Magic and Technology of MGLN

[Kha]

Originally Posted by Kikaifan

I've seen it as unison device > intelligent device > storage device > no device but manifesting a diagram > pure willpower.

I agree with that, but I'd add a clause that "This is true when the strength of the mage's Linker Core is constant."

[BatAttack]

Originally Posted by Kikaifan

I always kind of assumed that when she did that training at the start of A's RH wasn't doing anything for her.

Mmmm... I'd agree. And she seems to cast a basic barrier against Vita's homing bullet and hammer attack on her own too..

Though, that is six months later, and she has presumably been practicing.
By this point the math she needs for divine shooter (and any other spell she can manage device-less) could be within her grasp..

We don't know the limit of her intellect, but (1) she is an anime heroine, (2) she is frequently referred to a being academically smart and is a natural at magic (3) all the kids in Nanoha have near adult mental development anyway - if she is practicing the necessary math with Raging Heart everyday, within 6 months she might have graped it - perhaps intuitively rather than formally. It's difficult to say what these mages have to conceptualise to cast their spells..

I imagine telepathic communication and virtual visualisation tools (as per the manga) would make for good teaching aids, too.


@Keroko: I'm not sure about your tank analogy.
A device is an aid to spell casting, while a tank is everything to a tank crew.

After all, even without her 'tank', Nanoha can still cast spells.

And Yuuno has no device, but is far from harmless.

I think Nightengale's calculator analogy is more apt.. she is used to having a lot of the nitty gritty of spell casting off-loaded onto her I.D.

(In the same way that having an address book in my mobile phone has made my memory for phone numbers sloppy - I used to remember them all)

But as people have pointed out, she practices spell casting device-less sometimes, this might be to make sure she does not let those skills deteriorate (which would be what I called 'going soft' from over-reliance on her device).

[BatAttack]

Originally Posted by Nightengale

Erm...whut?

What's the difference? Yuuno and Lindy both fall under those categories, anyway.

I think Kikaifan is saying that Yuuno does not use magic circles (I thought he did) and that Lindy does..

[Keroko]

Originally Posted by BatAttack

I think Kikaifan is saying that Yuuno does not use magic circles (I thought he did) and that Lindy does..

*tilts head* I can't remember a single time where Yuuno was casting spells without a circle either.

[Kha]

Originally Posted by Keroko

*tilts head* I can't remember a single time where Yuuno was casting spells without a circle either.

His transformation occured without a sigil.

[Keroko]

Originally Posted by Kha

His transformation occured without a sigil.

It did? Could've sworn there was a circle then as well. Gotta re-check that when I get back.

[BatAttack]

Originally Posted by Kha

His transformation occured without a sigil.

Transformation to ferret? Or back again?

When Arf transformed to wolf form and back to human form, she did not use a circle either (ep 5, season1).

Apparently for multi-formed creatures (like Yuuno and Arf) a circle is not necessary. This probably only applies to their 'true' forms. It seems Arf can change her 'true' form with time (like her chibi forms), but I'm guessing she only has a couple of 'pre-set slots', as it were..

I'm guessing that they would still require a circle for disguise magic.

[Meophist]

Hrmm… In terms of magic and tech of Nanoha, there's one thing that stood out for me:
Why are the mages unaffected by their own attack magic?

[Darco_emp]

Originally Posted by Meophist

Hrmm… In terms of magic and tech of Nanoha, there's one thing that stood out for me:
Why are the mages unaffected by their own attack magic?

Hmm, Really care to point me to an example of this? I never really noticed it....

[Keroko]

They hardly remain unafected. Nanoha already nearly blew herself up when trying to improve her Starlight Breaker.

[Meophist]

Originally Posted by Keroko

They hardly remain unafected. Nanoha already nearly blew herself up when trying to improve her Starlight Breaker.

Well, that's true. I don't remember when the first time a character was unaffected by their own spell, but there's YnS's attacks. Specifically Starlight Breaker.

[Kha]

Originally Posted by Meophist

Hrmm… In terms of magic and tech of Nanoha, there's one thing that stood out for me:
Why are the mages unaffected by their own attack magic?

Nanoha almost blew herself up testing out SB+, and it was only thanks to Yuuno that she was in one piece.

I still remember her reply to "are you alive?" - "S-somehow..." It was absolutely golden. Hmm... Ok maybe more like golden brown.

Besides it'll be pretty haxx, if not overtrivializing, if they turned team damage off.

Fate: (caught in swordlock) Dam he's strong...
Nanoha: STARLIGHT BREAKER+
Enemy: What?! She's cra-- (swallowed up)

The blast simmers for a while, then out of a puff in the plume comes Fate

Fate: NANOHA! YOU RUINED MY HAIR!!!
Nanoha: Ah-hahaha... Gome, gome!

[Keroko]

Originally Posted by Meophist

Well, that's true. I don't remember when the first time a character was unaffected by their own spell, but there's YnS's attacks. Specifically Starlight Breaker.

Yami no Sho was completely unafected by the starlight breaker she shot, as for Nanoha and fate, they were hiding behind cardridge-powered barriers.

[Darco_emp]

Originally Posted by Meophist

Well, that's true. I don't remember when the first time a character was unaffected by their own spell, but there's YnS's attacks. Specifically Starlight Breaker.

I would not call that uneffected... Nanoha had too burn quite a few cartridges to keep that wild area protection up, also Fate also used a barrier type spell. and a third layer defenser plus is added to Suzuka and Alisa. So I think they are taking that attack very seriously.

If your talking about YnS, isn't she outside of the blast radius since that SLB was fired at a ~60degree angle

[Meophist]

Originally Posted by Darco_emp

If your talking about YnS, isn't she outside of the blast radius since that SLB was fired at a ~60degree angle

Was it? Did it just expand from where she fired it? Engulfing basically everything?

[Keroko]

Originally Posted by Meophist

Was it? Did it just expand from where she fired it? Engulfing basically everything?

Everything bellow her, yes. It only started expanding after it hit the ground.

[Meophist]

I must be remembering things wrong, I haven't watched A's in a while.

How about that black spherical attack?

[Darco_emp]

Originally Posted by Meophist

I must be remembering things wrong, I haven't watched A's in a while.

How about that black spherical attack?

Perhaps the places she is at is like eye of a cyclone. If we can a spherical field around YnS as the center of that attack then it should not effect her then. Or perhaps in the "coding" of her code she add an exception statement of sorts.

There are many ways to expain why an attack seems not to effect their user.

[Keroko]

Black sphere thing? You mean after Reinforce seperated from the defensive program? Cause that wasn't exactly an attack.

[LoweGear]

I think he's referring to "Diabolic Emission".

*is quite overwhelmed at the moment by the sheer size of this thread, has trouble keeping up*