World Of Warcraft Discussion Thread

[GDB]

Originally Posted by Hooves

Since Cata is getting waaaay better reviews then Wotlk, I'm expecting it to scale up to about 15-16 million subscriptions....

Is this assuming the total of Cataclysm, including China's eventual release 1-3 years from now, or just the initial month of sales?

Originally Posted by Konakaga

Hmmm epic relics from Inscription, hmm I guess they felt was unfair they're are crafted wands and ranged for other classes, but no relics for classes that used them, so I like this idea.

Just saw this. Depending on what other relics do, this could be a viable option for DKs, Druids, Shaman, and Paladins. The ones available were pretty good. Not great, but good. Probably won't be lasting slots, though.

[Ithekro]

Finally got up to the 12.500g needed to build a second bike if I needed. Next goal I guess it to build up a little bit more to cover the new flying requirements in the next two months...no pressure there...unless the World Events make things difficult for most of that time.

Looks like Kingslayer will be out of reach before 4.0 happens since the group seems to by laying low (unless they start something tonight or this weekend). Got to see the Lich King at least last week. They'd killed everything else and I got in the following week on an extension that didn't happen (as a raid). So I explored. stood by the Lich King...took pictures. Acted like a tourist to Icecrown.

[Hooves]

Originally Posted by Ithekro

Finally got up to the 12.500g needed to build a second bike if I needed. Next goal I guess it to build up a little bit more to cover the new flying requirements in the next two months...no pressure there...unless the World Events make things difficult for most of that time.

Looks like Kingslayer will be out of reach before 4.0 happens since the group seems to by laying low (unless they start something tonight or this weekend). Got to see the Lich King at least last week. They'd killed everything else and I got in the following week on an extension that didn't happen (as a raid). So I explored. stood by the Lich King...took pictures. Acted like a tourist to Icecrown.

@GDB: Yes

Also wait... Kingslayer is going to be removed before 4.0?? That just stresses my goal alot more....

[Ithekro]

Not removed...just not as...sound pre-4.0. (at least as far as I know)

Post 4.0 with the talent tree changes and the removal of the 30% buff, I have no idea how our group would do in ICC. Before lauch and thus not over leveling the instance yet I mean.

Post lauch when you can do it at level 85..then it won't be as great of an achievement.

[Hooves]

Originally Posted by Ithekro

Not removed...just not as...sound pre-4.0. (at least as far as I know)

Post 4.0 with the talent tree changes and the removal of the 30% buff, I have no idea how our group would do in ICC. Before lauch and thus not over leveling the instance yet I mean.

Post lauch when you can do it at level 85..then it won't be as great of an achievement.

I dont know how the groups will do without the 30%... Most of the time we have been relying on that buff to get our dps sky-rocketing to the dps we have now, but without it.... We might not be able to reach certain kills.... Let alone might get our tanks killed from under-healing.

[Clarste]

Originally Posted by Hooves

I dont know how the groups will do without the 30%... Most of the time we have been relying on that buff to get our dps sky-rocketing to the dps we have now, but without it.... We might not be able to reach certain kills.... Let alone might get our tanks killed from under-healing.

Well, the talents changes might help, or hurt.

[Last Sinner]

Put it this way...most classes are lucky to reach 9k DPS in 85 gear on beta - sometimes. You don't have a hope. Unless you find a top-line guild to buy it from. But it's not worth it.

[Ithekro]

That is what I'm basically worried about. Unlike Sunwell which was easier after the patch, Icecrown will probably be harder.

[Hooves]

Originally Posted by Ithekro

That is what I'm basically worried about. Unlike Sunwell which was easier after the patch, Icecrown will probably be harder.

Sunwell was defiantly easier when they nerfed it with the patch (which down-sized the bosses' HP) Icecrown... All were getting is the 30% buff removed, so there is not much change from the difficulty when it first released... Aside from us getting Cataclysm gear, and possibly steam-rolling it later on in the future just for kicks and giggles.

Put it this way...most classes are lucky to reach 9k DPS in 85 gear on beta - sometimes. You don't have a hope. Unless you find a top-line guild to buy it from. But it's not worth it.

9k DPS in 85 gear? I thought people would be racking up about 11-13k (depending on class) before the buff for ICC came out, I used to pull 7k on Deathbringer Saurfang with ToC gear... Maybe it was just that Death Knights were slightly still OP then... Still depends on the class basically, and if they havnt been nerfed severely.

[Xacual]

A lot of the talent changes are harsh for some classes dps, also don't forget that at 85 we'll have lost a lot of crit and hit. Also at 85 bosses and stuff will scale with players more.

Patch 3.0 may have reduced boss hp and stuff but it also seriously buffed some classes dps. My moonkin for instance gained about 600 dps from the patch putting her ahead of my way better geared ele shaman. Other classes were about the same it was kind of crazy.

[Ithekro]

3.0 buffed the hell out of my Voidwalker for a bit. (I was specced to buff my VW for questing, farming, and dailies at the time) Went from not really being able to hold aggro/threat all that well (and dying fairly often) to being able to mostly hold threat and almost never dying (farming rep in Nagrand became fun at that point), to current state of kind of able to hold threat with T10 armor and almost never dying unless hit by a boss or massive numbers of adds. And this is as Destruction.

