doesn't really care what happens to him as long as Nunnally can be happy in the end and he can get rid of the world as it is now by defeating Britannia.

[KrimzonStriker]

Also, he's had amnesia for like a year and he's still saying the sames thing he was always saying, without Nunnally or revenge on his mind for the past year, so that takes away the selfish motivation part I think you were pointing out since his who reason to be 'selfish' is well... not there anymore and he still keeps making this statement about how corrupt the world is, how to be strong is not justice, et cetra. He was just a bit more tame about his beliefs, because he lacked the personal involvement to want to do anything about it, even though he thought it was wrong or was opposed to it, well that is until the Awakening

[germanturkey]

jeez, whats with all the suzaku hate? he's the type of character who i try to model myself after in real life. (except the killing father part). Chivalrous, white knight type.

voted for suzaku, cc, milly, and arthur.

[KrimzonStriker]

Because he's not like that at all, he's actually a selfish brat who thinks his way is the way everyone should live their lives by and claims it as righteous even after witnessing firsthand the many atrocities of Britannia, that's why

[ashlay]

Originally Posted by germanturkey

jeez, whats with all the suzaku hate? he's the type of character who i try to model myself after in real life. (except the killing father part). Chivalrous, white knight type.

voted for suzaku, cc, milly, and arthur.

Suzaku's no chivalrous knight...well, maybe in 21 and part of 22, but that was it.

Yeah, Suzaku was a very sick person in season 1, and now he's just a killer who has chosen order over chaos. There's not much of a reason to hate him now of course, but boku Suzaku was nothing but a delusional, hypocritical, highly selfish fool, and there's plenty to hate about that.

[germanturkey]

he had ideals that he couldn't follow, which makes him more human than a lot of the other characters

[ashlay]

Originally Posted by germanturkey

he had ideals that he couldn't follow, which makes him more human than a lot of the other characters

those ideals were expedient means to alleviate his own guilt about killing his father. He never made any progress in realizing any of them, and once he overcame his guilt in 20, he discarded them for first Euphie's dream, and then to assure that Lelouch's dream would never, ever become a reality.

Even with the power of a Knight of the Rounds, Suzaku has just stood by and let Japan rot. Of course he's free to do that, there's plenty of reasons to not care about the Japanese, but it's clear that his ideals and goals indeed have nothing to do with making the Japanese's lives better. Don't confuse goals and ideals with mere devices. Whatever Suzaku truly wants in life, he's obtained it as the Knight of Seven. And it didn't have anything to do with a single word he said in the first 20 odd weeks.

[Dann of Thursday]

Taniguchi has pretty much made it clear through interviews and such that one is not supposed to like Suzaku and if you do, you are missing how sick of a person he really is with his ideals and such.

In truth, Suzaku doesn't really care all that much about the ideals he claims to have. All they serve to do help him convince himself that killing his Father was not a mistake and that he did the right thing.

Koshimuzu wrote up the best explanation on how Suzaku is not really that good of a person as he may seem to be with being all goody.

[ashlay]

Originally Posted by Dann of Thursday

Taniguchi has pretty much made it clear through interviews and such that one is not supposed to like Suzaku and if you do, you are missing how sick of a person he really is with his ideals and such.

In truth, Suzaku doesn't really care all that much about the ideals he claims to have. All they serve to do help him convince himself that killing his Father was not a mistake and that he did the right thing.

Koshimuzu wrote up the best explanation on how Suzaku is not really that good of a person as he may seem to be with being all goody.

koshimizu's explanation was a good one for what exactly was so wrong with Suzaku in season 1.

But of course, those days are gone. Suzaku's now no different than everyone else: pitting his desires against the world. I'm sure a lot of people want him to lose of course, but there shouldn't be any hard feelings, not anymore.

[Dann of Thursday]

A bit of a rant maybe, but it gets the point across.

I suppose you could say Suzaku is now a better person since he stopped lying to himself. We'll just have to see what happens from here with him.

Lelouch too, though the fact they plan on making him more likeable is a good sign for him.

[KrimzonStriker]

He's not a better person as far as I can tell, he's still the same egotistical, blood-curling, and submissive dog he always was, he's just admitted it to himself. Like I said, I'll probably respect him more as an adversary for Lelouch instead of pretending to be his friend, but that doesn't mean I don't think his cause and his reasons are just plain screwed up...>_>

[ashlay]

Originally Posted by Dann of Thursday

A bit of a rant maybe, but it gets the point across.

I suppose you could say Suzaku is now a better person since he stopped lying to himself. We'll just have to see what happens from here with him.

Lelouch too, though the fact they plan on making him more likeable is a good sign for him.

Any discussion of either Lelouch or Suzaku's motivations inevitably turns into a bit of a rant on everyone's part. Just look at most of the morality discussion thread. 0_o

Originally Posted by KrimzonStriker

He's not a better person as far as I can tell, he's still the same egotistical, blood-curling, and submissive dog he always was, he's just admitted it to himself. Like I said, I'll probably respect him more as an adversary for Lelouch instead of pretending to be his friend, but that doesn't mean I don't think his cause and his reasons are just plain screwed up...>_>

even a dog has his pride. Suzaku might be more or less a puppet of V.V. and the Empire, but it was his choice, and he's doing it for his reasons. You may think fighting for Britannia is screwed up, but what these soldiers are fighting for, whether it be Cornelia or Darlton or Guilford or Suzaku (and probably quite a few of the KotRs), isn't something that can be written off and condemned as "wrong".

If you want to talk about Lloyd and Cecile, or Viletta, or Schneizel (in a completely different way. >_>), then we might be able to say they're fighting for the wrong reasons. But not Suzaku, not anymore.

[Dann of Thursday]

Originally Posted by KrimzonStriker

He's not a better person as far as I can tell, he's still the same egotistical, blood-curling, and submissive dog he always was, he's just admitted it to himself. Like I said, I'll probably respect him more as an adversary for Lelouch instead of pretending to be his friend, but that doesn't mean I don't think his cause and his reasons are just plain screwed up...>_>

Yeah, all that is pretty much still true. The only thing I get out of the new him at all is that we'll be able to see him as a more worthy adversary than before like you said.

Originally Posted by ashlay

Any discussion of either Lelouch or Suzaku's motivations inevitably turns into a bit of a rant on everyone's part. Just look at most of the morality discussion thread. 0_o

Yeah that is true. Many seem to be convinced that Lelouch is the next Light Yagami and Suzaku is a paragon of virtue in some cases. While arguments saying the opposite are somewhat more correct they can still be subject to incorrect assumptions I suppose.