Gundam Build Divers - Episode 13 Discussion / Poll

[Obelisk ze Tormentor]

Originally Posted by Skye629

We've also already established that he's pretty lucky, so there's that.

Well, I guess that answers everything. And it seems his luck also rub off on his teammates as well since they were all able to dodge the Big Zam's million beams while various Force Captains got vaporized. I got a better name for such luck: plot armor. The same thing that Heero used when he blew Wing up with him still on it .

Originally Posted by Skye629

And for those who were wondering:

Umm....I guess the mech looks better in the anime than IRL. Kind of disappointed. I thought the colors are gonna be darker.

[magnumcyclonex]

I'm quite disappointed in this episode. We had the perfect opportunity to dig up some GBF nostalgia, but when we actually got to it, there was no "please set your Gundam", or announcement of "Plavisky Particles". Where was the wonder and awe of this "ancient" way of fighting that would've been brand new to Riku? It was like...nope, the controls are the same so you don't need a warm up, let's begin the GP Duel.

And for Riku to be so good and already get used to the new environment, let alone deal the winning blow to Tsukasa? Really? What kind of writing is this? How do you set the bar so high (Tsukasa was successful in his heyday right?) and then crap all over it in literally the next episode? They did the same when the OP's team battles Rommel's group. Doesn't make sense when you say Rommel is one of the best, and you write it in a way that Riku et al take the win.

I think the only saving grace was the speech about loving Gundam despite the changes, and the relationship Tsukasa has to Riku's team mate.

The show did a good job of having Tsukasa and Riku actually meet in person, but we still haven't met Ayame and Sarah in person, so the writing is still bad imo. Not that we need to meet them, but I wish the subject was addressed in some way.

[Nvis]

No leaks to Riku's new Gunpla? Seriously?


Did he take Tsukasa's idea and use the n-I-t-r-o system, whatever the heck that is?

[Obelisk ze Tormentor]

Originally Posted by magnumcyclonex

I'm quite disappointed in this episode. We had the perfect opportunity to dig up some GBF nostalgia, but when we actually got to it, there was no "please set your Gundam", or announcement of "Plavisky Particles". Where was the wonder and awe of this "ancient" way of fighting that would've been brand new to Riku? It was like...nope, the controls are the same so you don't need a warm up, let's begin the GP Duel.

I think the show did that precisely because they want to stress and establish that this is not GBF-verse but instead, a new GBD-verse.

Originally Posted by magnumcyclonex

The show did a good job of having Tsukasa and Riku actually meet in person, but we still haven't met Ayame and Sarah in person, so the writing is still bad imo. Not that we need to meet them, but I wish the subject was addressed in some way.

Ayame can be a shy boy for all I care. Unlike Koichi, we have less reason to meet Ayame's IRL persona. She can just keep being a mysterious kunoichi throughout the series. Also, Sarah is definitely a running mystery for the show, so I don't expect her identity to be revealed until a bit closer to the end.

[Faux Mecha]

i heard people said Tsukasa's custom Astray's name is a reference to a western movie starring Clint Eastwood titled Man with No Name, is that even true?

[Obelisk ze Tormentor]

Originally Posted by Faux Mecha

i heard people said Tsukasa's custom Astray's name is a reference to a western movie starring Clint Eastwood titled Man with No Name, is that even true?

Most likely, especially with the poncho:



Also, the title is not "Man with no Name". That's what people call Clint's character. The movies are called "Dollars Trilogy" with the most famous one titled "The Good, the Bad and the Ugly". It's from "Spaghetti Western"-genre which means western movies made by Italians.

IIRC the Tequila Gundam in episode 4 was supposedly based on a certain western character too but for the life of me, I can't remember someone specific.

[Tactics]

Originally Posted by Skye629

And for those who were wondering:

Woah, nice!

Definitely my favorite Gundam on this series ... despite the series still not excited me after I leave it to see if Episode 13 will make it better.
Riku have no issue to win against more experienced player behind what happened, also on game system that Tsukasa more experienced with? Yeah, sure.

[Kanon]

Originally Posted by Nvis

No leaks to Riku's new Gunpla? Seriously?


Did he take Tsukasa's idea and use the n-I-t-r-o system, whatever the heck that is?

I had never heard of that system either. Apparently it's a system that grants regular pilots newtype abilities, in which case I'm not sure what it actually does in the game.

[Rising Dragon]

NITRO System originates from the Mobile Suit Gundam U.C. 0094: Across the Sky game, installed on the Gundam Delta Kai.

For those of you complaining about Riku crying over the damage to the 00 Diver, saying Sei should knock some sense into him: Sei had the same goddamn problem. He had to grow out of it, but you guys are condemning Riku for not yet having the chance to do the same. Take off your nostalgia filters for a few moments, please.

For those of you complaining about him winning: while I too would've preferred he lose (because with his victory, we're now at the stage of "Now what?"), all he did was make a last second, unsuccessful dodge and impale the No-Name while he was open. Lots of more experienced fighters can lose to similar maneuvers, especially when they think their victory is assured. 00 Diver Ace had accrued more damage and Tsukasa still proved to be the better fighter. It wasn't an even fight in the slightest. It's not a case of "Well Riku won, so he's better than this far more experienced player." So again, you're letting your bias against the story show.

