Common mistakes made by fansubbers

[Rika-chama]

This message has been deleted by ElvenPath. Reason: Please do not discuss subs of a licensed show. Thank you.

I'm sorry.... what?

There are whole threads discussing subs of licensed shows, so why delete this post.....
Sense.... this makes none.

[DmonHiro]

Originally Posted by Rika-chama

I'm sorry.... what?

There are whole threads discussing subs of licensed shows.....
Sense.... this makes none.

I think you misunderstood what I meant. I was giving an example of a mistake that many groups make: over literal translation, while ignoring an equivalent english expression. It wasn't specifically about gg, I just used that as an example of whay should be done when possible. Of course, sometimes there is no way to translate something other then literally, but when one has the opportunity, one should take it. How many times have you seen "Why at a time like this?" used in a fansub? Does anyone actually talk like that in English? Of course not. We either say "Why now, of all times?", and usually just "Why now?". So why do many groups insist on using the literal translation?

[Rika-chama]

Originally Posted by DmonHiro

I think you misunderstood what I meant. I was giving an example of a mistake that many groups make: over literal translation, while ignoring an equivalent english expression. It wasn't specifically about gg, I just used that as an example of whay should be done when possible. Of course, sometimes there is no way to translate something other then literally, but when one has the opportunity, one should take it. How many times have you seen "Why at a time like this?" used in a fansub? Does anyone actually talk like that in English? Of course not. We either say "Why now, of all times?", and usually just "Why now?". So why do many groups insist on using the literal translation?

nono, dmonhiro, I understood what /YOU/ said. I just didn't understand why ElvenPath deleted it. THAT'S what didn't make sense.

[DmonHiro]

Lol, I though that you quoted my message after it got deleted. My bad. Any other people want to chime into this literal translation business?

[Desbreko]

Originally Posted by DmonHiro

How many times have you seen "Why at a time like this?" used in a fansub? Does anyone actually talk like that in English? Of course not. We either say "Why now, of all times?", and usually just "Why now?". So why do many groups insist on using the literal translation?

I wouldn't call that a case of over-literal translation but of bad editing. All three mean basically the same thing, and it's just how they're worded that separates them. It's possible to have very literal translations without the English sounding stilted.

[Kristen]

Here's another one. Simply not spell checking an OCR. I cannot say how many times I've seen "l" as "I", or capital W's in the middle of the sentence.

[the.Merines]

Originally Posted by Kristen

Here's another one. Simply not spell checking an OCR. I cannot say how many times I've seen "l" as "I", or capital W's in the middle of the sentence.

One might question how OCR'ing would be related to fansubbing rather than ripping.

Another common mistake: Coming back to fansubbing after "retiring."

[TGEN]

Originally Posted by the.Merines

Another common mistake: Coming back to fansubbing after "retiring."

If it's a TL, it's not a mistake of course. There's enough of the rest to go around, but not much when it comes to TLs .

[Vexx]

Originally Posted by DmonHiro

... How many times have you seen "Why at a time like this?" used in a fansub? Does anyone actually talk like that in English? Of course not. We either say "Why now, of all times?", and usually just "Why now?". So why do many groups insist on using the literal translation?

Actually, yes, some people do speak in that manner. But whether it is appropriate or not depends on the character delivering the line.

[max2k]

Originally Posted by Quarkboy

By encoding your episodes into a single GOP (i.e. forcing no I-frames except the first one).

A very nice idea. It should even help with the compressibility of the videostream! *hides*

[Zalis]

Originally Posted by Kristen

Here's another one. Simply not spell checking an OCR. I cannot say how many times I've seen "l" as "I", or capital W's in the middle of the sentence.

Originally Posted by the.Merines

One might question how OCR'ing would be related to fansubbing rather than ripping.

Depends on what you're using OCR for. Ripping commercial DVD/BD, OCRing the subtitles, running spell-check, and releasing them "as-is" in .srt or glorified .srt form -- that'd be ripping. OCRing hardsubbed fansubs, correcting OCR errors, correcting spelling/grammar/TL errors from the original subs, retiming, doing all-new karaoke and typesetting, and combining it all with a new raw -- I'd consider that pretty close to fansubbing.

[Ichihara Asako]

Originally Posted by TGEN

Well, if we're going on about that, I'd like to add that not having chapters at all is a mistake as well. Make it easy for people to skip jpoop OPs and EDs!

That's probably my largest gripe, given I dislike the vast majority of OPs, and if the show has something after the ED I'd like to be able to skip the music to get to it, too. Back when I used to sub I always thought karaoke was a huge waste of time since I rarely bother with OP/EDs, and it surprised me how many people do actually like them. Was much rage when I proposed the idea of cutting off the OPs and EDs entirely (back in AVI days).

