AnimeSuki Forums

Jan-Poo · 2013-05-18, 08:06

It could be harder than you think Spartan. All the automatic guided system currently in use for missiles would likely not be very effective against titans.

It would be very hard to make them hit their weak point instead of any other body part.
I would expect a very low accuracy.

I think that in the end large cannons would be the weapon of choice, lot less expensive than missiles, and they can be mounted on fast tanks (titans are slower than horses generally).

Artillery and air strikes can still be used effectively against a large crowd of titans. Generally normally titans shouldn't be much of a problem for modern armies, but the deviants could pose a serious threat.

Oh, you could also use unmanned vehicles, since titans ignore anything that isn't human and they are probably too stupid to recognize a threat. Kamikaze drones remotely controlled could work well against specific isolated titans.

Iron Maw · 2013-05-18, 12:12

I'm interested how modern forces would able deal with the Colossal and Armored Class Titans. Tanks are out of the question and air assaults are not better either.

Anh_Minh · 2013-05-18, 12:19

Why not? It's not like modern weapons can't deal with armored targets, and being colossal just makes you a bigger target.

Jan-Poo · 2013-05-18, 14:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iron Maw

I'm interested how modern forces would able deal with the Colossal and Armored Class Titans. Tanks are out of the question and air assaults are not better either.

It depends on how resistant is the armored titan's armor, though it's very hard to think it could deflect the strongest cannon's shotd or the anti armor missiles of the newest generation. In the worst case scenario we already have the technology to create railguns, and the armor should be on a supernatural level to resist that.

The colossal titan would be hard to hit from the ground level, so tanks are out of the question, unless you can place them on those high walls.
The main problem with him is finding a way to kill him before he vanishes. If he is smart, and he probably is, he would never appear where there are aircraft nearby. Best strategy to kill him is probably with a trap and constant vigilance.

Anh_Minh · 2013-05-18, 15:20

We can build ground based missiles and canons that target aircraft. We can build ground based missiles and canons that target things with 50m of elevation on them.

The "teleportation" is a problem, but

Spoiler for manga:

Gravitas Free Zone · 2013-05-18, 16:36

Tanks are low to the ground because if you're very tall, you stick up over obstacles and can be seen from a long way off.

Leaving aside the issue of the Colossal Titans for the moment, the regular Titans do not carry any weapons, let alone anything that would benefit from being elevated, so their height is not much of an advantage. And their critical weakspot, being toward their top, is going to be hit even sooner from range, since it'll clear the horizon first.

Obviously the writers of Attack on Titan have thoroughly stacked the deck against the humanity of their series, but given modern weaponry the giant mook brigade does not have too many advantages.

...which is why Laser-Class BETA showed up in that other everybody-is-going-to-die-because-we-wanted-it-that-way series that keeps coming to mind.

Anh_Minh · 2013-05-18, 16:46

What series is that?

Gravitas Free Zone · 2013-05-18, 16:50

Muv-Luv Alternative: Total Eclipse, whose threads ended up resembling these in that everyone's ideas for stopping the alien menace were shot down by some convenient thing that the writers had come up with in advance. Plus their being several quadrillion of the buggers, and humans being asses to each other both behind and in front of the scenes.

So yeah, this all sounds rather familiar right now...

apotheosis · 2013-05-18, 18:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jan-Poo

It depends on how resistant is the armored titan's armor, though it's very hard to think it could deflect the strongest cannon's shotd or the anti armor missiles of the newest generation. In the worst case scenario we already have the technology to create railguns, and the armor should be on a supernatural level to resist that.

The colossal titan would be hard to hit from the ground level, so tanks are out of the question, unless you can place them on those high walls.
The main problem with him is finding a way to kill him before he vanishes. If he is smart, and he probably is, he would never appear where there are aircraft nearby. Best strategy to kill him is probably with a trap and constant vigilance.

Stealth bombers seem like the optimal way to kill the armoured & colossal. Drop some guided missiles on them with enough force to destroy all of them, weak spot included. If a human stabbing it with forged steel swords can destroy their weak spot, pretty much any explosive force would be greater ..

The normal titans should be easy to kill with airborne drones who can stay out of range of the titans we've seen so far.

Jan-Poo · 2013-05-18, 18:21

"Stealth" Bombers are "stealth" because they have low radar signature, they aren't any less visible nor any more silent than other similar non stealth aircraft. It shouldn't matter against titans.
So in the end I agree to whoever said that helicopters would be better to fight titans. They are in fact better suited to fight ground based threats.

I'm still skeptical on guided missiles because they wouldn't be able to attack the weak point directly. The payload should be strong enough to blow up at least half of a titan to be sufficiently effective. This could be hard for 15 meters class titans.

NoemiChan · 2013-05-18, 19:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iron Maw

I'm interested how modern forces would able deal with the Colossal and Armored Class Titans. Tanks are out of the question and air assaults are not better either.