[quagmire]

I certainly see Tsukasa's point he was trying to make. In GBF and GBF Try, everyone took pride in the Gunpla's they built. If they got damaged, they rebuilt them and improved the model. The Gunpla reflects on their journey through Gunpla battle. GBN certainly seems to lack that pride for the Gunpla or rather the Gunpla represents something different. As seen with Ayame, Gunpla in GBN represents the friends one makes within the system. You see it in this episode when Riku was thinking how his friends in GBN helped him get this far by saying it wasn't just him that built 00 Diver. It wasn't really until Sarah told Riku that Trans Am was hurting 00 Diver did he really start caring about the Gunpla itself. Though he stopped using it more out of Sarah's feelings than the fact he didn't want to hurt the Gunpla. So far though no one else in GBN has that same pride feeling GBF/GBF Try had. Maybe the Wolf boy that sees Gunpla as artistic expression, but again not the same feeling.

I certainly like the GBF/GPD format better. You can certainly have both though in the GBN world. Have Tsukasa's pride as a fighter and builder where his Gunpla is his partner, but also have the friends and adventure part too.

[Skye629]

As a video gamer, there's something I really want to point out here

Being a veteran player DOES NOT instantly hand you a win

The main advantage veteran players have in an action/mmo game like this is they know the game really well, down to little interactions/life hacks/best spots etc. And a generally better battle sense (for lack of a better term) that is accrued over time (when to do certain actions in response to certain things). This is their biggest advantage.HOWEVER

The MOST IMPORTANT things in an ACTION FIGHTING GAME (because at the core, this is what GPD is) are skills like your reaction time, hand-eye coordination, adaptability etc. As a new player, if you possess high levels of these the gap between you and veteran/pro players are closed immensely. A naturally good battle sense coupled with good natural instincts also pretty much neutralizes most of a veteran players advantages. The rest can be gained over a short period of time

Playing and being with better players generally ups you skill's as well, so long as you're looking to improve. Riku has been getting that in spades along with general time/experience being spent in the game like a normal player


Riku vs Tsukasa was really nothing more than a new CoD player playing against a veteran CoD player on one of the older games (say MW4). The controls and base mechanics are like 95% similar.

While I would have preferred a "Draw" outcome, Riku winning was nowhere near out of the realm of possibility



Quick note: This is not taking into account Gunpla build quality/skills, which is another large factor entirely. Riku has enough support however that his Gunpla at the very least can keep up with the better machines out there



A funny thought that occurred to me.....a huge catalyst for Riku's growth and connections is actually that random player that tried to con him at the start. If he hadn't done that Magee would have never intervened (which in doing so set off a crazy amount of connections/networking to other higher level players)

[BoyTitan]

I don't get why both games can't exist at the same time. I like the hate towards the new game and the old game lack of existence being addressed. But I just can't see the old game dieing so much to the point no one play its anymore so its completely dead. Both games should be able to exist with gbn just be more popular regulation GPD to eternal second place. Like you can make a living in GBN but GPD pro players for the most part struggle. There were better ways to go about it. Still a really good story line just could have been done better. GBN does have the huge advantage of global multiplayer though...

[Rising Dragon]

Originally Posted by BoyTitan

I don't get why both games can't exist at the same time. I like the hate towards the new game and the old game lack of existence being addressed. But I just can't see the old game dieing so much to the point no one play its anymore so its completely dead. Both games should be able to exist with gbn just be more popular regulation GPD to eternal second place. Like you can make a living in GBN but GPD pro players for the most part struggle. There were better ways to go about it. Still a really good story line just could have been done better. GBN does have the huge advantage of global multiplayer though...

To understand this, go back to the start of Gundam Build Fighters Try, and listen to Miyagi's points when he was trying to get Fumina to join his club.

GP Duel, like Gunpla Battle in GBF, is expensive for players. The Gunpla get damaged from the battles. You have to spend money and buy new parts and new models to continue playing each time the model gets damaged. For players that aren't that good, it's a huge downside to playing, and it will keep would-be rookies from playing the game, especially if they're not that wealthy.

GBN Online, however, is simply a simulation. It scans the model and you use that in-game, and win or lose you don't need to worry about the health of your Gunpla afterwards. It draws more players in, and has a bunch of advantages besides--you get to play with the full-scale machines in a larger environment, with far more options on what you can do.

Whatever business involved likely controls both GP Duel and GBN Online. As a business, they'd naturally prioritize development of the product that gets them more customers and more money.

Chances are GP Duel is still played, but it's a far more niche hobby now than it was then in GBD. Eventually the company in charge will shut down development of the less popular product to divert resources to the newer, more popular one. And the game scene will move with it, going from GP Duel tournaments to GBN Online tournaments. Audiences do the same, leaving those who don't want to migrate in the dust. Like Tsukasa was.

[Obelisk ze Tormentor]

You know what, since this show has been really really shy about making Riku loses a fight or humiliated, I got this nagging feeling that if not for the obligatory “midseason upgrade”, Riku wouldn’t even suffer this much damage and would’ve gotten more of a straight-up win this episode and humiliated Tsukasa even more (which is saying something since Tsukasa already left crying like a bitch in this episode ).

