Mobile Suit Gundam 00 - Episode 13 Discussion / Poll

[ToxicNarcotic]

Originally Posted by wingdarkness

I think it's interesting that we finally have a masked-man in this incarnation and he's a supped up Gordon Lui serving an ambigous moe type...Well you don't put a mask on a character in a Gundam show and not have it mean something..That kinda kills Graham's masked potential ...I hope Honk Kong Pheuy can pilot a MS...

I think the mask was more out of precaution than anything else. So far CB has put a lot of effort into not revealing their identities (well except for Setsuna,) charging in with your face exposed probably isn't the greatest idea in case of any survivors.

[Eidolon Sniper]

Originally Posted by Zenemis

What's the excuse for drugs getting through the post today? :P

Granted it's a fairly large load, but I'm sure they'd be sending alot of heavy equipment up those elevators anyway.

I think either Lockon or Tieria explained how the Gundams were able to stow away in those elevators, back when they came down to the surface for the first time and Tieria had to hurry back to the Ptolemy.

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by ToxicNarcotic

I think the mask was more out of precaution than anything else. So far CB has put a lot of effort into not revealing their identities (well except for Setsuna,) charging in with your face exposed probably isn't the greatest idea in case of any survivors.

And there IS a survivor. The leader they were sent to rescue will see them regardless of anyone else surviving.

Hong Long work with Wang, who is a public figure. So his face is on public record. Thus he alone needs a mask, because he has more than one job.

[Anh_Minh]

But his mask looks about as useful as Clark Kent's glasses.

[Nightengale]

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

But his mask looks about as useful as Clark Kent's glasses.

But the only camera around is Rachmadi's eyes, and it being the night, along with him being old, dehydrated and hungry, you can't expect him to be able to clearly make out enough for an accurate picture revisualization.

Considering the situation, Pink Hornet's Kato going around looking like that isn't that bad. It's real stupid if it's done in public with television cameras around though.

[Anh_Minh]

I'm not saying it's necessarily bad. But if he's going to wear a mask at all, he could have done a better job.

[WhiteWings]

It was pretty dark and somewhat chaotic enough so that even if there was no mask there would have been a good enough chance that Hong Long's face would have been barely noticable and therefore less likely to be remembered. Hong Long (just a single letter from 'Hong Kong'... ) isn't what one would call a very public figure anyhow and might have managed to go about even if his face was shown.

The thing I can't get over is... Wang Liu Mei's personal jetcar... how can it be more not out of place and noticable? A purple aircraft in the middle of a desolate mountainous region with few other colors other than brown and gray even ignoring the local unstability.

On a side note though I think Setsuna and Marina's first meeting could have been polished a bit better I still hope they would play a great role in each other's character development without bombing it.

[Slayerx]

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

Your usual excuse; CB infiltrated the workforce that sends the packages into space.

Part of what makes Space elevators more viable than Rockets in sending materials into space, is that you can send a large quantity of goods into Space very quickly, cheaply, and constantly. There would be so many freight crates being shipped every hour, that there isn't enough time to open each and every one for examination more than once. Money would be wasted if people working up in the Rings are being paid by the hour, yet can't start work because the boxes of building materials were delayed.

According to the show, the Gundam was packaged and sealed with official labels as construction goods. It probably was already "examined" by a mole of CB and given the all-clear.

Well, while they couldn't open up and check every crate before loading them up and sending them, i would imagine they would be capable of having the crates sent through something like Large x-ray machines so that workers could get a peak inside with needing to stop the load process and open it up; or some other detection system... only time they would need to open up a crate is if they saw something suspicious, such as undeclared weapons or maybe bombs.

Really, i would imagine their would be some pretty heavy security concerning those elevators... considering how the are poeple in there world that hates solar, some nut job might try to plant a bomb in one of the crates and set it to blow after it got to the top... got to make sure horrible stuff like that don't happen... Not to mention the possibility that some body might stash something like a massive weapon on the elevator to be sent up (hint)...

i guess CB could still have a lot of influence in the elevator workers, but you have to wonder how much... frankly, i feel that this is one of those things the show should disclose to the viewers... So far this looks more like a plot hole to me, as the explanations have no actual proof behind them and may be completely false. i think the show should mention how it works... do they just disguise the crates and hope no one notices (which seems to currently be the case) or do they have inside men that help ensure the crate will not be found (or we just making that stuff up)

I would also say that CB being around for 200 years is speculation as well... sure the founder lived back then, but is he really the founder or is CB just using his name and image (afterall, he should be dead by now... an issue which i don't think i recall a lot of poeple addressing when they first announced he was the leader)... was the organization started 200 years ago or is it more recent... and as for those working for CB, right now we have only saw a handful of poeple and i don't recall anything that suggests they have something like hundreds or thousands working for them (afterall, the more poeple that know a secret the harder it is to keep the secret)... it's one thing to keep an eye on a few dozen poeple, but it's another thing to keep an eye on hundreds; never know one one might decide to see things differently, go awol, and reveal your secret... Really if CB does indeed have many under cover workers i would kind of except the show to show it to us... something like seeing some officers stop Setsuna, and as they are leaving one of them secretly hand him something... or lockon, sitting in a bar and one of the waitresses passing him some info... y'know, stuff like that, just to give that feeling that CB has many seemingly random undercover workers

[Owaranai Destiny]

Originally Posted by The Small One

There is something I wonder:
CB rescued this hostage in the middle of the night. Then they called the media and delivered him during the day. So where did they go during this time? I can't imagine, that this guy was about 6-8 hours in the cockpit with Setsuna, without even talking about who he might be and what they plan to do... all the stuff the whole world wants to know about CB.

