Code Geass (Generic discussion thread)

[Nogitsune]

Damn, too much to write, not enough time...
Oh well. xD

Originally Posted by Frostfire

That would, if anything, make his first best friend the most important and indicative of how he'd act towards others. It is his first, when he is at his most gullible/vulnerable/etc, it is often said that a person's first relationship with people is usually a showing of how they will act in the future and in general. It's your basis.

Didn't Gino have Anya before?
And really, neither her nor Suzaku let him get very close.

Your average Roman citizen either did not have slaves, or had indentured servants, we know this through historical records. Your average Roman citizen also didn't hesitate to punish their children and family on equal levels as their slaves, this is also pretty well known historically. Slaves in Rome were not treated inhumanly and their punishments were regularly on the same level as anyone else. So again this example falls through because, for the last time, Gino is not your average citizen with no idea of the real interworkings of the system. Which is why I quote for a you much better example in comparing the Britannians to the Germans.

And I still think a comparison to Germany is pushing it.
If Gino was supposed to be like anyone under the direct command of Hitler, the staff wouldn't have let him survive the way he did - not even for fanservice. Maybe he came across that way, but I doubt that was intended.

Further the means we may consider morally questionable for Romans, are anything but questionable for Gino and the KoR, they are downright abominable. And the system cannot exist without people perpetuating it, Gino and the KoR are those responsible for the growth and strength of the system. You do not just blame the system, ever, you also blame the people supporting and pushing forward that system. Same as with the Nazi's, people don't just blame Hitler, they blame all the lunatics who supported him and his genocide.

How old were Gino and Anya again?
They grew up in that system. We can't know if it made Gino into who he was or if he was perfect for a Britannian soldier from the moment he was born.

You should certainly list to me more than zero examples of where, in a time of conquest, a nation of people were perfectly happy and vocal that their government should annihilate citizens and civilians for the sake of keeping them quiet. The Romans did no such thing, in fact unlike the Britannians, Romans did not just kill indiscriminantely. Once a war was won, the people were absorbed into the system either as slaves or freemen, all based on what they offered and how they dealt with the merging of the cultures.

I'm not saying that Romans were the epitom of evil. Just that people tend to assimilate into the society they live in.
And the numbers system was supposed to make the conquered countries stable - that's what Schneizel explained to Cornelia in the Sound Drama. Now, she didn't exactly agree, but that simply shows how much she was infuenced by her father's teachings. She respected Schneizel a lot, yet she refused to really listen to him here.
Of course you can interprete that as her being "evil" by nature, but I can't see her as someone who would have supported Hitler. She's harsh, but she is also a very proud person, and not a racist.
She's not moral, no, but I find her much more likable than yout average mass murderer due to her personality.

You just helped me make my point, Clovis had to abandon his ideals to become what he became. The KoR and Cornelia, on the otherhand, are never shown to have had those ideals. As I said they were amoral. Clovis is a perfect example of someone losing themselves in the system when plans fall through. The KoR and Cornelia are perfect example of people who believed in and perpetuated the system of their own amoral choice and desire.

I imagine Cornelia being a far "nicer" person before Marianne's death. But I can't prove that, just like I can't know if the KoR were total psychos.
It's not the impression I got, though, and I find the comparison to the Schutzstaffel quite inappropriate.

So yes, Clovis is incomparable to the KoR, but you served in making my point. Clovis is driven out of a sense of failure and a vendetta, the KoR and Cornelia are driven by pure fascism and amoral mentality.

Vendetta?
I don't think Clovis held anything against the Elevens anymore, if it's that what you mean. He just didn't care much about them or any other stranger at that point.

Oh come on. Gino was kept alive through things that were killing unnamed machines regularly. His mecha is cut in half but doesn't explode, any other mecha that was cut in half (for instance todoh's one episode prior) blows up almost instantly. The man falls from god knows what height but isn't bothered at all. Every single other KoR was killed, but Gino and Anya lived. And believe me it has nothing to do with them being better people or more deserving of some second chance, it is just fanservice pure and simple.

It is just putting far to much faith and optimism in the writers when these characters never showed change. They are extreme fascists. This is what I chock up to a completely assenine epilogue where the staff didn't even know what to do but give you a stupidly happy, unrealistic ending.

It might have been fanservice that certain characters lived, but I still think the staff never intended them to come off as "beyond redemtion".

