Mahouka Koukou no Rettousei LN - Archived Discussion

[Von Himmel]

^
It's from the newest arc: Double Seven that hasn't been released in LN format yet.

[Chimurry]

Originally Posted by Von Himmel

And my point from the start is that prior to the war. I don't have any qualms about finding her background during the war or after the war since people could basically assume anything; there's always a possibility that things could get handled off-screen.

I already made that point back in my previous post in case you don't remember.

Yeah people could identify whether he/she is from military or not based on manners. You're grasping too much if you said you can see what specific unit they worked in by seeing it from appearance alone. Not everyone is a Sherlock.

Uhh?? I ain't said the Unit, I wrote before the attack, there's enough to think She top Military Elite, about the other: Ok, got it.

About Retsu, Koichi and the attempt to weaken Yotsuba revealing Tats is member of 101th in order anti magic factions attack 1st High, I honestly don't think this its the real plan, its too easy, something its wrong, such Plan have many flaws.

Koichi "could be" real motives theories:

1. Its highly probably Koichi wish paid back from Tats due the incident on Military research link to Saegusa during Vamps detention time, its not clear if Mayumi help and how, same issue about charge Tats with that incident, cuz they could know it was Sirius alone.

2. Due Okinawa and Scorched Halloween, Koichi understand how power full its 101th and its not affiliated to Saegusa or others Clan, however looks like they close to Yotsuba, remember 4th Clan don't openly declaring whom is with them, so he can assume 101th is affiliate to Yotsuba.

3. Using an excuse to force deals with Maya, direct confrontation could only weaken both Clans and Juumongi, Kudou and others its the real winners, but if he can deal marriage proposals with Yotsuba, he can take advantage of the mighty power full 4th Clan, on this point I think we still don't know Mayumi elder brother and his conditions, so its not only Tats whom could be targeted, however, in Mayumi November 2095 SS he shows abnormal interest on Tats and on Vol 4 offered Mayumi as bride like "take and go" deal, well even one of the twins of Tats not happy with elder one, like I said before: is been months since Koichi told Mayumi bring the siblings and She still didn't made it.

4. Retsu ready have his plans over the same issue (Yotsuba rising power), so I think Koichi is luring Retsu, cuz Retsu will use Koichi for his plans, remember the old man ready knows about USNA agent inner work.

I believe Koichi is probably one of the better knows Maya way of think, its not clear how is the business among them, remember the love past and anyone can tell this highly probable good motivation for decades of give/take, if they are not good relationship right now.

Finally: I don't believe this will solve within D7 next and remain release, most likely is a cliffhanger to next arc.

[Von Himmel]

Finally: I don't believe this will solve within D7 next and remain release, most likely is a cliffhanger to next arc

At least I hope they'll deal the matters with Shippou in this arc Hopefully he'll be more friendly at the end of this arc.. somehow I can see his relationship with Tatsuya would become interesting if he acknowledge his ability. That is to say that he's not going to loathe Tatsuya for no reasons like now but more in a sense of building a one-sided rivalry like Kasumi.

[malason13]

Originally Posted by Von Himmel

At least I hope they'll deal the matters with Shippou in this arc Hopefully he'll be more friendly at the end of this arc.. somehow I can see his relationship with Tatsuya would become interesting if he acknowledge his ability. That is to say that he's not going to loathe Tatsuya for no reasons like now but more in a sense of building a one-sided rivalry like Kasumi.

We'll if we have another one-sided rivalry is fine. However it is more fun if Kasumi's rivalry with Tatsuya turns into something more with a deep meaning(If you know what i mean) AHAHAHAHHAAHAHHA!!

[NeutralZero]

^Mayumi will surely be against it... while the other sister will certainly be happy since its a win win situation for her... either of the two Tatsuya chooses will still make Miyuki her onee-sama...
But that Shippou has something against the Saegusa so its possible that he'll be the wrench that will surely throw Koichi's orinal plan to to chaos... where both 4 and 7 receiving blows/damage...