Probably some food and rest for the poor man, who went on a hunger strike as a hostage. Besides, I'm pretty sure Rafhmadi had more important things on his mind, like pacifying the madness in Azadistan.

[Anh_Minh]

Originally Posted by The Small One

There is something I wonder:
CB rescued this hostage in the middle of the night. Then they called the media and delivered him during the day. So where did they go during this time? I can't imagine, that this guy was about 6-8 hours in the cockpit with Setsuna, without even talking about who he might be and what they plan to do... all the stuff the whole world wants to know about CB.

Yes, but seeing as Rachmadi has no boobs, Setsuna was less forthcoming and kept his mouth shut.

[Dean_the_Young]

Originally Posted by Sinestra

I wonder how many people heard Marina say Setsuna F. Sei like 10 times. I wanted to tell her to shut the hell up did she have to use the full name. If anyone caught wind of it they could think she is in league or knows a Gundam Meister personally which she kind of does i guess

Surprisingly, there was a giant helicoptor overhead that was drowning out much noise. They actually turned downed the rotator noise so that the audience could understand, but the implication was that no one would be able to hear them over the helicopter.

[D a m i e n]

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

Your usual excuse; CB infiltrated the workforce that sends the packages into space.

Part of what makes Space elevators more viable than Rockets in sending materials into space, is that you can send a large quantity of goods into Space very quickly, cheaply, and constantly. There would be so many freight crates being shipped every hour, that there isn't enough time to open each and every one for examination more than once. Money would be wasted if people working up in the Rings are being paid by the hour, yet can't start work because the boxes of building materials were delayed.

According to the show, the Gundam was packaged and sealed with official labels as construction goods. It probably was already "examined" by a mole of CB and given the all-clear.

Look at it this way; CB has been around for 200 years, long before the Elevators were built. It would be easy to infiltrate their personnel into the workforce and even through to management positions by now. They must have needed secret access to to Elevators because CB have their own Space-Station to maintain.

i guess i ll buy that explanation but i sure damn wish it could work like that, i get delais at work almost everyday because fedex & co are actually doing their job at verifying the kind of goods the society i work for is importing/exporting.
i think only diplomatic luggage dont get "officially" checked.

[Terra]

Originally Posted by Slayerx

I would also say that CB being around for 200 years is speculation as well... sure the founder lived back then, but is he really the founder or is CB just using his name and image (afterall, he should be dead by now... an issue which i don't think i recall a lot of poeple addressing when they first announced he was the leader)... was the organization started 200 years ago or is it more recent... and as for those working for CB, right now we have only saw a handful of poeple and i don't recall anything that suggests they have something like hundreds or thousands working for them (afterall, the more poeple that know a secret the harder it is to keep the secret)... it's one thing to keep an eye on a few dozen poeple, but it's another thing to keep an eye on hundreds; never know one one might decide to see things differently, go awol, and reveal your secret... Really if CB does indeed have many under cover workers i would kind of except the show to show it to us... something like seeing some officers stop Setsuna, and as they are leaving one of them secretly hand him something... or lockon, sitting in a bar and one of the waitresses passing him some info... y'know, stuff like that, just to give that feeling that CB has many seemingly random undercover workers

Yes it's speculation that CB has been around for 200 years, but it seems to fit with how large and how much influence they seen to have.

Schenburg disappeared without a trace, there was the line about the Gundams being the perfect embodiment of his ideals, plus what appears to be Schenburg himself delivering CB's annoucement to the World of their existance.

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by D a m i e n

i guess i ll buy that explanation but i sure damn wish it could work like that, i get delais at work almost everyday because fedex & co are actually doing their job at verifying the kind of goods the society i work for is importing/exporting.
i think only diplomatic luggage dont get "officially" checked.

I am certainly not suggesting CB managed to smuggle a Gundam back into Space through pot luck of avoiding random inspections. I am suggesting that this is an inside-job, that most likely CB had built up a transport network over the years.

The crate containing Virtue almost certainly had been "officially" checked. It would have the right signatures, and all the paperwork filed.

However, no matter how many layers of security you built up, you have to rely on those who does the checking to be absolutely honest, or it doesn't work. There was an incident last year when some baggage handlers at international airports were found to be smuggling narcotics through bags belonging to innocent travelers. Humans are flawed that way.