I understand you arguing for Clovis because you have something to go on, but your arguments for Gino have utterly nothing to go by other than "I think".

Well, the same is true for you, in a way.
The staff didn't show any signs of wanting Gino to be compared to nazis. They gave him some "fanservice qualities" that make that comparison seem completely out of place to me.

There is simply nothing to distinguish Gino from the other KoR (excluding Luciano) and there is everything to distinguish (and I am surprised I am saying this) him from Viletta, who actually shows a change in character and can be some what believed in the ending.

Since the rest of the KoR came off as mere cannon fodder, I'd say Gino simply had the advanatge of having a somewhat larger role in the show. That doesn't mean they all were beyond changing.

Can't we just agree that the only reason he survived is because of his fanservice cash cow? Because that is the only way you are going to explain how he survived things that killed everyone else. Blatant plot armor to keep him around without reason.

I don't think Code Geass would have lost too many fans if Gino had died saving Kallen or something, even if it hadn't been too heroic and merely a side-effect of whatever he was trying to do at that moment.
So... it might have been fanservice, but it also means, to me, that he wasn't as much of a horrible person as you make him out to be.

[roon]

Originally Posted by incorrupts

http://community.livejournal.com/cod...s/1296345.html
Credit to the respectful owners-chavos.

The more I stare at that, the more I wish they pushed Gino -> Milly. I mean, if all he was going to amount to was fanservice in the end, then that looks like the ultimate. They would look ridiculously cute together!

[bladeofdarkness]

are we back to the "gino is the antichrist" again
lets move on shall we

here is a topic
why is rakshata so attached to the guren
she treats it like her baby (and gets pissed off when Lloyd gets his grabby hands all over it)
but she also built the shen-hu (which is suppose to be better) and the shinkiro and (presumably) the zangetsu
why is she so attached to the guren specificlly ?

[morbosfist]

Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness

are we back to the "gino is the antichrist" again
lets move on shall we

here is a topic
why is rakshata so attached to the guren
she treats it like her baby (and gets pissed off when Lloyd gets his grabby hands all over it)
but she also built the shen-hu (which is suppose to be better) and the shinkiro and (presumably) the zangetsu
why is she so attached to the guren specificlly ?

She's attached to all of them, but the Guren is her masterpiece as the Lancelot is Lloyd's.

[Frostfire]

Originally Posted by Nogitsune

How old were Gino and Anya again?
They grew up in that system. We can't know if it made Gino into who he was or if he was perfect for a Britannian soldier from the moment he was born.

Anya is not someone you want to use as a comparison because she was brainwashed into her place. She has no willingness being there, Gino has every willingness.

You are helping me make my point that he is a pure born psychopath. He isn't a soldier following orders, he is a general telling his soldiers to eliminate innocent people to shut them up.

Originally Posted by Nogitsune

I imagine Cornelia being a far "nicer" person before Marianne's death. But I can't prove that, just like I can't know if the KoR were total psychos.
It's not the impression I got, though, and I find the comparison to the Schutzstaffel quite inappropriate.

A psychopath is a psychopath, there is not such thing as "partly psychopathic". If you can find a better comparison between them, that takes into account the elimantion of a ghetto and the desire to exterminate civilians seeking refuge, then please, point out the comparison.

Until then, I am going to compare the KoR to their most recent equivalent.

Originally Posted by Nogitsune

It might have been fanservice that certain characters lived, but I still think the staff never intended them to come off as "beyond redemtion".

Or the staff didn't give a damn? You can't just say he lived because he was redeemable. You have utterly nothing to base that on, whereas I have everything to base on that he is a psychopath and murderer.

Originally Posted by Nogitsune

Well, the same is true for you, in a way.
The staff didn't show any signs of wanting Gino to be compared to nazis. They gave him some "fanservice qualities" that make that comparison seem completely out of place to me.

The same isn't true of me, because I am not saying "maybe the staff did this". I don't care what the staff meant to do, I am showing you what the staff did do. There is no if and or but about waiting for a pretext to kill civilians. That is evil in its all so purest form.

Originally Posted by Nogitsune

Since the rest of the KoR came off as mere cannon fodder, I'd say Gino simply had the advanatge of having a somewhat larger role in the show. That doesn't mean they all were beyond changing.

Bismark's role was larger, Monica had the same number of lines. The only thing that he had over them was being best-gay-buds with Suzaku.

