Steins;Gate - Generic Discussion Thread

[risingstar3110]

I still think that's Stein; Gate is failing as an anime adaptation...

It's just like Shaft's anime (prior to Madoka) without witty comments and still shots. In another words, long dialogues and lots of following shots on speaking characters....

... so far feel like it's a visual novel instead of anime. And once again the pace is rather slow

[Kaos!]

Well, the problem is, for the first half of the series it's going to be all theory talking and no action. So long the anime adaptation manage to go out with a bang at the end, I think most of the viewers will forget about the boring parts at the beginning(which is similiar to its VN counterpart).

[Suzuku]

...well considering it was a visual novel consisting of mostly dialog...

[tomtkp]

Originally Posted by risingstar3110

I still think that's Stein; Gate is failing as an anime adaptation...

It's just like Shaft's anime (prior to Madoka) without witty comments and still shots. In another words, long dialogues and lots of following shots on speaking characters....

... so far feel like it's a visual novel instead of anime. And once again the pace is rather slow

And yet some who played the visual novel complained that the pace is too fast,some of the scenes originally in the visual novel were being written off.

The slowness of the pace now is considered normal as it is the nature of the story.Considered that Steins;Gate is a 24-episode adaptation,you cannot expect the story to go straight into action.There's still many theory to be unfolded and relationships to be built before the action comes.It's also unrealistic to build a relationship without some communication,right?So,be patient and wait for later episodes.There will be plenty of action in the later episodes.

[Proto]

Wow really? Personally I've thought that the pace so far has been perfect. But then again I've always been a sucker for such series, so I guess it's just me.

[Reckoner]

Originally Posted by Proto

Wow really? Personally I've thought that the pace so far has been perfect. But then again I've always been a sucker for such series, so I guess it's just me.

Perhaps I'm a biased observer as I'm used to the pace of VN's in general (Though haven't played this one), I but I agree with you here. The pace has been absolutely perfect as far as I am concerned.

[Deconstructor]

No, actually I sympathize with the dissenters here. Some people like to see Okarin and Kurisu calling each other perverts, or Okarin and Mayuri sharing their cup of noodles. In a visual novel, they count as character development. Others are more concerned with the cool part of science fiction, like Okarin entering a parallel timeline where someone didn't die and a ship didn't crash into a building. The "wow" factor has diminished over the last few episodes; the plot about time-travel is progressing slowly. But at least it's still going.

[risingstar3110]

Originally Posted by tomtkp

And yet some who played the visual novel complained that the pace is too fast,some of the scenes originally in the visual novel were being written off.

The slowness of the pace now is considered normal as it is the nature of the story.Considered that Steins;Gate is a 24-episode adaptation,you cannot expect the story to go straight into action.There's still many theory to be unfolded and relationships to be built before the action comes.It's also unrealistic to build a relationship without some communication,right? So,be patient and wait for later episodes.There will be plenty of action in the later episodes.

Faithfulness with adaptation has always been an issues (and will always been).

However for example, ep 4. Okabe went to the laundry, got some clues from his mobile, run back trying to call Hashida up from his sleep.Then he has to go out alone looking for that computer and accidentally meet Chris(tina) before they have a talk at the spot then another talk at the laundry stand...

Now if the whole sequences have any meanings, or if this was a novel then i won't mind to. But if all of those screens were to set up for Okabe and Kurisu for some emotional private talks... then clearly the pace got some problems. Can't he just stand at the laundry spot, claiming that Hashida won't wake up once he slept, before trying to run out to look for that computer and accidentally meet Kurisu?

[tomtkp]

Originally Posted by risingstar3110

Faithfulness with adaptation has always been an issues (and will always been).

However for example, ep 4. Okabe went to the laundry, got some clues from his mobile, run back trying to call Hashida up from his sleep.Then he has to go out alone looking for that computer and accidentally meet Chris(tina) before they have a talk at the spot then another talk at the laundry stand...

Now if the whole sequences have any meanings, or if this was a novel then i won't mind to. But if all of those screens were to set up for Okabe and Kurisu for some emotional private talks... then clearly the pace got some problems. Can't he just stand at the laundry spot, claiming that Hashida won't wake up once he slept, before trying to run out to look for that computer and accidentally meet Kurisu?