Really....? So nukes ain't gonna work?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Endless Knackwurst

Muv-Luv Alternative: Total Eclipse, whose threads ended up resembling these in that everyone's ideas for stopping the alien menace were shot down by some convenient thing that the writers had come up with in advance. Plus their being several quadrillion of the buggers, and humans being asses to each other both behind and in front of the scenes.

So yeah, this all sounds rather familiar right now...

MLA i far more realistic than SK..... I doubt Titans has a chance with a Destroyer Class or Laser Class.

Gravitas Free Zone · 2013-05-18, 19:50

The BETA had to be written to justify as well as defeat giant mecha; that raises the bar compared to having mid-1700s-tech-level humans as opponents...

There's already a Gundam beating up on titans in the image thread...

Iron Maw · 2013-05-18, 20:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

Why not? It's not like modern weapons can't deal with armored targets, and being colossal just makes you a bigger target.

Jan-Poo basically said what I was going to say. At that very least the Colossal Titan is going require a much higher degree of stratengy beyond just shooting at him considering his ability. Teleportation is not something you can really plan against especially when you do not know it's limits.

Quote:

Originally Posted by GenjiChan

Really....? So nukes ain't gonna work?

Maybe against the Armored Titan, but what's stop the Colossal one from just going "lol nope!" and blinking out? Worse yet there is a very high probably of coursing more damage to Human forces especially since Titan normally appear in human settlements. At best it's needs to be a last resort.

Quote:

MLA i far more realistic than SK..... I doubt Titans has a chance with a Destroyer Class or Laser Class.

Stronger? Probably. More realistic? Nah.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Endless Knackwurst

There's already a Gundam beating up on titans in the image thread...

It's a Gundam though. Aside form the high tech, they rare ever lose unless it's against another Gundam.

NoemiChan · 2013-05-18, 20:40

Quote:

Stronger? Probably. More realistic? Nah.

Come on. Disappearing giant is beyond physics. It's fantasy.

About Aliens? I believe in aliens.

MLA is far more realistic than SK.

Iron Maw · 2013-05-18, 22:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by GenjiChan

Come on. Disappearing giant is beyond physics. It's fantasy.

About Aliens? I believe in aliens.

MLA is far more realistic than SK.

Them being aliens has nothing to do with it. Even if extraterrestrial life exists, it doesn't mean they would look, or act like the BETA. Until that is proven, BETA are just as fictional and fantastical as Titans. Besides science fiction is hardly the best genre for realistic fiction anyway.

Jan-Poo · 2013-05-18, 22:52

Well the adjective "realistic" is always used for fictional entities or speculations.

You don't call "realistic" what is real to begin with.

There is a difference between something that while fictional can be theoretically possible in the real world (hence realistic) and something that really can't be possible.

I don't think that BETA are entirely plausible, especially the laser class, but they are for a good 90% in my opinion.
The titans however seem to be decidedly on the realm of supernatural, rather than sci-fi. If there is a scientific explanation for them, it's probably on a level that is indistinguishable from magic.

NoemiChan · 2013-05-18, 23:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iron Maw

Them being aliens has nothing to do with it. Even if extraterrestrial life exists, it doesn't mean they would look, or act like the BETA. Until that is proven, BETA are just as fictional and fantastical as Titans. Besides science fiction is hardly the best genre for realistic fiction anyway.

Well comparing between the two, which will likely happen IRL?

1. A Titan that could survive without eating a human for 100 hundreds and without source of nutrition? That could regenerate in a few seconds ( yeah, ok planarian could do but it has its limitations) A giant that just disappears and appears out of nowhere defying the law of physics and matter.

or

2. Beta an extraterrestrial being that came from somewhere outside Earth menacing us and kills every single thing it sees moving.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jan-Poo

I don't think that BETA are entirely plausible, especially the laser class, but they are for a good 90% in my opinion.
The titans however seem to be decidedly on the realm of supernatural, rather than sci-fi. If there is a scientific explanation for them, it's probably on a level that is indistinguishable from magic.

This is one I'm pointing LOls....

SagaraSouske · 2013-05-18, 23:13

Not sure how hard the titan skin is, since Mikasa was able to cut it with either a broken blade or a knife standing on the ground.

They have guns.

AC-Phoenix · 2013-05-19, 00:14

Has it ever been mentioned why the world suddenly turned medieval?
The first few seconds state that this is 2000 years from now on.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jan-Poo

I don't think that BETA are entirely plausible, especially the laser class, but they are for a good 90% in my opinion.
The titans however seem to be decidedly on the realm of supernatural, rather than sci-fi. If there is a scientific explanation for them, it's probably on a level that is indistinguishable from magic.

I'd go rather scientific. Considering how its 2000 years in the future (thus around year 4000) They might be the reminders of some war that has happened between anime now and anime then. Either created intentionally or y a nuclear accident.

Anh_Minh · 2013-05-19, 01:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iron Maw

Jan-Poo basically said what I was going to say.

For the elevation, at most it's going to take a redesign of tanks. Though probably not - you'd have to be stupid to fight close to it. If it's so close you can't shoot its weak point, run! Or knee-cap it and then shoot its weak point.

