Cat Shit One

[Sotobrastos]

You're honestly blowing this out of proportion.

It's some animals killing each other, dude. This is like dumb fundamentalists burning Harry Potter books and calling Pokemon satanic.

[Vexx]

Originally Posted by Darkcraft

I just saw the first episode and i have a moral problem with this animé. Cg is great etc ..im ok with this but i will say the fact this animé is technically good make it even more dangerous
Why? cause i went to the KLIK Amsterdam Animation Festival in 2008, in the Netherlands and saw exactly the same thing : a cute animal hero killing easily tons of bad and smelly uncute animals with technics coming from high tech material and intelligence/training

...

Um..... ever read Watership Down?????? Wind in the Willows? Mouse Guard? Redwall Abbey?

Talk about heading down a bizarre path here o.O

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by Darkcraft

not at all especially learning today this story is 20 years old reading the paper manga

i just state they were out of luck cause 2010 really wasn't the good time at all to call french pig..when it is the actual racist insult in the streets on one hand and the motto of nationalists on the other hand..its a free meal for these 2 types of dangerous guys, mostly youngs and adept of animé and games. they are transforming everything to their liking and for their idiot fight
we have murders each days and we don't know the future: nationalism, civil war etc..
We even had riots with firearms this night on this theme

it would not have been the same in 1990 when the paper manga was printed

See, but these guys will riot and murder ANYWAY without the manga. Why should we try to make those scum feel better? If they want to see insult when there are none, they are the ones to blame. The hatred is already there, it's not going to go away just because an authentic story about the Vietnam war used a different animal to represent the French.

[lightbringer]

Originally Posted by Vexx

Um..... ever read Watership Down?????? Wind in the Willows? Mouse Guard? Redwall Abbey?

Talk about heading down a bizarre path here o.O

This sums it up nicely.

We do not need politically correct satire. It seems these days you can't even sneeze without insulting someone's cultural sensibilities. Cat Shit One is fine the way it is, both the original manga and this episode. Similarities to Nazi propaganda are of course unfortunate but I don't see it as being intended in any way, shape, or form here. The idea that it should all be the same animal because otherwise it's discriminating is simply ludicrous.

Also, rabbits are not cute. They smell. And they bite.

[stormy001_M1A2]

Originally Posted by Vexx

Um..... ever read Watership Down?????? Wind in the Willows? Mouse Guard? Redwall Abbey?

Talk about heading down a bizarre path here o.O

It is a typical case of people seeing the phantom of their own delusion out of something direct.

[Bonta Kun]

Originally Posted by lightbringer

This sums it up nicely.

We do not need politically correct satire. It seems these days you can't even sneeze without insulting someone's cultural sensibilities. Cat Shit One is fine the way it is, both the original manga and this episode. Similarities to Nazi propaganda are of course unfortunate but I don't see it as being intended in any way, shape, or form here. The idea that it should all be the same animal because otherwise it's discriminating is simply ludicrous.

Also, rabbits are not cute. They smell. And they bite.

lol I knew what where that link was gonna take me, had to be
I was gonna bring up that ref before but then thought about it and decided to wait for someone else to, wanted to see how long before someone did.
One of my favorite bunny moments.

"a vicious streak a mile wide!"

[ChaosPaladin]

when is episode 2 coming out!!!! argh, i can't take it anymore. i need episode 2

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by ChaosPaladin

when is episode 2 coming out!!!! argh, i can't take it anymore. i need episode 2

A Japanese fan supposedly twittered the production crew about it and they said it will be next year. Don't panic yet; it's not confirmed.

[TinyRedLeaf]

Every time we argue, a bunny gets killed somewhere.

OK, before we all get too hot and flustered, let's step back a little and reflect a bit more.