Actually in the VN,there is no laundry stand scene,just the animators changed the background scenes with the dialogues from the VN retained.However,personally,I don't think there's something wrong with the sequences,neither do the sequences have something to do with the pace.
After receiving Titor's message in the laundry shop,he ran back to the lab because he had made the search for IBN5100 an uttermost priority.He was literally trying to force Hashida to search it together because Akihabara is a large place.Trying to find a computer within a large area alone is very difficult.However,seeing that Hashida wanted more sleep and Mayuri had her part time job,he was forced to search for it alone but of course he could not find it.Then,he met Kurisu in Akihabara streets and dragged her back into laundry stand to have a talk and also to collect the clothes since his clothes were still washing(almost finished?) in the laundry shop.

What I have written above is what I think the sequences were trying to tell me,but maybe you had interpreted it differently.It is normal that the pace of the story is slow in the early stage(the pace is even slower in the VN).At this stage of the story,the pace is literally still at 2nd or 3th gear.You won't see any fast and furious action any sooner,just character developments and more settings at least in several episodes.You will see the pace picking up probably in the second half of the story.

[risingstar3110]

Originally Posted by tomtkp

Actually in the VN,there is no laundry stand scene,just the animators changed the background scenes with the dialogues from the VN retained.However,personally,I don't think there's something wrong with the sequences,neither do the sequences have something to do with the pace.
After receiving Titor's message in the laundry shop,he ran back to the lab because he had made the search for IBN5100 an uttermost priority.He was literally trying to force Hashida to search it together because Akihabara is a large place.Trying to find a computer within a large area alone is very difficult.However,seeing that Hashida wanted more sleep and Mayuri had her part time job,he was forced to search for it alone but of course he could not find it.Then,he met Kurisu in Akihabara streets and dragged her back into laundry stand to have a talk and also to collect the clothes since his clothes were still washing(almost finished?) in the laundry shop.

What I have written above is what I think the sequences were trying to tell me,but maybe you had interpreted it differently.It is normal that the pace of the story is slow in the early stage(the pace is even slower in the VN).At this stage of the story,the pace is literally still at 2nd or 3th gear.You won't see any fast and furious action any sooner,just character developments and more settings at least in several episodes.You will see the pace picking up probably in the second half of the story.

Of course that he have to go back to the laundry stand to get his laundry because otherwise he can't have his laundry back..... But my points here is why they (the director) have to show all this? Not so much on character development. Not foresight of the later plot. Not even fan services.

For example, if it's an excuse for Mayuri to get all wet and flash her panty, then at least it works as fan-services to help on the sales. Or as Okabe left, Hashida actually opened his eyes and looks all serious (increase audience suspension for the coming plot). Here it seems like an unnecessary adaptation while tried so hard to be faithful with the adaptation

[MaiNoKen]

Originally Posted by risingstar3110

Of course that he have to go back to the laundry stand to get his laundry because otherwise he can't have his laundry back..... But my points here is why they (the director) have to show all this? Not so much on character development. Not foresight of the later plot. Not even fan services.

For example, if it's an excuse for Mayuri to get all wet and flash her panty, then at least it works as fan-services to help on the sales. Or as Okabe left, Hashida actually opened his eyes and looks all serious (increase audience suspension for the coming plot). Here it seems like an unnecessary adaptation while tried so hard to be faithful with the adaptation

I am not sure that there is much alternatives than to follow the VN closely - especially the original work is basically drama/plot driven. If the original work is some sort of action series, then it will be a different story.

It is worth questioning if S;G really worth a 24 series episode. If S;G does HAVE to fit 24 episodes, it will require fillers to whatever extra air time they have. The problem is the complete opposite for like Angel Beats, Madoka Magica when the are stuck with 11/12. It forces the creators to move the plot up even the plot can use my character development. I think the real culprit is inflexibility of TV scheduling. Some series may need 16-17 episodes (I think that makes a good length for S;G), and so on. The creators just do NOT have that an option. They are force to be slow down or sped up the plot; however, some creators are better at pacing than others. Considering the original S;G work, I think the pacing so far is all right.

[tomtkp]

Originally Posted by MaiNoKen

I am not sure that there is much alternatives than to follow the VN closely - especially the original work is basically drama/plot driven. If the original work is some sort of action series, then it will be a different story.