Quote:

At that very least the Colossal Titan is going require a much higher degree of stratengy beyond just shooting at him considering his ability. Teleportation is not something you can really plan against especially when you do not know it's limits. Maybe against the Armored Titan, but what's stop the Colossal one from just going "lol nope!" and blinking out? Worse yet there is a very high probably of coursing more damage to Human forces especially since Titan normally appear in human settlements. At best it's needs to be a last resort.

Spoiler for manga:

2013-05-18, 08:06	Link #241
Jan-Poo 別にいいけど Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: forever lost inside a logic error	It could be harder than you think Spartan. All the automatic guided system currently in use for missiles would likely not be very effective against titans. It would be very hard to make them hit their weak point instead of any other body part. I would expect a very low accuracy. I think that in the end large cannons would be the weapon of choice, lot less expensive than missiles, and they can be mounted on fast tanks (titans are slower than horses generally). Artillery and air strikes can still be used effectively against a large crowd of titans. Generally normally titans shouldn't be much of a problem for modern armies, but the deviants could pose a serious threat. Oh, you could also use unmanned vehicles, since titans ignore anything that isn't human and they are probably too stupid to recognize a threat. Kamikaze drones remotely controlled could work well against specific isolated titans. __________________

2013-05-18, 15:20	Link #245
Anh_Minh I disagree with you all. Join Date: Dec 2005	We can build ground based missiles and canons that target aircraft. We can build ground based missiles and canons that target things with 50m of elevation on them. The "teleportation" is a problem, but Spoiler for manga: it's not specific to colossal or armored titans.

2013-05-18, 18:21	Link #250
Jan-Poo 別にいいけど Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: forever lost inside a logic error	"Stealth" Bombers are "stealth" because they have low radar signature, they aren't any less visible nor any more silent than other similar non stealth aircraft. It shouldn't matter against titans. So in the end I agree to whoever said that helicopters would be better to fight titans. They are in fact better suited to fight ground based threats. I'm still skeptical on guided missiles because they wouldn't be able to attack the weak point directly. The payload should be strong enough to blow up at least half of a titan to be sufficiently effective. This could be hard for 15 meters class titans. __________________

2013-05-18, 22:52	Link #256
Jan-Poo 別にいいけど Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: forever lost inside a logic error	Well the adjective "realistic" is always used for fictional entities or speculations. You don't call "realistic" what is real to begin with. There is a difference between something that while fictional can be theoretically possible in the real world (hence realistic) and something that really can't be possible. I don't think that BETA are entirely plausible, especially the laser class, but they are for a good 90% in my opinion. The titans however seem to be decidedly on the realm of supernatural, rather than sci-fi. If there is a scientific explanation for them, it's probably on a level that is indistinguishable from magic. __________________

2013-05-18, 23:13	Link #258
SagaraSouske Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007	Not sure how hard the titan skin is, since Mikasa was able to cut it with either a broken blade or a knife standing on the ground. They have guns. __________________

2013-05-18, 12:12	Link #242
Iron Maw Banned Join Date: Feb 2006	I'm interested how modern forces would able deal with the Colossal and Armored Class Titans. Tanks are out of the question and air assaults are not better either.

2013-05-18, 12:19	Link #243
Anh_Minh I disagree with you all. Join Date: Dec 2005	Why not? It's not like modern weapons can't deal with armored targets, and being colossal just makes you a bigger target.

2013-05-18, 16:36	Link #246
Gravitas Free Zone Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2012	Tanks are low to the ground because if you're very tall, you stick up over obstacles and can be seen from a long way off. Leaving aside the issue of the Colossal Titans for the moment, the regular Titans do not carry any weapons, let alone anything that would benefit from being elevated, so their height is not much of an advantage. And their critical weakspot, being toward their top, is going to be hit even sooner from range, since it'll clear the horizon first. Obviously the writers of Attack on Titan have thoroughly stacked the deck against the humanity of their series, but given modern weaponry the giant mook brigade does not have too many advantages. ...which is why Laser-Class BETA showed up in that other everybody-is-going-to-die-because-we-wanted-it-that-way series that keeps coming to mind.

2013-05-18, 16:46	Link #247
Anh_Minh I disagree with you all. Join Date: Dec 2005	What series is that?

2013-05-18, 16:50	Link #248
Gravitas Free Zone Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2012	Muv-Luv Alternative: Total Eclipse, whose threads ended up resembling these in that everyone's ideas for stopping the alien menace were shot down by some convenient thing that the writers had come up with in advance. Plus their being several quadrillion of the buggers, and humans being asses to each other both behind and in front of the scenes. So yeah, this all sounds rather familiar right now...

2013-05-18, 19:50	Link #252
Gravitas Free Zone Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2012	The BETA had to be written to justify as well as defeat giant mecha; that raises the bar compared to having mid-1700s-tech-level humans as opponents... There's already a Gundam beating up on titans in the image thread...