Advice for surge protection and/or UPS.

[Hyperion]

So within the past two weeks I've lost two D-Link wireless routers due to close by lightening strikes. I'm sick of wasting money on brand new routers if they are going to get fried within the next few days. I've decided that I need better surge protection, but have no clue what I'm looking for.

A friend of mine is an electrician so I went to him for advice. He asked me how the strikes are coming in, and in all honestly I don't know. I don't think it's coming in from the cable line cause it's not frying the modem. I think it has to be coming in from the power line.

He told me a couple of things to get, one being a complete home surge protection box. He told me one to get here, it's the CHSPULTRA. He also told me to invest in better surge protectors like this one.

Another friend told me to invest in a UPS. One similar to this one. But all in all I have no idea what to get.

Both told me to make sure I get something to plug my cable line and ethernet ports into, but I thought those were bad.

[Neat Hedgehog]

Not sure why someone would tell you to get a UPS when what you need is a surge protector. A UPS is nice for preventing sudden shutoff of computer equipment, though, and I would recommend one. Mine has saved me a lot of time and hassle during power outages. They are expensive to buy retail, and you're usually better off getting a :scratch & dent" in my experience. Most units that retail under $200 barely give you enough time to shut off your computer. The one in that link wouldn't even give my system enough time to sneeze, let alone go through an entire shutdown routine.

You can go somewhere like, say, http://www.techforless.com/ and get a dented UPS that will have enough juice to run your system for a couple hours for around $80. That's what I did. Even with all the equipment I run now (modem, monitor, file server, 24-port switch, etc), I'm still looking at about 40 minutes of runtime (it's an APC 1800 watt unit, meant to back up servers for about 10 minutes on full load, weighs in at 120lbs). This is sorta like what I have, only this is the US (120v) version: http://www.techforless.com/cgi-bin/tech4less/SUA2200

They have more normal equipment too, also at very low prices. Don't worry about the whole "scratch & dent" thing. If it's a UPS, it pretty much either works or it doesn't, and they'll guarantee it to work for 90 days. Never had any of their "scratch & dent" stuff break down on me, either. They also have good deals on surge protectors, too.

Also, there's nothing wrong with having a surge protector that you can plug ethernet and coax into. It's generally a good idea, too. The only possible reason I can think of that would make it a "bad" idea is the slight possibility of "noise" caused by running through another set of connectors, instead of just a solid cable. I've never actually heard of that causing any noticeable issues, though, unless the surge protector had faulty jacks.

[spikexp]

If the problem is only the surge that kill your routers, just take a normal power bar like this
http://www.amazon.com/Belkin-12-Outl...d_bxgy_e_img_c
the powerbar with surge protection will just cut all power if there is to much power coming in the line.

But if you want to be protect from everything (surge and sub-voltage) take an ups, APC brand are all good, so just take one that fit your budget.


But, I think that is you have money to spend on a UPS, go for it, all the ups from APC will do the job 'cause it's a really great brand for UPS ($50 UPS to ... are all good).
It's a little price to protect electronic device that cost a lot (TV, computer, ...).

[westom]

Originally Posted by Hyperion

So within the past two weeks I've lost two D-Link wireless routers due to close by lightening strikes. ...
A friend of mine is an electrician so I went to him for advice. He asked me how the strikes are coming in, and in all honestly I don't know. I don't think it's coming in from the cable line cause it's not frying the modem. I think it has to be coming in from the power line.

A surge is an electrical connection from cloud to earth. IOW electricity flows in everything in that path simultaneously. Later, something(s) in that path is damaged.

Protection is always about where energy dissipates. Always. Either energy dissipates harmlessly outside the building. Or that energy is inside hunting for earth destructively via appliances. Anything that would magically make that energy disappear or would somehow stop what three miles of sky could not stop (ie that Belkin) is a scam.

Today a destroyed router. If you don't replace the router, next time it will hunt for earth via a digital clock, dimmer switch, computer, or air conditoner. You had damage because you permitted energy inside the house. That means energy must hunt for earth destructively.

Cable typically has 100% surge protection. Cable company connects a wire from their cable to single point ground where cable enters the building. Now energy is harmlessly absorbed outside the building. No protector because the superior protection is a wire connection to earth.

AC electric is the most common source of surges. Three AC wires enter the building. Only one (should) connects to earth. Therefore any lightning strike well down the street is a direct lightning strike to appliances inside your building via those other two wires.

Effective protection means every wire inside every cable must connect short (ie 'less than 10 feet') to single point ground. If any wire is not earthed, then energy is hunting destructively inside the building.

To be damaged, an appliance must have both an incoming and outgoing electrical path. Your router has a perect outgoing path. Cable is already earthed. You have surge damage because energy is inside the building. Hunting for earth via appliances. Incoming on AC mains. Outgoing to earth via cable. If both paths do not exist, then no electricity; no surge; no damage.

That first passed through router and modem simultaneously. Everything in that path conducts the surge. But only something in that path is damaged.

Protection is about where energy dissipates. Will that Belkin (or APC, Tripplite, Panamax or Monster) at hundreds of joules absorb surges that are hundreds of thousands of joules? Of course not. Will the Belkin stop what three miles of sky could not? Of course not. Where are the manufacturer spec numbers from Belkin that says it provides protection? Do not exist. Protectors inside the house do not connect to earth. Do not claim protection. Are profit centers.