More ordered chapters would be nice so I could just not get OP/EDs at all now it's more readily possible. But most encoders are too lazy. Encoder delays were the largest source of drama when I was subbing, not TLs, oddly enough.

[Heibi]

Originally Posted by Ichihara Asako

That's probably my largest gripe, given I dislike the vast majority of OPs, and if the show has something after the ED I'd like to be able to skip the music to get to it, too. Back when I used to sub I always thought karaoke was a huge waste of time since I rarely bother with OP/EDs, and it surprised me how many people do actually like them. Was much rage when I proposed the idea of cutting off the OPs and EDs entirely (back in AVI days).

More ordered chapters would be nice so I could just not get OP/EDs at all now it's more readily possible. But most encoders are too lazy. Encoder delays were the largest source of drama when I was subbing, not TLs, oddly enough.

Too bad that's not a common mistake and only a personal preference. And the encoder I deal with goes out of his way to get them done quickly and produce the best product he can.(I think most do) And since you are getting these fansubs for free shouldn't you at least do the honorable thing and watch the actual OP/ED that the folks(animators) who produced it worked on?(Out of respect - or sheer politeness) And you know, since you have to use the pointer to click on the chapter button, it only takes a second or two longer to advance the progress bar on the player.

[Ichihara Asako]

Originally Posted by Heibi

Too bad that's not a common mistake and only a personal preference. And the encoder I deal with goes out of his way to get them done quickly and produce the best product he can.(I think most do) And since you are getting these fansubs for free shouldn't you at least do the honorable thing and watch the actual OP/ED that the folks(animators) who produced it worked on?(Out of respect - or sheer politeness) And you know, since you have to use the pointer to click on the chapter button, it only takes a second or two longer to advance the progress bar on the player.

I disagree. It is a mistake. Chapters are a standard feature of MKVs and not using them is an error on the encoder's part. DVDs are usually chaptered and all the bluray I've seen (no anime yet) have been so far. It's something that should always be done.

I don't have any idea what you're talking about it being honourable to watch OP/EDs when the vast majority of them have terrible music and often contain spoilers (characters not yet appeared, at the minimum). They're worthless to me and a waste of time.

Also, what pointer? I watch most anime on my TV, and I have a remote with a "next" button to skip chapters. Fast forwarding is more clunky. Certainly not a second or two.

[Heibi]

Originally Posted by Ichihara Asako

I disagree. It is a mistake. Chapters are a standard feature of MKVs and not using them is an error on the encoder's part. DVDs are usually chaptered and all the bluray I've seen (no anime yet) have been so far. It's something that should always be done.

I don't have any idea what you're talking about it being honourable to watch OP/EDs when the vast majority of them have terrible music and often contain spoilers (characters not yet appeared, at the minimum). They're worthless to me and a waste of time.

Also, what pointer? I watch most anime on my TV, and I have a remote with a "next" button to skip chapters. Fast forwarding is more clunky. Certainly not a second or two.

Never mind. You're clueless.

Well, I will add a few things. Adding chapters is a choice, not a mistake. I also watch everything on my TV and if I wish to skip and OP/ED I just use the mouse and on-screen arrow to fast forward by clicking on the advance bar. Takes me about 2-3 seconds to skip an OP/ED.

[DmonHiro]

Sorry, Hebi, you are half in the wrong here. There is nothing "honorable" about watching the OP/ED of a fansub. You're sill getting it for free, so it makes no difference. Also, it takes a total of (and I am not joking on this) 1 minute MAX to make chapters for an .mkv. I'm not talking about ordered chapters, because those are a BITCH to make properly. But, if you can't be bothered to make .mkv chapters in one minute, you ARE lazy, which is ironic considering how much more time everything else takes.

Ichihara Asako, you're the other half of wrong. What you said is your preference, and your preference alone. You can't say that not doing it your way is a mistake just as I can't say that my friend can't cook because he doesn't add Vegeta (condiments) on this chicken. Also, your idea of cutting off the OP and ED during the .avi days was indeed stupid and you deserved all the rage you got. Most people want the OP/ED in the episode even if they do skip it.

[Heibi]

Originally Posted by DmonHiro

Sorry, Hebi, you are half in the wrong here. There is nothing "honorable" about watching the OP/ED of a fansub. You're sill getting it for free, so it makes no difference. Also, it takes a total of (and I am not joking on this) 1 minute MAX to make chapters for an .mkv. I'm not talking about ordered chapters, because those are a BITCH to make properly. But, if you can't be bothered to make .mkv chapters in one minute, you ARE lazy, which is ironic considering how much more time everything else takes.