Originally Posted by Nogitsune

I don't think Code Geass would have lost too many fans if Gino had died saving Kallen or something, even if it hadn't been too heroic and merely a side-effect of whatever he was trying to do at that moment.
So... it might have been fanservice, but it also means, to me, that he wasn't as much of a horrible person as you make him out to be.

Or died when he fell from several kilometers up, or when his KMF was cut in half, and I can keep going.

[demon_god04]

Originally Posted by Nogitsune

And I still think a comparison to Germany is pushing it.
If Gino was supposed to be like anyone under the direct command of Hitler, the staff wouldn't have let him survive the way he did - not even for fanservice. Maybe he came across that way, but I doubt that was intended.


I'm not saying that Romans were the epitom of evil. Just that people tend to assimilate into the society they live in.
And the numbers system was supposed to make the conquered countries stable - that's what Schneizel explained to Cornelia in the Sound Drama. Now, she didn't exactly agree, but that simply shows how much she was infuenced by her father's teachings. She respected Schneizel a lot, yet she refused to really listen to him here.
Of course you can interprete that as her being "evil" by nature, but I can't see her as someone who would have supported Hitler. She's harsh, but she is also a very proud person, and not a racist.
She's not moral, no, but I find her much more likable than yout average mass murderer due to her personality.

Yeah, because everyone deserving of punishment got what they deserved right? *looks at Viletta* If we were to compare, Gino was someone directly under the command of the Emperor. If Charles was as "evil" as Hitler then you tell me, would Gino be the equivalent of a staff officer under Hitler?

Again, using Rome as an example was a poor choice. Rome did not encourage conquered areas to assimilate into it's culture, hell the Romans took on so much of the Greek culture and arts that many people say that though the Romans conquered the Greeks, culturally it is the other way around. In fact Caesar's last words to Brutus was not in Latin but in Greek. Even in terms of religion, the Romans believed that the gods of other cultures are the gods of the region and made no move to force conquered areas to adopt Roman religion. In fact even in the Roman Legions, the auxiliaries were encouraged to keep the weapons and skills of their people to compliment the Legionaries if they proved to be useful. This is completely incomparable to the Numbers system which was just oppression through brute force and the erasing of the conquered cultural values. As we saw in the anime itself, it is not like the Areas had any loyalty to Britannia where as the allies of Rome held their loyalty to Rome even after the Roman army was defeated at Cannae by Hannibal left Rome without an army and at the mercy of the Carthaginian army. When Hannibal invaded he expected Rome's allies to be happy to rebel against their Roman oppressors and was baffled at the fact that they closed their gates to him and held fast to their loyalty to Rome. Rome granted citizenship or privileges to the areas conquered and their policies are one of the reasons they were able to forge such a strong empire. Very different to the Numbers system.

Hitler did not kill the Jewish just for fun, it was a political move to push the problems onto the Jewish population as the German masses were already dissatisfied with them because they were wealthier or seen as such. Sacrifices if you will to ensure his support and backing. And Cornelia? The cleansing of the Ghetto to lure out Zero, just for the purpose of luring out Zero. The killing of innocent Japanese or "Elevens" for a greater goal of capturing a terrorist. I dunno do you think Cornelia would have supported "hitler-esque" way of doing things? And not racist? You are kidding me right? She was one of the ones originally protesting Suzaku's promotion, only Darlton supported it because he recognized Suzaku's abilities.

[Levy]

(I'm still amazed by the lack of hate for Jeremiah, given that he is in canon, the worst racist of the bunch, far way worst than Cornelia...
it's funny, in a way.)

[Frostfire]

Originally Posted by Levy

(I'm still amazed by the lack of hate for Jeremiah, given that he is in canon, the worst racist of the bunch, far way worst than Cornelia...
it's funny, in a way.)

I think his character is a joke, is that good enough for you? (I said this before, lol.) But I don't know how much more of racist he is than Cornelia, or Viletta for that matter, in canon. Have you seen his PD? He's not in Japan because he wants to trample on the Japanese for lulz or honor or fame (Viletta's reason being the later two) but for revenge on Lelouch and Nunally.

That's more hatred driven than racism.

[Levy]

But Jeremiah is the head of the Purist Faction, he is more racist than the average, just as Villetta was in the beginning - she changed her mind lately, but that's another matter...

He might have had his personal reason for going to Japan specifically, but he was a member of the Purist Faction from before and the Purist Faction is the most integralist fringe of the Britannian elite, otherwise, it won't be called that way...

