Darker Than Black - Episode 12 Discussion / Poll

[DragoZERO]

That left an even bigger question mark on top of my head than the first season did. At least Suou's story was wrapped up.

I'll wait for the DVD specials and then make a final opinion of this season since they are necessary to make sense of most of this.

And I demand a third season that will tie everything together and leave only a little left over for the viewer.

[Sephiroth_760]

@ orion
ah seems plausible xD

Originally Posted by orion

July is an evolved doll. He wished to stay with Suou. The Gate granted that wish and transported him to the new Earth with her. However, she's 13yo and he's 10 yo. He lost her due to age differences. Let's face it. It's not cool for a 13 yo female to look at a 10 yo male.

no, I mean, honestly
if his wish was to be with suou, why did he lose suou? I think there's a better explanation, but if there isn't one, I really gotta say that BONES idea's ran out xD

[Myssa Rei]

Originally Posted by Sephiroth_760

and who's that boy/girl who awakened in the coffin and killed the CIA's men?

The boy? If we follow the mythological references, as mentioned by myself and a few others before, it should be Kagutsuchi, the last deity born from Izanami and Izanagi in the original myth.

[Sephiroth_760]

Originally Posted by Myssa Rei

as mentioned by myself and a few others before

xD after reading the first 3 pages I noticed that most of the posts are just ppl who are the same like me, being confused and asking everything they don't understand, so I figured out that I just ask again, becuz reading how confused the other ppl are won't answer my questions hahah xD

[orion]

Originally Posted by Sephiroth_760

no, I mean, honestly
if his wish was to be with suou, why did he lose suou? I think there's a better explanation, but if there isn't one, I really gotta say that BONES idea's ran out xD

Remember The Gate is a cruel being like when the Devil grants wishes in films.

You don't have to date someone to be with them. You can be a friend. However, when you are a 13 yo girl, you're not going to be hanging around a 10 yo for very long. He is not in her social circle so he lost her.

------

Kagutsuchi's birth kills Izanami. So even if Hei had chickened out, Yin still would have died. Kind of sad. Hei killed Yin and it didn't stop a thing. He was too late. Old Earth won't be around for too much longer now imo.

[Jin Kizuite]

I think it's bad none of the answers to the hundreds questions are concrete seeing as its all up to viewer speculation.

That's why I think it's bad, it should explain itself in the episodes why it is that way, and lay a proper foundation for the fictional universe.
- But not like a certain manga/anime *coughbleachcough* where they do it in a stupid ass way. (Telling how your Shikai works to the enemy)

It's basically like:
BONES: here's what happened. There's some gates, contractors and other stuff. Figure the rest out yourself if you can actually follow it as it plays.
And not have to spend hours consulting with other people to try and reach some sort plausible conclusion that makes sense to them.

It should already make sense and the discussions should be about if you like it or not. Not discussing wtf you think even happened. Terrible.

[orion]

Well perhaps it more understandable to those who knew their Japanese legends. I'm assuming Japanese viewers knew something about their legends. This show was based on Izanami and Izanagi legend.

They did throw in some explanation at the end to catch us up.

[Sephiroth_760]

Originally Posted by orion

Remember The Gate is a cruel being like when the Devil grants wishes in films.

You don't have to date someone to be with them. You can be a friend. However, when you are a 13 yo girl, you're not going to be hanging around a 10 yo for very long. He is not in her social circle so he lost her.

Kagutsuchi's birth kills Izanami. Old Earth won't be around for too much longer now imo.

haha xD well alright, for now, I don't care about July's wish lol
I think I've got a bit of a view about the ending now ...

but I still have one mor thing to say!

to me, this ending is terrible xD
like I said, I'm gonna add this ending to the "worst endings I've seen"

having flying cars and a 2nd earth pulled out of pandoras box like it was always meant to be that way

even dressing up Misaki and making her look happy, wtf?!
maybe that manager turning into rambo was a good fortune for Misaki? xD

[Myssa Rei]

Originally Posted by Jin Kizuite

*snips*

Somehow I gather that you've never watched Paranoia Agent? Or Lain? Compared to those, this open ending is nothing.

Originally Posted by Sephiroth_760

*snips*

The flying cars were there since Ryuusei no Gemini started. Not paying attention? There's a difference between not understanding, and NOT WANTING TO UNDERSTAND despite some things being in plain sight.