[Anh_Minh]

Once or twice is an inside job.

Again and again for months is all three blocks failing to realise what was going on and to take the proper steps.

[Sinestra]

Originally Posted by Dean_the_Young

Surprisingly, there was a giant helicoptor overhead that was drowning out much noise. They actually turned downed the rotator noise so that the audience could understand, but the implication was that no one would be able to hear them over the helicopter.

I did notice that they did tone down the copter noise, i just thought it was funny she said Setsuna's name like 10 times. Even if they toned down the noise her bodyguards were close enough to have heard the 2nd time she yelled his name. Meh i was just overthinking it.

I did forget to say i like Setsuna's parting message to the Princess. "Its up to you if we come again or not"
I thought that line was a nice way to end it, preview for the next episode confused me a bit not really sure what to expect next.

[Alice16uy]

Good episode Yay for clever Graham.
Just listened to the new OP (Ash Like Snow). It's pretty terrific, look forward to it. I just hope the OP sequences are as good as they are in Daybreak's Bell.

[wingdarkness]

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

Once or twice is an inside job.

Again and again for months is all three blocks failing to realise what was going on and to take the proper steps.

CB has the damn United Nations in their back-pocket, do you really think they couldn't have a cell of individuals making Gundam tracking hard as hell?? Like VCV's analysis, you're thinking it's idiotic because it's the future...How do you think arms dealers work? How do you think drugs get into the US with checkpoint after freaking checkpoint set up everywhere? How do you think nukes get sold on the black-market and shipped or delivered thousands of miles with minimal engagment? How do you think goods are smuggled onto the Baltimore harbors (In a container system much like 00's)without the cops even getting a whiff? In the future (even 300 years into the future) I suspect, despite the technological upgrades for security there will always be foul play (especially covert and organizational foul play)...Whose to say the other powers aren't smuggling their own gains through the orbital elevators? It's not about some dope forgetting to scan a container, it's about that guy who dresses like Maximillion Pegasues from Yugioh (The UN liason to Marina) making sure that guy doesn't scan that... container...

It's a network, and after all the world influence CB has shown to this point, is it truly that hard to imagine they could get away with this? (Using context-clues) They've been a hidden organization for 200 years man... With the ridiculous funds to create unsurpassed Gundam technology that certainley had to incoporate some very powerful and CONNECTED individuals...Individuals who scoff at the notion of a container being checked being their downfall...

[Dean_the_Young]

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

Once or twice is an inside job.

Again and again for months is all three blocks failing to realise what was going on and to take the proper steps.

You've never worked for a government or administrative body, have you?

No, you clearly haven't or you would no how BS that is. Corruption on any level is hard to root out when it's deeply rooted and knows how to protect itself: look at the NYPD or police forces across the nation. Or at the means of smuggling over any border, or bribes taken by minor officials, or "unofficial understandings," or any other criminality that has been going on since the start of organized government. And that is for people who are regularly corrupt: Celestial Being has been established for almost two centuries and doesn't have to do that. Celestial Being's agents would be the men who live within their means, obey the laws and pay taxes, do a full and otherwise perform their jobs without complaint. In short, they are going to be respectable members of society with no hint or indication of involvement, and should any probes come down would be completely safe.

Not least because of the likelyhood that CB has other members in the security network, who can easily deflect any suspicions directed at a certain blameless employee. And as long as that employee is there, any curious scan at the one-in-several-thousand containers of actual relevance won't be reported.

If it's a human; it could just as easily be an entirely automated process because of the scale, in which case wouldn't it be funny if a certain program was installed into the recognition/detection software to automatically replace any image/report of a scanned crate with a gundam with what would normally be expected? Software routines like that can't be caught simply by "testing" the software; even relatively simple software computation loops can't be 100% tested.

Really, you're whining about nothing important. It doesn't effect the story. It doesn't even affect the plausibility, because by deigning to watch a Gundam series you've already accepted to watch the law of physics, probability, and human/political rationality done away with in the interest of dramatic expediency. You're bitching for the sake of bitching. If this was Batman, you'd be bitching about the utility belt and his grappler gun which can quickly pull his weight and more. If this was Superman, you'd bitch about how heat vision doesn't burn his eyeballs. Evangelion would see much annoyance about some vague triviality or another.

Seriously. I've seen you bitch for months before I joined, and it's never anything important to the story as a whole. In an earlier episode of 00, you bitched about something they ended up covering in the very next episode. It's annoying and really doesn't help anything. You don't even make it an interesting point for debate because your tone doesn't even allow for the possibility that you're anything less than 100% correct. It's arrogant, it's annoying, an it would be much less so if you took a chill-pill and stopped jumping any minor plot detail you don't like.

Jeez.

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Now, now... Chill, everyone. This is a friendly discussion. We can all make our points without blowing up, and it would be easier for your opposition to accept your arguments. Let us all cool off before the Mods find this and go CB on us all.