( I do not want you to hate Jeremiah, nor do I, I was just surprised that he's mentioned this less in such a discussion, given his integralist background, but yes, maybe is the fact that none can take Orenji seriously... XD; )

[morbosfist]

Originally Posted by Levy

But Jeremiah is the head of the Purist Faction, he is more racist than the average, just as Villetta was in the beginning - she changed her mind lately, but that's another matter...

He might have had his personal reason for going to Japan specifically, but he was a member of the Purist Faction from before and the Purist Faction is the most integralist fringe of the Britannian elite, otherwise, it won't be called that way...

( I do not want you to hate Jeremiah, nor do I, I was just surprised that he's mentioned this less in such a discussion, given his integralist background, but yes, maybe is the fact that none can take Orenji seriously... XD; )

Jeremiah is too disarming with his 200% motherfucking loyalty. You just can't hate him. Regardless, he does come off as pretty racist in the beginning, but he's quick to get over it at least. Even that racism seems to be a matter of loyalty, as he doesn't care one way or the other as long as he's doing what he perceives as his duty.

[Frostfire]

Originally Posted by Levy

But Jeremiah is the head of the Purist Faction, he is more racist than the average, just as Villetta was in the beginning - she changed her mind lately, but that's another matter...

He might have had his personal reason for going to Japan specifically, but he was a member of the Purist Faction from before and the Purist Faction is the most integralist fringe of the Britannian elite, otherwise, it won't be called that way...

( I do not want you to hate Jeremiah, nor do I, I was just surprised that he's mentioned this less in such a discussion, given his integralist background, but yes, maybe is the fact that none can take Orenji seriously... XD; )

The reason he's not brought up much, at least by me, is because his actions are a different variety than the KoR. Jeremiah is a soldier with unquestionable loyalty, he is a person blind to the system and devoted only to a person. So his evil is proportional to the evil of the person controlling him, or his good.

On the other hand the KoR don't have to answer to anyone but their Emperor, but we know from the show that he hardly enforces any power over them and allows them to do whatever they deem best. I consider the KoR, people in charge of their own destiny, whereas Jeremiah is someone who is a puppet to the strings of fate.

He is certainly racist but it seems to be racism driven through hatred, because prior to the death's of Lelouch and Nunally, I had more the impression that the man was far more concerned with their happiness and his own loyalty/devotion to Marianne than the number of nations he can keep under heel.

Compared to the KoR who only go by what they themselves deem to be the best course of action, he is someone who is told the best course of action and he follows through with it. Its like comparing a general and a soldier. If the general orders a massacre and the soldier carries it out both are culpable but the majority of the fault lies on the man giving the orders.

They all have obvious mental issues, though. Jeremiah is blind like a bat and will do anything to fulfill his sense of loyalty and duty, even kill. The KoR are plain amoral machiavelians.

[Levy]

Originally Posted by morbosfist

Jeremiah is too disarming with his 200% motherfucking loyalty. You just can't hate him.

ahah, I'm sure this has its importance in the apparent free-pass he gets from the largest part of the fandom, really XD

Regardless, he does come off as pretty racist in the beginning, but he's quick to get over it at least. Even that racism seems to be a matter of loyalty, as he doesn't care one way or the other as long as he's doing what he perceives as his duty.

Mh.. you mean, him joining the BK and his conversation with Sayoko are to be intended as sings of him overcoming his racism?
Because the very same can be said for Gino and he's still a racist psycomurder, it seems!

EDIT: @Frost: Being racist is not required to become part of the KoR, otherwise, Suzaku won't have been allowed in. Otherwise, being racist IS a leading trait of the Purist Faction Jeremiah joined on his own will and it has nothing to do with devotion to Marianne.

[Frostfire]

Originally Posted by Levy

ahah, I'm sure this has its importance in the apparent free-pass he gets from the largest part of the fandom, really XD

I doubt the majority of the fanbase even cares about him, actually.

Originally Posted by levy

Mh.. you mean, him joining the BK and his conversation with Sayoko are to be intended as sings of him overcoming his racism?
Because the very same can be said for Gino and he's still a racist psycomurder, it seems!

No.

He was: turned into a machine by his empire, used as a weapon, went looney, was fried by magnets, and finally betrayed his nation for his own personal ideals. He never got over his racism, he simply became a different entity entirely when his brain was switched out for a machine. Remember, when he woke up, the only thing driving him was revenge and fanatical loyalty.