[Sephiroth_760]

Originally Posted by Myssa Rei

The flying cars were there since Ryuusei no Gemini started. Not paying attention? There's a difference between not understanding, and NOT WANTING TO UNDERSTAND despite some things being in plain sight.

well, I haven't rewatched the whole series now, maybe I forgot that these flying cars had an appearance lol
it's always like that with ongoing animes, I'm forgetting much stuff what happened earlier, specially things like flying cars xD

[orion]

Originally Posted by Myssa Rei

Somehow I gather that you've never watched Paranoia Agent? Compared to that, this is nothing.

Trapeze from this season wasn't exactly a walk in the park either imo.

Sometimes you just have to absorb all the info and review it. Just like having a physics problem solution explained to you.

Originally Posted by Myssa Rei

The flying cars were there since Ryuusei no Gemini started. Not paying attention? There's a difference between not understanding, and NOT WANTING TO UNDERSTAND despite some things being in plain sight.

Originally Posted by Sephiroth_760

well, I haven't rewatched the whole series now, maybe I forgot that these flying cars had an appearance lol
it's always like that with ongoing animes, I'm forgetting much stuff what happened earlier, specially things like flying cars xD

A flying car was at the end of Suou's monologue in ep. 1 (9:05) as she was remarking about changes that were happening.

[Sephiroth_760]

Originally Posted by orion

A flying car was at the end of Suou's monologue in ep. 1 (9:05) as she was remarking about changes that were happening.

I see
maybe I'm going to rewatch it ... it would clear a few questions I guess, but as far as I can remember I never thought of this series to be good

it's gonna be a hard decision xD

[Kunagisa]

Originally Posted by Jin Kizuite

That's why I think it's bad, it should explain itself in the episodes why it is that way, and lay a proper foundation for the fictional universe.

The episode made a lot of sense to me, in fact, it was pretty boring reading through the first 3 page of the discussion when people did not understand the episode come in and go what the heck happened WITH NO FOLLOW UP on what they THINK happened after watching the sub.

Then I offered a detail post explaining everything and asked for people's idea on if they think it's correct. Next thing you know, 6 pages after where everyone just comes in and go "I DON"T KNOW WHAT HAPPENED THIS SUCKS" with, again, no explanation. The ones that offered valid questions were all answered by my post which obviously most ignored. What's the point of coming to a discussion forum when you just going come in ignore what other people say? T___T

Granted, reading through 10 other pages of stuff is annoying, but it's BECAUSE most of the people don't READ BEFORE THEY POST that it's filled with 10 pages of I-DON'T-GET-IT posts.

Originally Posted by Jin Kizuite

It should already make sense and the discussions should be about if you like it or not. Not discussing wtf you think even happened. Terrible.

I don't agree with this. Different interpretations exist, which foster part of the discussion.

[Nightengale]

I don't get how some of you are thinking Hei killed Yin. He smiled before he did whatever he did to her, and the results? The calamity-bringer was still born and the prophecy was still complete even though Yin told Hei there was still time to end things by killing her there and then.

Not to mention those 11 episodes of Hei telling himself 'kill kill kill kill' was out of ignorance. He thought Yin was a lost cause, and deluded himself into blaming himself for it and steeling himself to kill her. However, that last talk with Golgo proved him wrong, and that Yin's real soul was very much alive and not the evil monstrosity that Dark Yin ( Izanami ) was.

I think the fact that the shota-Yin was born showed that Hei didn't go through with killing Yin. I mean, what's the point of killing Yin if it doesn't stop the birth of the antichrist (shota-Yin)? It's a DOUBLE BAD END for Hei if Yin is really dead.

[orion]

Originally Posted by Nightengale

I don't get how some of you are thinking Hei killed Yin. He smiled before he did whatever he did to her, and the results? The calamity-bringer was still born and the prophecy was still complete even though Yin told Hei there was still time to end things by killing her there and then.

Not to mention those 11 episodes of Hei telling himself 'kill kill kill kill' was out of ignorance. He thought Yin was a lost cause, and deluded himself into blaming himself for it and steeling himself to kill her. However, that last talk with Golgo proved him wrong, and that Yin's real soul was very much alive and not the evil monstrosity that Dark Yin ( Izanami ) was.

I think the fact that the shota-Yin was born showed that Hei didn't go through with killing Yin. I mean, what's the point of killing Yin if it doesn't stop the birth of the antichrist (shota-Yin)? It's a DOUBLE BAD END for Hei if Yin is really dead.

Right. It's called irony.

Hei's attempt to save her actually caused her to escalate towards death. So now to save her, he had to kill her.