[malason13]

Originally Posted by NeutralZero

^Mayumi will surely be against it... while the other sister will certainly be happy since its a win win situation for her... either of the two Tatsuya chooses will still make Miyuki her onee-sama...
But that Shippou has something against the Saegusa so its possible that he'll be the wrench that will surely throw Koichi's orinal plan to to chaos... where both 4 and 7 receiving blows/damage...

1. We'll you're right for Izumi it will definitely be a win-win situation. For Tatsuya it will only cause problems. For Mayumi a potential love rival? For Miyuki - It will be the worse! The nightmare among nightmares for her!

2. Well you are right about Shippou. He will not be introduced if he was not important in the D7 arc.

[Shorya]

Personal thoughts:

1. I don't think Koichi knows about Tatsuya being a Strategic Warhead; his actual relationship with Yotsuba *him being the niece of the Maya* and him being a Guardian.

2. if he really do know and still planning the same thing then it's plain idiocy...
first if other countries got to know about a new Strategic Warhead of Japan, that sure would affect the peace +plus+ Government surely won't want their Trump card *Tatsuya* to be revealed and Seagusa's *Koichi* being the one behind the plan will surely face the Government + public wrath..

3. Till now we've seen many a time that Yotsuba's network for information gathering is exceptional and they surely won't want their exceptional plaything *Tatsuya* and their future Family head to encounter something which'll put them in bad shoes..... plus Tatsuya also has another great source "kokone-sensei" the famous ninja who's well known for his info collection and even he won't want his cute pupil *Miyuki* and a good student to be in some unnecessary trouble...... and also their's something that Shizuka told Tatsuya on her arrival from USNA.

4. I don't get it how does revealing Tatsuya being the member of 101 independent battalion would hurt Yotsuba. Though I got that a high school student being a part of military may rose some public opinions but the most of family heirs and members do take part in frontlines during a war....... the only problem could be that the Ten families aren't allowed to partake or interfere in Military, which here breach the condition since Tatsuya's part of Military.

5. And wouldn't it would be a kinda beneficial for Yotsuba if a member of their clans one of the most important asset and aid of Japan, since The "fifth family" surely enjoys favourable treatment and benefits because of "Mio" being Japan's officially registered Strategic Warhead.....There maybe be some opposition initially but it's a fact that Yotsuba did support the country by providing such a valuable asset which's even more that just a simple Warhead who causes Mass destruction *like his achievements in Software field and his abnormally vast knowledge which can help in solving the numerous mysteries of magic like "cardinal codes" etc*

[L-V]

So after two months I finally finished reading this whole thread. And decided to register in this forum today. I'm already feeling bits of impending headache. But before that, without regards to the most recent posts (since I think my own interpretations/comments will be convoluted if I read them now).

Originally Posted by Flere821

Spoiler for Part 3 of 3:

Meanwhile Koichi, the current Saegusa family head, is having the actress Mari over as a guest. Mayumi led Maki to Koichi, and wondered why was someone from the entertainment industry contacting one of the Ten Clans.

The Saegusa Twins took their thoughts to Mayumi after she finished dealing with Maki, asking her what does she think about the current Shippou family head. Mayumi figured out the twins would only be asking this if they got into some trouble with Takuma, and confronted them about this. Kasumi didn’t manage to even attempt to fake nothing happened with Mayumi’s sharp instincts. Before Mayumi could start lecturing the twins Izumi said it’s not Kasumi’s fault, and Mayumi decided to trust them for now. Mayumi confirmed the current Shippou family head isn’t a confrontational one, so it’s purely a personal issue by Takuma. The twins then started theorizing why would he do this, discarding theories like he has some personal magical skill to rival the Ten Clans members to there’s some other backer behind his actions. Mayumi told the twins they’re thinking too much into this, but they’re not convinced.

Maki proposed a deal to Koichi, asking him to not intervene when her father break the pact between the mages and the anti-magic faction. Koichi agreed eventually, on the condition whatever her side is doing they leave the Saegusa-affiliated mages out of it.