It is worth questioning if S;G really worth a 24 series episode. If S;G does HAVE to fit 24 episodes, it will require fillers to whatever extra air time they have. The problem is the complete opposite for like Angel Beats, Madoka Magica when the are stuck with 11/12. It forces the creators to move the plot up even the plot can use my character development. I think the real culprit is inflexibility of TV scheduling. Some series may need 16-17 episodes (I think that makes a good length for S;G), and so on. The creators just do NOT have that an option. They are force to be slow down or sped up the plot; however, some creators are better at pacing than others. Considering the original S;G work, I think the pacing so far is all right.

I don't think S;G will have any fillers in the whole 24 episodes because the volume of the story is very huge.If S;G anime is 12 episodes(1-cour) or 16/17 episodes long,it will be disasterous as many scenes have to be written off and the pacing will be too fast.The VN has 11 chapters plus one prologue and it will take you at least 30 hours of playing time to clear True End.30 hours of playing time fitted into 24 episodes(even 12 episodes),can you imagine that?Personally,if the anime directors want to 100% follow the original VN,it will take at least 30 episodes to finish it,but we won't want that,right?The pacing will be very slow at the early stages of the story,hence 24 episodes is okay already.There will be no fillers whatsoever.

[MaiNoKen]

Originally Posted by tomtkp

I don't think S;G will have any fillers in the whole 24 episodes because the volume of the story is very huge.If S;G anime is 12 episodes(1-cour) or 16/17 episodes long,it will be disasterous as many scenes have to be written off and the pacing will be too fast.The VN has 11 chapters plus one prologue and it will take you at least 30 hours of playing time to clear True End.30 hours of playing time fitted into 24 episodes(even 12 episodes),can you imagine that?Personally,if the anime directors want to 100% follow the original VN,it will take at least 30 episodes to finish it,but we won't want that,right?The pacing will be very slow at the early stages of the story,hence 24 episodes is okay already.There will be no fillers whatsoever.

I am arguing that being stuck at multiples of 12 is inflexible and is harmful to any TV series quality. There are already fillers in the TV series where contents that are NOT in the original VN being introduced, and I think the pacing of the original VN is good. My claim is that creators are adjusting the story unnecessarily in a way they think they need to fill up the season. While the length of the series should be planned ahead, but the length itself has to be determined what need to be covered not the TV scheduling inflexibility requires.

The VN chapters are not created equal length, and some chapters of S;G can be done in 1 episode (like the prologue), and some may take 2-3 (I cannot describe that chapter without spoiling - let just say... the 2-3 chapters in exact middle of the VN).

[klare]

the whole eps is about getting the IBM, i mean IBN pc

the chars are weird but interesting, feels like some hints are given for future story

[orion]

Originally Posted by klare

the whole eps is about getting the IBM, i mean IBN pc

the chars are weird but interesting, feels like some hints are given for future story

Kind of like a whole day spent trying to change your cellphone and upgrade your plan. Real life has entered my anime.

[tomtkp]

Originally Posted by MaiNoKen

I am arguing that being stuck at multiples of 12 is inflexible and is harmful to any TV series quality. There are already fillers in the TV series where contents that are NOT in the original VN being introduced, and I think the pacing of the original VN is good. My claim is that creators are adjusting the story unnecessarily in a way they think they need to fill up the season. While the length of the series should be planned ahead, but the length itself has to be determined what need to be covered not the TV scheduling inflexibility requires.

The VN chapters are not created equal length, and some chapters of S;G can be done in 1 episode (like the prologue), and some may take 2-3 (I cannot describe that chapter without spoiling - let just say... the 2-3 chapters in exact middle of the VN).

Inflexibility of the scheduling is a reality unfortunately.Nowadays,you won't see many animes which have episodes other than the multiples of 12 or 13.The Japanese animators now prefer to follow with the season schedule than having the anime finished in the middle of the season.

I am sorry that I may missed your point.Maybe I just think that 16 or 17 episodes are not enough to finish off the story.However,what a discussion we have today.It makes me wanting to know what the directors would do with the next 20 episodes.Let's wait and see.

By the way,when comparing the episode titles with the chapter titles in the VN,it seems that :Prologue (episode 1),Chapter 1 (episode 2,3)and Chapter 2 (episode 4,5).The directors are using 2 episodes for the first 2 chapters.

[MaiNoKen]

Originally Posted by tomtkp

Inflexibility of the scheduling is a reality unfortunately.Nowadays,you won't see many animes which have episodes other than the multiples of 12 or 13.The Japanese animators now prefer to follow with the season schedule than having the anime finished in the middle of the season.