Ichihara Asako, you're the other half of wrong. What you said is your preference, and your preference alone. You can't say that not doing it your way is a mistake just as I can't say that my friend can't cook because he doesn't add Vegeta (condiments) on this chicken. Also, your idea of cutting off the OP and ED during the .avi days was indeed stupid and you deserved all the rage you got. Most people want the OP/ED in the episode even if they do skip it.

My point about the honorable thing to do was quite basic. As long as you're getting it for free the least you could do is watch the whole thing. And don't complain when someone doesn't make something the way you want it. We don't want to hear it in this thread. The old adage comes into play - "Do it yourself."

But soft subs sometimes don't like chapters and the timing gets messed up. And from what I gather from Asako(I can't be bothered with clicking on the advance bar attitude), folks who want chapters are even more lazy. I remember the days before remote controls for TVs and VCRs.

And if it isn't an actual ERROR it isn't a mistake. Remember what the theme of the thread is. Most have forgotten it seems. Common Mistakes made by fansubbers. So if it isn't spelling mistakes, translation mistakes, timing errors, too small a font to read, fonts that blend in with the background, etc... it doesn't belong in this thread. Quit putting preferences in a mistake thread basically.

[Ichihara Asako]

Originally Posted by DmonHiro

Ichihara Asako, you're the other half of wrong. What you said is your preference, and your preference alone. You can't say that not doing it your way is a mistake just as I can't say that my friend can't cook because he doesn't add Vegeta (condiments) on this chicken. Also, your idea of cutting off the OP and ED during the .avi days was indeed stupid and you deserved all the rage you got. Most people want the OP/ED in the episode even if they do skip it.

So it would seem. I lived with them, because that was just the standard at the time. Back then I did watch anime on the computer, so it wasn't a big deal to skip it anyway. I do have a few releases with the OP/EDs removed, though, so I wasn't the only one who felt that way.

Originally Posted by Heibi

My point about the honorable thing to do was quite basic. As long as you're getting it for free the least you could do is watch the whole thing. And don't complain when someone doesn't make something the way you want it. We don't want to hear it in this thread. The old adage comes into play - "Do it yourself."

I do, sometimes. If the series is worth it. I'd rather just avoid groups with lazy staff that don't do it all properly to begin with, though. Which is easy enough fortunately.

But soft subs sometimes don't like chapters and the timing gets messed up. And from what I gather from Asako(I can't be bothered with clicking on the advance bar attitude), folks who want chapters are even more lazy. I remember the days before remote controls for TVs and VCRs.

How am I supposed to click when I don't have a mouse? I have a remote that can either skip chapters, or fast forward 2-4x speed. There is no clicking. I don't usually watch anime on a computer.

And if it isn't an actual ERROR it isn't a mistake. Remember what the theme of the thread is. Most have forgotten it seems. Common Mistakes made by fansubbers. So if it isn't spelling mistakes, translation mistakes, timing errors, too small a font to read, fonts that blend in with the background, etc... it doesn't belong in this thread. Quit putting preferences in a mistake thread basically.

You've already listed the common mistakes as far as scripts go (which are trivial to correct, anyway) so what else do you expect people to talk about?

But seeing as I don't even watch subs, I don't really have much to say about them. So it comes more to encoding practices rather than the script issues. Which is still a part of fansubbing, and QC is supposed to notice such issues too, not only pay attention to editing, styling and timing.

There's only so far a thread can go based purely on spelling/translation errors and timing/styling issues. Which nobody watching fansubs should generally gripe over, anyway, since they're free fan-made things that don't have a board or shareholders to answer to (instead, we should be watching OPs/EDs, right?)

[Heibi]

Originally Posted by Ichihara Asako

But seeing as I don't even watch subs, I don't really have much to say about them. So it comes more to encoding practices rather than the script issues. Which is still a part of fansubbing, and QC is supposed to notice such issues too, not only pay attention to editing, styling and timing.

There's only so far a thread can go based purely on spelling/translation errors and timing/styling issues. Which nobody watching fansubs should generally gripe over, anyway, since they're free fan-made things that don't have a board or shareholders to answer to (instead, we should be watching OPs/EDs, right?)

So, why the heck are you posting in this thread? You don't need to even bother since you don't even need subs. Kinda pointless I would say. Go away, you have nothing to contribute.

[Schneizel]

Originally Posted by Ichihara Asako

Which nobody watching fansubs should generally gripe over, anyway, since they're free fan-made things that don't have a board or shareholders to answer to

I think this attitude is a mistake.