Hei was shown powering up with his hand near Yin's chest. It's implied that he fried her. However, you can choose to believe he didn't even though he said "let's end this."

Remember the myth. Izanami is killed in childbirth. Even if Hei didn't do it, she still dies.

Also, those 2 versions of Yin are Yin. That's why the dark version (Izanami version) could hover and the white version (Yin remnant) could allow herself to get in range to be killed. Dark version would have killed him when he powered up if he attempted to kill that version.

[forgottendiary]

Originally Posted by physics223

I didn't think lowly of the ending. I thought it was particularly decent, and some ends were resolved.

With regard to Hei killing Yin, here's my interpretation of it. It's not the same as others, but it's still pretty logical to me.

Good one, thank you. Best I've read so far and it has somehow blunted my shock and exasperation of this episode and the series in general.

Ah well, there's still the OVAs to look forward to and heh, perhaps a less trollific S3?

[Nightengale]

Originally Posted by orion

Right. It's called irony.

Hei was shown powering up with his hand near Yin's chest. It's implied that he fried her. However, you can choose to believe he didn't even though he said "let's end this."

Remember the myth. Izanami is killed in childbirth. Even if Hei didn't do it, she still dies.

If he simply wanted to kill her, his usual electricity ( it doesn't come with flashes nor does it make his star shine brightly ) would be more than sufficient. But no, he used his electron hax. And why on her chest?

But never mind, there are 2 ways to look at it, I saw it as Hei choosing the 3rd option again. You were less optimistic. The way I saw it, there was enough implications to sway Hei and lead him to choose something else. Otherwise, there was absolutely no reason to put Yin and Dark Yin ( Izanami ) as 2 separate existence. Heck, we didn't even know until this episode that they're both 2 different souls so to speak, we were all like Hei, under the assumption that Yin in her entirety has evolved and changed completely beyond recognition.

And the myths are just parallels, it doesn't mean everything happens as it did in the mythology of Izanami and Izanagi. If that's the case, where's Mizuhame if the antichrist is Kagu-tsuchi? Would Shion be the one to kill Kagu-tsuchi? What about the many many children that Izanagi and Izanami were said to bear?

[orion]

Originally Posted by Nightengale

If he simply wanted to kill her, his usual electricity ( it doesn't come with flashes nor does it make his star shine brightly ) would be more than sufficient. But no, he used his electron hax. And why on her chest?

But never mind, there are 2 ways to look at it, I saw it as Hei choosing the 3rd option again. You were less optimistic.

And the myths are just parallels, it doesn't mean everything happens as it did in the mythology of Izanami and Izanagi. If that's the case, where's Mizuhame if the antichrist is Kagu-tsuchi? Would Shion be the one to kill Kagu-tsuchi? What about the many many children that Izanagi and Izanami were said to bear?

Well if you're going to kill someone fast and painless, you stop their heart. And the powering up sequence looked good from an animator's standpoint I bet.

This show isn't about uplifting endings. They killed contractors left and right. From the beginning, it was stated that Hei wants to/had to kill Yin.

You're taking the myth too literally. The show only chose to focus on the one with the last child of the couple before Izanami dies. Plus, Shion died before Izanami so he couldn't kill the kid.

If they wanted to stop this, they had to kill Yin in ep. 1 imo.

[Jin Kizuite]

If theres about 6 pages with people going: "I don't understand what's going on."
Somethings gone wrong. Discussion.

[physics223]

Originally Posted by forgottendiary

Good one, thank you. Best I've read so far and it has somehow blunted my shock and exasperation of this episode and the series in general.

Ah well, there's still the OVAs to look forward to and heh, perhaps a less trollific S3?

Hopefully.

People are taking the myth too literally, in my humble opinion. It doesn't make sense that Hei wishes for his powers in order to lose Yin, because he had been doing well without his powers even beforehand. I don't think Hei is at that low a level to wish for his powers if it meant to sacrifice Yin, especially with what Golgo 13 shared to him before he went there. The fact is that she loved him so much that she tried to stifle her evolution or awakening, and he, being closest to her, obviously realized it. It just doesn't make sense for him to kill her, especially when in the gate he saw there were two separate existences.

I think it makes more sense that he loses Suou (because she has become important to him) with the gain of Yin. He lied to Suou the same way he lied to Yin in the OVA, and he does that to only the people he values. Of course, everything is open to interpretation.

I think that Misaki got a lot more attractive with the last episode, though. She just looked fresher; perhaps the creators are tacitly joining in the fun with the Misaki-Hei dynamic, where she looks happier when she sees him.