After Maki left, Koichi contacted Kudou with a visual call. He calls Kudou by ‘sensei’ rather than Kudou’s other titles, a habit from back when he was Kudou’s student with Yotsuba Maya and Miya. Koichi told Kudou he had just received one of USNA’s agents who’s part of their plot to subvert the Japanese media to use as leverage against the Japanese mages. Kudou remarked Koichi would have known all this before today, he has his own sources. Koichi revealed he plans to use the USNA to weaken the Yotsuba, that particular Clan has become too powerful, far superior to the rest of the Ten Clans and can dictate the fate of their nation if they wished to. Kudou has similar sentiments to Koichi, but said nothing outwardly since both side knew this already. Koichi plans to reveal the existence of the student who’s in 1st High and is part of the 101st Battalion, the media and the human rights focused politicians will eat this reveal right up. Koichi also waved aside Kudou’s remark Koichi’s daughters currently attending 1st high will be affected by this, Koichi thinks in this case the other students will only be seen as victims. Kudou commented Koichi is probably doing this mainly because 1st High’s Principal holds a neutral position and refuses to take sides in the politics within the Ten Clans – basically, the principal had refused to ally himself to the Saegusa. Koichi denied the importance of that particular tidbit, saying his main focus is weakening the Yotsuba, and this attack on 1st High is because the 101st Battalion is close to the Yotsuba. Koichi thinks attacks on 1st High students by anti-magic factions are within acceptable losses, and it’ll serve to twist public opinion against the anti-magic faction, which is a boon for the Ten Clans (in his POV). Kudou said he does not hold the authority to approve of Koichi’s plans, nor had he ever had that authority. Koichi replied authority aside, Kudou still has the influence over the plan if he wished to intervene. Kudou in the end declared he does not disapprove of Koichi’s plans, which Koichi then thanked Kudou and closed the conversation with satisfaction.

Before the screen has turned off, Kudou’s face looked like a weary old man fitting his real age.

Spoiler for Koichi & Kudou Stuffs:

From what I understood...

KOICHI speculates/knows:
1. Tatsuya is a Yotsuba
2. There's a Yotsuba in 101st Battalion
3. He's studying in First High
4. He has a sister.

KUDOU knows:
1. Kazama err...acquired Tatsuya 3 years ago (a scene from Nine Schools Competition)
2. Tatsuya is a Yotsuba guardian
3. [This is just an opinion] Considering he was the chairman (?) of Ten Master Clans during that time 3 years ago, and the fact that he knew Tatsuya joined 101st Battalion then, I assume he also knows about Tatsuya, the berserker version.


Considering the above stuffs, I think Koichi's...plan was like that because he thought that Tatsuya is Maya's successor, (I am uncertain if he knew of the Guardian system, but I think not). He was well-aware Tatsuya is the older of the siblings, and if he knew/confirmed he's a Yotsuba, I think it isn't impossible for him to think that way. And therefore, divulging Tatsuya's identity will not only make Yotsuba's plans of keeping him away from spotlight be ruined, it will definitely be easier for Koichi to keep track of how Tatsuya/Yotsuba moves without all those secrecy stuffs...and ultimately, predicting how they move = weakening them. (insert those anti-magic organization, USNA and 101st battalion issues here).


At the end of Flere's summary, Kudou was stated to look "weary". He didn't approve but he didn't disapprove of Koichi's plans either, which makes me think that although he wanted Yotsuba to weaken (hence his answer), he was wary (?), conflicted with what's the best approach/plan without involving Tatsuya (I just got the feeling he actually wanted to keep him as an ally). But I assume he wasn't able to voice out (or maybe he really didn't plan to in the first place) Tatsuya's real power. The weary look was probably like a silent "Koichi doesn't know what's he's up against" expression.

^ I hope my assumptions didn't conflict that much with previous posts. /not up against heated arguments with my migraine.

Also... link

[pampz21]

ah...Koichi is an idiot who doesnt finish his homework!!!!
If he had done his homework then he wouldn't miss Tatsuya's title as a SPECIAL lieutenant that only in certain situation that it he secret information will revoke like Kazama said.
yeah so hes a child soldier who cares anyway in the course of history theres alot of them, eventho in public Tatsuya doesnt have anything to do with the Yotsuba, like the mass media has the intellegence source to surpass the Yotsuba clan satellite source....

anyway I just wish that they wont hurt Miyuki and Tatsuya's friend, or else they'll unleash the wrath of demon god again, this time pointed at there own Japanese security!