Originally Posted by Darkcraft

I just saw the first episode and i have a moral problem with this animé. Cg is great etc ..im ok with this but i will say the fact this animé is technically good make it even more dangerous

Why? cause i went to the KLIK Amsterdam Animation Festival in 2008, in the Netherlands and saw exactly the same thing : a cute animal hero killing easily tons of bad and smelly uncute animals with technics coming from high tech material and intelligence/training

the problem is that it was a cartoon propaganda 1943 film from goebbels direct for german kids. it was restaured from parts found around 2005 in german archives. a good cute and intelligent fox killing lot of bad, smelly and uncute rhinoceroses (means "nose horns" in german meaning.. jews)

there is always something behing choice of animals..It can be good if you always end it with a moral/teaching like with la fontaine but it can also lead to the worst easily. and i find it leads to the worst here..no teaching at the end despise lot of troubling analogism:x heroes leaving on a sunset :x

First of all, I do think Darkcraft makes some valid points, even if I do not agree with his interpretations. The point of the matter is that all stories are created from a historical context, one that usually reflects some aspect of a storyteller's personal prejudices. That is a given. This is why a thorough study of any story — or any form of art, for that matter, from literature to movies and music — has to include some research on a creator's biography and the cultural background in which he grew up.

Depending on how one approaches the subject, it's not necessarily a case of "blowing things out of proportion". Take Rudyard Kipling's writing, for example. The Nobel Laureate for Literature composed The White Man's Burden, a poem that urged people to tackle social ills wherever they may exist. Unfortunately, it also came to be seen as an unconscious manifestation of cultural bigotry, a belief that Western civilisation during the Victorian era represented the pinnacle of civilisation that all other societies should aspire to.

Is the message behind the poem necessarily bad, even if it was written with good intentions? And, was Rudyard Kipling a white supremacist? To answer such questions, we need to have a deeper understanding of his personality and biography and, more importantly, the moral character of society during the Victorian era.

Judged in the light of today's moral norms, the poem can seem politically insensitive but, in the time of Queen Victoria, it could have served as a powerful call to social activism.

So, to return to Darkcraft's concern, yes, I do understand where he is coming from. A show as apparently harmless as Cat Shit One can, in the wrong context, deliver an unintended message of racism, in the same way The White Man's Burden also came to be reviled as a misguided appeal to Western arrogance within Kipling's lifetime.

The lesson from Darkcraft's reference to the German propaganda cartoon is that, sometimes, we can't immediately see how dangerous even seemingly innocuous stories can be.

Now, while I agree that this should rightly be a concern, I don't fully agree that it is necessarily applicable to Cat Shit One, in contrast to Goebbel's cartoon. That was the product of an ultra-nationalist regime, whose record was already plain for all Europe to see by the 1930s, even before World War II broke out. Granted, I haven't seen the said cartoon, but its inherent intent was probably clear to other parties at the time of its creation.

Cat Shit One, on the other hand, is the product of a Japanese team of writers and animators, whose only intent was probably to make some cool entertainment. True, it picks up most of its basic plot from current affairs, with heavy reference, obviously, to the ongoing fighting in Afghanistan and Iraq.

And, while it's true that the corrollary Arabs in this animated short are crudely portrayed as the bad guys, let's face it: It is not far removed from what we already see in the media today, with regard to the conduct of some extremist fighters.

So, what I'm saying is that Cat Shit One is no more guilty of "propaganda" than what is already out there in the news. The animated short comprises no more than 22 minutes of actual footage. It doesn't have a lot of time to give us sufficient exposition to create an alternate universe with great narrative depth. So, it relies instead on what most people already "know" about the ongoing war, and allows their imagination to fill in the details.

=========

As for the implied "racism", through the use of cute rabbits to portray heroes and ugly, crazed camels to portray the villains, again it's an issue of intent versus viewers' perspectives.

It would take a stretch of imagination to believe that insult was truly intended through the choice of animal avatars for any given ethnicity. The most we can say is that some of the choices may seem insensitive on hindsight.

But can we really hold the creators responsible for that? People can be sensitive about almost anything they don't find to their liking. Many viewers blasted, for example, Star Wars Episode I for its "insensitive" use of Chinese accents for the aliens of the Trade Federation. And many were definitely not amused with Jar Jar Bink's caricature of Jamaican speech and behaviour.

"Racism" was seen when none was probably intended.


So, let me put it this way: If there are people who find the characterisation in Cat Shit One offensive, let's by all means talk about it. It's not wrong to point out how various symbols can appear insulting, because it's certainly true that we are not often aware of our own prejudices.

