(CR) Sousou no Frieren (Frieren: Beyond Journey's End)

[magnuskn]

I see a problem with Serie's reasoning that so many people only passed because of Frieren... since it took Frieren to defeat her own clone (with Fern's assistance). Otherwise Sense would have been the big obstacle in the dungeon and we saw what Übel did to her.

[Thor's Hammer]

It occurred to me since there is no mana detected from the spell Frieren used on the Demon King 80 years ago, making it like a curse, that Fern could possibly learn that spell and have an out against Sorganeil in the future since Sorganeil prevents the use of mana. It would thus be very useful for Fern to have that as part of her repertoire in the future if she has to fight Ubel or Wirbel.

[Twi]

Originally Posted by frubam

What is the significance of Serie's fluctuating mana?

Mana detection. Suppression causes fluctuations because it's being forced and Serie was looking for someone who could notice that she was suppressing her mana, showing exemplary detection abilities. It's basically stating based on the entire conversation prior with her apprentice and the guy who didn't notice that Serie was also suppressing her mana even as she mentioned Frieren having done so.

Her own apprentice couldn't even tell that she was suppressing her mana when he noticed Frieren doing it (and keep in mind Frieren has spent her lifetime doing it, so he was talented) due to those same fluctuations, while Fern could tell at a glance that Serie was holding herself back. So from her perspective, Fern is even more promising as a magic student and she's younger than the guy, meaning she can basically train her to be an even greater mage.

[kari-no-sugata II]

Originally Posted by Kazu-kun

It has been long established that mana grows with years of training. Serie seems considerably older than Frieren, as she was already considered a great mage when Frieren just started her training. This means her mana must be way bigger than Freiren's. But according to Lernen, Frieren and Serie's mana look similar in size. The obvious conclusion here is that Serie must be suppressing her mana, hence the fluctuations.

And she's better at it than Frieren, because the fluctuations in her mana are harder to detect.

We can only imagine how big her unsuppressed mana must be. What a terrifying mage despite being so petty and tsundere. lol

While I understand this chain of reasoning in isolation it doesn't explain why Serie then went out of her way to diss mana suppression as inefficient.

It could be a "do as I say and not as I do" scenario but personally I suspect that there's another reason for Serie's mana fluctuations.

[Kazu-kun]

Originally Posted by kari-no-sugata II

While I understand this chain of reasoning in isolation it doesn't explain why Serie then went out of her way to diss mana suppression as inefficient.

It could be a "do as I say and not as I do" scenario but personally I suspect that there's another reason for Serie's mana fluctuations.

I don't think there's any deeper reason. Serie is a tsundere. She can never be honest. She projects the air of a mage who cares primarily about power and how to become stronger, but suppressing your mana is a inefficient technique. It takes too much time to master and the rewards are pretty limited. Of course Serie would not admit she's doing it too.

[Endscape]

Originally Posted by magnuskn

I see a problem with Serie's reasoning that so many people only passed because of Frieren... since it took Frieren to defeat her own clone (with Fern's assistance). Otherwise Sense would have been the big obstacle in the dungeon and we saw what Übel did to her.

You could make the argument that without Frieren around the folks who reached the last chamber might not have pulled together like that to defeat the copies.

Originally Posted by kari-no-sugata II

While I understand this chain of reasoning in isolation it doesn't explain why Serie then went out of her way to diss mana suppression as inefficient.

Serie is a tsundere. She talks a harsh game but she clearly valued Flamme and what she created.

[Shadow5YA]

Originally Posted by magnuskn

I see a problem with Serie's reasoning that so many people only passed because of Frieren... since it took Frieren to defeat her own clone (with Fern's assistance). Otherwise Sense would have been the big obstacle in the dungeon and we saw what Übel did to her.

Kanne and Lawine wouldn't have passed the first test without Frieren.

There are more competent mages than Serie expected, but some of them were also clearly carried.

[ChronoReverse]

Ultimately, normally there are very few candidates making it to the 3rd test and in the past, none made it past the tests Sense gave out.

We don't know if this particularly exam Sense came up with was harder or easier than the past ones (the test-takers certainly didn't think it was easier) but there clearly are far more candidates than usual this time and many of them clearly not even close what first class seems to mean.

[Twi]

I feel so bad for Serie's apprentice. The old dude notices Friren's instability and ends up getting roasted that he doesn't have much longer to live and can't fight her, so she shouldn't take on human apprentices. She's being a Tsudere, but come on the man was on your side for 50 years.