Also the addition of Chaos Bolt and making Confragrate useful (glyphed) in a rotation (for extra damage and a haste buff) helped as well. Chaos Bolt crits were awesome at 3.0 compared with what I was use to seeing from my Incinerates.

In seeing the recent TotalBiscuit Mage videos, and the size of the Arcane damage and crits, I wonder about how Warlocks will compete...though Fire and Frost damage didn't seem all that much higher than what I'm doing now. (Arcane damage was high but very mana intensive) Dps seems to be around 6k self buffed on a target dummy for all Mage specs in ilvl 333 gear (Dungeon gear pre-raiding), which is about what I do in a Raid currently in ilvl 251 raid gear with raid buffs (based on other peoples Recount as I don't currently use that addon)...also I don't think that includes my pet's dps, though I don't know what my imp is putting out (just that he wants to start seeing other warlocks).

[Last Sinner]

Anyone who goes Arcane in Cata should stop playing...it's Fire or nothing. Aside from a 3% damage boost, Arcane is pure junk. Fire's crit benefit for all, the survival talents, better use of mana, AoE spells - that is the way to go. Frost has changed a fair bit but is still a good tree. Once you figure out the new priorities, becomes easy to assimilate.

You may seriously want to learn the new Affliction, Ithekro. The new things it has are pretty lethal.

[Kotohono]

Well looking at talents for ret pally I think it stands to possible become more DPS than it does currently once the new priority and dealing with holy power down, though I am sure it's going to take me sometime to get anywhere near use to holy paladin's changes, and I am still not sure what the heck holy power does for the holy spec, I can tell for retr. but not holy. Also anyone know where[if it's available] what changed set bonuses for current tier will be for classes like my retr.'s tier 9 is "Your Righteous Vengeance talent now has a chance for its damage to be critical strikes.", but Righteous Vengeance is being removed, so what going to be in it's place?

And I did ICC 10 today with PUG group cause I missed my guild raid cause I was doing online homework early and watching Fate/Stay Night: UBW, anyways we cleared all up to got Prof. Putricide no wipes, then we did not even get him as low as my guild has, so they decided to do Crimson Halls and we beat princes first try and queen second attempt despite me and two others in the raid having never done either fight before making me go at my guild for always trying go for prof. before them.

[Last Sinner]

Hate to break it to you but pretty much every Heroic in Cata - even the trash - is at a Putricide standard, if not higher.

[Kotohono]

Originally Posted by Last Sinner

Hate to break it to you but pretty much every Heroic in Cata - even the trash - is at a Putricide standard, if not higher.

I am worried about the bar being that high and not sure how it's possible to make every 5 man that complex, though I'll take that kind of standard over HoR HC becoming the standard , and really I am more worried about how people in random HCs will be then since I can handle fight of that nature[just freaking DPS or person controlling abomb. always mess up there, seriously have never wiped that fight due to heals <_<].

[Ithekro]

We are expecting fail heals in CATA.

[GDB]

Originally Posted by Ithekro

We are expecting fail heals in CATA.

I prefer to think of it as "sane" heals. Wrath was just so ridiculous in pretty much every aspect of everything.

[Hooves]

Originally Posted by GDB

I prefer to think of it as "sane" heals. Wrath was just so ridiculous in pretty much every aspect of everything.

Heals were getting so much buffs in Wrath, that it was just getting silly and not surprising that they over-heal...

[Kunagisa]

Originally Posted by Hooves

Heals were getting so much buffs in Wrath, that it was just getting silly and not surprising that they over-heal...

Overhealing is just part of the game mechanic I suppose. It's either live or die in most cases since the damage's spikey and super over heal compensate for that.

My main roles were tank and healing (warrior and druid) with offspec dps. I must say healing is boring in wrath except a couple of fights, namely:

• HM vezax 25
• 2 healing firefighter 10 pre-nerf
• 2 healing algalon 10 without holy paladin or disc priest
• heroic anub 25
• 2 healing marrow 10 heroic with 1 tank/4 healing marrow 25 with 2 tanks without any paladins
• 5 healing saurfang 25 without paladins (and not eough dps to kill him under 5 marks)
• Phase 1 and 2 of heroic LK without a disc priest or holy pally

So really, healing isn't that bad in WOTLK considering most of the end bosses provide enough difficulties (before nerfs and buffs) to entertain you at each level of content. It's just outside of those specific fights rest is kinda dumb that's all.

The mentality of zerg it harder works for almost all the bosses trivialize a lot of mechanics (or lack of) once you outgrow the gear by one content level makes healing that much more boring near the end.

Tanking continue to be fun though because things are more interactive for tanks I guess. I never really find DPSing particularly engaging by any means (except when you're studying for a midterm and you want to just go auto-pilot mode for bosses).

Tonight's the last week we're going for Bane (get people to raid at this time of the year and period of expansion is sooooooooooooooooooooooooo hard) assuming if 4.0.1 comes through next Tuesday/Wednesday. This, Immortal, and Herald of the Titans are the 3 titles I want from Wrath, so if we get this tonight that means I have 2 out of 3 that I want, and I'll be satisfied with it (can always go back and get Herald in cata providing enough people want to farm outdated gear).

[Hooves]

I finally reached my goal reached 14k dps on Deathbringer Saurfang on 10 man (with Bloodlust + Army of the Dead + Hysteria) I was so happy to make it that high