But to accuse a show like this of overt racism? That would take a great deal more substantiation than that provided by personal opinion.

[SaintessHeart]

Originally Posted by Vexx

Um..... ever read Watership Down?????? Wind in the Willows? Mouse Guard? Redwall Abbey?

Talk about heading down a bizarre path here o.O

Weasels aren't cute!

*sees a weaselgirl*

I take my words back. Funny that you mentioned a children's book in that list.

[Casshern]

It's pretty obvious that the animals weren't meant to be flattering to any of the ethnicities they portrayed, and for some people it can hit a little too close to home. But imo this is no more or less offensive than something like team america. Wether you're offended or not depends on the individual viewer's circumstances.

Spoiler:

[wingdarkness]

Well I'm kinda dead inside since I just found out this isn't a weekly series like I thought T_T...

But on to more important questions, any word on whether PETA is gonna torch Japan over this Cat$hit?

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by wingdarkness

Well I'm kinda dead inside since I just found out this isn't a weekly series like I thought T_T...

But on to more important questions, any word on whether PETA is gonna torch Japan over this Cat$hit?

Well, I am pretty sure PETA couldn't decide which animal side to support.

[wingdarkness]

^Oh it's Bunnies FTW...

Imagine just popping a CD of Cat$hit One into the TV in a PETA break-room...How many mofos would be secretly cheering inside?

[aohige]

Originally Posted by Vexx

Talk about heading down a bizarre path here o.O

You are too kind Vexx, I was thinking of much harsher words such as "idiotic" or "moronic".

As for animal representations.... Monkeys representing Japanese is not a "sign of intelligence".
Monkeys are synonymous with ridicule to us Japanese, much like many of the western world.
We use monkeys as symbol for idiocy very commonly in our speech, so please don't insinuate accusations you have little idea of, Darkcraft.

All the animal representations are equally stereotypical, with intent of cynicism.
Politically correct sensitivity is rather stupid when it's a fair game.

[Bombo]

THAT'S A DAMN EPIC EPISODE oooooooommmmmmmmmmmggggggggggg <3 <3 <3
wow ..Just wow...the rabbits action soooo cuuuuuuuuute and damnt action
OMG I'm really excited..i want the second episode now...
The fight between camels vs rabbit...was awesome...

Right now i'm packy fan now..I want buy a rabbit now and call him packy haha.

animals with weapons hahaha I love it

Originally Posted by Darkcraft

if you talk about middle east and arabs .. the noble animal culturally significant they are proud of is the horse.. horse origin is arab and its the animal showing status and aristocraty, militay victories etc...

100% wrong...is the camel..the arabian in the arabian /persian gulf their the noble animale is Camel..and they call it "desert ship" and for proof this..there's a race in their country and winner getting over 1million dollar from the princes country .
Not all middle east their noble horse or camel.

[stormy001_M1A2]

Originally Posted by firehawk12

How long will it be between episodes?

From the looks of it, this is a pilot episode in attempt to get funding from sponsors. Hopefully if the response is good enough ( I don't mind to buy the DVD/Bluray of this gem) more $$$$ will come for the studio to crank up the work. As for now, we all can hope for the best.

Just my 2 cents.

I show this to my friend who served with the military and he absolutely loved it.

[Bombo]

Originally Posted by stormy001_M1A2

From the looks of it, this is a pilot episode in attempt to get funding from sponsors. Hopefully if the response is good enough ( I don't mind to buy the DVD/Bluray of this gem) more $$$$ will come for the studio to crank up the work. As for now, we all can hope for the best.

Just my 2 cents.

I show this to my friend who served with the military and he absolutely loved it.

I hope they release new episode from this ..I really love it.

[yongshun]

you know Packy reminds me of Capt. Price from Call of Duty 4 just because of how bad ass he is.

[Bonta Kun]

Originally Posted by yongshun

you know Packy reminds me of Capt. Price from Call of Duty 4 just because of how bad ass he is.

haha yea now that mention it thats a good comparison, it's all business no play with these guys.

god I'd love to see the other guys of their team, if these 2 epic pros can whip up a sh** storm like that wonder what a whole team of them would be like