Also loved how when she was walking past him we saw how he looked as a younger mage. She probably does care about him considering she saw Flamme as a child while remembering her.

[stray]

Originally Posted by Twi

She's being a Tsudere, but come on the man was on your side for 50 years.

"Only" 50 years...

[Nachtwandler]

Originally Posted by TURI123456

Among the examinees who do you think will over to the exam and become a First-Class Mage and who not?

I am sure Denken will pass (Fern already did) but I doubt anyone else will.

[Kazu-kun]

I think Ubel will pass, because she seems to have the mentality that Serie is looking for: she doesn't afraid of anything and has a thirst for power.

[EroKing]

ngl part of me kept thinking Ubel was gonna walk in and just slice Serie in half had she tried to fail her

[Cloudedmind]

Originally Posted by Kazu-kun

I don't think there's any deeper reason. Serie is a tsundere. She can never be honest. She projects the air of a mage who cares primarily about power and how to become stronger, but suppressing your mana is a inefficient technique. It takes too much time to master and the rewards are pretty limited. Of course Serie would not admit she's doing it too.

And to add to this, it also stands to reason that someone had to teach it to Flamme, the same way Flamme taught it to Frieren.

[Ragashingo]

Originally Posted by Cloudedmind

And to add to this, it also stands to reason that someone had to teach it to Flamme, the same way Flamme taught it to Frieren.

Fern taught it to herself to hide from the demons attacking her village, didn't she? She was hard for Frieren to detect from the very beginning.

[Kazu-kun]

Maybe Heiter taught Fern the basics of mana suppression.

[Shadow5YA]

Originally Posted by Ragashingo

Fern taught it to herself to hide from the demons attacking her village, didn't she? She was hard for Frieren to detect from the very beginning.

Hiding your presence temporarily for stealth and keeping your mana permanently low are two different things altogether.

[magnuskn]

Originally Posted by Endscape

You could make the argument that without Frieren around the folks who reached the last chamber might not have pulled together like that to defeat the copies.

That's much more hypothetical than Sense being the guardian of the Spiegel, who would have been easily defeated as soon as Übel walked through the door.

[TURI123456]

I think people here have forgotten that the reason that a lot of people were over the second exam was Denken, not Frieren.
Denken is the one who tried to make people work together and his team was the first one to come to that room before the end of the dungeon, even more without Frieren's clone more people were over the test because Denken's group was there first, at the same time that other people still fought against the clones.


About Serie, Serie is the kind of teacher who takes only those with a natural talent. Don't takes the wrong idea about her she will work hard for her students and do a great job as their teacher and she (really) will take care of them and she will let them get into her heart (even if she denies that) but at the same time she still overlooks those that she doesn't "THINK" that can be good mages in other words those that "SHE can't IMAGINE that can be good mages by under HER guidance".

[Anh_Minh]

Originally Posted by Kazu-kun

I think Ubel will pass, because she seems to have the mentality that Serie is looking for: she doesn't afraid of anything and has a thirst for power.

And she's not overly attached with what "everyone knows" about magic. Serie's problem with Frieren's favorite spell may be that it's something Flame taught her instead of something she discovered herself. (Then again, there's a good chance she was going to disapprove of Frieren's choice regardless of what it was.)

Originally Posted by kari-no-sugata II

While I understand this chain of reasoning in isolation it doesn't explain why Serie then went out of her way to diss mana suppression as inefficient.

It could be a "do as I say and not as I do" scenario but personally I suspect that there's another reason for Serie's mana fluctuations.

It's probably that she's tsundere, but she could also be sincere. (Plus, misleading her students would be another level of dick move.)

She said that it takes time, that Frieren isn't where she should be at her age... But Serie herself is a lot older. She's done all the things that were of a higher priority than Mana concealing. Throwing a few centuries into perfecting that skill is nothing.

Originally Posted by magnuskn

I see a problem with Serie's reasoning that so many people only passed because of Frieren... since it took Frieren to defeat her own clone (with Fern's assistance). Otherwise Sense would have been the big obstacle in the dungeon and we saw what Übel did to her.

She's not entirely fair, but she's not interested in being fair. She judges by instinct.

Originally Posted by Kazu-kun

I see no problems with Methode being an all-rounder with several different capabilities. There's no rule that says only Frieren gets to have many abilities. If anything, I want more mages like Methode to show up.

Yeah, I have zero problems with it either. It's the same mana pool, and I bet a lot of skills carry over. The catalyst is cheap enough that even an orphan like Heiter could get one. It just makes sense that any mage with the least bit of talent would learn at least enough divine casting for first aid.