I don't recall Gino doing much of anything other than getting kicked in the head.

Originally Posted by levy

EDIT: @Frost: Being racist is not required to become part of the KoR, otherwise, Suzaku won't have been allowed in. Otherwise, being racist IS a leading trait of the Purist Faction Jeremiah joined on his own will and it has nothing to do with devotion to Marianne.

Exceptions to the rule always exist. I also did not say the KoR were racist, I said they were amoral fascists. Suzaku went about as low as it gets in the manner in which he acquired his title. You're not making good examples for the KoR being good people.

And I never said Jeremiah got over any of his racism, because Jeremiah Gottwald died when he was turned into a machine.

[morbosfist]

Originally Posted by Levy

Mh.. you mean, him joining the BK and his conversation with Sayoko are to be intended as sings of him overcoming his racism?
Because the very same can be said for Gino and he's still a racist psycomurder, it seems!

Gino never joins the Black Knights, though. That's an alliance of convenience against a greater foe, and he's still dismissive of "Elevens" in his conversation with Kallen. Compare to Jeremiah, who uses "Japanese" in conversation with Sayoko, and is willingly assisting in freeing Japan.

[Levy]

Originally Posted by morbosfist

Gino never joins the Black Knights, though. That's an alliance of convenience against a greater foe, and he's still dismissive of "Elevens" in his conversation with Kallen. Compare to Jeremiah, who uses "Japanese" in conversation with Sayoko, and is willingly assisting in freeing Japan.

*shrug* I fail to see the big difference in joining them and forming "an alliance of convenience" when he went there whining on his own to have his mecha repaired by that filthy indian pipe-smoker scientist, and willing to fight alongside with them
I don't remember if Scheizel had merged his forces with the BK already by the time Gino joined them, though...

Wich conversation with Kallen, btw ? the one in ep.23. I don't remember him saying anything but "I think I'm starting to understand you better now"

Alright, I see what you mean about Jeremiah overcoming his prejudice. They should have shown Sayoko in the farm with him in the ending: instant!romansuuu!<3 fanservice and a reinforcement to the idea that even Orenji is changed for the better =)

Originally Posted by Frostfire

I doubt the majority of the fanbase even cares about him, actually.

As far as my experience of the fandom goes, Jeremiah is very well-loved for a minor character.

Exceptions to the rule always exist. I also did not say the KoR were racist, I said they were amoral fascists. Suzaku went about as low as it gets in the manner in which he acquired his title. You're not making good examples for the KoR being good people.

this 'good' VS 'bad' thing is giving me such a headache I should give up for good, really!!
I never said they were GOOD, just that is reasonable to assume that, if a Purist faction exist, this is to be considered the highest standard of racism in the elite of Britannia, while in the KoR it is not a requirement to be a racist extremist, given that Suzaku was allowed to join in. He is the first one, okay, but still he was allowed in, adn Suzaku is in no way a racist.

And I never said Jeremiah got over any of his racism, because Jeremiah Gottwald died when he was turned into a machine.

here, I don't get what you meant... ?_?

[morbosfist]

Originally Posted by Levy

*shrug* I fail to see the big difference in joining them and forming "an alliance of convenience" when he went there whining on his own to have his mecha repaired by that filthy indian pipe-smoker scientist, and willing to fight alongside with them
I don't remember if Scheizel had merged his forces with the BK already by the time Gino joined them, though...

Wich conversation with Kallen, btw ? the one in ep.23. I don't remember him saying anything but "I think I'm starting to understand you better now"

Alright, I see what you mean about Jeremiah overcoming his prejudice. They should have shown Sayoko in the farm with him in the ending: instant!romansuuu!<3 fanservice and a reinforcement to the idea that even Orenji is changed for the better =)

I meant the conversation in 17 and 18, mostly 17. Turn 23 is understandably shorter, and doesn't lend much insight. Turn 24 does, though. He's still fighting for "his" Brtiannia against Lelouch's, so he prefers the racist expansionist empire to the equal-opportunity expansionist empire.

As for joining forces in general, logically Gino could only have made it there with Schenizel's help. He's not going to be crossing an ocean of his own accord in a disabled and flightless Knightmare. Schenizel had contacted the Black Knights beforehand.