[henzaeroz]

Originally Posted by Shorya

Personal thoughts:

1. I don't think Koichi knows about Tatsuya being a Strategic Warhead; his actual relationship with Yotsuba *him being the niece of the Maya* and him being a Guardian.

2. if he really do know and still planning the same thing then it's plain idiocy...
first if other countries got to know about a new Strategic Warhead of Japan, that sure would affect the peace +plus+ Government surely won't want their Trump card *Tatsuya* to be revealed and Seagusa's *Koichi* being the one behind the plan will surely face the Government + public wrath..

3. Till now we've seen many a time that Yotsuba's network for information gathering is exceptional and they surely won't want their exceptional plaything *Tatsuya* and their future Family head to encounter something which'll put them in bad shoes..... plus Tatsuya also has another great source "kokone-sensei" the famous ninja who's well known for his info collection and even he won't want his cute pupil *Miyuki* and a good student to be in some unnecessary trouble...... and also their's something that Shizuka told Tatsuya on her arrival from USNA.

4. I don't get it how does revealing Tatsuya being the member of 101 independent battalion would hurt Yotsuba. Though I got that a high school student being a part of military may rose some public opinions but the most of family heirs and members do take part in frontlines during a war....... the only problem could be that the Ten families aren't allowed to partake or interfere in Military, which here breach the condition since Tatsuya's part of Military.

5. And wouldn't it would be a kinda beneficial for Yotsuba if a member of their clans one of the most important asset and aid of Japan, since The "fifth family" surely enjoys favourable treatment and benefits because of "Mio" being Japan's officially registered Strategic Warhead.....There maybe be some opposition initially but it's a fact that Yotsuba did support the country by providing such a valuable asset which's even more that just a simple Warhead who causes Mass destruction *like his achievements in Software field and his abnormally vast knowledge which can help in solving the numerous mysteries of magic like "cardinal codes" etc*

1. agree with you

2. -

3. -


4. from Mayumi SS we know Koichi’s concern is that the Yotusba family is trying to establish an extremely close relation with the independent 101 Squadron.
maybe Koichi just try to cut down the ties between Yotsuba and 101 / Military .

well, i don't think it will effect Yotsuba afterall. Yotsuba still far superior to the rest of the Ten Clans ( Yotsuba Maya is one of the world's single most powerful magicians + they have Walking Nuclear Silo )



5. nope, Yotsuba want to keep their secret and work in shadow. revealing their secrets can be backfire.

if Tatsuya revealed as War Class Magician then he should worry about his head being hunt by mages from another country. keeping secret is very important for him if he still seek for freedom.




ah, i wanna ask about Government, Military and Mages position in japan. Mages are under the Government but not the military, right ?

[Flere821]

Remind me again, what's the title of the Mayumi SS again? I'm drawing a blank on this one

@ D7 topic: My understanding of Koichi's plan is as follows:

-Koichi does not know Tatsuya's one of the Yotsuba.

-Koichi knows the 101st is close to the Yotsuba Clan. Tatsuya is one of the 101st (though not that Tatsuya's true ability is that of Strategic Class).

-Anti-magic faction is likely to launch a attack on 1st High, with Maki manipulating Shippou into helping her goals as the kid is blinded by his hatred to the Saegusa. The attack will have enough strength to force a massacre of 1st High, to end up with a atrocity (killing a lot of minors) that is so horrible Japanese public opinion will no longer tolerate such extremists. This attack is likely to be prevented only if Tatsuya unleashes his ability as one of the 101st to protect the school. However, even if Tatsuya does not give a damn, escapes with Miyuki with her safety as the top priority and let the rest of the school die, Koichi might not be well and truly F@#$ed - Koichi sees losing all the students of the entire 1st High as "tolerable", as the anti-magic faction will still be taking a huge backlash (he does not seem to believe his daughters will be affected by this in any way).

-The (surviving) students of 1st high in general will be seen as victims, both from the attack and by how Koichi plans to twist the events to show 1st High are training (some of) them into child soldiers like Tatsuya, a blatant disregard of human rights which resulted in making the school a target for anti-magic faction attacks. The 101st will take a huge hit from this revelation, weakening their influence, and due to their close ties with the Yotsuba the 4th Clan will be dragged down with the 101st in the behind-the-scene politics.