Only a 'whole house' protector will connect energy harmlessly to earth. More responsible companies that provide 'whole house' protectors include General Electric, Intermatic, Square D, Leviton, and Siemens. A Cutler Hammer 'whole house' protector sells in both Lowes and Home Deport for less than $50. That is well less than $1 per protected appliance. Yes, even the dishwasher needs surge proetction. What appliance most need protection during a surge? Smoke detectors. More reasons why everyone needs one 'whole house' protector.

No protector is protection. This is the mistake that electrician makes. And why anyone recommending a UPS for protection is completely deceieved; openly promoting a scam. Protection is always about where energy dissipates - earth ground. Most will have trouble with this due to retail propaganda. No protector is the protection. Only single point earth ground provides that protection. A protector is nothing more than a connecting device to earth.

The Belkin and that UPS do not connect to earth. Neither claim protection in the only place they cannot lie - numeric spec sheets. Yes, they can lie all they want in sales brochures - which is why that other poster recommended a UPS. A protector is only as effective as its earth ground.

Install a protector to connect every AC electric wire to earth. Even electricians often do not understand this. No protector does protection. Earthing (where energy is absorbed) does the protection. Therefore a connection from protector (ie breaker box) to earth must be short (ie 'less than 10 feet'). See that number? Critical. Also wire must have no sharp bends. Must not route through metallic conduit. Must be separated from other non-grounding wires. And must meet all other existing 'whole hosue' protectors at single point earth ground. What is the most important component is any surge protection system? What requires most attention? What do those who understand this stuff discuss most? Single point earth ground.

Find a bare copper quarter inch wire that connects the breaker box to outside earth ground rods. If that wire goes up over the foundation and down to earth, then earthing is defective. That wire must go through the foundation and down to earth. It must be shorter. It must not make sharp bends going over the foundation. And it must be routed away from all other wires above the box.

Yes, the amount of information posted is significant. But only because it is so new to virtually everyone. All this stuff was understood even 100 years ago. But retail salesman cannot profit by teaching reality. So an overwhelming majority never learned what does the protection - earth ground. If you think two rereads are enough, then you are sadly mistaken. Because most everything here is so new to you and every friend.

Protection is always a simple and easy solution. Waste no money on plug-in protectors and UPSes. One 'whole house' protector with that short wire connection to single point earth ground. Protection is always about where energy dissipates. If energy is anywhere in a building, then it must hunt for earth destructively via household appliances. Protectors inside the house are ineffective. Earthing one 'whole house' protector means energy is absorbed harmlessly outside.

Where to spend the most money? On earthing. Because protection is only provided by the single point earth ground. A protector is only as effective as its earth ground. The NIST (US government research agency) is quite blunt about this. Says why earthing is so important and why plug-in protectors (and UPS) are ineffective:
> A very important point to keep in mind is that your surge protector will work
> by diverting the surges to ground. The best surge protection in the world can
> be useless if grounding is not done properly.

I called the Belkin and UPS as ineffective. The NIST is blunter - calls then "useless". Even the world's best protector (that 'whole house' protector) can be useless if you do not inspect and upgrade the only thing that does protection - earth ground.

You should have plenty of questions because this 100+ year old technology is so new.

[Hyperion]

Damn Westom, just had to go with stuff way over my head didn't ya? How about a dumb down version? I think I get the gist of it though.

[airstorm]

Make sure everything is properly earthed.

[westom]

Originally Posted by Hyperion

Damn Westom, just had to go with stuff way over my head didn't ya? How about a dumb down version? I think I get the gist of it though.

Protection is always about where energy dissipates. Always. Either energy dissipates harmlessly outside the building. Or that energy is inside hunting for earth destructively via appliances. Anything that would magically make that energy disappear or would somehow stop what three miles of sky could not stop (ie that Belkin) is a scam.

No protector is the protection. Only single point earth ground provides that protection. A protector is nothing more than a connecting device to earth.

Protection is always a simple and easy solution. One 'whole house' protector with that short wire connection to single point earth ground. Protectors inside the house are ineffective. Earthing one 'whole house' protector means energy is absorbed harmlessly outside.

> A very important point to keep in mind is that your surge protector will work
> by diverting the surges to ground. The best surge protection in the world can
> be useless if grounding is not done properly.

A protector is only as effective as its earth ground.

[spikexp]

Forgot to talk about grounding since I thought every house electricity were make with grounding, but some house might not have it.
The surge protector work by redirecting the energy in the ground.

[Neat Hedgehog]

Grounding your entire house is, of course, a good idea, and most houses should already be grounded. Of course, this really only helps if the power surge is coming from somewhere else, and not your power lines themselves.

But a surge can also occur when the voltage coming from your local substation fluctuates causing an unusually high voltage which can damage your equipment. We've had voltage here that reached over 150v, and it's supposed to be standard 110 - 120v. That sort of surge is not going to be handled by simply grounding your house, because it's not coming from something like a lightning strike. As far as your house is concerned, there's no problem at all in a scenario like this. This is the sort of thing that surge protectors are meant to protect your equipment from, not lightning strikes.

That's also where a line conditioner becomes very useful.

edit: Also, as far as investing in a UPS, it's useful in preventing damage from "brown outs" or "power sags" when the line voltage dips below proper operating specs. A UPS, a good one, will kick in to pick up the slack, preventing your equipment from shutting off or going batty, such as read / write errors caused by insufficient power.