If not in the technical department then I’m afraid Riku is OP when it comes to narrative/plot. I mean, we’re already halfway in the show and Riku has yet to receive his straight-up loss, and after this, he’ll get an even better Gunpla. By this point in the show, Reiji & Sekai already got their straight-up losses against their relative peers. Reiji already lost to Tatsuya in episode 6 of GBF while Sekai got his ass handed to him by Minato in episode 4 of GBFT. By comparison, Riku has never suffered a straight-up loss in a legit duel. Even Ogre could not claim a legit win against Riku since their fight happened during a chaotic event involving Mass Divers and Riku got caught off-guard by Ogre’s sudden aggression towards him. And in their so-called “rematch”, Ogre had to admit his Force’s loss due to certain complications.

This episode should’ve been a perfect opportunity to have Riku lost and bring him down-to-Earth especially after his big Deus Ex-Victory in the great battle against the Big Zam. Furthermore, (please correct me if I’m wrong) Tsukasa himself said the deal to return the SD kit to Ayame was only to have Riku fight him in GPD, right? Riku doesn’t have to win, right? If so, then it’s even more of a perfect opportunity for Riku to experience loss in the story.

It’s almost like the show is afraid to have Riku lost a fight for some reason. That really disappoints me as I thought by having a more down-to-Earth MC will make the fights even more exciting, compelling and less predictable than previous Build shows. Surely that’s not a farfetched or unreasonable expectation, right? Instead, we got an MC that never lost a legit duel (so far) despite supposedly being a fairly normal boy. How come the super-powered MCs of past Build series are allowed to lose (which makes for a better story) but normal-boy Riku isn’t? To add insult to injury, Riku doesn’t have much of a personality. And don’t even get me on Riku’s Deus Ex-Waifu. The only positive thing I can get out of Riku so far is that at least he doesn’t have the equivalent of the annoying Build Knuckle (I hope I don’t jinx it by saying that).

Here’s hoping things improve in the second cour. I still enjoy this series but, god, it could’ve been so much better. The amount of wasted potential in this show is just too much. It reminds me of AGE.

[Rising Dragon]

Obelisk, Reiji vs Tatsuya round 1 and Riku vs Ogre round 1 were practically the same. They weren't even proper duels, with both protagonists having the battle forced on them by their respective rivals--as you may remember, Tatsuya started up the fight immediately after Reiji beat Gonda. No formal request, he just pissed Reiji off so Reiji would come after him.

Riku lost then, just as Reiji lost. The machines' lack of damage was even the same.

Let's not play this selective memory game. You're better than this.

[Obelisk ze Tormentor]

Originally Posted by Rising Dragon

Obelisk, Reiji vs Tatsuya round 1 and Riku vs Ogre round 1 were practically the same. They weren't even proper duels, with both protagonists having the battle forced on them by their respective rivals--as you may remember, Tatsuya started up the fight immediately after Reiji beat Gonda. No formal request, he just pissed Reiji off so Reiji would come after him.

Riku lost then, just as Reiji lost. The machines' lack of damage was even the same.

Let's not play this selective memory game. You're better than this.

My bad, I mis-typed. I meant "episode 5 in GBF" where Reiji & Sei got a proper match with Tatsuya and the dynamic duo ended up losing. I'll edit my previous post to not cause further confusion. Thus, my points still stand.

[Rising Dragon]

Episode 6, you mean. 5 was Mao's introduction.

[Tactics]

I personally do not side with "everything can happened on battlefield so even veterans can be defeated by newbie" reason for this;
Even with Riku is said to have crazy good eye-to-hand-coordination that make him capable to do almost anything, the difference is still there.

Reiji and Sekai also have it too, but later Tatsuya and Minato affirming, "Sorry guys, different stage requires effort" with they showing what they're capable of.
Here Riku is dealing with someone who supposed to have better knowledge about Break Decal and capable of applying NITRO System, the gap is enough to consider Riku victory is like seeing Patrick score victory in serious match against Graham, not impossible but very hard to believe considering how visible the gap that a lose would be more understandable.

[charasu]

Goddamit, that such nice battle, but the lack of aiyaiyai make it drop for the tense(ノ-_-)ノ~┻━┻

[Rising Dragon]

Originally Posted by Tactics

I personally do not side with "everything can happened on battlefield so even veterans can be defeated by newbie" reason for this;
Even with Riku is said to have crazy good eye-to-hand-coordination that make him capable to do almost anything, the difference is still there.

Reiji and Sekai also have it too, but later Tatsuya and Minato affirming, "Sorry guys, different stage requires effort" with they showing what they're capable of.
Here Riku is dealing with someone who supposed to have better knowledge about Break Decal and capable of applying NITRO System, the gap is enough to consider Riku victory is like seeing Patrick score victory in serious match against Graham, not impossible but very hard to believe considering how visible the gap that a lose would be more understandable.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but if you're a super-experienced dumbass who stands stock still after hitting your opponent non-fatally, you deserve to be run through.