[henzaeroz]

Originally Posted by Flere821

Remind me again, what's the title of the Mayumi SS again? I'm drawing a blank on this one

don't know which one but got it from Whsie last year

http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost...&postcount=865

Originally Posted by Flere821

(he does not seem to believe his daughters will be affected by this in any way).

you write this....

Maki proposed a deal to Koichi, asking him to not intervene when her father break the pact between the mages and the anti-magic faction. Koichi agreed eventually, on the condition whatever her side is doing they leave the Saegusa-affiliated mages out of it.

Originally Posted by Flere821

The 101st will take a huge hit from this revelation, weakening their influence, and due to their close ties with the Yotsuba the 4th Clan will be dragged down with the 101st in the behind-the-scene politics.

what evidence he can used to proof the ties between Yotsuba and 101 ?

Tatsuya ?

[millie10468]

I'm drawing a serious blank... who's Maki again?

[Awrya]

The actress in Double Seven, who has an alliance with Shippou and visited Saegusa Koichi. If I remember correctly, she's said to be a USNA spy as well.

[millie10468]

Originally Posted by Awrya

The actress in Double Seven, who has an alliance with Shippou and visited Saegusa Koichi. If I remember correctly, she's said to be a USNA spy as well.

I see. Thanks I was wondering if I had missed her in the released novels. I think it has already been mentioned but isn't it treason, what Koichi is doing with Maki?

[Chimurry]

Originally Posted by Flere821

Remind me again, what's the title of the Mayumi SS again? I'm drawing a blank on this one

@ D7 topic: My understanding of Koichi's plan is as follows:

-Koichi does not know Tatsuya's one of the Yotsuba.

-Koichi knows the 101st is close to the Yotsuba Clan. Tatsuya is one of the 101st (though not that Tatsuya's true ability is that of Strategic Class).

-Anti-magic faction is likely to launch a attack on 1st High, with Maki manipulating Shippou into helping her goals as the kid is blinded by his hatred to the Saegusa. The attack will have enough strength to force a massacre of 1st High, to end up with a atrocity (killing a lot of minors) that is so horrible Japanese public opinion will no longer tolerate such extremists. This attack is likely to be prevented only if Tatsuya unleashes his ability as one of the 101st to protect the school. However, even if Tatsuya does not give a damn, escapes with Miyuki with her safety as the top priority and let the rest of the school die, Koichi might not be well and truly F@#$ed - Koichi sees losing all the students of the entire 1st High as "tolerable", as the anti-magic faction will still be taking a huge backlash (he does not seem to believe his daughters will be affected by this in any way).

-The (surviving) students of 1st high in general will be seen as victims, both from the attack and by how Koichi plans to twist the events to show 1st High are training (some of) them into child soldiers like Tatsuya, a blatant disregard of human rights which resulted in making the school a target for anti-magic faction attacks. The 101st will take a huge hit from this revelation, weakening their influence, and due to their close ties with the Yotsuba the 4th Clan will be dragged down with the 101st in the behind-the-scene politics.

About Tatsuya/Yotsuba/101th connection this from your D7 chapter 3, part 3:
Quote @Flere821 D7 ch3 P3 summary:
"Koichi revealed he plans to use the USNA to weaken the Yotsuba, that particular Clan has become too powerful, far superior to the rest of the Ten Clans and can dictate the fate of their nation if they wished to. Kudou has similar sentiments to Koichi, but said nothing outwardly since both side knew this already. Koichi plans to reveal the existence of the student who’s in 1st High and is part of the 101st Battalion, the media and the human rights focused politicians will eat this reveal right up. Koichi also waved aside Kudou’s remark Koichi’s daughters currently attending 1st high will be affected by this, Koichi thinks in this case the other students will only be seen as victims. (... ) saying his main focus is weakening the Yotsuba, and this attack on 1st High is because the 101st Battalion is close to the Yotsuba."