I am sorry that I may missed your point.Maybe I just think that 16 or 17 episodes are not enough to finish off the story.However,what a discussion we have today.It makes me wanting to know what the directors would do with the next 20 episodes.Let's wait and see.

By the way,when comparing the episode titles with the chapter titles in the VN,it seems that :Prologue (episode 1),Chapter 1 (episode 2,3)and Chapter 2 (episode 4,5).The directors are using 2 episodes for the first 2 chapters.

I will have to admit I actually did not do a careful estimate how many episodes needed. Now let's do it here:

Prologue : 1
Chapter 1 : 2
Chapter 2 : 2
Chapter 3 : 2
Chapter 4 : 3
Chapter 5 : 3
Chapter 6 : 3
Chapter 7 : 1
Chapter 8 : 1
Chapter 9 : 2
Fake End : 1
True End : 1

Total : 22

So it does come pretty close in filling a 12-episodes slot, but there is room to fill in some 1-3 1-shot material. I will admit 16-18 is a not a very good estimate.
Using 2 episodes per chapters 1 and 2 are reasonable. For the whole pacing of the series, I will wait till I see chapters 5 and 6 animated. If contents will get dragging out, it will happen in chapters 5 and 6.

[Eater of All]

Originally Posted by Reckoner

Perhaps I'm a biased observer as I'm used to the pace of VN's in general (Though haven't played this one), I but I agree with you here. The pace has been absolutely perfect as far as I am concerned.

This.

I came into Steins;Gate expecting some crazy hard sci-fi plot right off the bat that will screw the audience's brains into oblivion. I don't particularly mind such an approach, since I'm a sci-fi fan and I enjoy am used to having my brain screwed.

But I think this kind of pacing works better. For one, the plot of Steins;Gate seems pretty elaborate so far, with references to real-life people and objects like John Titor and the IBM5100. Instead of throwing confusing stuff at you every few seconds and call it a day, it slowly builds up an atmosphere and lets the audience absorb its developments. Meanwhile, it goes and fleshes out its characters, bringing them all into some relationship with the plot at hand. I think one of the reason why Ever17 fared so well is because it forces you to trudge through 20 hours of character development (Steins;Gate is definitely doing a better job at that though, of course), and then hits the fan with the shit at the end. At that point, one can actually, you know, give a shit, about what is happening to the characters. Sci-fi stories aren't just physics theories, they're stories.

If anything, at least Steins;Gate is nowhere near as bad as Chaos;Head so far (but then, not much can be either).

[MaiNoKen]

Originally Posted by Eater of All

This.

I came into Steins;Gate expecting some crazy hard sci-fi plot right off the bat that will screw the audience's brains into oblivion. I don't particularly mind such an approach, since I'm a sci-fi fan and I enjoy am used to having my brain screwed.

But I think this kind of pacing works better. For one, the plot of Steins;Gate seems pretty elaborate so far, with references to real-life people and objects like John Titor and the IBM5100. Instead of throwing confusing stuff at you every few seconds and call it a day, it slowly builds up an atmosphere and lets the audience absorb its developments. Meanwhile, it goes and fleshes out its characters, bringing them all into some relationship with the plot at hand. I think one of the reason why Ever17 fared so well is because it forces you to trudge through 20 hours of character development (Steins;Gate is definitely doing a better job at that though, of course), and then hits the fan with the shit at the end. At that point, one can actually, you know, give a shit, about what is happening to the characters. Sci-fi stories aren't just physics theories, they're stories.

If anything, at least Steins;Gate is nowhere near as bad as Chaos;Head so far (but then, not much can be either).

The s**t will come quite a bit earlier than the end. Expect major trolling around about middle of the series. I will not reveal what that is however .

S;G is not the kind of show that things get active quickly. It is NOT a shonen action series. It is not a series that give quick fixes of entertainment. However, some serious anime dramas do let impacting s**t hit early to grab attention, and then slow down before re-heating up. While that weird stuff does happen in episode 1 (VN prologue), it is far from impacting - weird and suspense, yes; wow effect, no.

[Jao]

Originally Posted by MaiNoKen

While that weird stuff does happen in episode 1 (VN prologue), it is far from impacting - weird and suspense, yes; wow effect, no.

Really? It impacted on me plenty. I was holding my breath at the end with the elevator.