Originally Posted by Levy

I never said they were GOOD, just that is reasonable to assume that, if a Purist faction exist, this is to be considered the highest standard of racism in the elite of Britannia, while in the KoR it is not a requirement to be a racist extremist, given that Suzaku was allowed to join in. He is the first one, okay, but still he was allowed in, adn Suzaku is in no way a racist.

Suzaku bribed his way in by admitting aloud that he'd sell out a friend to get a leg up. He isn't a racist, but he played himself as a backstabber in that scene.

[Frostfire]

Originally Posted by Levy

*shrug* I fail to see the big difference in joining them and forming "an alliance of convenience" when he went there whining on his own to have his mecha repaired by that filthy indian pipe-smoker scientist, and willing to fight alongside with them
I don't remember if Scheizel had merged his forces with the BK already by the time Gino joined them, though...

Given the circumstances, its more likely that he was picked up as an able hand given the magnitude of the war, but there is no sign of him having any allegiance to anyone other than himself and old Britannia. He's wearing his old KoR uniform, he's using his KoR unit, and so on. All the symbolism around him is Britannia.

Originally Posted by Levy

Wich conversation with Kallen, btw ? the one in ep.23. I don't remember him saying anything but "I think I'm starting to understand you better now"

In Turn 17 he says what is akin to the Elevens being inferior to the Britannians. In Turn 23 he says that he may understand her better, but he gets shrugged off. He was also not fighting for them, as he so clearly says, he's fighting for his own ideology of what Britannia is.

Originally Posted by Levy

As far as my experience of the fandom goes, Jeremiah is very well-loved for a minor character.

News to me.

Originally Posted by Levy

this 'good' VS 'bad' thing is giving me such a headache I should give up for good, really!!
I never said they were GOOD, just that is reasonable to assume that, if a Purist faction exist, this is to be considered the highest standard of racism in the elite of Britannia, while in the KoR it is not a requirement to be a racist extremist, given that Suzaku was allowed to join in. He is the first one, okay, but still he was allowed in, adn Suzaku is in no way a racist.

Would you prefer indecent people? It's to the same end. None of the KoR are shown to be necessarily racist, and I never said they were. I said they were amoral fascists. They are fascist extremist, especially if you look at their elite position. You are defined in the company that you keep, and they keep company with lunatics like Luciano.

Originally Posted by Levy

here, I don't get what you meant... ?_?

Jeremiah Gottwald, the man we met in Narita, died when he was turned into a machine. His brain was half broken down and turned into a synthetic processing system. The only thing left of the man was his fanatical loyalty and desire to serve. We see that fine enough at the end of S1. I believe its even said that he completely lost his mind and all control.

Jeremiah Gottwald, Orange, died. Jeremiah the super robot is what came out of it and as you can see as early as when he first appears, he has no trace of his purist ideologies in him. He is only driven by servitude.

[Charred Knight]

Originally Posted by Levy

(I'm still amazed by the lack of hate for Jeremiah, given that he is in canon, the worst racist of the bunch, far way worst than Cornelia...
it's funny, in a way.)

Its kind of hard to take Jeremiah seriously, I mean the man is basically suffering from massive brain damage for a good portion of the series causing him to act like a crazed stalker whenever Marianne is mentioned.

[Frostfire]

Originally Posted by Charred Knight

Its kind of hard to take Jeremiah seriously, I mean the man is basically suffering from massive brain damage for a good portion of the series causing him to act like a crazed stalker whenever Marianne is mentioned.

This.

If we want to compare him to the KoR, be my guest, serves to make my point.

[bladeofdarkness]

since this thread is in dire need of a new topic
allow me to pose a new topic for debate

it can be said that after looking at the varius geass powers that there is a connection between the person and the power they get based on either personallity or mind frame
for a few examples

C.C wanted to be loved and her geass made everyone around her fall for her

marianne was a woman who was able to reach into the hearts of everyone she met (there is not a single character in the show that didnt adore her, other then V.V) and her geass allowed her to litteraly do that

charles was a man who believed that the world is full of lies and his geass allows him to make anyone believe whatever he wanted them to

and lelouch was a man who could manipulate anyone to do whatever he wanted them to do with his words alone
its only natural that his geass would be the litteral personfication of that trait

if we assume that geass manifests itself according to the person who posses it
what kind of geass do you think the other characters in the show would posses (suzaku, kallen, etc)

i personally think that rivals's geass would make him invisible