Unless my imagination play me tricks I see Koichi - Retsu talk about Tats.
I was thinking reading the few lines about Kirihara opinion, Miyuki happiness to see finally her brother stands more than her when they arrive to the conflict area, how looks like the students have?? deep respect for them, so I was remembering Tats act of flickering rifle bullets with bare hands in front of the auditorium audience (to be accurate: it was MD from Tats, but he plays Vegas trick to not reveal his mist dispersion, so on the open view he was using his bare hands), so his respect meter from students and in special from high grades have to high to avoid any of them trying funny stuff, off course plus other public incidents like the Student Elections act and previous recruitment week.

About Koichi plans on 1st High anti magic attack: I think, Koichi is smart enough to understand the actual "normal" live combat level of the students are higher than usually is in others schools, so the conditions like liberte attack has changed, they're more experienced on the field, its not clear if they keep practices like did before Thesis Competition event, I hink they even get more live combat training after Vamps arc events, so its not clear if will be chance for the anti magic groups, off course I think the unavoidable fate for them is disappear in small flame and dust like Blanche did.

[waffler]

wait does yotsuba maya count as a strategic mage? because shes like one of the strongexst mages rite but i never heard of her being a strategic class mage

[blackwhite67]

Originally Posted by Flere821

Remind me again, what's the title of the Mayumi SS again? I'm drawing a blank on this one

@ D7 topic: My understanding of Koichi's plan is as follows:

-Koichi does not know Tatsuya's one of the Yotsuba.

-Koichi knows the 101st is close to the Yotsuba Clan. Tatsuya is one of the 101st (though not that Tatsuya's true ability is that of Strategic Class).

-Anti-magic faction is likely to launch a attack on 1st High, with Maki manipulating Shippou into helping her goals as the kid is blinded by his hatred to the Saegusa. The attack will have enough strength to force a massacre of 1st High, to end up with a atrocity (killing a lot of minors) that is so horrible Japanese public opinion will no longer tolerate such extremists. This attack is likely to be prevented only if Tatsuya unleashes his ability as one of the 101st to protect the school. However, even if Tatsuya does not give a damn, escapes with Miyuki with her safety as the top priority and let the rest of the school die, Koichi might not be well and truly F@#$ed - Koichi sees losing all the students of the entire 1st High as "tolerable", as the anti-magic faction will still be taking a huge backlash (he does not seem to believe his daughters will be affected by this in any way).

-The (surviving) students of 1st high in general will be seen as victims, both from the attack and by how Koichi plans to twist the events to show 1st High are training (some of) them into child soldiers like Tatsuya, a blatant disregard of human rights which resulted in making the school a target for anti-magic faction attacks. The 101st will take a huge hit from this revelation, weakening their influence, and due to their close ties with the Yotsuba the 4th Clan will be dragged down with the 101st in the behind-the-scene politics.

You are correct except for points 1 and 3. Read Menzaeroz's post. The link to Mayumi SS is there and Koichi knows that Tatsuya is Yotsuba. It said so. If the link doesn't work, then try searching for Itsuwa Mio. I don't think it will be that horrible. I mean, this is a school of magicians that have seen some action and a member of 101 is the vice-president so I doubt it will be a complete massacre.

Originally Posted by waffler

wait does yotsuba maya count as a strategic mage? because shes like one of the strongexst mages rite but i never heard of her being a strategic class mage

No. There are only two strategic-class mages, Tatsuya and Mio.

[babbo3d]

Originally Posted by blackwhite67

You are correct except for points 1 and 3. Read Menzaeroz's post. The link to Mayumi SS is there and Koichi knows that Tatsuya is Yotsuba. It said so. If the link doesn't work, then try searching for Itsuwa Mio. I don't think it will be that horrible. I mean, this is a school of magicians that have seen some action and a member of 101 is the vice-president so I doubt it will be a complete massacre.



No. There are only two strategic-class mages, Tatsuya and Mio.

She is the only registered one and tat is unregistered but that does not mean they are the only ones

[Chimurry]

Originally Posted by babbo3d

She is the only registered one and tat is unregistered but that does not mean they are the only ones

Vol 3, Retsu and Kazama talk states Japan only have 2 Strategic Class Magicians, 1 unregister and Mio, they saying Masaki its good but not on Tats level.